Backup Point Guard (redux)

not a lemon. We just gotta sit tight and take our lumps and we 'ripen' with each and every passing game.  

There's no poison in the system (ala the Knicks); we're just young and still growing/fusing together. I'd hold off breaking things up trying to go for the knock out right now; we obviously didn't make the proper off-season moves in order to do that and if we tried to, well, they fell through (ahem KG)

Every game there are signs of life with our current squad; now we just need patience; we're only 3 games off .500 as opposed to 10+ under. You think teams like Seattle at 2-11 or Minnesota at 1-9 are panicking and ready to blow up their young teams just because vintage Boston is doing so well? Probably not.

Give our young guys some time and burn; lets give Monta even more burn til he gets comfortable and 'Believe' in him instead of stripping his confidence with trade threats after every sub-par game. And If Nelson's gonna keep running BD into the ground like an idiot and not trust the pieces he helped assemble, then maybe we should look no further for the root of the problem

I remember watching JRich early years and I wanted him gone after EVERY GAME because he had 'potential' but always seemed to fumble the ball away, he couldn't hit the big shot, he couldn't take people off the dribble nor finish off one foot; he was awkward and seemed lost at times and sucked real bad sometimes - basically the growing pains Monta's going through but Monta's got a much higher/greater growth ceiling imho.

So as far as backup PG, unless J-Kidd leaves NJ and is willing to play for peanuts coming off the bench with us, I'd hold out til next year's draft and just play this year out regardless of how painful.

and shoot get some more minutes at point and let baron rest more.

Had this debate with OZ (and maybe a few others) a couple of months ago, but we MUST draft a PG in next year's draft. Next year's likely draft class is one of the most PG rich classes ever. We may (hopefully) have to trade up to do so, but there could be value at the PG spot as late as the 16-20 picks depending on what teams with what needs end up in what spots.

I say this year, we bide our time with Monta and Bellinelli giving spot minutes. If Monta shows he can hack it w/out dribbling off his leg every other play, great, PG problem solved. If he can't but continues to show he is a legit scorer, do a sign and trade package with him for a solid pick, 8-13 range, and draft the PG of the future.

This is not the same as waiting for your first round pick to develop. Monta Ellis is a restricted free agent that will, on his scoring and hype, demand more money than he is worth.

This is not a team that has the time to wait for a backup point guard to develop, it most certainly does not have time to watch a combo guard try to be   a backup point guard. All the feel good nonsense about hoping that Ellis becomes a point guard is just that, nonsense. Baron Davis is the most important guy on the team and protecting him should be our #1 priority- that means a legit backup point guard.

Ellis is a commodity that should be cashed in immediately, let's stop fooling ourselves. He doesn't fit and his timeline doesn't fit the team's timeline. Bye.

Names I like:
Telfair, young, speedy, passes the ball, lots of upside. Unfortunately, he's small, historically a bad shooter, not physical, low FTA rate. He's also on a one year deal so there is no long term risk.

Duhon. Makes $3M expiring. Can be had for nothing because the Bulls are sucking. Reputedly a great individual defender. No offensive game outside of decent 3P shooting.

Carlos Arroyo. Playing very well. Expiring $4M contract. He's my favorite so far, as he's toned down his shoot-first tendencies and assisting at a better rate.

Calderon. Ridiculously good distributor. not that much individual offense, but hits enough open J's to keep defenses honest. Good percentages all around.

With Conley down there's no way we'd get Lowry, he's just too good and the Grizz envision themselves having a new Ford-Calderon combo.

It'll take a while to see which names are really available.

watch backup PG Louis Williams against the Warriors tonight

He's in the D League now, but he was always considered a major talent at Kansas and he's looked impressive in a couple D League games so far for Austin.

He had 28 and 7 on 9-17 shooting in their first game, and 34 and 6 on 14-24 shooting in their second against Kosta's Jam.

Only issue is that I can't remember if he really plays a true PG or not. That being said, the D League is a great resource for a lot of talent that teams have egregiously rarely used so far. Jose Barea (from my school, Northeastern) wouldn't be a bad backup PG to have right now, right? He spent almost all of last year in the D League. Lots of free talent floating around.

I think everybody is giving up on Hudson a bit hastily. Dude has been hurt and yeah he had one terrible game but come on people give the guy a chance. I'm not saying he's going to make us a championship contender or anything but honestly I think all we really need from him is a few minutes a night to keep Baron fresh. Monta started off slow but he's definitely making strides- taking better care of the ball, distributing pretty well, and reining in his shot selection. If he can give us 30 solid minutes a night and Hudson can give us 10 we should be fine. I actually welcome back a healthy Hudson so that we can scale back Jack's ball-handling duties. Jack is obviously a key component in our system but I think Nellie needs to define his role a little bit to try to keep his turnovers and FGAs down.

He's playing great and he's younger than anyone else out there. He's made some great passes and has put forth an effort to distribute the  ball more this early in the season. He still only looks to pass once he's arrived to the hoop, instead of making the skilled interior and pick and roll passes, but he's still improved nonetheless.

Can anybody please explain to me like I'm an 11 yr. old, very specifically, the reasoning as to why a 22 yr. old ball player as talented as Ellis, can not be a good back-up now, and a great starting PG in about 3 yrs?

