The "Win Now for Nellie!" Movement
A brief recent history of the Golden State Warriors.
- Don Nelson winning, exciting Basketball.
- 13 years of Hell.
- Don Nelson winning, exciting Basketball.
Mr. Cohan, respectfully, screw the salary cap/luxury tax. If you are willing to pay Nellie $5 million to come back, buy him a team. Please. Even if it does cost you some money. (How's that loss of playoff revenue feel, btw?) You have a core of great young players for the future, but you also have three leaders right now and a small window of time to win. Bite the bullet and bring the bucks.
I urge all of you GSoMers and all of the Warrior Nation to make some noise to try to get Mr. Cohan to open his heart and his pocketbook to give Nellie a great going away year (or two) WHILE still planning for the future!

WARNING! I am no expert! This is all just from stuff that I have read. I could be totally wrong!!! And of course this is just one scenario...add yours in the comments!
Our salary cap situation, as I understand it. (Please correct me if I am wrong) The cap will be between $55-57 million this year. The luxury tax kicks in around $72 million?
We do NOT have to worry about the cap to keep Buike, Beans and Monta! All have either Bird rights or, in Buike's case early Bird rights. The same goes for Pietrus, ( I think) if Nellie wants him.
Geoff Lepper recently said our cap number is $46 million.
With only Baron, Jax, Al, Belli, Wright and Kosta signed.
Kawakami says the maximum any team other than the Warriors can offer Ellis and Biedrins: 5 years, $75.2M. Worst case scenario, both will get at least close to those offers. If that happens, we're screwed. If we get lucky and can keep Monta for less, their combined salary is abest case scenario of about $15 mil.
That takes us to $61 million. Already over the cap! So Cohan is already kissing the bonus for staying below the cap goodbye.
We can also sign our rookies regardless of the cap, figure around $3 million and we are at 64, leaving approximately $8 million to fill out the bench before hitting the tax.
Add Buike (a must!) at around 2.5...66.5
But the only way we can sign bench players if we are over the cap is with the MLE and the Bi-annual exception. Estimated at 5.7 for the MLE and 1.9 for the BE.
Let's recap at this point. The team so far.
- Baron, Belli (?)
- Ellis, Buike, Belli
- Jax, Buike #2 pick
- Al, Wright, #1 pick
- Beans, Kosta
66.5 or 5.5 left before the tax. About the same as the MLE. That gives us 11 players...and a crappy bench. We obviously still need a back up PG, a better backup SF than the #2 pick gives us, and backup C.
My solution? Diop and Beno Udrih. They should fit nicely under the MLE and the tax. The problem the is at the backup SF. Though we would still have room to sign a 'cheap' SF with the B.E., there just aren't any out there that I can see. We could get Julius Hodge (h/t Mind of Mullin) from the D-league....Or.... resign Pietrus with his Bird rights. But that might put us over the Luxury Tax < gasp! > by a million or two. At which point why not sign CJ to round out our 15?
- Baron, Beno, CJ or #2 pick
- Ellis, Buike, Belli
- Jax, Buike, Pietrus
- Al, Wright, #1 pick
- Beans, Diop, Kosta
"Win Now for Nellie!"
Notes: The keys are Diop and Beno, solid relatively cheap guys who could bloom, or who will be gone in two years. Duhon is a better PG, but will be a couple of million more, Cohan says no! Udreh is an up and comer though and seems solid. (Plus we then have Beno, Belli, Buike and Brandon coming off the bench...the Killer B's!) Nellie would be comfortable with Diop from Dallas, and gets his shotblocker. Either Buike or MP should be 'on' on a given night, Nellie can mix and match them. We can't count on Nellie playing the rooks, but if they bloom, so much the better!
So, Cohan <strong>has</strong> to go over the cap/tax for a year until Baron leaves, (30 year old PG, big salary, will want a big, long term deal, great FA crop coming....sorry, he's gone next year.) Adonal is off the books, and we don't need Al for Nellie's system....see below.
(Note, if I was Mullin...I would break the bank for Calderon as the PG of the future, he should be even more than Duhon, but a FA PG with his potential doesn't come around very often...GET HIM now!)
