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Motion To Remove Stephen Jackson

HOLY JEEZ, where do I start?

Stephen Jackson is GARBAGE. He is slow, he can't hit a bucket, he is a terrible passer with maybe one or two highlight passes a game and for every few good thing he might do even before his horrendous shooting slump he screws it all up with 3 terri5ble decisions.


I am a fan of real basketball. I get a lot of slack for loving the Spurs but the Spurs play basketball. The Warriors do not. Stephen Jackson plays 35+ minutes a game and he is stinking up the place. He is a disgrace. He could have been a decent trade piece if the Warriors did not mess up and give him an extension which no one would have offered him anywhere close to.

I feel just awful for the young players. I would rather have Rob Kurz run the point because at least I know he will play hard and he won't complain and throw his fists at the ref and stop running while the other team gets an easy fast break bucket.

Biedrins and Turiaf need to protest and sit out for x-number of games until either Don Nelson is gone so a new coach will have the guts to bench Jackson or Stephen Jackson is gone.

Jackson on any other team would be a 7th man. I couldn't see him starting for any team. This is what happens when you make a GLORIFIED REC PLAYER your "main man."

Please, please agree with me and end this nightmare. MOTION TO REMOVE STEPHEN JACKSON starts here.

BTW, Jamal Crawford is just as terrible as Jackson, but at least he is quick and athletic...

This FanPost is a submission from a member of the mighty Golden State of Mind community. While we're all here to throw up that W, these words do not necessarily reflect the views of the GSoM Crew. Still, chances are the preceding post is Unstoppable Baby!

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you're right about him being trade piece.

jamal will get better once he settles in, he isn’t this bad all the time.

by HoLdEmUP on Dec 16, 2008 3:44 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Motion denied

Jackson is playing injured, playing sick, and doing everything he can for the team. He’s a soldier. True, his numbers are down but that’s because of his injuries AND because Nelson is running him into the ground (39.9 minutes/game), and not giving him breathers (yesterday he played 22 out of 24 first half minutes).

Think back to last year— Jackson returned from the suspension and provided such a fantastic lift to the team. That’s what Jackson can do when he’s not injured and not being exhausted by Nelson.

by dubbubba on Dec 16, 2008 3:53 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

There is a fine line between being a solider and doing too much while hurting the team

Right now Jackson being on the court is hurting the team. If you read every local newspaper article on the Warriors you would know. Even the ever so generous, unbias Jim Barnett and Bob Fitzgerlad are hinting that maybe, just maybe Jackson needs to reconsider playing fewer minutes now.

There are too many reasons as to why he is still playing heavy minutes despite all the injuries and horrendous shooting slump. Nelson is afraid to bench him, he just signed an extension, he’s labeled as a Captain, etc…If Nelson pulls him out of a game for mistakes, it screws up their relationship, Jackson gets pissed off, feels disrespected. If Nelson doesn’t pull him, he hurts the team in multiple ways. Just too much ego.

As to your comparison to last year, Baron Davis was still here, the engine of this team, the true leader that made the team better. Please don’t compare this team to last year’s team. Car with engine vs. car with no engine…

by buzzer beater on Dec 16, 2008 4:50 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Jackson’s numbers are down. When they were up, they weren’t very good either. He’s never been a really good shooter. He’s always been a mediocre to poor rebounder for a guard and atrocious to abysmal for a forward. He played more than 39 minutes a game last year as well.

I think too many people saw a correlation between Jackson’s return and improved play and concluded that he was the reason for this, the primary reason, and as such, was valuable beyond belief. This is not necessarily the case. Sometimes teams hit rough patches. The Warriors just had theirs to open the season. (Without a personnel change to blame it on, Houston had a 6 game losing streak early in their season as well.) The team had a very tough early schedule and had already showed a dominant win before Jax returned. I suspect he helped. I suspect that giving him the majority of such credit is a major mistake.

by jae on Dec 16, 2008 5:13 PM PST up reply actions   1 recs

i like how you worked your way around being logical there.

last year the warriors became a much better team when jackson was on the floor. it was no coincidence they started getting wins once he got there, he completed the lineup and was really good at playing the role he did. this year he’s playing a larger role than he’s capable and is playing injured. last year jackson’s numbers were not great but he did what was needed to win, hit timely threes, good perimeter d, and good passing every now and again. his to’s were limited because he wasn’t handling the ball as often, and wasn’t forcing passes. this year he’s playing injured so his timely three’s aren’t going in, well nothing’s going in, he isn’t able to play good perimeter D and hes turning the ball over a lot. i think when monta gets back to full health (could be a while) jackson will move back into a more suited role and will be back to playing well again. until then, more bad play from him is expected, especially while injured

by montamazing on Dec 17, 2008 3:56 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

It could have been a coincidence that we started to win when he returned. I don’t know if it was or wasn’t, but sometimes, teams, even good teams, have bad streaks. Houston had exactly the same record we did after 13 games and had a 6 game losing streak as well. It can happen.

If you look at the pre-Jax games last year, we lost twice to Utah, a team that was just better than us, the Mavs, a perennial playoff team a year removed from a 67 win season, Detroit, a perennial power, and Cleveland, a team coming off a 50 win season and an NBA finals trip. Yes, we could have won some of those games, but it wasn’t a given. The Jazz crushed us twice and the other ones were relatively close. The loss that stung was a relatively close one to LAC, another reasonably close game. The team actually turned around and started to really click the game before Jax came back, avenging the LAC loss with a blowout victory. They started to win before he came back. Whether or not they would have continued to do so is an unknown.

