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Andris Biedrins: Franchise Player?

First of all, this is not a hype thread. Let's be real here, he's one of the better Centers in the NBA but he's got a lot to work on his game still. But I do want to open up discussion whether you see Biedrins as our franchise player a couple of years from now. With Monta's situation in limbo and Biedrins playing pretty well, as well as him publicly saying he wants to take on more offensive responsibility, there's no better time to ask: Do you see Biedrins becoming our franchise player in the future? Does he still have that much potential to go that far? Or is he an All-Star center at best?

I ask this because Biedrins have continued to improve on his game every year and we already know how he shoot a high percentage and that he grabs alot of rebounds. His stats for the first 5 games of the season are definitely up there with some of the better big men in the NBA. But then you also realize that the opposing coaches don't worry about Biedrins right now. For the most part, all they want is to box him out and keep him in foul trouble. So I wonder, can he really continue to be effective once teams start focusing on him defensively. And can he continue to take his game to the next level.

I see two current roadblocks for him right now.

1. His post game or the way he score in general. To his credit, he's add a couple of new moves to his repertoire. But right now, it's effective because it's catching everybody by surprise. I wonder if, when teams start scouting him, he can continue to use those moves effectively. I like the way he can take his guy off the dribble, I think it's something that will always be to his advantage. But he's gonna need to make adjustments on the post once guys start playing his left hand.

2. I got this whole will he be a franchise player question in my head because of this reason. Passing off the block or off the double team. This is definitely new territory for Biedrins and Wednesday night's game against the Nuggets was probably the first time I saw it happen. Biedrins was set up on the block, and you have guys coming at him to double. We all know he has pretty good hands but it'll be interesting to see if he also has the skills to make the right pass off the block. If he's really gonna take on a bigger role offensively, then it won't be long until teams start devising a game plan for him.

For a moment, let's forget we have Monta. Judging his game, his growth. Does Biedrins have the potential to be our go to guy?

Discuss.

 

 

Poll
Can you see Andris Biedrins as our franchise player in the future?
Yes
136 votes
No
45 votes

181 votes | Poll has closed

This FanPost is a submission from a member of the mighty Golden State of Mind community. While we're all here to throw up that W, these words do not necessarily reflect the views of the GSoM Crew. Still, chances are the preceding post is Unstoppable Baby!

0 recs  |  Comment 31 comments

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Franchise Player?

he is already -he lead whole league in FG % last year and is leading NBA in rebs right now
IMO 9mlns + development money is steal even at this moment

1. rebs
2. FG%
3. some post game
4. garbage points (putbacks tipins)
5. some FTs
6. pick’n’roll
7. soft hands
8. great game without the ball
9. hardworker
10. i must break you

build a team & destroy the roof and

Sign Tim Hudson now!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

by nuttinbutnet

by Lat We N Trash on Nov 7, 2008 6:30 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

I think youre getting a bit carried away. He’s looking very very good, but franchise player is a stretch right now. Teams dont exactly build their gameplans around how they are gonna deal with Beans just yet.

by sam23 on Nov 7, 2008 7:08 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

he is looking like a steal for the money he's making

But in no way is he the franchise player just yet.

I think throughout the year teams would start focusing on him as he starts getting the ball more. If he can then continue to put up the same stats or better, then he can make a claim of being our franchise player.

And that’s essentially what I’m asking. When we start feeding him the ball more, and teams started focusing on him, can he still put up the same numbers?

by lightz0ut on Nov 7, 2008 7:30 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Monta

The x-factor is Monta. If he comes back and performs at a high level, than the team is going to be modeled around him a little bit more. If Monta comes back and plays poorly, Biedrins is going to get the ball more often and play well. Either way, Biedrins is a great player who can put up 14 and 12 a game, in my opinion.

by monta101 on Nov 7, 2008 6:31 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

i said yes

the one thing that absolutely amazes me about this guy, is how he just keeps improving. seriously two years ago, i thought he wouldn’t develop any new skills. get better at the ones he had, sure, but nothing drastically new.
fast forward to this season.
the dude is taking centers off the dribble, posterizing guys as if he just realized that he could do that. and word is hes working on a half decent jumper.

AB doesnt want to be good. he wants to be really good. and hes really good at getting really good.

he has a ways to go until he is a true franchise player. he might not be THE one, but if monta comes back as monta, the two can be a very formidable duo.

by Run Dubz on Nov 7, 2008 6:31 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

biggest roadblock

FOUL TROUBLE!! plenty of analysts and “experts” have been saying Nellie needs to play Biedrins more since the middle of last season, but they forget Biedrins limits his own minutes nearly every single night.

by sam23 on Nov 7, 2008 7:10 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

That's not completely fair..