Running teams like the Warriors need what? mmm urrrrr uhhhhhh players who can run? Ding! Ding!!! That's correct, players who can run.
Who would be  more appropriate in a guard, than having a player with Ellis' speed on our team?

How old is he again?

Has he not shown an ability to take a game over and dominate a team's defense???

Could you at least wait until he'd be a college graduate until you write him off completely?

You're crucifying this guy, and he hasn't even scratched the tip of the ice berg, and he basically won the game for us tonight against the 6er's...Don't start kissing his ass when he develops into a fine ball player, and don't jump back on the band wagon when Belinelli does the same...mercy...

Back-up PG

So basically you probably caught on that I'm under the opinion that we will do fine with Ellis. However, I don't think Hudson's the guy for the job. I don't like his size, his versatility is a bit limited as far as what he does for us, and so far he looks like he's planning to shoot us out of games.

So, my plan would be to stick with Ellis for now, while sending a freaking legion of scouts to the D-league(yes, the D-League where we snatched Buike) and to Europe, to check out the hottest product over there. We look to for another heist to commit, and find us a young player who can run a team and shoot the ball. Someone got passed over, and that someone's pissed. That someone's on a mission to be on an NBA squad and show the world what he's really made of. We need to find him, just like we find everyone else.

OR we can make a few bonehead trades, bring in a scoring "little person" or some ol mopped up bastard to come run the show for us...then we'd find ourselves a real back up point...not some overrated weakling like Ellis.

I just glanced at some of the discussion here, but I'll just give my overall thoughts on this.

Look, the likelihood the Warriors find/pick up a guy that can actually contribute as a backup PG to Baron right now is REALLY low. Incredibly low. The Lasme move was surprising enough and I doubt the team has another one of those up their sleeve. This is why I'm a proponent of them keeping Hudson around until he's healthy - and trust me, right now he isn't.

You all saw a glimpse of what Hudson can still do in the preseason and I'm not quite sure why that has gone by the wayside. He isn't going to be this amazing player, but for 15 minutes off the bench, I wouldn't mind it at all. And you'd bring Baron's minutes down from 40 as it is now to around 30, which is quite healthy.

With so few options around, there's nothing you can do right now and for those of you who think Monta is the answer, there's a reason that it isn't quite working out. I challenge you to show me real evidence that Monta is learning how to play the point. From December 06, when people really started noticing Monta, how much has he really improved? I've seen an athlete be an athlete - scoring and battling, but I haven't seen a player that has reached another level.

Are there reasons for that? Sure, he's had injuries, especially that neck situation in training camp, which has held him back from growing. All offseason, I was told he was working on his ballhandling and passing but I have seen only a play or two where he's made that work.

Monta really has the ability - he has shown me moments of brilliance where he'll drive and find someone in the paint or something, but I don't see it enough to think he's a point guard. He's not even Leandro Barbosa - look at the shooting percentages - but the Suns gave up on making Leandro a PG anyway.

Look, Monta's got to show that he can learn the position. I don't feel he's done that. That's just my opinion, but I don't feel like he's the answer to your PG needs.

in 2009

I mean, we depend on Baron for so much, but we got 2 other cats that can create, and oh they're co-captains.  So, I would argue that a back up PG is not the obvious glaring need in the line up.  Ellis is a fantastic player who is adjusting to the league learning his tendencies, that is all.  If you are figuring out ways to stop him, then he's already ahead of the game.  If Baron cannot play, Monta will win us games.  He's done it the past two seasons.  I have the utmost confidence in him rising to the challenge.  Baron has earned Nellie's undying admiration for many attributes, but shot selection probably isn't ranked higher than guts, determination, playmaking and leadership.  So, we can get by with Marco and Monta running the point.

What we cannot live without, however is rebounding and defending the post.  We win games when we play defense, create chaos, drain open shots and rebound the ball.  Nelson chooses to call out Al and to some extent, Barnes, for not showing up consistently every game willing to battle for the boards.  Biedrins, after a slow start, is again, making an impact.  The season rests with Al, Pietrus or Wright stepping up and grabbing minutes.  So, yes, it would be nice to add a quality Janeero Pargo-type back up PG or a seasoned, rebounding machine like Darko, with our trade exception, but I don't see it happening.

A bit sheepishly, I admit that my "best idea" in the Original Post (getting Lowry), was lame because I missed the Conley injury.
I can plead only ignorance for isolation.
I'm currently living overseas, and, though an obsessive W's fan since Run TMC, its hard to stay up with all the news from the league.  
Everyone watches futbol everywhere else, so I can talk some EPL shit these days, but sadly my nba knowledge is suffering.

So I guess the thing is, live with what we've got.  Wait to see what THud can do when healthy, and otherwise ride Ellis.  Still, every night I see 40+ minutes next to BDiddy's name.  and that's just a recipe for disaster.  Here's hoping Nelson realizes that wins now will only help us if Davis is also healthy and rested enough to dominate in the playoffs.  
so it would be better to take a few extra losses early and develop some trust in Belli, and Ellis at the point.  then put it all out there in the last 20 games again.

But what a game against the Suns.  DUBS