I’m not saying that Jax didn’t help. But there’s other things that were going on and the simple equation that we were terrible without him and great with him is an oversimplification that ignores the schedule, ignores that the team had demonstrated considerable variation in their play and improvement before he returned and ignores that sometimes, correlation does not equal causation.

I’m not sure why you conclude I’ve worked my way around being logical. What I’ve presented is logical. Just because you disagree does not change this.

by jae on Dec 17, 2008 9:19 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Houston also lost Yao and then went on a 22 game winning streak

Does that mean that Yao is the source of their problems? Boston lost James Posey, and now they’ve gone on to the best record in 27 games ever, I guess Posey was holding them back last year. Utah just lose Deron Williams for the second time, and they’ve now gone on a 5 game winning streak. They should just trade the guy to us already, cuz he clearly sucks for them.

montamazing, you get the idea? Not everything that happens is the reason for things that happen later.

"No no Nene!"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zB5DxNl4EB0

by Dubs fan in Boston on Dec 17, 2008 10:51 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

no, definitely doesn't get it

because things like “heart” and “leadership” are more important than actual productive play, right…oh wait.

"If you hit .440 with 20 bombs, you don't have to do s---. You don't have to bring a glove to practice, just hit and leave whenever you want. You can bring a 40 and smoke a cigarette and call me from the parking lot asking me what time the game is, and I'll tell you. You can even say 'F--- you, Steve!' Actually, don't say that, that wouldn't be very nice." -Steve Friend, Head Coach, Chabot College Gladiators Baseball

by flipgatey3 on Dec 19, 2008 12:42 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

JackLoser

Jackson was a good 3rd/4th behind baron and monta (plus the awesome play of ‘buike last year). They expect him to play like a stuperstar and that’s not his fault. But Jackson THINKS he is a superstar and leader of the team and being the oldest he is providing nothing to the younger plays other than jacked up shots, complaints and awful decisions.

Come on, who in the right mind is injured and decides to shoot 70something shots while going almost 10% fg. The so called “Cap’tn Jack” should realize there he should give up the terrible shots to his teammates and sooner than later his shot will come back. Obviously he doesn’t realize this.

by CallMeTheTruth on Dec 16, 2008 5:42 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

*puts on Lakers jersey*

I DONT CARE IF HE IS HURT, AND IS KILLING HIMSELF FOR THE TEAM. I WANT WINS, AND I WANT THEM NOW. TRADE OUR TRAINERS, TRADE OUR HOT DOG VENDORS, I WANT A MOVE MADE PEOPLE.

I DONT CARE IF IT MAKES SENSE. LOOK AT TORONTO THEY FIRE SAME MITCHELL………… FOR NO REASON AT ALL….FIRE FIRE FIRE

WITH AN INTERIM COACH WERE GONNA ROCK. INTERIM COACHES ALWAYS LEAD THEIR TEAMS TO THE PLAYOFFS.

WARRIORS ARE THE WORST EVER…IVE BEEN A FAN FOR 4 DAYS, IM ANGRY

by sjboy on Dec 17, 2008 8:07 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

IVE BEEN A FAN FOR 4 DAYS

That’s insulting. You should not liken new fans to silly impatient fans who think they can do a better job than Don Nelson. I’m sure most new fans realize that the coach of the team probably knows more about the Warriors than they do.

"No no Nene!"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zB5DxNl4EB0

by Dubs fan in Boston on Dec 17, 2008 10:53 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Disagree

I agree with dubbubba, he’s not as effective as last year because this year he has to handle the ball more and create his own offense, whereas last year it was created for him by Baron and Ellis. Who remembers Jackson wide open threes that took two seconds to get off, but had everyone on the edge of their seats until it was either a miss or a make. Ellis will solve alot of the teams problems, but not all of them. Nelson needs to Start Wright at PF and quit messin around with small ball. Wright does well everytime he is in the game, Am I the only one who sees this? Nelson is quoted as saying he didn’t play Wright because it was a small man’s game yesterday, really? How bout having the height advantage once, and not putting the burden of getting every rebound on Biedrins? But I digress, I think Jackson can be better, when Ellis is back because defenses will key on him less.

by warriorsnut on Dec 16, 2008 4:06 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Jackson

Jackson is playing hurt and also playing out of position a little bit. The team doesn’t have a true point guard, so he’s asked to do a little more than maybe what he’s used to or good at. I don’t look at Stephen as the problem. I think we’d be an even worse team without him.

by Rated-R Superstar on Dec 16, 2008 4:19 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Yes I agree. Stephen Jackson needs to GO fast. Besides his leadership abilities or whatever, how can anyone be satisfied with his game? When you think about it, he is probably below average in every basketball skill category besides free throwing and, maybe, defense . He just carries himself like hes good at everything. And even when he is fully healthy, he still shoots at or below 40 percent, moves like a turtle, and basically plays like a rookie. We either need to trade him or sit him on the bench, but i doubt the later will work because you know he wont like it.

by henbus on Dec 16, 2008 4:20 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

i woulda

picked al over nellie……..

