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Harping on the JRich Trade

Kemp_8_tiny by IceDubs on

This is my first-time post, and I've only been reading GSoM for a few months now, so I figured instead of throwing up a crazy trade idea I'd get a thread going on the other topic everyone seems so opinionated about.

The dreaded JRich draft-day trade.....

I gotta admit that I'm getting a little annoyed with everybody thinkin that we shouldn't have traded Jason last year, and how we would have/ could have/ should have been a better team with him on the roster this year. And before anybody jumps all over me, let me state that JRich was the sole reason a lot of us were Warrior fans in those lean years, and he carried us through some tough times. I love the guy to death, and he deserved to be treated with more respect than how things went down. Unfortunately, the NBA, as well as this fan site, is much, much more of a what-have-you-done-for-me-lately type of place. Respect and loyalty holds almost no weight in comparison to results and money.

So on that note, the JRich trade was the correct move, regardless of whether or not BWright developes into a 20 ppg player. Let me explain why....

With JRich on the roster this year, our "big 3" wouldn't have magically become the 'big4'. Monta Ellis' growth would innevitably have been stunted, because he simply wouldn't have gotten the touches or even the minutes to do the things he did this year. Jax wouldn't have been as effective, as he would have been playing power forward half the time and also getting less touches. Even JRich wouldn't have put up close to the numbers he did in Charlotte this year, because he wouldn't have had a chance to put up 18 shots a game. All this is a huge reason why he was deemed expendable.

On top of it, he is 27 years old and had just come off a season partially lost due to a knee injury that was taking forever to heal. Yes, he did play all 82 games this year, but at this time last year everyone was still worried about his injury history. At his position, and the way he plays, as soon as he cant elevate off the floor his career will be all but over.

As if all of the above wasn't enough of a reason to trade him, between him, Baron, Jax and Al, they were making a lot of money (I think about 80%of the payroll). We needed to cut some costs, and its been to do this early rather than too late, when you cant get any value for your guys.

And to boot, we were about to completely drop his contract on another team (something that rarely happens in the NBA these days) AND get a big-time prospect at a position of need.

In the end, to me, the trade makes a heck of a lot of sense, and realistically doesn't need any defending. The Warriors 06-07 roster wasn't going to get any farther than it did, and realistically shouldn't have gotten that far. Our 07-08 team was a better team, despite the fact that it was more of a rebuilding year for us. How can we look at this years team and say it was a failure? We won 6 more games in a conference that saw improvements from a bunch of other teams. Our future is much brighter now than it would be if we didnt trade JRich, and we wouldn't have been better this year with him.

Objections?

This FanPost is a submission from a member of the mighty Golden State of Mind community. While we're all here to throw up that W, these words do not necessarily reflect the views of the GSoM Crew. Still, chances are the preceding post is Unstoppable Baby!

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This has been rehashed endlessly

Essentially, the ‘06/’07 team was together, free of injuries, for two months and they made history. Then, Mullin split them up.

I would’ve liked to have seen them together for one more year. See what they could do. I actually think the players would’ve liked that too, listening to them talk.

How either team would’ve done is conjecture. But all the “future” talk in the world is meaningless to Warriors fans. We’ve been talking about the future for the Warriors since 1993 and I think we deserved one more year of “the present.”

by chacabuco on May 12, 2008 3:35 PM PDT   1 recs

the present

is over rated… look at the mavs and the suns… invest in the future not in the present.

by saintdee on May 12, 2008 3:52 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

The Future vs. The Present

You have to be able to mix the old and young, which meant either JR or Harrington had to go last year, and our glaring lack of PF/C, and our abundance of SG/SF made more sense to trade JR.

This team outperformed last years team, so I can’t say that we didn’t get another year of “the present”. It isn’t like the team took a step back. Right?

by passionately objective on May 12, 2008 4:58 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I love you.

I can say that right.

I agree with everything you’ve written, and probably better worded than what I would have done.

