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Around SBN: Dan Marino Starting College For Developmentally Disabled

The Baron Davis sucks diary

No, I'm not joking.  And yeah, I'm a Warrior fan.  Baron was the reason they lost to the pathetic Clips.  Period.  

24 FRICKING SHOTS FROM ONE OF THE WORST SHOOTERS ON THE TEAM???  

If he could've even hit 30 percent from the 3 line, the Dubs would've been in overtime.  (Even if only to watch him hoist up more bricks for the extended period.)

And didn't anyone notice him "take the last shot" at the half, which would've put them ahead going into the locker room?  Er, except instead he showed off his handles, and let the shot clock expire.  

I don't have the numbers, but anyone who has watched the Dubs over the last few seasons knows, when Baron holds the ball for the "last shot" of the quarter, it's most likely going to clank off a rim, or get stuffed.  

Baron is simply NOT a shooter.  And he never HAS been.  He's always near the bottom of the league in FG% among PGs, and his 3pt shooting has always been embarrassing.  So he should go to the rim more and get fouled, you say?  He can't shoot free throws either.  68% lifetime.  

Bigger teams just pack the middle, and hack every W taking shots in close (because they know even if they get to the line, they'll miss) or force them to shoot from outside (where perentages tell you they miss, and bigger guys are standing there collecting uncontested rebounds).

But Davis BELIEVES he's a shooter.  He (and apparently Nelson) BELIEVES he's the best shooter on the team.  And so he dominates the shot attempts almost every night.  And except on those nights when they accidentally fall for him, the W's are fighting against Baron's averages.

I enjoyed the run at the end of the season.  My jaw was on the floor watching them beat Dallas.  I couldn't believe my eyes.  It wasn't the same team of brick layers I watched all last season.  Instead every shot seemed to go in.  And the fact is, anybody who watched the NBA all season KNEW they were whipping a BETTER team.

They were the NBA's Colorado Rockies last year.

But that was last year.  

Is it possible to be a Warrior's fan and not "believe" this team as currently constructed is a play-off team?  I humbly suggest it is.  

They're too small (because Nelson either benches or gets rid of big guys) and because they don't have enough high percentage shooters taking shots (KA may be a welcome exception) they can't play "small ball" consistently.  With the current recipe they can't win unless at least two guys have crazy. over-their-heads, shooting nights.  There's no escaping the numbers on this team.

I'll watch the Warriors because I'm a fan.  But even though hope springs eternal, I'll probably find some other things to do in a couple weeks.  When they're 2-8.        

This FanPost is a submission from a member of the mighty Golden State of Mind community. While we're all here to throw up that W, these words do not necessarily reflect the views of the GSoM Crew. Still, chances are the preceding post is Unstoppable Baby!

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It's sad
You had what I thought was an extremely well-written diary and a lot of good points (I agree BD is not a great or even very good shooter), but it's going to be lost in the shuffle with that whiny title.

by Atma Brother ONE on Nov 3, 2007 9:12 AM PDT reply actions  

asdajgf
it's similar to the "Don Nelson sucks" diary. OZ is whiny too
Ronald Reagan was a jerk.

by Nooob on Nov 3, 2007 11:25 AM PDT up reply actions  

He came down on OZ too
And OZ changed the title. It's easy to get whiny when your team loses a couple in a row, but it's understandable that Atma expects a certain standard of etiquette here.
.

by olympicmike on Nov 3, 2007 12:04 PM PDT up reply actions  

Some might now see the
the value of that card carrying..ring bearing..emotional team leading... suspended Jax!!

by streetballer on Nov 3, 2007 5:38 PM PDT up reply actions  

Hey
It's my favorite mysterious, out of context posting, cryptic, W's insider.

I thought you wouldn't be hanging around here anymore once the season started.