When Maggette missed those consecutive shots in a span of a humming bird’s flap,
Crawford simply looked at the bench and said, "Are you serious?"

by gorillas on Dec 16, 2008 8:50 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

i agree 10000000%

he needs to get the hell out of here.

by GsWBush on Dec 16, 2008 4:30 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

*raises my hand* I agree 100%

Feel free to check out my analysis of Jackson in my Maggette vs Jackson post.

by buzzer beater on Dec 16, 2008 4:38 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

The team we have now.

Just like Nellie said, “It’s not fun coaching this season”.

I think he’s talking about how he can’t afford to have the team have fun on the court and do all those crazy plays. Nellie actually has to ‘think hard’ in his coaching schemes now, whereas back then he would let Baron and company run and be successful at scoring. The current Warriors team that we have has to play conservative and structured in order to win right now; whenever they try to be all fancy and shoot too much they end up sucking, BAD.

The only play this season that reminded me of the Baron-led-Warriors was when Ronny Turiaf blocked a shot, kept it in play, outlet passed it to Belinelli, and Belinelli swished the three on a fastbreak. That was reminiscent of the 06-07 Warriors where we would have guys making hella crazy three pointers all the time, especially at a very fast pace. I barely seen anything like that this season so far.

by Five Ten Entertainment on Dec 16, 2008 9:42 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Stephen Jackson is not good enough to be a Leader

How can he be a leader when….

he is in a horrible shooting slump, injured hand, and does not realize he needs to stop shooting 15,20% night after night, and focus on making the team better by doing other things such as playing lockdown defense (like he locked down Nowitzki), rebounding and passing.

he complains about EVERY SINGLE FREAKIN call he doesn’t get from the ref! I am so sick of watching him yapping at the ref while the rest of the team sprints back to play 4 on 5 defense at a disadvantage. SHUT UP AND GET BACK ON D! Next time when I go to the game, everytime I see Jackson opens his mouth complaining to the ref, I’m going to stand up and shout “shut up and get back on D.” I might have to do that 10-20 times a game but i don’t care.

he claims he’s a lockdown defender when he really isn’t anymore. He is so incredible annoying and lazy on defense, it’s hard to watch. he lets his opponents drive by and casually reaches from behind trying to knock the ball away. He gambles, relies on his teammates to bail him out. when he turns the ball over, he grabs his man in frustration to stop the play.

he doesn’t realize what is good for the team. he tells the reporters that “if they (teammates) want me to sit out a game, then I will, but they tell me they want me to be out there.” I’m paraphasing from an article. You know why no one has the guts to tell him to sit out, cuz he plays with a bunch of unestablished rookies under 25. If Robert Rowell is pointing a gun at Nelson’s head and dares him to yank him out of a game, and if Nelson doesn’t tell Jackson to sit out, do you think the rookies will?

Jackson is clearly not fit to be a leader of this team. Drop the ego, bench yourself, stop hurting the team please.

by buzzer beater on Dec 16, 2008 5:09 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

False

It would take me like 1 hour to make any sense out of your post here. Start a blog instead, that way I dont have to read it.

by sjboy on Dec 17, 2008 8:09 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

You're an idiot

Jackson goes through a shooting slump and all of the sudden you want to trade him? Wait a couple weeks and you’ll be reminded of what a good player he is. I can’t believe you have such a bad memory. Remember when he played a huge role in getting the warriors to the playoffs. Have you forgot the beginning of the season? He might not be the ideal leader, but he’s better than anyone else on the team. It’s not all his fault, he’s struggling right now because he’s on a team where he’s the first option when he’s really second or third. Don’t blame him.

Get a new coach? I’ll refresh your memory again. Remember when Nelly got us to the playoffs and past the mavs? Remember when he revitalized out franchise? You say you want a new coach. If a roster sucks new a coach is going to help. If anything, Nelson is the best to maximize the roster we have. If the warriors are smart they’ll let him build the franchise.

by rainman120 on Dec 16, 2008 5:41 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

NEVER

I HAVE NEVER LIKED JACKSON. Even when he was on the Spurs which is my favorite team btw, I didn’t really like him. Now that I can see him almost every game for the last few years he is a disgrace to the term “professional athlete.” The playoff series against Dallas was a fluke. We got a lucky matchup, that was it. I hate how everyone got on the Warriors bandwagon just because of that. There’s a reason why Jackson gets shipped around.

The reason why he seems better than everyone else is because he never passes the ball up when he should. When other players finally touch the ball they just jack it up because they might not get it again for the next 3 possessions.

AND LASTLY, are you JOKING ME? Are you saying even with Maggette out, we cannot seem to utilize Brandon Wright or even Rob Kurz? “Maximize the roster” b.s. We have young talent that needs to get minutes. Nelson is just an old coach who does the same old tired, fruitless tricks and everyone in Warriorsland is too afraid to go against him and Jackson.

by CallMeTheTruth on Dec 16, 2008 5:50 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I have to reiterate...

I NEVER LIKED JACKSON. I HATE JACKSON. We never should have gotten into the playoffs. We didn’t deserve to. And trust me, Nellie is not a good coach. Just imagine how good Popavich would be as a coach here or even Avery Johnson.

by CallMeTheTruth on Dec 16, 2008 5:52 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Wow

So when we don’t make the playoffs you’re mad about…when we do make the playoffs you’re mad about it.

You are such a positive person!

