Trade Rumors/Possible Trades/Nellie?
by gswLLBatman on Apr 18, 2008 12:02 AM PDT
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PrintWhats all this talk of trading Baron Davis. You're talking about trading Baron freakin Davis the guy that turned the entire franchise around in 2 and a half years with help of course. He is probably the 2nd most consistent player on the team besides Monta. He brings the energy and the soul to the team when they need it the most. Trading Baron with one more year left on his contract and while his in his prime would be straight up stupid. Monta is not ready to lead the team yet especially with his lack of true point guard skills, plus we have to vet to teach him besides Baron. Baron is untradeable at this point and time because of what he obviously brings to the team and every player has his off nights we just notice his more because he is the face of the team. I would personally like to start the Shawn Marion movement. What Marion brings to the team: reliable defense, scoring from all over the floor, reliable rebounding, knowledge of run n gun basketball. His basically a stronger, bigger, more athletic Harrington without the focus on the 3-point shooting. We could trade Pietrash, Barnes, Harrington, POB, Kosta and some draft picks becaue Miami wanted Pietrash and Barnes last year so I'm guessing there is still some interest. They need a center there as well might as well use the centers we are not using. Lastly, I think Nellie should stop coaching the Warriors. I didn't say fire or let go, what i meant is he should be promoted to some executive position and let someone like Keith Smart take over or any coach that has a run n gun mentality but with a bigger emphasis on defense, rebounding, and has an actual rotation. This season when the Warriors wanted to play D they did but most of the time we either lost or we were to late to act. Rebounding, I don't know about the rest of you but I don't think the less rebounds more forced turnovers thing worked out this year. Why not have both. Nellie obviously overplayed his starters. Baron, Monta, Jax, Al, and Beans were exhausted as the season went on. We have a bench, Nellie never utilized it to its potential. Decent Centers in Kosta and POB, not good decent. Croshere was whatever, could be easily replaced for some young guy, Wright was so under used this year it was not even funny. We got Kaz, Belinelli, and Watson to give a to the best back court in the league why the hell not use them. Nellie's theory of playing the vets first is stupid. If you have talented rookies use them for God sakes.
This FanPost is a submission from a member of the mighty Golden State of Mind community. While we're all here to throw up that W, these words do not necessarily reflect the views of the GSoM Crew. Still, chances are the preceding post is Unstoppable Baby!
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I wonder
if Marion would stay in Miami if they get the 1st pick. He will be third option again after Wade and probably Beasley.
true
which is also why he would not enjoy being the 3rd or 4th option on the Dubz.
Let Miami or someone else pay him max for long-term. When his athleticism fades towards the end of his huge contract, he will be even more overpaid and overated.
by misterjennings on Apr 18, 2008 11:54 AM PDT up reply actions
im sticking with my
marion sign and trade to the clips for brand theory. marion gets to be the man for the clippers, and pat riley gets one of his favorite big men to put next to dwade. marion cant really go anywhere else. but id love to get him here.
Marion at power forward
Baron, Monta,Jackson, Marion, Biedrins, does Marion want to get abused each night against the opposing teams power players? A beefed up Brandon Wright would be our best option, but Marion would be a great offense/defense/rebounder on this team and Nelson can substitute Wright, Bellinelli and Buke off the bench. I like this trade but Marion is asking for a max contract and would be $$$$. He needs to play in the run and gun west to utilize his skills. Wow, why didn’t Mullin make this move before the trading deadline?
because the suns
wanted Shaq and not TMNT, POB, Pietrus or whoever else that we had to offer.
Also, the Suns would never give Marion up to a conference rival because he could end up coming back to bite them.
by misterjennings on Apr 18, 2008 11:44 AM PDT up reply actions
meh
the only thing i really took away from this is u saying baron is the second most consistant player on the team, which is not true. monta and andris are by far the two most consistant
Good Post.
You made alot of good points, especially about making Keith Smart head coach. I’m very curious about what coaching tactics he would use with the team we have since he has been under Nellie all this time as Assistant Coach.
As you said, I think he would emphasize D, Boards, believe in his bench and be less strict on them, and hopefully keep the run-n-gun style of play that we all love to watch.
