REPORT: Kurt Thomas Traded to the Sonics
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=txsunssonicstrade&prov=st&type=lgns
The articles states that not only does seattle get Kurt Thomas but they also get 2 first round picks. Meanwhile Phoenix gets a conditional second rounder. If I read the article correctly, Phoenix is getting fleeced. Is that what it would cost us to get rid of Foyle? Something sounds shady to me. Any comments?
Details:
the Seattle SuperSonics added some veteran muscle to their front line Friday, acquiring forward Kurt Thomas from the Phoenix Suns. Seattle also received a pair of future first-round draft picks in 2008 and 2010 while Phoenix was sent a conditional second-round pick in 2008 as part of the deal.This FanPost is a submission from a member of the mighty Golden State of Mind community. While we're all here to throw up that W, these words do not necessarily reflect the views of the GSoM Crew. Still, chances are the preceding post is Unstoppable Baby!
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43 comments
Comments
wow
If i were the warriors i'd rather keep the two picks and have Foyle for his two remaining years.
by kenntoe on Jul 20, 2007 11:20 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
pure salary dump...
by JimBarnett2KevinGarnett on Jul 20, 2007 11:25 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Yeah it was a salary dump
by racsan on Jul 20, 2007 11:28 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
draft picks
by raypress23 on Jul 20, 2007 11:46 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
WTF?
Ws should have gotten in on it(Foyle and two firsts, two seconds to Seattle, Thomas to GSW) I wouldn't mind seeing Thomas in a W uniform.
by belli nellie on Jul 20, 2007 11:47 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
This has nothing to do with KG...
by JimBarnett2KevinGarnett on Jul 20, 2007 11:54 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
sure did leave Phx light
by hardcore on Jul 20, 2007 12:15 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Diff between Seattle and Minn
For Seattle, since they're not giving up players, those picks are good gambles. But for Minn, if they're giving up Garnett, it's a different equation. Thomas is an expiring contract. They'd get that space if they let Garnett walk though, so it's not really a plus by itself. They need young talent from Phoenix to make it worthwhile, since picks from Phoenix probably aren't worth much, certainly not next year.
by jae on Jul 20, 2007 2:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I understand what you are saying...
by JimBarnett2KevinGarnett on Jul 20, 2007 2:36 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
luck and odds
Good GMs also find talent in the second round and with undrafted non-roster players. I'm not sure that there's evidence that the late first round, where you've got a guaranteed contract in hand really has a higher success rate than the 2nd round or non-roster invitees.
Would Minn really be better off with a guy taken at 25 who gets a contract no matter what over bringing in several guys who weren't drafted? I'm not saying I know the answer, but the overall rate of success of late first rounders suggests that a) luck is important and b) if you can spot talent, you can spot it elsewhere too. Other than Garnett (again, luck is important) who has McHale spotted?
Losing Garnett is going to be a tough sell to the fans in Minn. A 25th overall pick won't win much love at the box office.
by jae on Jul 20, 2007 3:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
This might be
by kenntoe on Jul 20, 2007 12:33 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
good point
besides Phx is thin without Thomas now:
Boris Diaw
Shawn Marion
Amare Stoudemire
and they'd have to move one of those, I'd think, to land KG anyway, no?
by hardcore on Jul 20, 2007 12:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes
by J Rich 4 MVP on Jul 20, 2007 12:54 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
on the realgm celtics board
This might be a last ditch effort seeing as how it is higly likely that Minny has already agreed to send him elsewhere. Although this is all unconfirmed mumbo jumbo. although i have been hearing similar things on two different boards by two different posters.
August 6th--we will see if something happens.
I'm already sad to see Brandon go.
by kenntoe on Jul 20, 2007 1:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sounds fishy.
by jae on Jul 20, 2007 1:52 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why for PHX?
To also throw in FIRST ROUND draft picks is mindboggling.
For those that have called Cohan cheap in the past...be glad we're not giving away multiple draft picks for absolutely nothing. They've traded away at least 4 firsts now, all to sign crap like Marcus Banks. Robert Sarver sucks.
by OptionZero on Jul 20, 2007 12:45 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
hear thunder from North?
by hardcore on Jul 20, 2007 12:59 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah I Don't get it
I can understand the salary dump part. But the two first round draft picks part is straight up ridiculous. It's not like Kurt Thomas' expiring contract is much of a burden to the Sonics at this point anyway.
by jlagace on Jul 20, 2007 1:11 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Maybe a burden.