.

by olympicmike on Nov 3, 2007 5:45 PM PDT up reply actions  

Hi olympicmike..
The season starts...when Jax returns!

by streetballer on Nov 4, 2007 5:43 PM PST up reply actions  

I GOT IT NOW!!
streetballer= ACTION JACKSON
THIS IS OOOAKLAND!!!

by Tim N Chris Burger on Nov 4, 2007 8:32 PM PST up reply actions  

in agreement
For two weeks at the end of last year Baron Davis was the best basketball player in the universe. That said, I have always been tremendously worried about his game, especially as a leader, because his genius is only in his extraordinary kinetic physicality. He is not a shooter, but he is also not many other things beside. Although he makes smart veteran plays from time to time, I don't see him doing much in the way of thinking out on the court. While this is perhaps a strength for this wack-ass chaos club, and it is by far the most entertaining and exciting form of athletic performance to watch, it also makes for an endless stream of poor judgments and missed opportunities. I can't count the number of times he made a bet regarding a play that had him do something no wise or intelligent player would do only because he could rely on his extraordinary hand and foot speed or his ability to imagine his body doing something no other player could imagine. Yet this only takes you so far. He is certainly the perfect floor leader for Nelson, but man sometimes watching him makes my head explode.

And, Atma, I understand you're trying to manage the tone of the website and the diaries by coming down hard on these 'whiny' titles, but he wouldn't have used the title if our own moderator hadn't used the same title for Nelson.

by Ormolov on Nov 3, 2007 10:29 AM PDT reply actions  

Tone of site
And, Atma, I understand you're trying to manage the tone of the website and the diaries by coming down hard on these 'whiny' titles, but he wouldn't have used the title if our own moderator hadn't used the same title for Nelson.

And I literally ripped OptionZero for doing the same and for the "Pietrus should be shot line". He's since deleted the line about Pietrus and changed the title, so I have to give him his due on that. I'm not trying to have double standards- we have a certain style and class here that I expect EVERYONE to follow. There are no exceptions. If people don't like how we do it here, they're welcome to go somewhere else. This is a family show and a conscious spot. The day it's not those two things is the day I quit.

by Atma Brother ONE on Nov 3, 2007 3:40 PM PDT up reply actions  

Proven fact
Last night Buike was the highest scorer(on GSW) with 33 pts and BD was 2nd with 22 pts. . .  he got outscored by  a D-League legend and he's a veteran.

by warriorgirl on Nov 3, 2007 10:55 AM PDT reply actions  

who cares?
azabuike outscored everybody last night.  he was on fire, baron was not.  who played better in the first game?  BARON.  what the hell are you even trying to say here?  Baron had an off night?  Baron Sucks?

You and the writer of this diary can't say baron sucks over one game.  Frankly, our team is not that good and baron is that good and he felt like he had to do more to win and it just didn't happen for him.  If you've ever been a good player at any point in your life in High School or whatever you would understand this.

by Proof on Nov 3, 2007 11:24 AM PDT up reply actions  

ok?
that "proven fact" proves nothing at all
is latrell sprewell gonna have to choke a b*tch?

by Spree4Threee on Nov 3, 2007 11:40 AM PDT up reply actions  

Shot selection
I believe there is a direct relationship between Baron's shot selection and his energy level. The more tired he gets, the more 3P happy he gets...and the worse he is at it.

Additionally, he gives up too easily when his teammates fail to execute plays, and he settles for a 3Per. This was his greatest fault when Monty was around, lack of patience to run the offense, instead choosing to go one v one from the perimeter.

He needs to reign it in one way or the other and the rest of the team needs to move the ball around. There's no point in floor spacing if it's not going to be used.

Questions? Complaints?

(AIM: JetForze; email: Jon.d.ma@gmail.com)

by OptionZero @ Golden State Of Mind on Nov 3, 2007 11:01 AM PDT reply actions  

Not only that,
there is a lack of support for him. When we had Jason Richardson the load on Davis was not as heavy. Since his departure, we certainly rely alot more and apply more pressure on Baron to produce especially because we are without Jackson at the moment. Just hold on tight for another 5 more games, 4 after tonight's game and well be back with energy.
I am as powerful as 100 times 100 times 100 times 13 Stilts!

by jeppalepala on Nov 3, 2007 2:33 PM PDT up reply actions  

Shot Selection
Shot selection and shot  accuracy has been both Baron and the Warroirs' problem so far this season.   The  Warriors are shootng 25.5% on 3 pointers.  Baron is a hideous 2-18 from outside  of the paint.