I think you forget that Dirk was shut down by Jackson. Go back to the Spurs blog. I’m sure I’ve been a Warriors fan longer than you so don’t sit there saying everyone got on the Warriors bandwagon because of the playoffs.

by Captain Jack on Dec 16, 2008 6:53 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Correction

I am not mad about warriors not making the playoffs. I could care less because by then most of the games are shown on TV which is basically the only reason why I watch the Warriors nowadays. You probably have been watching the warriors longer than me, but I have played more real basketball and I know what real basketball is – not this crap Don Nelson throws out there.

I am not mad at the Warriors, I am pissed off at Jackson and Nellie whose huge egos seemed to have trickled down into making Azubuike feel like he’s a superstar and CJ Watson the new Allen Iverson among others.

by CallMeTheTruth on Dec 16, 2008 7:23 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Ummmm.....

Don Nelson has the second most wins in NBA history. I’m not saying his style is perfect, or will ever win a championship, but…

“Real Basketball” is 5 people on a court, trying to get the basketball in the hoop and keep the other 5 players from doing so. Everything else is strategy…..now you can wish we had Gregg Pop, but don’t tell me that this isn’t “real basketball,” and don’t jump back on the bandwagon when we start winning again, be it in 2 weeks or 2 years.

As for Jackson, Nellie, us losing, yes, I am frustrated too. But I want to point out the following:
-We are 25 games into the season
-Our best player has played 0 games
-Our second best scorer has only played 16 games.
-Our leader has been playing injured.
-We have as many players ready to get significant minutes at the 4 and 5 spots as most teams have in their starting lineup.
-We already admitted to rebuilding and missing the playoffs this year.

Basically we can’t have our cake and eat it too. We can’t complain about needing to develop the young guys, and complain about losing. They are synonymous. Right now Nellie is trying to bridge the gap, so our players get used to winning, and our vets don’t feel like they’re riding the pine.

We’ve got Monta, Jackson, Maggs and Beans all locked in to the future. We can’t avoid them while we try to develop the other guys.

by bradyk2 on Dec 16, 2008 7:46 PM PST up reply actions   2 recs

rec'd

This post pretty much kills every fanshot/fanpost/fangasm at gsom. You could respond to pretty much any complaint with this. Fire Nellie? See this comment. Release Jackson? See this comment. Frustrated with losing? See this comment.

If it wasn’t so long bradyk2 I would make it my signature. Well done.

"They can trade me," Bonds said. "I don't think they will, though. It's not like I want to be traded, man. I'm a Giant. I'm stuck here till the end."

by GameSix on Dec 17, 2008 7:47 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Thank you, GameSix

It just seems like people are getting so typically American, needing results now. Good things take time. Look at the Cavs.

Let’s all take a deep breath, and look at this seriously before we try and trade our entire team away.

by bradyk2 on Dec 17, 2008 2:27 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Only point of contention is...
We have as many players ready to get significant minutes at the 4 and 5 spots as most teams have in their starting lineup.

Most teams have 2 players that fit that category in their starting lineup. The Warriors do not have 2 on the entire team. No, Turiaf doesn’t count.

"No no Nene!"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zB5DxNl4EB0

by Dubs fan in Boston on Dec 17, 2008 10:55 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

And you believe Brandan Wright isn’t ready to get significant minutes because…?

It’s not because he’s been bad, because he’s been good. It’s not because he plays badly with Biedrins, because they play better together than most combos on the team. It’s not because he’s bad on defense, because while he makes some mistakes, he’s a better defender than most people on the roster, and we objectively and subjectively play better defense when he’s in.

So why is it? Do you really think he’s not ready solely because Nellie doesn’t? Nellie’s not infallible. He’s a legend, and deservedly so… he knows more than any of us. But Nellie makes a lot of mistakes. Trading Mitch Richmond for Billy Owens was a mistake. Alienating Webber in his rookie season was a mistake; counting on Webber last year was a mistake. Riding Baron and Jack too hard last year was a mistake. Giving small minutes to Brandan Wright… is a mistake.

I can understand railing against people who think Nellie’s an idiot. I can’t understand thinking that because Nellie does it, it must be right. Nellie makes more mistakes than any other great coach in the history of basketball. He tries a lot of weird stuff… some of it’s inspired, and some of it works okay, and some of it is really, really bad. Most things he’s done this year have been really, really bad, and keeping Brandan Wright on the bench is at the top of the list.

We have two good frontcourt players, in Andris Biedrins and Brandan Wright. God only knows when Nellie will realize that, but there’s no reason why you can’t.

by onlxn on Dec 17, 2008 11:51 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I think that Nellie’s instincts are usually right. He seems to have an above average eye for talent, whether it’s at the top of the draft like Nowitzki or Richmond or late in the draft like Sprewell and Josh Howard, or from the CBA or out of the league like Elie and Askew and Barnes. He doesn’t seem concerned with where a player is projected to go in the draft like so many risk averse GMs who won’t take a guy they like because it’s “too high” for him and they fear ridicule for the risk more than anything else. He is ready to toss unconventional lineups out there and usually has success at this.