There were plenty of times last year when he got reduced minutes because Nellie wanted a different matchup. Sometimes when we would fall behind, Nellie would put in the “TMNT @ Center” lineup just because he thought it would give better scoring. Look at his December game log from last year:
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3828/gamelog;_ylt=Ap2L4Erkq11cyZY4cN0UEgf8PKB4?year=2007

More than half the games, he collected less than 3 fouls, yet played less than 30 minutes. January & Feb follow the same deal. Sure, sometimes he would pick up a lot of fouls, but it was Nellie deciding to go with a different lineup that effected his PT far more. Nellie needs to play Beans more. End of story.

I hate Chris Rock, Eddie Murphy, Dave Chappelle, and Russel Peters because they make fun of white people like me. They also make fun of other kinds of people, which hurts me deep down because my ancestry is so mixed that I don't know what my official "race" is... so I get offended for all races!

by Dubs fan in Boston on Nov 7, 2008 7:21 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

True

I also think Biedrins’ foul trouble has to do more with the refs than him. He’s still in transition between a young player and a veteran. He gets called for a foul just by standing in the paint. It’s not like he’s reaching in for stupid fouls. Those calls should lessen year by year as he earns the respect of the refs.

by lightz0ut on Nov 7, 2008 7:25 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

yea

its not totally his own fault, but he does need to cut down on the fouls.

by sam23 on Nov 7, 2008 8:11 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

The only way I see Monta & Beans negatively impacting each other is...

Monta scores too efficiently, so Beans won’t get as many ORebs & putbacks for easy points/FG%… Seriously guys, guards & bigs coexist together very, very well. As long as Beans can stay on the floor, he’ll be spectacular.

I hate Chris Rock, Eddie Murphy, Dave Chappelle, and Russel Peters because they make fun of white people like me. They also make fun of other kinds of people, which hurts me deep down because my ancestry is so mixed that I don't know what my official "race" is... so I get offended for all races!

by Dubs fan in Boston on Nov 7, 2008 7:13 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

can he really continue to be effective once teams start focusing on him defensively.

  Compared to really good big men like Kal Malone it will be easy for teams to shut down Dris if he tries to do too much. Dris doesn’t have even average shooting or handling skills so he will find it hard to improve.

Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me

by Skeptic con Urquell on Nov 7, 2008 7:47 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

As long as you're randomly AB to Karl Malone

You might also point out that he’s already a better rebounder and defender than the Mailman ever was.

Obviously, the mailman had unbelievably refined post skills for his size. Then again, thanks to his lack of D and his softness when it counted, he ended his career with the same number of rings as Biedrins currently has, despite playing his whole career with the second-best point guard of all time.

Then again, the whole comparison is utterly ridiculous. But then, you knew that already. Biedrins’ game is much more comparable to Dennis Rodman’s than to Malone’s. (NB: Rodman has seven rebounding titles and five rings, compared to Malone’s zero and zero).

As for his “finding it hard to improve”: the haters have been saying saying that his whole career, yet somehow, hard or not, he keeps improving. His last four seasons, by PER:

age 19: 13.6
age 20: 16.2
age 21: 19.2
age 22: 23.2 (so far)

As to the thread question: it depends on your definition of “franchise player,” obviously. If you mean elite player capable of leading his team to a championship, he’s not that, and may never be. If you mean most valuable, most irreplaceable player on the Warriors, he’s that already (and would be even if Baron were still with us).

OBAMA AMABO

by Sleepy Freud on Nov 7, 2008 9:08 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

+1

what he said, he is very good at what he does but will never be that dominate center, just doesn’t have the bulk, but any team would love to have him. Put the right pieces around him (which we may have sans a PG) and look out.

by qin on Nov 7, 2008 11:07 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Behind...

Magic? The big O? CP3? Who’s in your fave 5?

I hate Chris Rock, Eddie Murphy, Dave Chappelle, and Russel Peters because they make fun of white people like me. They also make fun of other kinds of people, which hurts me deep down because my ancestry is so mixed that I don't know what my official "race" is... so I get offended for all races!

by Dubs fan in Boston on Nov 8, 2008 2:43 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Magic

… right?

Of the ones I’ve seen:

1. Magic
2. Stockton
3. CP3 (rising fast)
4. Payton
5. Kidd
6. KJ
7. Isiah
8. Baron
9. Nash
10. Deron

… or something like that. I’m sure I’m forgetting someone…

OBAMA AMABO

by Sleepy Freud on Nov 8, 2008 7:40 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Payton AND KJ over Zeke?

Here’s mine Post-1989

1. Magic
2. Stockton
3. Zeke
4. Payton
5. Kidd
6. Nash
7. Scottie Pippen
8. Maurice Cheeks
9. Chauncey Billups
10. CP3

IMO we can’t compare CP3 to those greats so far. He’ll be good, but it’s too early to tell.

Hasheem "The Beat" Thabeet or Brandon Jennings. A Warrior in 09.

by ejdacanay on Nov 8, 2008 11:58 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Actually I might go with:

2. Zeke
3. Stockton

But its close

Hasheem "The Beat" Thabeet or Brandon Jennings. A Warrior in 09.

by ejdacanay on Nov 8, 2008 12:09 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

You're probably right about Zeke

He was an amazing player. My rating of him is clouded by his horrible, phony personality, and laughable post-Pistons resumé.