In the Mike Montgomery days baron was notorius  for hoisting fall away threes early in the shot clock.  He  made about 10%  of those.  I agree with OZ, Baron's energy level has a lot to do with his shot selection.  Also his general health. If he is favoring his bad wheels, he'll  take the  physically easiest path and jack off-balance threes.

The Warriors are shooting only 30% on all shots outside of the paint.  The ONLY way the Warriors win is if they hit 40% of those  shots.  They're not this bad, but they probably need a couple of more 3-point shooters in reserve.

For the moment these guys are killing themselves outside of the paint:

Baron 2-18, Monta 3-11, Barnes 2-7 and Harrington  1-10.

They HAVE to hit their outside  shots.

by San Francisco Slim on Nov 3, 2007 2:54 PM PDT up reply actions  

He doesn't suck, he needs more rest
Agree w/OZ on this one. I do think BD is slightly overrated on this site and by Dub fans, in general, but after watching him in April last year, I have come to believe he is a top 5-6 point guard. The key is getting him rest.

When will Nellie realize that leaving him to suck air on the floor doesn't help in the short run and will be terrible in the long run? He should be limited to 30 min a night. Period. Otherwise, he'll continue to blow games w/crappy shots and will be out for another 20-30 games this season.

by chacabuco on Nov 3, 2007 11:09 AM PDT reply actions  

asdf
if baron plays 30 min. a night, the warriors win 30 games tops. He is vital to our team success, but do i think he needs more rest? Hell Yes. there is no way we'll make the playoffs if he has to play 46 minutes. Unfortunately we SUCK when he's not on the floor. I think that shot selection and percentage correlates with the amount of minutes he had to play last night.
Warriors, Stupidest franchise in the league.

by kenntoe on Nov 3, 2007 12:24 PM PDT up reply actions  

Baron
Nobody complains about his FG% when he drops 30+..

As for taking the last shot, B.Davis is the ONLY clutch player on this squad.. Remember those game-winning shots against Seattle, Dallas, and Houston?. When Monta hit that game-winner against NJ last year, Baron set him up for it.. I agree that Baron is NOT the best shooter on the team, nor does he take the best shots, but he gets everyone involved (11 ast vs LAC, 10 vs Utah),he probably has the best court IQ in the team, and he usually harasses most other PG's who guard him straight up.  

By the way, its only been 2 games into the season.. remember Dallas at the beginning of the season last year? they lost like 4 straight or somethin like that until their first win.. im not saying that the W's will do the same, but until about AT LEAST 10-15 games into the season, ill reserve judgement..

is latrell sprewell gonna have to choke a b*tch?

by Spree4Threee on Nov 3, 2007 11:20 AM PDT reply actions  

dallas was
and is still a better team. They just don't matchup well with the Warriors.
Warriors, Stupidest franchise in the league.

by kenntoe on Nov 3, 2007 12:25 PM PDT up reply actions  

ok
i never said dallas ISN'T a better team.. im just sayin that the first few games dont necessarily reflect how the rest of the season will be..

im sure Dallas was also gettin bashed by their fans at the beginning of the season last year..

and i remember two years ago the W's were killin  until the about mid December and failed to reach the playoffs that year..

is latrell sprewell gonna have to choke a b*tch?

by Spree4Threee on Nov 3, 2007 12:38 PM PDT up reply actions  

oh yea
i get what you're saying

i just mean that with Dallas, you have to give them the benefit of the doubt that they won't suck for 82 games.

The warriors on the other hand are still a mystery.

Warriors, Stupidest franchise in the league.

by kenntoe on Nov 3, 2007 10:49 PM PDT up reply actions  

he needs a different go to shot
this baseline fadeaway stuff just is no good. it worked for a series last year, but... think of guys like nash and rasheed- they have dependable, high-percentage shots for the end of games. baron typically seems off-balance. you don't get anymore points for degree of difficulty. baron is a ninja, you know, he gets mad respect- but its about discipline too.

by airport son on Nov 3, 2007 11:21 AM PDT reply actions  

Rasheed Wallace?
i'm sure you could have thought of a better  example than rasheed (Kobe, Arenas, Horry, even Derek Fisher)  