The problem is that his instincts aren’t always right but it seems he can be particularly stubborn in changing his mind when he’s wrong. And when he’s wrong, it seems to cascade into everything. He appears to hve decided that Wright cannot play. He’s said otherwise in interviews, suggesting that, if you can believe anything he says, that at some conscious level he knows that Wright can contribute, but his behavior suggests that he doesn’t believe this. His behavior is such that when things are going wrong he tries to plug the hole with what he’s had success with in the past when things looked conventionally bleak (“small ball”) even if he does not have the ideal parts (e.g. no real point guard, a collection of guys who don’t shoot particularly well, lackadaisical defenders who do not generate the postive turnover margin you generally need) to make this work like it should).

His instincts don’t appear to be right and I suspect that they’re at odds with what he knows to be true, hence the real lack of any direction, of any semblance of a plan. The worrisome thing to me is that this looks very, very much like the 94-95 season to me, the last time that Nelson watched a team unravel.

by jae on Dec 17, 2008 12:31 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Agree with all that. The strangest thing of all to me is his repeated point in interviews lately, that for smallball to succeed, your small guys need to be better than theirs, and ours aren’t. He verbalizes the problem perfectly. And yet, when push comes to shove, you see Jack at power forward and Wright in his warmups.

I really hadn’t thought another ‘94-’95 was possible, but this season feels more like that one than any other. Nellie’s bad ideas are steering us off course, and he seems unwilling, or unable, to stop it.

by onlxn on Dec 17, 2008 12:40 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I agree somewhat

I do feel like BWright needs more minutes (but, like I said, I feel Bellinelli and Randolph do as well, and I feel like we shouldn’t sacrifice our vets. it’s a catch 22).

Is he ready to get significant minutes, at the 4 spot? no.
Right now, Bwright has almost an identical body to Kevin Durant. Wright is 6’10" 210#, KD is 6’9" 215#. Durant struggles with being to small at the TWO spot. I love Brandan Wright. I absolutely love the guy. But you cannot ask a guy with Kevin Durant’s body, and very little experience to get 30 minutes a night guarding Pau Gasol and Amar’e Stoudemire.

It’s just not a good idea. Wright can play our 4 when we want to utilize mismatches, or when we play the Heat, or other small teams. He can play the 4 when he gains 20 pounds next offseason. He can play the 3 when his shot gets more consistent.

We are not the team we were 2 years ago, we can’t have this guy playing 30 minutes a night at the 4 spot. It would be detrimental to him, and our team.

by bradyk2 on Dec 17, 2008 2:33 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Correction

The above response was directed at OnixN.

by bradyk2 on Dec 17, 2008 2:34 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

He can play the 4 when he gains 20 pounds next offseason.

Or he goes KG crazy. I’m not all about the bulk, but I really don’t see him being effective with that much more time on the court. Right now, if opposing offenses started seeing him and learning his game a bit better, I’m 95% sure they’d eat him alive. Like Brady, I do like the guy, and I do have some hope that he’ll be an effective starter some day, but that day is not right now, no matter how much you or Sleepy want to believe it is.

"No no Nene!"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zB5DxNl4EB0

by Dubs fan in Boston on Dec 17, 2008 3:18 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

It’s funny that you act like we’re the ones grasping at straws. Brandan Wright has played well from day one of his NBA career. He is effective running the floor, effective in half-court… he’s done well against little guys and big guys. He succeeds in almost every game.

It’s cute that you’re “95% sure” he’d get “eaten alive” if teams saw more of him, but he’s not surviving through trickery… he’s fast and long and active on defense, much like on offense. He has held his own so far, and generally players get better defensively with more court time. Your theory is that Wright will get worse with court time, because… well, no because. You just think that.

To think that Brandan Wright wouldn’t be a capable starter at power forward is to ignore all available evidence. Yeah, he looks skinny and goofy. He doesn’t play that way.

by onlxn on Dec 17, 2008 4:31 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Wright will have trouble in some situations and be able to give people trouble in others. Most players player better with more playing time (up to a point). Very few guys who get small and irregular PT get worse when they get regular time. Some don’t get much better, but most get somewhat better. The degree to which the league “figures him out” is not likely to be greater than the degree with which he figures out things himself.

When I hear detractors talk about how they’ll figure him out, it sounds like he’s a one-trick pony, who’s had people fooled all along. I guess he had people fooled when he was one of the top 3 HS players in the country and when he started for one of the top college programs in the country from day one. It’s not like he’s a nobody who just picked up the game. He’s been an elite talent for a long time and he plays like he’s got elite talent. He had an unDogly fg% in one of the top conferences in the country and appears to be able to get shots to fall at far above average percentages in the pros too. The results are there. I’m not sure why Nellie seems blind to this, but he is.

Brandan won’t overpower people or back people down in the paint. That’s something that some PFs do, but not all, and there are ways to be effective at both ends of the court without throwing weight around. Sure, he could fail with more PT, but what he’s shown indicates that he’s earned the right to see. There’s a difference between throwing someone out there so we can see what he can do and putting someone out there to see if he can continue to do what he’s shown he can do.

by jae on Dec 17, 2008 7:24 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

onixn

The problem is, if you look at the stats, BWright is a good defender because he’s athletic and long-armed and gets lots of blocks, and he gets a lot of rebounds for the same reason.

However, he still gets overpowered for easy layups and rebounds with some regularity, which doesn’t show on the statsheet.

by bradyk2 on Dec 17, 2008 8:47 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

That does show up on the statsheet, though. You can tabulate how frequently the other team scores when Wright’s on the floor. You can tabulate how well his man does. When you add it all up, Wright still rates as a defensive positive.