Warriors, Stupidest franchise in the league.

by kenntoe on May 12, 2008 11:20 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

curious

as to whom you love?

by passionately objective on May 20, 2008 4:22 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I miss JR.

I cried when we traded him. He was a top 3 Warrior all time for me. I however do believe that we would’ve won at least a game with him in the roster when S. Jax was suspended. JR’s clutch ability and driving ability was also excellent. People forget that Baron and JR was one of the best backcourts in their season when they were together, and that was with a worse supporting cast. I honestly loved J-Rich to death and would’ve wanted Baron or Monta to go instead of him.

by ejdacanay on May 12, 2008 6:53 PM PDT   0 recs

crazy man

i loved jrich too. but trading monta away would have been dumb and baron is personally one of my fav pg’s in the league. prolly should have traded harrington while he was hot.

by J2daZ on May 12, 2008 7:56 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

JR over BD and Monta?

That’s what gets franchises into trouble. Can’t get too nostalgic or else you’ll go down.

by passionately objective on May 12, 2008 8:30 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Monta's

current value was certainly not as high as last years. Monta, was the last piece Minny wanted before almsot trading KG to us.

But JR’s devotion and love to the team was unmatched by any Warrior in recent history (w/ Foyle being next). And thats why I love him more then Baron and Monta. Like I said in another diary, JR was our Kobe for half the decade.

by ejdacanay on May 12, 2008 8:33 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

i love baron too

but top 3 warrior of ALL TIME? what are you like12 years old?

by sam23 on May 13, 2008 7:48 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

jrich

not baron

by sam23 on May 13, 2008 7:48 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

uhm.

Since when did I say skill wise too? What is with you people? And the keyword is that I said for “me”

My Favorite (Top) 3 (No Order):

Manute Bol
Jason Richardson
Wilt Chamberlin

And why you gotta lay insults? Are you that immature? e-thug maybe?

by ejdacanay on May 13, 2008 10:39 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

If JRich is in your top 3, you must either be very young or not have a very good memory

Mullin
Hardaway
Richmond
Barry

Just to name a few. I’m sure there are plenty of others, but I don’t want to waste any more time on this topic. JRich was good, and he was the only good thing about the Warriors for a while, but there’s just too much history for him to be top 3 in my book or many others’ books.

by Dubs fan in Boston on May 14, 2008 9:34 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

.

The fact that I’ve met 2 of my top 3 a is a huge factor in that. All 3 of their out of basketball work is what inspired me as well all 3 had great characters too. And for me alot of times Character > Skill.

-Manute Bol (who was there during the TMC run) is extremely active with Sudanese rights and has done several Humanitarian efforts with them including the Sudan Freedom Walk.

-Jason Richardson’s commitment to the team was astounding. No one since I could remember for the Warriors had that much commitment to an organization. Apologizing for not making to the playoffs shows a level of maturity that does not exist for the majority of NBA players.

-Wilt Chamberlain. My relatives love and fan fare of him rubbed off on me. I’ve read his autobiography as well.

by ejdacanay on May 14, 2008 1:23 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

dubs fan made my point for me

I wasnt talking about skill, but I was seriously asking are you like 12 years old or what because youre leaving a lot of truly great warriors out of your top 3 if you put JRich in there. It wasnt an insult, it was a serious question. I’m not a fan of hurling actual insults around on here, but you have to be able to take a little criticism, if youre that sensitive dont psost.

by sam23 on May 14, 2008 11:37 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Common Sense

How would a 12 year old know this much even if the kid is brainwashed with Warrior propaganda? Why would a 12 year old be posting on an online blog in the middle of the day when he’s supposed to be in school? Would a 12 year old kid type perfectly while arguing and have at least good sentence structure and punctuation?