Remember these GW shots?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lhsxp9PKUV4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZubvPYD8u0Y

not exactly off balance

is latrell sprewell gonna have to choke a b*tch?

by Spree4Threee on Nov 3, 2007 11:35 AM PDT up reply actions  

No love for Hashweed!?
Come on he won that championship for Detroit. Well Chauncey def did his, but Rasheed: 4th quarter, 1/2 court,low post, money. Maybe a bad example, esp since he's a forward- I just love that guy. Anyway, Baron has definitely won his share of games, but remember we were 42-40.I'm not trying to hate at all, he made b-ball fun again. Just saying we could win games less dramatically with higher percentage shots and it would still be cool with me.

by airport son on Nov 3, 2007 11:58 AM PDT up reply actions  

i like rasheed
i would like to someday buy drugs from him..especially after that brawl against the W's when he was in Portland.  

Rip, B.Wallace, and Prince earned that ring for Detroit just as much Billups or sheed. But that's a different story

is latrell sprewell gonna have to choke a b*tch?

by Spree4Threee on Nov 3, 2007 12:21 PM PDT up reply actions  

I think he practices that shot alot and it's
his go-to move when he needs to create a shot quickly. I don't really think that shot is the problem
It's almost like the Warriors have 6 guys out there... they always have a guy open! - Jon Barry commentating game 3 last year

by gsw4life on Nov 4, 2007 1:44 AM PDT up reply actions  

Baron
I think he's just trying too hard.  The team goes ice cold from the field and he tries to make up for it with ridiculous 3 point shots.  I just think too many of our players are not scoring effectively.  When Jackson comes back from suspension I think everything else will fall back into place.  Baron Davis does not suck.  Without Baron Davis this team loses to the Clippers by 25.

by Number22Drew on Nov 3, 2007 11:38 AM PDT reply actions  

Lazy
Baron is a very emotionally driven player and unfortunately he can get lazy and jack up bad shots when he's not emotionally driven to finish at the basket. But hey lets give the Clips a little credit they did collapse the lane well and make it hard for him to finish inside.

Another issue that I see is the lack of trust in his teamates. I think that it's natural this early in the year, with so many new faces and increased rolls for last years bench warmers, no Jack, he's probably feeling a lot of pressure to win these games by himself.

I'm not too worried. This is going to be a tough year early on with Jax out and a very tough schedule. We are all going to have our "end of the world" moments in the next few weeks. Lets just hope they can hang around and stay somewhat competitive until Jax gets back and the team starts to gel.

.

by olympicmike on Nov 3, 2007 12:18 PM PDT reply actions  

my thoughts
it seems like baron is not playing with the same intensity and desire that he showed at the end of the season last year. maybe it's just because it's the beginning of the season, but if we're gonna have a chance he needs to up his energy level

by AJC3317 on Nov 3, 2007 12:44 PM PDT reply actions  

we need
jackson soooooooooo bad!!!!!!!!!

by MrsMattBarnes on Nov 3, 2007 12:51 PM PDT reply actions  

Don't taze me bro!
Are you kidding me!  Can we all agree that we are a running, perimeter shooting team and if we play great defense, rebound, hit our shots, know matter who takes them, we are successful and if we don't then you all know. (Nellie Ball?)  WE ARE NOT a pound it inside half court offense team.

Could Baron's shot selection be better? Sure, but we are talking about the NBA.  I have been a Warrior Fan for 30 years, I am telling you from experience that we are way better off at the point than we have been since Tim Hardaway.  If I was Baron coming off the season ending run he had last season I would be creating for myself.  BTW, we are four hours away from game 3 of the season.  If he continues to consistently miss his shots by the All Star break, I will change my name to formerlythecity the Messiah!

by Baron the Messiah on Nov 3, 2007 1:19 PM PDT reply actions  

we just don't have the personnel
to win.

I'm starting to think the 9-1 run was a fluke.

prove me wrong Dubz, please prove me wrong...