Nellie gets everything he needs for his last year, with matchup flexibility and at least decent players everywhere. But we DO go over the luxury tax. After Nellies last year, the team under contract becomes a VERY ice base to add a big time Free Agent to!..... (see bottom of post)
Unless we trade Al.
But the only way that works to help the tax situation is to "Jrich him' Trade him to JUST move up in the draft and get another TPE. Back to square one with the Brandon scenario. A rook Nellie probably won't play, we won't get Beasley, lol. And the lynchpin of Nellie's 3 point shooting, big man to spread the floor, philosophy gone. And Brandon starting, after Nellie wouldn't even play him off the bench!. We could try to trade AL for Artest, but why would Sacto do that? Doesn't make sense for them unless they REALLY want the TPE for some reason. So we can't trade Al. The Don would not be happy.
Or be back.
I think this is the real story of the off-season, a little war between Nellie and Cohan to get the team Nellie wants. We can't get a <strong>ton</strong> better, we just don't have the pieces to trade, etc. No championship .....yet. But if Brandon, Buike and Belli come along and we have a bench Nellie can <em>play</em> to rest the starters and do his matchup magic, this is a darn good team. My theory is that if Cohan won't pony up the bucks this year, Don won't be back. Which makes EVERYTHING different and the Warriors a 'build for the future' team.
Which will be the subject of my next entry!
,
,
2009 team under contract
- Ellis (with two summers and a full season to learn the point.) Beno, CJ or this years #2 pick
- Buike, Belli, 2009 #2 pick
- Jax, FA or 2009 #1 draft pick
- Wright, this years #1
- Beans, Diop
With nice cap room to sign a big FA!
This FanPost is a submission from a member of the mighty Golden State of Mind community. While we're all here to throw up that W, these words do not necessarily reflect the views of the GSoM Crew. Still, chances are the preceding post is Unstoppable Baby!
0 recs |
32
comments
Comments
Win for Nellie!
I concur on that! However, I don’t think we need to change our roster much…
by bradyk2 on Apr 21, 2008 11:18 PM PDT 0 recs
I agree
Just adding Udreh and Diop would make a huge difference, if the BW and Belli can contribute this year.
by Wdharma on
Apr 22, 2008 12:14 AM PDT
up
0 recs
i am so
confused? where did Wright go in your roster?
by saintdee on Apr 21, 2008 11:38 PM PDT 0 recs
ooops, I call him Brandon
Since that happens to be the name of a old friend, lol I changed it in the diary for clarity, thanks.
by Wdharma on Apr 22, 2008 12:18 AM PDT 0 recs
Interesting...
I think you’re a few thousand below what it’ll take to get Udrih and Diop, but overall that’s what we’d need. If Nellie can convince Cohan to open the coffers, more power to him. It still has to be done right. I’d still like to target Kirilenko. Utah is going to have to sign Deron soon and Millsap now, we could give them Al (an expiring 3pt shooter) and Kosta (to keep the white guy ratio). Or S&T PoB or something.
I don’t know about the word out of Utah at the moment, but he was in the “falling out of favor/crying about PT” mode the last two years… maybe he reconciled with the 38% 3pt shooting this year.
by Dubs fan in Boston on Apr 22, 2008 10:10 AM PDT 0 recs
Why exactly is everyone thinking that Millsap will be a free agent this year? He originally signed a 2 year deal with a team option for the 3rd year (http://deseretnews.com/dn/view/0,1249,650197868,00.html). There’s zero chance that they won’t exercise the option.
We more or less completely lost our S&T options with the POB when his 3rd year wasn’t exercised. We don’t have Bird rights for him and he’s an unrestricted free agent. We’re also limited in what we can offer him as a free agent to what he’d have made if we had exercised his option. Granted, no one else will offer him more, but neither does anyone else have much incentive to try to acquire him that way. At the price he’ll command on the market, just about any team can find a way to make him fit.
by jae on
Apr 23, 2008 11:08 AM PDT
up
0 recs
Sorry...
Sorry for only using the ESPN trade machine for my Millsap info.