Truly the mentality and maturity in which you rationalize on the basis of poor evidence or corroboration is making me feel that you yourself should not post.

by ejdacanay on May 14, 2008 1:42 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

insults

You question my maturity or call me an “e-thug”, just because I questioned your top-3 Warrior list? Wow. Stop being so damn sensitive, man, I’m just saying you have a very strange top 3 list. (Wilt Chamberain=character? hmmm, thats a new one) It seems like it would be the top 3 list of a younger person who never watched run TMC or Rick Barry, loved JRich, thought the novelty of a 7’7” player was interesting, and heard stories about how great Wilt was and heard that he spent a couple seasons as a Warrior. But whatever, you’re certainly entitled to your opinion, but if you put it out there on here, don’t expect to not receive a little criticism.

by sam23 on May 14, 2008 2:09 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

.

What does this:

what are you like12 years old?

Have to do with this:

You question my maturity or call me an "e-thug", just because I questioned your top-3 Warrior list?

Completely irreverent. It seems you, yourself have to defend yourself after I have criticized you. So listen to your own words which are listed here:

you’re certainly entitled to your opinion, but if you put it out there on here, don’t expect to not receive a little criticism.

Stop being so damn sensitive, man

you have to be able to take a little criticism, if you’re that sensitive don’t post.

I have even corrected your grammatical errors on the last quote.

Only major thing with Wilt’s character as I can see was the claim that he slept with 20,000+ women.

If character isn’t a big factor for you then so be it. Let stats and basketball ability reign supreme for you. I personally admire those with great character. Another Ex-Warrior of great character would also be Derek Fisher, but heck he was a sucky warriors squad and isn’t HoF material so who cares? I do.

Like I said, I do remember the TMC era, mainly because of Manute Bol. But jsut like the Warriors today I do not like many of the players with the exceptions of Tim, Mullin, Pietrus, and Wright (who I actually followed in UNC). The first two are certainly top 10.

by ejdacanay on May 14, 2008 2:44 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Re:

Anyone that replies “lol” isn’t doing much to make their case. On the other hand, this has gone on long enough, good day to you gentlemen.

by passionately objective on May 14, 2008 4:17 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

well

now I feel like I’m arguing with a 12 year old. All I said was that your top 3 warriors list is crazy. Sorry, but it is. If you want to go correcting everyone’s grammar and trying to pick petty fights, go right ahead, but I’m not having any more part of this. (oh and fanfare is one word, make sure youre don’t live in a glass house before you go hurling stones)

by sam23 on May 14, 2008 8:58 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Excellent.

Its mature of you to give up. you haven’t given a single worthy and sensual rebuttal to any of my rebuttals or points anyways, its cute arguing with a person who has no corroboration or. i like how you also charge me of starting petty fights when you clearly started his “petty” fight by calling me a 12 year old and calling me sensitive.

I also find it funny how you say:

All I said was that your top 3 warriors list is crazy.

When clearly there was more to it. GG.

by ejdacanay on May 14, 2008 9:16 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

hahahaha

man, I was done with you …....but your response was too good to pass up. I havent given a single “sensual” rebuttal? hahahaha. I sure hope I didn’t make a SENSUAL rebuttal. For someone who obviously prides himself so much in his posts, you might want to invest in a dictionary. I think you meant to write something like sensical, which is not actually a word either, but I’m assuming you meant the opposite of nonsensical..which, coincidentally, is exactly the word I would use to describe all of your posts in this debate. But go ahead and respond by misusing the word corroboration again (how am I supposed to provide evidence that you have a strange top 3? you just do).....it makes you look sound so smart and makes me feel all sensual.

by sam23 on May 14, 2008 11:24 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Touche

got me there! But you as well have used sensual the wrong way in your last sentence.

Did you have to use the dictionary to find what Corroboration means?The points in which you provided none of that is 6, 8, and 10 posts above this one.

(how am I supposed to provide evidence that you have a strange top 3?