I’m not saying he’s a brilliant defender. I’m not saying he doesn’t make mistakes. I’m not saying he doesn’t get pushed around at times.

I’m saying he’s a decent defender. The numbers say that, and so does the naked eye. And by virtue of being decent, he’s a better defender than most players on our team.

If he’s one of our most efficient offensive players, and one of our better defensive players, why isn’t he playing more? Why should the bar be so high for this one player, on this one turd of a team? He doesn’t have to be KG… he just has to be a better power forward than Stephen Jackson or Corey Maggette. And he is.

by onlxn on Dec 17, 2008 9:41 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Dubs fan...

Yeah, the only problem is he won’t get KG. KG is one of those special players who plays well largely because of his intensity and amazing will to get the ball. He and DH12 are like Rodman – they just have a will to get the ball that can’t be countered with strength.

I love Wright, but it is a twice in a decade player that has that will.

Plus, Garnett came into the league with a solid jumper.

by bradyk2 on Dec 17, 2008 8:46 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

In that case

We’ve got 1. Now my points even stronger. :-/

by bradyk2 on Dec 17, 2008 2:27 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Correction

I’ve been playing basketball pretty much since I could walk. I’m not sure what level you played at, but “real” basketball is exactly what Bradyk2 said-5 people on the court trying to put the ball in the basket. You’re telling me 10 guys at the park who only played high school ball are playing “better” ball than an NBA team.

No matter WHO was coaching or WHO our leader or captain is on the team, we cannot win with a team where 3 undrafted, d-league players are starting. What do you expect Buike and Watson to do? No one on this team can create offense for themselves so we gotta force it.

by Captain Jack on Dec 17, 2008 12:17 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

As have I

I have definitely played basketball since I’ve been walking as well, and at a competitive level. My point was, to sound nerdy, that the definition of basketball is, “a game played by two teams of usually five players each on a rectangular court having a raised basket or goal at each end, points being scored by tossing the ball through the opponent’s basket.”

My point was, there’s no such thing as REAL basketball, as long as you’re playing it. Every team in the NBA plays REAL basketball. You can argue strategy all you want, but I just failed to understand the “warriors don’t play real basketball” comment.

I never said anything suggesting that 10 guys at the park are better than an NBA team.

As for your second paragraph, I agree, which is why I don’t understand why everyone’s mad at Nellie. When all’s well (literally), we won’t be starting ANY undrafted d-leaguers. Our starting lineup will most likely be Ellis/Crawford/Jackson/Maggette/Biedrins. That’s four proven 20ppg players, and a proven 15 and 10er.

by bradyk2 on Dec 17, 2008 2:37 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Hi

All the fans that migrated from LA here ( like Call me The Truth… The Truth = Paul Pierce. Pierce = from LA. Coincidence? okay..> ) are super negative.

Suggestion, move to New York, watch baseball, the Yankees buy everyone

by sjboy on Dec 17, 2008 8:10 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

agree

I blame both Jackson and Nelson for not willing to drop their gigantic EGOs and do the right thing. Nelson needs to make the necessary adjustments to make this team gel better, game by game basis. Not just because Jackson and Maggette has huge contracts, they should play 48 minutes a game while hurting the team.

Nelson has a short leash on the rest of the team, time to extend that leash on to the struggling veterans. Jackson needs to realize playing hurt, while showing toughness and grittiness, isn’t always a good thing for the team. Michael Jordan playing with a flu-like symptom and dropping 48 pts on Utah while leading the team to a win is a good for the team. Baron Davis playing with a bruised ribs, sprained ankle against the Mavs in the playoffs and dunking on AK47 for a key win is good for the team. Biedrins playing with stomach pain in a win against the Celtics (21pts, 13 rb), which later he discovered was appendicitis, is good for the team.

Jackson sprained wrist, shooting below 20% for 5 straight games at a high volume, heavy minutes, in consecutive losses, not good for a team.

by buzzer beater on Dec 16, 2008 6:46 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Remember when Jackson played a huge role in getting the Warriors to the playoffs? Well, sort of. He was on that team and did his part, but the real turnaround happened with the return of Richardson and Davis to the lineup. Before that, Jackson was part of the squad that fell from one game under .500 before the trade to 9 games under .500 before they got it in gear. You get both good and bad with Jax. He’s been an adequate NBA player for quite some time. He got elevated in the minds of many into something beyond that last season. I suspect that the elevated opinions of him were somewhat misguided as are the extreme negative ones. But alas, Rowell decided he was the guy and extended him, so we’re stuck with him.

Remember when Nellie’s players lost faith in him in 94 as the team imploded into a mess that it didn’t come out of for more than a decade? Nellie can be a very good coach. He also has some serious faults, faults that are part the reason he’s never won a championship and faults that, when things are as they are now, get in his way of righting the ship. He’s great at cleaning up messes left by others, not so great at getting out of messes that occur on his watch. I’m not sure that Nellie is the coach for this roster in that he doesn’t seem to be much for working with younger guys. But alas, Rowell decided he was the guy and extended him, so we’re stuck with him.

by jae on Dec 16, 2008 7:01 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

No Nellie is average coach because

He takes a bad or average team and makes them good but when he has a good team he screws it up….thats why he has never won a championship.

by montadaboss on Dec 16, 2008 6:03 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

It's more like

Mullin and Rowell ruined our playoff team with stupid trades and free agent signings. I’m sorry but last time I checked he’s still the same exact coach-just on a worst team. How is that his fault?

by Captain Jack on Dec 17, 2008 12:21 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I love how

You take a hall of fame player/coach’s career and you sum it up in 1 line. Your knowledge of basketball is so small.