I’d forgotten about PoB’s UFA status and it’s effect on our ability to offer a contract… oops. And I’m guessing we couldn’t perform this trade until we settle things with our own RFAs. Meh… gotta use Kosta then.
by Dubs fan in Boston on
Apr 24, 2008 8:12 AM PDT
up
0 recs
Udrih... Is it likely?
First off, wonderful post… thanks for putting the time into it.
I like the idea of signing Udrih but i am skeptical of the likelihood…
I just read a Sac-Bee article in which it states that the Kings are probably willing to put up most of their MLE to re-sign him.
Even if we offered him a similar deal where do you think he would prefer to play? This is what his agent had to say about Beno’s returning to the Kings:
“It’s certainly been a good fit,” said Udrih’s agent, Marc Cornstein. “When the season is over, I’ll sit down with Beno and go over the priorities, but I would have to guess playing time and role are the most important.”
If he stays, he’s the starter in Sac Town where he’s likely to get more minutes and have a clear role as the team’s starting PG for the future.
Does the prospect of being the starting PG here after Baron departs really tempt him away? If he comes here his role and his minutes are much more uncertain.
Granted, I think he would see substantial minutes next year in a dubs uniform because we all saw this year that Baron needs a lot more rest. However, it won’t be starter minutes…
So although I like the idea, I am just not sure what we have to offer in order to tempt him away from re-signing with Sacto…
"To be a great champion you must believe you are the best. If you're not, pretend you are." - Muhammad Ali
by Dubs Wise on Apr 22, 2008 10:29 AM PDT 0 recs
Thanks
And thanks for the info on Beno I was hoping Sac was undervaluing him, too bad! And too bad we didn’t sign him when we had the chance last year instead of Thud, sigh.
Next option….to answer kenntoe below then too….Nellie was playing Monta more at the ‘point’ in the few minutes that Baron rested. Maybe that is the solution, while seeing if CJ comes along. That opens more PT for both Belli and Buike, which with Buike at least improves our D when Baron is off the court. That would probably come close to keeping us out of the tax while bringing either MP or MB back.
I would go ahead and use our #2 pick on a PG for sure then…and hope for another Agent Zero, LOL
by Wdharma on
Apr 22, 2008 1:11 PM PDT
up
0 recs
duhon
i think he’d be cheaper than beno actually. especially with the concerns about his commitment when he went to see the duke game on an off day without notifying the team. he’s a little more physical as well and would be a better guy to pair with monta than cj, when baron is resting.
by sam23 on
Apr 24, 2008 12:25 AM PDT
up
0 recs
The best way
The easy way to win one for nellie would be to hog tie and gag him so we can get some post players and build a half court game and a defense. When it’s over untie him and stick a cigar in his mouth and hand him a beer.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Apr 22, 2008 10:35 AM PDT 0 recs
I think it's most realistic
to expect the same core to come back with:
1. Increased role for Marco and Brandan.
2. (Hopefully) Better contributing bench players.
3. (As a result of reason #2) Less minutes for Baron, Jack and Monta.
I think Diop is an interesting player to go after…as long as he’s not the Only big man we get this offseason.
I think CJ should be given the opportunity to come back and be the back up under Baron. He’s earned that with his play last year just like Kelenna in 06-07’.
Give him the first try and we may not need to use the MLE on a backup pg.
Warriors, Stupidest franchise in the league.
by kenntoe on Apr 22, 2008 12:18 PM PDT 0 recs
The bench is the key
Well the bench and the Al situation
Some good big man role players out there this year to set up for trying to get a big FA….in 2009, or trading Barons expiring contract for one at midseason….IF the team doesn’t gel. I wouldn’t mind picking up Skinner or Ely for cheap either
See my post above for the PG sitch in light of Sac wanting to keep Beno. The CJ/Ellis size and defense problem is the only thing that concerns me there.