You tell me. Your running your mouth without listing anybody who is supposed to be a top 3 all time favorite.

by ejdacanay on May 14, 2008 11:56 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Hardaway, Mullin, Thurmond, Barry, Richmond, Attles, Wilkes, maybe Chamberlain but he spent the majority of his career elsewhere

my top 3? Hardaway, Mullin, Thurmond

by sam23 on May 15, 2008 12:20 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

.

nice list, no criticism needed. it is your fave 3. i like nate too

by ejdacanay on May 15, 2008 1:05 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

by the way

my usage of sensual was intentional….maybe you need to look up sarcasm. and no I dont need to look up corroboration. If you want to get personal, implying stupidity by pointing out grammatical errors, I’m willing, but I dont think this is really the forum for it.

by sam23 on May 15, 2008 12:23 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

.

I find it funny how you think it is a personal attack when clearly you started off the barrage by assuming I’m a 12 year old and calling me sensitive. And your really asking if I am really 12 years old? Come on I’ve been hanging around on forums and blogs for years and seen these insults were people ask if your young, usually they ask if your 8, 10, or 12.

Don’t contradict yourself.

by ejdacanay on May 15, 2008 1:10 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

your list

still seems like a 12 year olds. I’m sorry, but it does. I dont mean that as an insult, criticism..yes, but not an insult. JRich is a rather weird or random top 3 warrior, and so is Manute. It gave me the initial impression that you hadnt been a warrior fan for very long. but I whatever, sorry it escalated to this, no reason to continue this argument.

by sam23 on May 15, 2008 3:36 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

.

Alright good. This got no where. I call a cease fire till someting real is worth arguing about. I have made my peace. lol

by ejdacanay on May 15, 2008 5:02 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

You cut school?

so if you’re not in school ur implying your cutting? Jeez what’s next? drug dealing?

by deseanjackson on May 19, 2008 10:15 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

JRich v. Kobe

If JRich was our Kobe, then why dont we have three rings to show for it? I love JRich too, but lets not put him on some crazy pedestal.

by IceDubs on May 12, 2008 8:42 PM PDT   0 recs

lol.

I never said in skill, correct me if I’m wrong. Kobe means alot to the Laker franchise, JR was of that value before Monta’s breakout season. Kobe was committed to the Lakers prior before his BF (BF From White Chicks movie) during the off-season. JR’s commitment to the Warriors was so much more then that of Kobe’s, remember JR was the one who made the letter to Warrior fans for missing the playoffs? Who else has apologized like that? JR also provided the BOOM for Warriors with his dunking ability. Most importantly, JR was the captain and the leader of the Squad before and even when Baron came, just like Kobe.

These reasons are why I personally love J-Rich.

by ejdacanay on May 12, 2008 9:20 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

lol.

Sign ^^^^ !!!

by Sleepy Freud on May 12, 2008 9:46 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

lo

"Monta is the MAN." -Bob Fitzgerald

by WarriorForLife on May 13, 2008 8:23 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

l

Sign ^^^^ !!!

by Sleepy Freud on May 13, 2008 10:33 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

What?!? Who likes her?!? I'll kill em!

Lol.

"Monta is the MAN." -Bob Fitzgerald

by WarriorForLife on May 13, 2008 10:03 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

If you don't want people to like her

Why do you plaster her lovely visage all over this site…? ;-)

Sighhhhhh…

Sign ^^^^ !!!

by Sleepy Freud on May 14, 2008 3:50 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

lol

I’m Filipino too, but I must say I liked Brooke White better. Ramielle seems like she acts too much.

by ejdacanay on May 14, 2008 4:11 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

who is that

woman in the pic above? forgive my ignorance.

by passionately objective on May 14, 2008 4:18 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Ramielle Malubay.

Filipina American
4’2” 80 Lbs
American Idol Top 10 Contestent

Overhyped IMO. lol.

by ejdacanay on May 14, 2008 5:23 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

8o lbs.?