How many coaches have been around for 20+ years? When was the last time Don Nelson was an assistant?

Go do some reading before posting please.

by sjboy on Dec 17, 2008 8:13 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

as much

as i would like to trade jack…it may be a lil hard now cause of that damn contract extension we gave him. right now, i say FIRE NELLIE instead! i hate that old man…

When Maggette missed those consecutive shots in a span of a humming bird’s flap,
Crawford simply looked at the bench and said, "Are you serious?"

by gorillas on Dec 16, 2008 6:21 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

damnnn.........

Stephen Jackson SUCKS. He does not know how to make plays, and even if he does, they make a bigg fuzz about it. He does not know how to take it to the rim, he makes the stupidest drives thats impossible to make, and everytime he drives and doesnt make a basket, he looks at the ref and complains like a lil bitch! This guy is stiff as hell, everytime he gets the ball everyone stops moving, he posts up from like the 3 point line, he makes like 8 turnovers that really messes up the outcome of the game, and he isn’t clutch.

He sometimes does gets 20 points a game, but thats if he shoots like 40 damn shots!
But since people think he’s a great basketball player and give him alot of credit, I say trade him and Maggs for A.Jamison.

by proballer23 on Dec 16, 2008 7:05 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

I second the motion!

but seeing how our front office is…he will be with us till 2013.

My only hope is that he retires after this season, and get rid of Maggette this season for a pick or expiring contract.

I will always be your fan JRich. Good Luck

by chili01 on Dec 16, 2008 7:29 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

"I am a fan of real basketball."

Does And 1 count too? I love And 1!

by Tony.psd on Dec 16, 2008 8:08 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

I loved slamball

For about 15 minutes. Till that guy almost severed his ankle.

"No no Nene!"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zB5DxNl4EB0

by Dubs fan in Boston on Dec 17, 2008 2:02 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I just gotta ask...

WTF Jackson?? The dude can be a good player, but plays good in about 20% of his games this season, if that. The man plays the weakest defense I can remember seeing, and has no hustle. Any rookie has twice the hustle as him. AND I WONT EVEN GO INTO HIS HORRIBLE SHOTS HE TAKES.

by warriorsrballin on Dec 16, 2008 8:53 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Is anyone else tired??

Is anyone else tired of venting on this site? Like, making long posts about how we feel.

I would have made somewhat of a big post about what I like and don’t like about Jackson, but I noticed that this whole season i’ve been doing the same thing over and over again.

Long posts about:

“I still believe! We can still make the playoffs, this is why I think so!..”
“WTF! What happened in that game?!”
“Wow, Maggette was a waste”
“Dammit we have to do something about Jackson”.
“Wow, this team really sucks now. They’re pissing me off”.

It’s like a never ending parade of negativity. Why can’t this team go on a decent win streak for once, so we can all settle down and relax for a couple of days. It’s like this team is causing all of their fans to start nagging; every game showcases a new reason to make a long post about how bad the team is. =[

by Five Ten Entertainment on Dec 16, 2008 9:48 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Like... I wanna do something funny...

But we’re losing lol, and its blocking my focus to have fun w/ it…

i won’t lie, the past week or so I’ve wasted my time nagging back at folks here with all the negativity. I won’t take what I said or posted back but it has put a strain on my thinking ways… I need to rethink my priorities sad 2 say… mortgage is due next month and I gotta get that scrilla.

by Tony.psd on Dec 16, 2008 10:05 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

How about humorous pictures about how much we currently suck? lol.

The “We Suck” change up of the “We Believe” sign was hilarious.

I can see how it can be difficult to do a funny pic, though. I just tried thinking of a new picture idea you can probably do, but couldn’t come up with anything. It’s like, there’s a lot of negativity coming from all of us right now, and barely any comedic relief in any of our posts; that’s how bad the team is right now, they’re so frustrating that we can’t even joke about how much they suck. haha.

by Five Ten Entertainment on Dec 16, 2008 11:31 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

The worse sign design I think this year ws that Tricycle one...

I didn’t get any bad responses here on GSoM but at the game I either got no love at all, or Filipino’s just didn’t feel like saying anything… 80% of my people so to speak straight ignored me, walkped past me or were too stubborn to enjoy a good laugh… and while I spent most of the time explaining to non-pinoys what a tricycle was (which i didn’t mind) the whole Idea of representing “Filipino night” was a bad idea for me… not to say I’ll never bring a sign to the game again- the vibe was just so different that night…

I think Vonteego pointed it out the day after, about a crab effect within our culture. I’ve heard of it but never experienced it and when i finally did it left a bad taste in my mouth.

by Tony.psd on Dec 17, 2008 5:07 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Absolutely Agree

Man, if anybody has watched any Warriors game, you really hit the nail on the head about SJax. He is playing soooooooooooo badly right now. It’s really quite embarrassing. “Glorified Rec Player”. I haven’t heard a better description of someone since Elaine called Kramer a “Hipster Doufus”. Well put.