As I say in the diary, I would LOVE to get Calderon, whatever he costs, for next year and beyond.
by Wdharma on
Apr 22, 2008 1:25 PM PDT
up
0 recs
get rid of Al?
i admit, i was calling for that… at the trade deadline when we could have actually gotten something for him. now, it’s too late. besides, we need a strong bench, Al is a strong bench player, though he’s certainly not a starter. he gives the W’s a versatile player who can guard a 5, 4 or even 3. he stretches the floor on offense and CAN heat up. of course, he has his problems, well documented on this blog, so i won’t get into them.
unfortunately, i don’t think that CJ is the answer. jeeze, look at him and monta in the back court, 2 guys who weight < 180. they will get ABUSED.
keeping our young players and signing a good PF is what this team needs. i’m not looking at the draft as a place to help us out immediately, so, by the math above, i’m not sure where the money to get a backup for dizzle will come.
speaking of boom, my gut feeling is this guy is gonna be a W for a long time, for better or worse. if the W’s can win next year without dizzle having to impersonate jordan every night, his leadership and distribution skills make him a marketable player even as his physical skills decline (ala stockton, kidd)
"i'm just trying to follow my dream, dad."
"but your dream is stupid!"
by pervisNeverNervous on Apr 22, 2008 2:35 PM PDT 0 recs
Nice diary
Very well done. I think chances are that your plan is pretty close to what the front office is thinking. The only thing is the specific players you mentioned (Beno and Diop) may have earned themselves a slightly higher paycheck next year. You are definitely on the right track though, as far as the types of players to look out for in the offseason.
I would agree that CJ will get the chance to earn the job in Summer League/Training camp. Hopefully he could be an affordable option with another offseason to improve his game.
I would guess that next year we see a slightly more mature (for better or worse) version of the team we had this year. We need to bank on the improvement of AB, Monta and B Wright, and hope for a key FA signing or two to add depth. If we are really lucky we might even get a serviceable player in the draft. I don’t see a major roster overhaul.
"...OlympicMike is clearly the Barack Obama of GSoM"-Sleepy
by olympicmike on Apr 22, 2008 2:56 PM PDT 0 recs
er... Nice FanPost =P
"...OlympicMike is clearly the Barack Obama of GSoM"-Sleepy
by olympicmike on
Apr 22, 2008 2:59 PM PDT
up
0 recs
I agree.
...As much as I like living out crazy-wild-fanboy-dreams.
This team would’ve been in the playoffs if it weren’t for a lack of depth. Jack’s 6 game suspension, Nellie refusing to incorporate the rookies early, Mickael’s Injury (as much as some of you like to argue) all had a big impact on our season.
Now, i’m not saying we would’ve done anything in the playoffs, just that we’re at least a playoff caliber team and shouldn’t be too down on the impressive season they put together.
Warriors, Stupidest franchise in the league.
by kenntoe on
Apr 22, 2008 3:08 PM PDT
up
0 recs
Don't forget!!!
Andris’ appendix! That killed our Feb/March push.
by Dubs fan in Boston on
Apr 24, 2008 8:15 AM PDT
up
0 recs
minor changes
keys to next season, a healthy Baron and Jackson, sign Monta and Biedrins, and draft the best available at #14, regardless of position, we need someone who is ready to contribute as well as a trading chip. We need a backup SF, PG,PF continue to see a bulked up B. Wright ready to bang inside. I like Udrih, Duhon, and Calderon, all would be able to give quality minutes, Douglass-Roberts, Rush or Arthur would be solid SF picks for our bench. Must utilize the JRich trade exemption and possibly move Al’s contract for a backup PF.
by shootda3 on Apr 22, 2008 6:56 PM PDT 0 recs
wrong
the suns were a horrible call, and a couple ridiculous suspensions away from proving the run and guy system CAN work in the playoffs a year ago. then they went and screwed their team with the shaq trade. stoudemire is a beast playing the 4 rather than the 5, but the pick and roll doesnt work, cant run anymore, and dont have their best 1 on 1 defender.
by sam23 on
Apr 24, 2008 12:31 AM PDT
up
0 recs
You
Are a fool. The New Iggy. Suns had been doing it for 4 years, being the superior Run-N-Gun team. That is the exact same reason why they traded for Shaq. Steve Kerr is a genius for realizing it and sending Marion for Shaq.
by ejdacanay on
Apr 24, 2008 7:21 AM PDT
up
0 recs
The Suns have not, and will not
Get any further this year than in the last few years. While it was an interesting trade, and seems to have worked out much better than anybody expected, they’re not going to win this year, and next year Sarver’s going to be crying about the $20M he’s giving to Shaq, while Marion will be crying about how nobody loves him.