If I were Seattle's GM, I wouldn't give $8million away for a late first round draft choice, which is what they'll get. Not all first round choices are created equal. Late first rounders are pretty much worthless, so the lone pick would have been a bad deal for SEA. I'd have insisted on the second one (in 3 years) that, should Phoenix's fortunes turn, which given Nash's age could really happen, could be a good pick.
by jae on Jul 20, 2007 2:24 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
First Round Picks are Worthless?
by Dubs4Life on Jul 20, 2007 2:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Odds
I'm not disputing that there are good late round picks. I'm saying that most of them aren't good. Throw as many names as you can find. I'm certain I can come up with twice as many flops picked in the same slot. The list of names doesn't prove that late first round picks are going to be good. It just says that they aren't all flops.
There are always good players at the back of the draft. There's usually good players in the second round and as non-roster invitees. But odds don't favor a late first round pick being any good and odds are important (unless one is a fool who doesn't understand statistics, 'invests' in lottery tickets and decides that putting the deed to the ranch on the roulette wheel is sound financial management). I tend to think that talent evaluation has a bunch to do with it, but so does luck, and, based on the number of flops to success stories, luck probably has as much to do with it as anything. MOST late first round picks don't wind up being any good. Is this because the talent scouts are all terrible, or because there's luck involved?
If a team is banking on late round draft picks improving them, they're taking a big gamble. Sure, someone wins the lottery. Sure, a particular number comes up on the roulette wheel, slot machines pay out big every so often, but they're still the fool's bet.
It might not hurt (much--you do have to pay a guaranteed salary) to have a late first round pick, but it probably doesn't help much. In the business of basketball, teams want to make money, and having Thomas around for a year at $8million has a real cost ($8million!) to the Sonics, an amount more than what they made in profit last year. Is it worth turning a loss for a late first rounder? Maybe you think it is. Maybe you feel that a team's net profits are worth what's probably a ten to one shot of getting a guy who can actually get off the bench in the Association. Personally, were I a GM, it wouldn't be worth nearly that much, but hey, that's just me )(and my burden of understanding statistics and probability).
Nelson traded three future firsts to get Webber because he believed with Webber those picks would be late first rounders and he believed he could find equal talent in the CBA or elsewhere. Based on his record for non-roster invitees, I'd say he's probably right. The nice thing about those guys is that you're not waiting to see who is out there with one shot at it. You don't have to risk a guaranteed contract if they suck, can't make the team in camp, whatever. He certainly wasn't going to pay $8 million for something he thought he could get for nothing.
by jae on Jul 20, 2007 3:37 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
If a team is banking on late round draft picks ...
by hardcore on Jul 20, 2007 3:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Poor planning?
Question for the cap experts. Does this in fact help the suns avoid Lux tax this year or do they have to wait for the TPE to expire?
by olympicmike on Jul 20, 2007 1:29 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
This year
by OptionZero on Jul 20, 2007 2:18 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thanks
by olympicmike on Jul 20, 2007 2:23 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
tax threshold.
by jae on Jul 20, 2007 2:27 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wow
This trade is so lopsided that there could be something big in the works. Sarver can't be that stupid... can he?
by Caught Backcourt on Jul 20, 2007 1:43 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Salary Dump
by ballin on Jul 20, 2007 1:46 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
My question is:
by ffgolden on Jul 20, 2007 1:46 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
In-division
by OptionZero on Jul 20, 2007 2:19 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
maybe they
by kenntoe on Jul 20, 2007 1:49 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
A deal in place?
by Vash01 on Jul 22, 2007 4:10 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
mind boggling
If they did it to get an exception that they could do the Minny salary dump side deal with, it doesn't work. Like you guys said, they would have to trade either Matrix or Amare and that would leave them with like 2 big men. If it's a strict dump, then they screwed themselves out of the KG race for the sake of saving some dough. Either the Suns are secretly near bankruptcy or something or there is something in the works that noone has yet considered. This is crazy.
by Lifelong on Jul 20, 2007 4:12 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Well the luxury tax being dollar for dollar,
Thomas likely wouldn't be w/ the team after next season and he was pretty useless last season until the san antonio series. But it's questionable whether he could repeat his relative effectiveness against duncan as a 35 yr old in the next playoff season. The suns are likely hoping diaw & stoudemire, in particular, can step up their post defense next season.
it's one of those moves where initially you're all "what the hell?", but as you get over the initial shock, it starts to make more sense.
oddly, losing thomas while adding grant hill makes them more GSW-like in terms of make-up (though obviously they have more talent).
by the evil monkey on Jul 20, 2007 9:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
it just means
by kenntoe on Jul 20, 2007 4:42 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
allan houston
by Muggsy on Jul 20, 2007 5:00 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Steve Kerr
by ssmokinjoe on Jul 20, 2007 8:40 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Yea...
by gswrico on Jul 20, 2007 9:06 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Suns Site
by gswrico on Jul 20, 2007 9:09 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I wouldn't jump on Kerr just yet...
by BaronForPrez on Jul 20, 2007 10:25 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
idea...
by ssmokinjoe on Jul 20, 2007 10:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

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