Warriors, Stupidest franchise in the league.

by kenntoe on Nov 3, 2007 10:51 PM PDT up reply actions  

Baron Does Not Suck
He isn't the best player and there are a lot more players that I would rather have than Baron Davis. If I had a choice, I would trade him for someone else. Baron Davis is a consistent player, but he needs one more star next to him for the team to be good. Baron isn't the type of guy I really trust with the ball but he is extremely fun to watch. He already has 2 Double doubles to start the season which = that he does not suck!

I would let him go at the end of the season or the W's should pull off a major trade with another team.

Ballin

by ballin on Nov 3, 2007 3:24 PM PDT reply actions  

off topic...
but does that Maxim add destract you too everytime you scroll down?

i gotta go take a cold shower...

by Anomaly on Nov 3, 2007 3:33 PM PDT reply actions  

Baron Davis
is being Baron Davis.  The way he's been playing is nothing new.  He's streaky and he takes bad shots.  If he didn't have these flaws in his game, he'd probably be better than Michael Jordan.  So give him a break, he is what he is.

He isn't going to be shooting like this forever too.  When he starts heating up like he did last year he's going to be winning alot of games pretty much on his own and everybody will be singing his praises once again.  

Look on the bright side, he's averaging 10 assists/game and 2.3 steals/game; so it's not like he's completely dogging it out there.  

Baron Davis is simply THE microcosm of the Golden State Warriors.  When he's off, things seem hopeless.  But when he's on, he's UNSTOPPABLE BABY!

by jlagace on Nov 4, 2007 12:58 AM PDT reply actions  

words of wisdom
It's almost like the Warriors have 6 guys out there... they always have a guy open! - Jon Barry commentating game 3 last year

by gsw4life on Nov 4, 2007 1:48 AM PDT up reply actions  

Isn't he also
the w's 2nd leading rebounder?
THIS IS OOOAKLAND!!!

by Tim N Chris Burger on Nov 4, 2007 10:22 AM PST up reply actions  

thank you
Isn't it funny that some of today's fans get all negative and pedantic with the player that just gave them the greatest stretch run and individual performance they've seen from their home team in decades?  You can crunch the statistics all you want, but the fact remains that Baron is our best player, our best scorer and our best point guard.  Guys in that category (Arenas, Marbury) are gonna have a lower shooting % than they deserve. Baron shot 43.9% while scorin 20.1 ppg.  Compare that with Arenas 41.7%, 28.4 ppg; Marbury 41.4%, 16.4 ppg.  Guys like Nash and Tony Parker shoot higher % mostly cuz they can afford to take only good shots cuz their teams are loaded with scoring options.  Baron doesnt have that luxury.  He will shoot us out of games, but he will shoot us in to games we have no business winning.

Go back to last year, we wouldn't have made the playoffs or beat the Mavericks if we played the traditional half-court style.  We don't have the personnel.  So we said screw it, jack up a bunch of threes and play all out, full court D, maybe we'll win, maybe we'll lose, but at least we have a chance. If we played the way everyone else does we'd lose everytime.

We are the Warriors.  We got Baron Davis, Nellieball, some big cajones and not a whole lot else.  I love and enjoy it.  If you don't go root for the Spurs.

arguing on the internet is like runnin in the special olympics . . . even if you win you're still retarded

by BoomRich on Nov 6, 2007 7:49 AM PST up reply actions  

Baron does not suck...
however he does take shots while down in the game from 3 point land, he's done this his entire career at least while he's been in a Golden State uni.  I've always felt that if he would stop taking ill advised 3's and start taking it to the hoop we would have better games.  It just doesn't make sense to take the smallest percentage shot when down in a game, take it to the rack, make a layup, draw a foul, get to the line, get in the bonus.  These are all positives even if he's not hitting all his FTs he's still drawing fouls.  The other issue I have with Baron this season is his defense is HORRIBLE, I've seen his man get point blank layups every night because he's losing vision on his man.  All in all I'm glad to have a player on my team that can take anyone to the rim on any given possesion, I just hope that I start seeing it a lot more often and for all the 3 point attempts to go way down, it creates more efficiency, and with the lack of size and therefore lack of boards we need to be effecient shooting or we will lose most games.
It's all about the killer cross-over baby!

by warriorsfiend on Nov 5, 2007 11:48 AM PST reply actions  

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