Geez, she’s almost as light as Brandan Wright…

Sign ^^^^ !!!

by Sleepy Freud on May 15, 2008 6:19 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

.

i LOL’d

by ejdacanay on May 15, 2008 10:18 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Mannnnn. I missed the last 'l'

That just killed it. :/

"Monta is the MAN." -Bob Fitzgerald

by WarriorForLife on May 13, 2008 10:02 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

JRich vs. Kobe

Mediocre defender vs. All NBA defender
Passionate vs. would kill you with the basketball if given the opportunity
Gets to the line 5 times per game vs. gets to the line 10 times per game
65% FT percentage vs. 85% FT percentage
and most importantly:

Captain and leader of crappy team vs. captain and leader of good team

Stop it, yes, there are similarities, except JRich was worse in every category. One could compare Kobe to the SG on my HS basketball team too, but that doesn’t mean he should play for the Warriors.

by Dubs fan in Boston on May 13, 2008 10:36 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

JRich is a poor man's Kobe

Not a homeless man’s Kobe, a poor man’s Kobe. You don’t win championships paying a poor man’s anything upwards of 10M/year. You just don’t.

by Dubs fan in Boston on May 13, 2008 10:42 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

.

What part of “I never mentioned skill” don’t you get? And it doesn’t matter if a captain is on a crappy team or good team, if the person has a knack for leadership or is blessed with it then he will improve the team.

Thats like comparing Matt Barnes as a captain to Steve Nash or Jason Kidd.

by ejdacanay on May 13, 2008 6:26 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Er

So remind us what you’re arguing again?

You said “JRich was our Kobe.” It’s a puzzling comparison, given that:

1. JRich is demonstrably a much, much better person than Kobe.
2. JRich genuinely seems to care about his team, his teammates and his fans, whereas Kobe is an egomaniacal SOB who only seems to care about himself.
3. JRich is demonstrably a much, much worse player than Kobe.

On the other hand, they’re both shooting guards, and they’re both human beings, so you may be onto something. I don’t quite get how Barnes, Nash, and Kidd factor into the equation, but I’m sure you’ll enlighten us.

Sign ^^^^ !!!

by Sleepy Freud on May 13, 2008 7:10 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

theyve both

won dunk contests, and that goes a loooong ways to making them similar. Harold Minor and MJ-very similar.

by sam23 on May 13, 2008 7:52 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

.

JR was our Kobe, Our Superstar.

Both provided leadership, fire/explosiveness, dedication, and intangibles. They both are loved by their organizations, fans and staff alike. They got people into the seats, even when their respective teams were not too good (JR=Pre-Wagon Warriors, KB=Post-Shaq Lakers, thus bringing revenue to their clubs.

And like I said I never said “Skill Wise”

And to counter this point: “You don’t win championships paying a poor man’s anything upwards of 10M/year. You just don’t.”

In addition to that person who receives 10M/year. Give me:

Pau Gasol, Derek Fisher, and Lamar Odom or
Kevin Garnett and Paul Pierce or
Tim Duncan and Manu Ginobli or
Shaq or Gary Payton

What do these Championship caliber teams and stars (Kobe, Allen, Parker, Wade) have in common? A SUPPORTING CAST. And when J-Rich finally got a supporting cast. What do you know? He gets traded.

=====================

His comment:

JRich vs. Kobe:

Captain and leader of crappy team vs. captain and leader of good team

My Response:

it doesn’t matter if a captain is on a crappy team or good team, if the person has a knack for leadership or is blessed with it then he will improve the team.

Thats like comparing Matt Barnes as a captain to Steve Nash or Jason Kidd.

What Boston is basically saying is that “J-Rich’s leadership skills were good only because he was on a crappy team.” Thats a load of baloney to me. If a person is a natural born leader or has great leadership skills then he can lead a team/group regardless of whether that team/group is weak or strong.

Barnes = Not Natural Born Leader/Little Leadership Experience
Nash/Kidd = Natural Born Leaders/Good Leadership Experience

by ejdacanay on May 13, 2008 11:08 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Yup

You’re saying a lot of stuff, to be sure, but I’m still having trouble distilling the point from all the rest of the huffing and puffing. JRich, unlike Kobe, or Duncan, or Shaq, is not a player you can build a championship team around. Now that’s a point you can hang your hat on. The other stuff is just too deep for me, I guess.