I 100% agree with you when you said:
“If you have talented rookies use them for God sakes.”
If the dubs keep that Run-n-Gun style, we definitely need them and the bench as it was living proof that a 6-man rotation worked in the beginning but faultered at the end.
One thing I don’t want is Marion on this team. I love to watch him play and i like his game, but I think we got other talent on the team that could provide what Marion brings.
Maybe Wright can? Maybe Biedrins improves his game even more tremendously by developing a 15ft jump shot and a solid post game?
I know there are some (or alot?)of Beans haters, but i really wanna keep this kid cuz I think he is going to be one bad mofo in the league. He even has a leather wallet that says “bad mofo” in the front of it.
If Mullin keeps his word to keep Money Ellis and Beans, I think they are going to be one of the best Duos in the NBA.
As alot of people been talking about, Beans just needs a servicable PF or even a great PF along side. Like a Milsap, Leon Powe, Maxiell, etc…
Those mentioned and alot of PF’s are slept on late in the draft.
What happened to Chris Taft? I really liked that kid too. If he was healthy along side of Beans, I think the dubs woulda wrecked fools in the West.
I also hope we can get Joey Doresy somehow. I think he would compliment Beans and the dubs.
Okay im done with this wall of text. Bye.
[ passes mic over to GSoM heads for further commenting ]
Romes Mac Mojous
by ROMESdavidWOOD37 on Apr 18, 2008 9:05 AM PDT reply actions
i want see 08/09 W’s like
Baron
Jax
Monta
AB
Wright
Azubuike
Kosta
CJ
others may go and bring something better back
and one more thing
i think lot of people don’t realize how big potential Kosta has just because he is big -at least while players like Mbenga are still playing for teams like Lakers
build a team & destroy the roof
by Lat We N Trash on Apr 18, 2008 10:57 AM PDT reply actions
not convinced about kosta
the kid is big, but his game is typical of euros, he likes to shoot jump shots and is averse to banging the boards/physical play. he’s young though and that can develop w/ time.
"i'm just trying to follow my dream, dad."
"but your dream is stupid!"
by pervisNeverNervous on Apr 18, 2008 11:44 AM PDT reply actions
i was wery sceptical about him before this season
but not now
i think problem is his nature -he seems like very quiet shy guy -but it can be changed by maturing -that’s why he looks lost on court beside Baron or SJax
but he is BIG and with soft touch to ball
build a team & destroy the roof
by Lat We N Trash on Apr 18, 2008 11:59 AM PDT up reply actions
Really fill the need
Nellie will be back, so’ll BD, Monta, Capt Jack & AB.
The priority will be frontcourt starter.
GSW needs to package TMNT & surplus future pick(s) & who ever else it takes to get one of these guys:
J.Oneal,Artest,Kirilenko,Marion. Buike,CJ,Bnelli, likely to return, along with Wright (6th man) & Perovic. With a years more seasoning & strength the bench will be in a position for Nellie to trust ‘em enough to keep us fresh for the playoff push ‘09. How many years did it take for Suns to figure out how to keep Nash fresh for postseason?
how?
As much as I’d like to have the bigmen you mentioned, there is no way the warriors acquire any of them.
If Indiana trades JO, they’re looking for a young bigman in return to replace him. They’re not looking for an Al Harrington.
Do you think Cohan, or Stern, wants to reunite Jackson and Artest? Exactly how will Artest fix our rebounding and streaky shooting?
AK would be great. Coach Sloan knows this. He’s not going to give a team in his own conference the
“missing piece to the puzzle”. They’re looking to win now, not get picks to draft players that might pan out in the future.
Marion’s not only a very valuable player, but also likely an expiring contract (unless he opts out and decides he’d like to play for Memphis). If the Heat decide to trade him, they can get more than Al Harrington and a mid first round pick back. I’ll give you one thing, which is Marion is probably more easily acquired than the other players on this list.
re- how?
My post was flush with the frustration of how we missed playoffs & finished real weak. So I relied more on the emotion/wish part of my list of who, rather than how realistic acquiring one of these guys might actually be. Sacrificing Cohans money might be more realistic than any of the core guys.