But I have to say in his defense that he is playing injured. And he has played well in the past. I don’t think he really is this bad. But if he is playing this bad due to injury, due to bad attitude, due to trying to do too much to make the team win, due to any reason, he should be sat down on the bench. Or he should be on the injury unable to play list. Or some other thing, but he shouldn’t be on the court playing the way he is.

And I put that on Nelly. He needs to step up to the players that aren’t playing well or giving a good effort on defense or ballhogging and put them down. If he’s afraid another Al Harrington situation is going to arise, then he clearly does not have control of the team. Or he doesn’t care. But in either case Nelly needs to be talked to by upper management because if something doesn’t change then he should be let go for someone who will take out underperforming players and put them on the injury report or let them ride pine for a while until they get their act together.

by runandgun on Dec 16, 2008 11:01 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Been saying this for years now...

This guy is the guy when you get him on your team in a pickup game, everybody on your team is quietly pissed, you’ll probably lose, you can’t tell him anything or he’ll fly off the handle. Ruins chemistry, no ball movement. Isn’t he leading, or second in, the league in turnovers? He never even tries to rebound. Each game he’ll be good for 3 “bull in a china shop” drives, lose the ball out of bounds of his knee, complains to the ref like my 3 year old daughter when I take away he fruit snacks, then his guy dunks at the other end before he crosses court plays. While we’re at it, can we dump Nellie too? What do we really think he’s gonna accomplish here? He ruined our team once already, remember C-Webb?

by mr40waters on Dec 16, 2008 11:10 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Stephen Jackson

I like him when he plays his role, but not when he does anything more. He was great last season when a majority of our offense came from Baron and Monta; but when Jackson is our “top guy”, that’s when he starts getting ugly. Having a group like Baron/Monta/Jackson/Harrington was great because it took pressure off of everyone. But now, we have a lot of talent but no one is meshing with each other on the team.

Once Monta comes back, things might get a little better. Jackson can start playing his role more, with Crawford and Ellis as the main source of scoring. Just give the guy a chance, he’s never had this much pressure on him to lead a team before. I wanna see the team play with Monta back before I start making bold statements about Jackson.

by Five Ten Entertainment on Dec 16, 2008 11:36 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Another problem is that

Jackson himself has admitted that he’s not used to Nellie’s new drive-and-kick offense. It takes away from Jacks iso style of play, where he says he’s had the most success. I think the best game we had in terms of looking reasonably smooth on offense was that @Oklahoma game when Jack was out. The ball was moving, it was dizzying, every player was acting on instinct. There was no stopping and thinking in the game flow.

I wish Nellie would experiment without Jack for a few games and see what happens.

by IQofaWarrior on Dec 16, 2008 11:38 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Yes, experiment without Jax, without Magette, and using Watson sparingly because he has a tendency to non-pass and ball-hog as well, although I like his heart/effort and rebounding better then the other said guys.

Stick with the max effort, hussle, team, pass, run, gun, race, whatever you want to call it guys: Monta, Bellinelli, Randolph, Wright, Biedrins, Turiaf, Azabuike, Kurz, Morrow. Let Randolph and CJ play if they are playing the team game, if not, put there butts on the bench. Trade Magette and put SJax on the Injured list until he is healthy. If Donny boy isn’t able to do that, then yank his butt too.

by runandgun on Dec 16, 2008 11:53 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

wat?

dude, he’s the heart and soul of the Dubs now. You can’t get rid of him without totally killing the team

Ellis to the RIM!
Monta for the win?! YES!

by XIAOXIAO on Dec 17, 2008 3:20 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

+1

Agree. Fire Jackson!

=Gaucho=

by Gaucho! on Dec 17, 2008 4:16 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

lol

Gaucho = Santa Barbara = Close to LA.

Close to LA guy asking for a firing.

Im telling you guys, we’ve been taken over by LA FANS!!

by sjboy on Dec 17, 2008 8:14 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

woah now sjboy

i went to ucsb, and i do not endorse this gaucho’s point of view. besides for all know he could be from argentina…

"They can trade me," Bonds said. "I don't think they will, though. It's not like I want to be traded, man. I'm a Giant. I'm stuck here till the end."

by GameSix on Dec 17, 2008 9:30 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

besides for all know he could be from argentina…

or El Ceritto

by jae on Dec 17, 2008 10:13 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Jackson should just get him minutes limited...

While he is playing like crap right now, it is hard to get rid of him completely without getting another leader-type back. Cap’n Jack is the one, ever since coming from Indy, who’s been keeping everyone together as a team instead of everyone being out on their own. If you get rid of him completely, it doesn’t look like anyone could really step up and be that “glue” we all know Cap’n Jack to be.

by Dr. Orpheus on Dec 17, 2008 11:26 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

Also...

I feel like people underestimate Jack.

Is he playing horribly now? Yes.
Does he have poor shot selection? Yes.
Do I cringe when I’m streaming the play-by-play and it says “incoming shot by stephen Jackson?” Yes.
Does he turn the ball over too much? Yes.

Would we have won more than 7 games if we didn’t have him? NO.

by bradyk2 on Dec 17, 2008 3:13 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Well...

Clearly that means Nelson deserves to be fired! Yay!!!

"No no Nene!"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zB5DxNl4EB0

by Dubs fan in Boston on Dec 17, 2008 3:20 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Haha

Well, some certainly feel that way.

I don’t but that’s just me….

by bradyk2 on Dec 17, 2008 8:47 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

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