I don’t really have an issue with posters talking about their feelings — “favorite players,” “love”, “intangibles”, “leadership skills”, etc. — but that kind of stuff makes for very strange bedfellows with reasoned arguments.

I’m just hoping against hope that this is the last GSoM diary in which we have to go over JRich and his cute face and big muscles and intangibles and the evilness and stupidness of Mullin. All the relevant points have been made, repeatedly. It’s been a year — can we move on?

Sign ^^^^ !!!

by Sleepy Freud on May 14, 2008 4:23 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

.

Yea, people are the ones who made a big deal out of my post. I already moved on, but I was forced to defend myself from this onslaught.

by ejdacanay on May 14, 2008 7:45 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Kobe

Is a poor man’s MJ. I’m just sayin….

by sam23 on May 13, 2008 7:50 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

asdf

Because of trading J Rich we’re essentially getting B Wright plus Monta and Andris, with being stuck under his contract it would have been hard to sign just one of our youngins, let alone both of them. In my book, even though it hurt to see him go it was by far the smarter move. It’s a pleasant step in the right direction after all the horrendous contracts we’ve given out over the last decade.

Stephen Jackson catches on the wing and faces up against Vujacic. When Jax looks down and sees Vujacic, his eyes light up. He pulls out his nine, screams "Thug Life" and empties the clip, then drives in for a basically uncontested layup.

by J Rich 4 MVP on May 12, 2008 9:01 PM PDT   0 recs

chemistry

BD and JRich were the heart and soul of this team, had awesome chemistry, passion and will to win, with JRich on this team this year, Baron and Jax would be fresh and Monta would still have developed would have had a deeper rotation for Nellie. We would still have plenty of tradeable assets and could have watched our Warriors challenging in the playoffs. There is absolutely no guarantee next year that we will make the playoffs with this present team or be even close to a championship team. Should have dumped Al(9M) and not resign Pietrus(3.4M)/Barnes(3M) for cap space. We are now challenged with signing an undersized SG with defensive liabilities for 10-12M ,a thin, offensively challenged center for 8-10M which will handcuff this franchise for the next 5 years. Sorry, but I don’t see Monta, BWright and Biedrins taking us to a championship. I’d still rather build around BD,JRich and Jackson and see them play for 3-4 years together.

by shootda3 on May 12, 2008 9:25 PM PDT   1 recs

I'm sorry, but i don't see Jrich carrying us to a championship either.

Perimeter Teams don’t win in the playoffs.

Jrich’s best assets are the jumpshot, jumpshot, and…the jumpshot. And he’s never been one to shoot it at a great clip either, nor is he deadly from the free throw line. The only caveat to this is he played with heart and hustle and was the fan favorite on a crap team.

I don’t blame Jrich for being perimeter oriented. He’s a shooting guard for Pete’s sake. But, his abilities are best utilized with a Big man. The Warriors had none at the time that they could dump the ball into, and get a high percentage shot in the half court set.

The ability to get (and convert) high percentage shots in a half court set gives you a great chance to succeed in game, and through the playoffs, once teams start slowing the pace down. This is where perimeter teams suffer because, using common sense, tells us that farther shots from the rim are tougher to make.


Bad Defensive teams don’t win in the playoffs

This is where Jrich would hurt us. He’s really not that great of a defender. His lateral movement is astoundingly sub-par.

This is also an area of concern for me with the philosophy behind the Warriors defense. They like to get into the passing lanes and swipe at the ball. But half the time the guards let their man blow past them in an attempt to swipe at the ball! Good penetrators get into the lane any time they want for a high percentage shot, or get to the line. This puts our bigmen at a strong disadvantage. I don’t blame AB for committing a lot of fouls, when the blame shouldn’t be on him, but the guards for allowing penetration. Our defensive philosophy is to not play defense straight up and deny penetration, but to gamble at swipes and getting into the passing lanes for the flashy play, when all it takes is fundamental man up defense.