They were close last year. If they squeak by the Spurs, could they have beaten Utah and Cleveland? Would Nash’s whiteness trumped LeBron’s ability to get calls? Who knows…
Anyways, I haven’t researched sam23’s past comments, but throwing around such offensive KLove related insults for having a opinion different from yours is just wrong.
by Dubs fan in Boston on
Apr 24, 2008 8:21 AM PDT
up
0 recs
im no iggy
if youre going to call me an idiot at least provide some reason. shaq has made the suns worse. i agree that defense and post play makes you MORE LIKELY to win a championship, but its not the only way to win. run and gun CAN work. the suns got screwed last year, sold out and damaged their team in the long and short term. should the bulls have called it quits on the build around jordan idea after it failed for 4 years? steve kerr’s shaq trade is hardly genius, he traded away a guy who was perfect in that system for one of the worst contracts in the nba not in the knicks organization. amare has shown he’s much better as a 4 than a 5, and marion probably would have walked after this year, but shaq has ruined their flowing offense and the pick and roll they ran to near perfection. his interior presence on d is mitigated by the fact that they are now missing one of the best one on one defenders in the nba. we cant just suddenly decide to be the pistons or spurs, we dont have the personnel. to be competitive without a duncan, garnett or a team of solid defensive players run and gun is the best chance we have at being competitive. dont get upset and start slinging insults just because i dont agree with you, its a shallow tactic.
by sam23 on
Apr 24, 2008 9:55 PM PDT
up
0 recs
.
Who said I was calling you an idiot and that I’m upset? I think of Iggy being Silly because he always makes funny or laughable comments. I’m sorry if I insulted you. But…
There have been only about 4 good or viable run-n-gun/nellie ball teams in the league history.
Milwaukee Bucks (1976-1986) (Not pure Run-N-Gun)
Run TMC
Phoenix (2003-2008)
Golden State Warriors (2006-2008)
All always end up with good records, but none have reached the NBA Finals. And there will probably be none who will make the Finals, furthermore win the Finals in the future.
Nellie Ball specializes in Superior Offense and Firepower, but what does it sacrifice? It sacrifices mainly:
Size (3 Guards/2 Fowards is the usual)
Rebounding (We give up the league worst most-opp rebounds)
Slow-Tempo Play
Defense (We gave up the league worst most-opp points)
w/ many more basic basketball fundamentals.
Brandan Wright and Marco Belinelli are very good at Defense which the team failed to realize. Wright with his wingspan make him a good natural defender. Marco on the other hand was used for Defensive assignments when he played for his Italian team, Climamio Bologna.
We are pretty far from being a Championship calibur team so now is the time to make the transition to a more slow tempo’d game. If Don Nelson comes back I can guarantee you that Nelson will draft another Nellie ball type player instead of a big bruiser or possibly a pass first PG. DeAndre Jordan would be my pick or the Lamar Odom prototype in Randolph.
by ejdacanay on Apr 25, 2008 12:09 AM PDT 0 recs
defensive prowess & draft
neither BWright nor MBeli are even competent defenders – yet. Wright might be but until he works to offset his slender frame through either training or footwork (likely both) he will be gorged on inside. Marco showed little if any ability to guard on the perimeter, whether he was a decent defender across the pond is irrelevant to what he can’t do in the NBA …
... the time to make the transition is post-Nelson, whether that is this summer or next matters little in the draft – in fact we should be happy he’s helping in the draft since his picks measure up better than most of Mullin’s do in longevity of NBA career as well as getting value for the pick
by hardcore on
Apr 25, 2008 1:25 PM PDT
up
0 recs
Precedence is not proof
The Suns could easily have won it all last year. Nellieball/Dantoniball may not be the ideal system for winning it all, but it’s silly to say it can’t.