So, I’ll admit shopping for such bigmen may be easier said than done…Given Nellie’s unwillingness to go with rookies, having just finished a 3 rookie roster season, a Dev league guy, or a Chris Wilcox type guy, might be what Mully settles for.
Trading
in the NBA is not an easy task. In order to get something good you have to give up something good in return. The Warriors dont have a lot in terms of trade assets, because so much of our roster has contracts that expire in June.
For the record, Pietrus, Barnes, and POB wont be a part of the club once we can make trades….. and they have no value anyways…. The only tradable assets are the guys we want to keep. Harrington might have some value to a playoff team that needs a scorer off the bench (Houston, Cleveland, etc.) but he has a big contract and it’ll be hard to work a deal.
Realistically the Warriors will have to make their biggest splashes in free agency this offseason. If Al can get off loaded to a team with cap space its possible the warriors can gain another trade exception (like for JRich) which is more valuable because it means we have more cap space for free agents.
Lets hope Mully keeps his streak going of making the right front office decisions!
trade ideas??
What about trading the 08 1st rd pick for Charlie Villanueva??
Or trading the trade exception for Josh Smith and then adding the 08 1st rd pick in a seperate deal??
I think either one of them (esp J.Smith) would be great for the warriors and the system that they run.
Villanueva? No thanks. Adequate rebounder for a guy his size, but someone 6-10 should hit more than 43% of his shots (especially since he’s not deadly with the 3-ball). This guy would add nothing but more errant jump shots.
he would add a big body who would guard the other teams big body. Why would he have hit 3pts?? Do you want him to be troy murphy or something. he would be a good addition to the bench. He’s not a superstar but the warriors need a couple bigs. If you expect him to solve all of the rebound problems he wont.
Well, since he doesn’t hit a high percentage of his 3s, he’s neither a Troy Murphy nor a post player. He hasn’t shown much on offense or on defense. He won’t solve the rebound problem and big men who can’t rebound don’t really help on defense. Someone needs to collect boards after misses or you do not get a defensive stop. He won’t solve the post scoring problem either. I don’t really see anything to recommend him.
draft picks
Lottery picks are valuable and would have to be included only for an all star forward, I would keep our 1st round pick and try to trade up for another one later in the round. We probably could have traded Pietrus straight up for Villanueva and not waste a draft pick. Josh Smith would be difficult to pry away from Atlanta even if we gave up our lottery pick. We would probably have to include Brandon Wright in the deal.
re:draft picks
Lottery picks are valuable but who has the warriors developed lately(im talkin about 2000thru now) that turned into good players besides Jrich(the jury is still out on Bwright) Don Nelson hardly ever plays rookies. Yeah the warriors could have gotten Villanueva for pietrus straight up but they didnt. I would give up BWright and this years lottery pick for Josh Smith. I know everyone is saying that this is a good draft but it is probably Nelson and possibly Baron last year(hopefully not) JSmith is a restricted free agent and CVillanueva will be in his last year of his contract. JSmith would be hard to get though.
one more thing
The warriors did develop ellis but he is not a lottery pick.
Wasted Picks
Lasme, Taft,POB, Perovic, Murphy, Dunleavy, Dampier, Ike, Todd Fuller, etc. etc. .... we got lucky with Biedrins and Monta, but the Warriors are horrible at evaluating talented big men. I have little faith in the Warriors ever getting the best available player in the draft regardless of position because they are always reaching for that undersized and /or unpolished PF/C. Nellie saved this team by not having to use a 4 and instead play 3 shooting guards. We should be patient and just start stockpiling the best players available to use for future trades. No team wants to trade for stiffs/garbage players.
Dampier wasn’t drafted by the Warriors. He was acquired in trade. Taft played reasonably well when healthy. It’s hard to really consider a second round pick who makes the club ‘wasted.’ Many, many 2nd rounders see their last real action in the summer league.
Dreadfully few teams are good at evaluating big men. Taft had talent. Verdict is out on Perovic but as a second rounder, if he’s a good practice player, he’s ahead of the curve. For a middle of the draft pick, Murphy turned out reasonable. A starter in the league drafted then is a pretty reasonable result. Since the team and office has turned over entirely since Fuller was drafted, I’m not exactly sure what the relevance of him as an indication of the club’s ability to judge talent is.