I agree with the OP, the situation and the opportunity presented last summer was pretty rare. It was a savvy move by Mullin and I think the biggest gripe people have is by the shock of the whole thing. I guess never really getting to say goodbye has really given Jrich fanboys something to gripe about.

Warriors, Stupidest franchise in the league.

by kenntoe on May 12, 2008 11:34 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

no argument...

you point out the weaknesses of jrich’s game. every player in the league has them. now for jrich’s upsides:
- he’s much bigger, taller, stronger than monta making him able to guard larger players in the post, makes him less of a liability in my opinion
- he’s a good scorer (the loss of 20 pts per game will hurt any team)
- he’s a good rebounder, almost 6 per game
- provides rest to the other gaurds by being a consistently productive player
“it was a savvy move by mullin…” actually, putting monta as starting sg without having a productive backup was not. the jrich/monta duo was much better than the monta/buke duo. getting bw as another project player is redundant and unnecassary. we already have pob who has at least proven himself in the d-league. bw’s production in limited minutes is contributed by his shockingly long arms and quickness. in more minutes, he will prove to be a liability as teams will no longer be surprised by him. the salary cap was no issue. with jasikivicous, petrius, barnes, hudson, and bw (would’ve never existed) of the books for ‘08-09 there would be no problem signing monta for another year. the real problem is baron’s contract, who I think is next to go. for the same reason they got rid of richardson. truth be told, the dubs no longer want to pay big $$ for superstars. young players and short term contracts are in mullin’s future plans. this is what that trade was all about. saving money. not for the future well-being of the team. that’s the only real sense that can be made. getting to the playoffs ever again will only be a result of luck, IMHO!

by oldskool on May 13, 2008 10:32 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

also

by playing big, both Baron ,Jax,and JRich can post up smaller defenders in the half court when often times this past season the offense stalls, JRich proved to be a very good 3pt shooter this year at 41% and hit an NBA best 243 3pt shots, could of used him when Baron,Jax, and Al were shooting 4-20 . Our defense was worse this year as we couldn’t stop anyone down the stretch. The best move for Mullin was to keep our 2007 playoff team intact and eventually trade Monta and Al for a PF before the trade deadline (Gasol, Artest) then make some noise in the playoffs.

by shootda3 on May 13, 2008 11:43 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

JRich, Thanks for the memories

“JRich was the sole reason a lot of us were Warrior fans in those lean years, and he carried us through some tough times. I love the guy to death”
If this is love your friends would do well to not turn their backs on you!
“How can we look at this years team and say it was a failure?”
Maybe cause we’re sitting home watchin the other teams play? while last years crew( with a healthy Jason and a happy Baron) were in the 2nd round.( and your new boy Monta was sitting on the bench hiding under a towel!)

by Skeptic con Urquell on May 12, 2008 9:31 PM PDT   1 recs

there

are just as much of these as there as much as trade ideas so its not really new but oh well i miss him. i still have his poster and jersey on my wall :(

So I don't have a signature well these words would do! Who knew that upgrades can have downgrades too!

by 24k state fan since 87 on May 13, 2008 3:04 AM PDT   0 recs

JRich: A Horrible Trade

I used to defend that salary dump before, but now in hindsight it seems like poor judgment (unless Brandan Wright turns into a bonafied star).

Here’s why:

Monta Ellis would have been just as good if JRich stayed. Monta made his MIP campaign coming off the bench last year, remember? He wasn’t THAT much crazier this season from last, nor did he get “more opportunity” with JRich gone. An extra 3 minutes per game and an extra 2 shot attempts? That’s the difference between Monta starting full-time this year and backing up the guard spots last year with JRich starting. I don’t buy that JRich HAD TO GO for Monta to succeed, Monta was already improving at an alarming rate with JRich still here.