Give me a starting 5 of
CP3
Kobe
LeBron
Amare
Howard
Make D’Antoni coach, and force them to run all day. I think they’d do all right.
Sign ^^^^ !!!
by Sleepy Freud on Apr 25, 2008 5:52 AM PDT 0 recs
haha
Well for one that’ll never happen (Olympics maybe?). Even then, the chemistry may not be good when you have 4 guys being Franchise players and being the primary scorer. The fact that 100% of those teams who won championships were slower paced teams should make us convert back to normal.
by ejdacanay on
Apr 25, 2008 8:22 AM PDT
up
0 recs
I dunno...
The Bird Celtics and Magic Lakers - the teams I grew up with - were both pretty fast-paced, offensive-minded teams. Obviously they had great big men, but they were definitely not “slower paced.”
You’re basically right though: since the ‘80s the teams that tend to have thrived in the playoffs have been the hard-nosed, grind-it-out types. This year’s Celtics are close to the ideal of what a championship team should look like: everyone on that team, from KG and Pierce down to Powe and Big Baby, is a tough, hard-nosed fighter, with sound fundamentals on offense and defense. They’re also (for the most part) fabulous FT shooters, which should serve them well when and if they ever have any tight games late.
You watch them against Atlanta - like the Ws, a young, undisciplined, athletic team that likes to run all day - and it basically supports your point.
Still, I’m pretty sure a fast-paced team CAN win it all. Give Nellie CP3, LeBron, and Amare to work with and he’ll prove it…
Sign ^^^^ !!!
by Sleepy Freud on
Apr 25, 2008 1:20 PM PDT
up
0 recs
Just for fun....the Warriors version...
It’s mostly about roles in Nellieball, if everyone fills their role well, it works. Of COURSE if you have superstars everywhere it’s better, lol.
Ideally, for next year
CP3 = Baron/Monta with a fresh energized Baron, since (the improved on defense and passing) Monta is playing 15 minutes at PG and 20 at SG. Baron plays D (please) and shuts down the oppo PG, disrupting their offense. Monta plays PG when their PG is on the bench, so his defense is not a liability
Kobe = Buike and Ellis. The (further developed)defense and 3-point shooting of Buike, starting, to shut down the oppo SG and there to receive the kick-out on on BD and Mota’s drives. Ellis comes in for the offensive spark as needed, moving Buike to SF. Eliis gets 12 mins at pg and 24 at SG
Lebron = Jax (hahaha) and Buike….and Barnes or Piertrus. Jax gets better at shot selection ad drives more, (as he did before he wore down, got injured) Buike better at goig to the hole, Bor P brings the energy
Amare = And here is our problem! Amare actually is NOT what Nellie wants, he wants someone to hit the three to spread the floor for the drive/kick…but who can drive/kick too. But also is a big rebounder. This mythical player is, imo, the weakness of Nelliball, Dirk was about as close as you can get…and even with him Nellie only got close. But remember only one team a year wins it all! And in the last twenty years, only four or five teams have won it, and other than the Pistons, (and the Rockets while MJ was on vacation) they all had one of the leagues’ top superstars. So I do agree that for Nellieball….just like any other system …..to get to the top you need stars. He had em Dallas, and got close.
If Al gets his head right and stops disappearing next year (a BIG if) just thik how much better the W’s would be! Al is THE key
Howard = Andris at the end of last season, when Nellie started getting him the ball. Look at the numbers! Give him minutes and the ball! Get him a backup who can bang and block against the Boozers et al (Diop or Skinner) and he only gets more effective when he is in.
IF Al and Baron play up to their potentials and the young guys develop AND we have a bench to matchup/neutralize the oppo…we are DAMN good.
IF…LOL
Not a champ though, unless we get lucky…..or find a new better/tougher Dirk
by Wdharma on
Apr 25, 2008 1:17 PM PDT
up
0 recs
it's not...
about pace – it’s about personnel.
John 8:44 -Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do.
by triplesix on Apr 25, 2008 9:26 AM PDT 0 recs