In general, after the first few picks, most big men are lucky to be journeymen stiffs. This isn’t something particular to the Warriors. There’s a premium of demand on bigs that tends to make GMs across the league somewhat stupid into gambling that the guy with 4 thumbs will somehow turn into a legitimate post player.
Miami
Would you trade Monta/ Al and our #14 pick to Miami for Marion and the #1 in the draft if Miami happens to end up with it? Baron, Jackson, Marion, Beasley, Biedrins as our starting 5. Would this team be competitive? Who would you must have, Baron or Monta?
Trading Baron
is very realistic. It’s not STUPID. He turned this franchise around in 2 and half years with the help of Jack and Al and will command top dollar on the FA market. With extensions looming for Monta and Biedrins, you really suppose Cohan would be willing to go into luxury tax territory for a point guard who takes some quarters off? I love Baron, but don’t get me wrong…there are a pretty good handful of other players I’d rather have in a Dubb uniform. I’m personally tired of his stat-padding defense.
Yes, Baron played all 82 games this year and we seen where that got us. Baron was better served either getting injured (since we didn’t have a legitimate backup at PG) and playing 65 games so he’d at least be able to finish the season strong.
Extensions between Baron, Monta, and AB would cost nearly $40 million already with an entire roster to fill out. Where on the other hand you have Monta and AB, both very young and up and coming players with more cap room to play with. Yes Baron did much for this franchise…but we’re not winning a championship or heading to the top of the west with Diddy, Tay, AB, and fillers. Sorry, it just isn’t happening.
You talk of bringing in Shawn Marion? Are you kidding me? We’d have $60M in payroll with those 4 alone. We do need 12 on the active roster. Plus you talk of trading Pietrus, Barnes, and POB all whom are free agents?
Let’s be serious here… we have a few options:
1. We do not extend Baron…let him walk after this year and we build around Tay, AB , and B-Wright and look towards a nice 2009 FA class and and a stellar 2010 FA class.
2009/10- Iverson, Rasheed, Elton Brand, Chris Paul, Deron Williams,
2010/11- Amare, McGrady, LeBron, D-Wade, Chris Bosh,
2. We resign Baron, Tay, and AB to long-term extensions, forcing us to resign to perennially fighting for a low seed in the Western Conference. (I just really don’t see Cohan being able to open up the wallet. We’re talking about a guy who sued the co-owners of the W’s when he first bought on and a guy whom the IRS were seeking close to $160M in back taxes.)
3. We resign Baron, Tay and AB to extensions. Cohan is willing to hit the luxury tax for a year or two and is willing to go hard after a legitimate low post presence/ banger and an able shot-blocker to complement AB well. Not to mention, he dishes out some money to bring some talent and veteran presence to our bench…helping lead Golden State deep into the playoffs and hopefully to a Championship.
And another thing....
“energy and soul to the team when they need it most”
Did you see the Phoenix game? The most pivotal game of the year? That was the one of the worst, if not worst half of basketball I’ve ever seen Baron play. He played absolutely no defense, was not looking to pass the ball, and was lethargic on both ends of the court. Baron plays when he wants to. Plain and simple.
the Phoenix game was the most pivotal of the year? I thought the Denver game, one where if they won they’d control their own destiny, was significantly more pivotal. As Denver won out, the Phoenix game was meaningless.
Ok
maybe a different choice of words were in order. Maybe still one of the more pivotal games of the year. The game still had meaning and still could lead to a possible playoff berth, so the game was far from meaningless.
If Baron were to play on both ends of the court for the entire time he’d be out there, maybe I’d feel differently.
It should be pointed out...
That we will not trade Baron Davis. We may lose him to Free Agency, but there is no possibility of us trading him, regardless of how smart some people may think it. That’s not to sound arrogant, just that management is not going to trade him. They may lose him, but not on purpose.
Also...
I don’t think anyone would pick up his $17 mil next year…
Good Point.
He’s worth it, in my opinion, but people may be weary of his injuries.
BD
Is an expiring contract next year (if he doesn’t opt out) and his value at the trade deadline will be significant.
I think
baron should be traded for dekek rose. He is just so talented and I think he could teach monta a lot on defense, due to their similar frame. Monta+D.Rose= Dynasty
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