Not sure how Pippen got on your list — that’s kind of stretching the definition of point guard, dontcha think? If he’s a PG, why aren’t MJ and Bird?

As for CP3: I agree that it’s too early to say much, but it should probably be noted that his 2007/08 was more dominant than any season Isiah or Stockton ever had. He’s already better at rebounding and taking care of the ball than either of them. Barring injury, I’d put my money on his climbing to #2 on that list.

OBAMA AMABO

by Sleepy Freud on Nov 8, 2008 12:39 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Scottie did play point alot.

Point-Forward. Still though, I would rank him pretty high.

Hasheem "The Beat" Thabeet or Brandon Jennings. A Warrior in 09.

by ejdacanay on Nov 8, 2008 11:43 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

+1

Only missing OZ to make this a good blog spot once again.

by fuller over bryant on Nov 8, 2008 10:55 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I voted yes

I think he can be a co-Franchise player with Monta

I see the future, and it is Pablo

by CB30 on Nov 7, 2008 8:57 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

no

He’s one of those players that you can’t really do without (especially for the position he plays), but at the same time you’re not willing to designate him as your franchise guy. I have all the respect in the world for Biedrins and his game, but i doubt he’ll develop into the face of the Warriors.

I pray i never have to use a gun again...

...unless i'm at a strip club parking lot...

...and somebody tries to run me over with their car...

...But how often does that happen??

by ssmokinjoe on Nov 7, 2008 9:01 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Not a franchise player

Among bigs, that tag is reserved for guys like Kevin Garnett, Tim Duncan, Dwight Howard, Yao Ming, etc. Biedrins is an excellent player, one every NBA team would love to have, and he’s only going to get better. But he’s not a franchise player.

by Ben Q Rock on Nov 7, 2008 10:07 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Can someone provide a definition of ‘franchise player’ that has some real objective measure to it?

by jae on Nov 7, 2008 11:51 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

franchise player

Usually the franchise player is best player on the team if i’m not mistaken. That’s something that can be objectively measured. But on top of that, he’s the singular player that the team is built around especially for the future. Not just a piece of the puzzle, but the keystone to the whole team. At least that’s how i understand it.

I pray i never have to use a gun again...

...unless i'm at a strip club parking lot...

...and somebody tries to run me over with their car...

...But how often does that happen??

by ssmokinjoe on Nov 8, 2008 1:33 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

good point

And I’ll take ssmokinjoe’s definition. Most of the time, it’s someone who’s gonna anchor your offense, but can be your defense too (although nowadays it’s either offense or both).

On offense, Andris is efficient but far from being our go to guy down the stretch when we need a bucket. He’ll make plays for himself out of nothing, that’s what makes him good. But he’s not the guy you would feed the ball too and get out of the way and let him make the right play. Right now at least. He’s showing he can score on people on 1on1 situations. I guess my question is, can you see him developing that even more and take it to the next level?

On defense, he is sort of our anchor on defense (I’m extending defense to grabbing rebounds, after all you don’t stop playing D until you secure the ball) . Except for the staying on the floor part and really guarding the best and keeping up wit them.

by lightz0ut on Nov 8, 2008 12:19 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Can someone provide a definition of ‘franchise player’ that has some real objective measure to it?

I’d say it’s the one player you’d keep above all the others. Kobe for the lakers, CP3 for the yellow jackets, etc.
   Right now depending on Montay’s recovery Dris might be our franchise player but that only says we are pretty weak not that Dris is a top drawer player. He doesn’t have shooting or handling skills to be more than a lane clogger and occasional garbage goal type of guy. A lot of his effectiveness is just opportunity, we don’t have very good rebounders and we play a style that keeps a lot of the players away from the basket so either Dris gets it of the other team gets it. Brandon Wright shows about the same effectiveness(in limited minutes) as Dris with more potential for scoring away from the basket so maybe they are co-franchise players?

Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me

by Skeptic con Urquell on Nov 8, 2008 9:27 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

AB = Natural PF

Once we get a real Center our frontcourt will be nasty

Hasheem "The Beat" Thabeet or Brandon Jennings. A Warrior in 09.

by ejdacanay on Nov 8, 2008 12:43 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

ejdacanay is right on

Beans is a PF who has trouble guarding pure centers, thats my Turiafs signning was such a good one. NOW Beans is off to a great start but im not going to call him a franchise player until he can prove to put up these great #’s for a full season. Monte is the future face of this franchise and Beans will be his lanky sidekick

by GoldenWarrior988 on Nov 8, 2008 9:03 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

the man

is a beast. I might get his jersey now.

by warriorfan4life on Nov 8, 2008 3:06 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

BOGUT

is he better than #1 pick Andrew Bogut?
who the bucks see as some sort of franchise player.

I’d Say hes mighty close.

who will have a better career?

The Beginning of the "We Believe" Movement of Melbourne, Australia.

by DoomBizzle on Nov 8, 2008 11:29 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

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