Jason Richardson is an ELITE DEFENDER… compared to Monta Ellis. Just on his size, strength and athleticism alone, JRich makes the Warriors defense that much better with him starting at the 2 rather than Monta. Having to have Baron Davis guard other teams’ elite shooting guards burned him out. Monta getting torn up by Chris Duhon and Roger Mason Jr. (and other nobody-guards of the association) was just demoralizing to watch. JRich’s departure put an already defensively-flawed team at an even bigger disadvantage.

Baron Davis would not have had to play 39 minutes per game with JRich here. If JRich stayed, that may have forced Monta to play and learn the backup point more, giving more rest to the Baron. Instead, Nelly was stuck with only two guards that he felt he could trust: Baron and Ellis. So they soaked up most of the minutes, and we all saw how Baron just ran out of steam at the end.

We weren’t a better team this year compared to last, even if our record says so. We need to realize that we spent half the season last year without Jackson and Harrington (and with Dunleavy, Murphy, and Foyle). We were a monster team last year after the trade and made that insane run to finish out the season. This year, we weren’t exactly worse but we weren’t leaps and bounds better either.

We would have had enough salary space under the luxury tax to re-sign Ellis and Biedrins anyway. It doesn’t make sense to me that Mullin traded JRich for cap space a full year before he had to re-sign Ellis and Biedrins. Right now we’re something like $28 mil under the salary cap, we could’ve just as easily kept JRich and pay Ellis and pay Biedrins. And if we still needed cap space to fill out the rest of the roster we could’ve traded JRich away THIS offseason, and probably yielded more value in return due to his near-expiring contract.

Maybe the departure of JRich was inevitable for our longterm success, but I just think the decision was made a year too soon.

by jlagace on May 13, 2008 4:25 AM PDT   1 recs

To quote the guy that Bill Walsh quoted:

It’s better to make a move a year too soon, rather than a year too late.

*or something like that.

by passionately objective on May 13, 2008 9:54 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

yea

just ask Brian Sabean

by sam23 on May 13, 2008 7:52 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I don't think we're 28Mill under the cap.

From TK’s blog.

* The Warriors would still have Richardson’s $12.2M salary for next season, $13.3M salary for 2009-2010 and $14.4M salary for 2010-2011 on the books.
  • Counting Baron Davis’ $17.8M for next season, the Warriors with Richardson would have about $78.1M tied up with 12 active players on the 2008-2009 payroll.

That’s already WAY over the projected $68M or so luxury tax threshold for next season. That’s very, very bad.

The main point is that we would be a marginal playoff team at best, with a team in luxury tax hell.

The main point for me is that Jrich was good, but not great. Not good enough to be untouchable. His production was filled by Monta. I agree that i think Monta would have developed either way.

I don’t agree that Jrich would’ve gotten Baron’s minutes down. Jrich had no handle and was an average-below average playmaker. Now you’re stuck in hypotheticals. Jrich would’ve slipped over to the 3 while Monta stayed at the 2. Throwing Monta into the fire would not have made him a better point guard.

The core of BD, Jrich, Jack, Al, and Dris’ didn’t spend a whole season together. You make the argument that they were a better team. I don’t agree. This team is largely a perimeter oriented team with no low post presence. These sort of teams hardly make noise in the playoffs. Not to mention the fact that this is a sub-par defensive team.

Trading Jrich a year early was a great move. Getting Brandan, who was a highly touted prospect don’t forget, should be a solid starter at worst. We need to make the transition from a perimeter oriented team, to a well balanced inside-outside team that plays defense. Two things in which Jrich can’t provide.

Warriors, Stupidest franchise in the league.

by kenntoe on May 13, 2008 10:22 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Link

Blog Site

Warriors, Stupidest franchise in the league.

by kenntoe on May 13, 2008 10:22 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Usually I like Kawakami's stuff

But he’s made some wild assumptions about our 2008-2009 team payroll. The facts of the matter are that we only have 6 players under contract including the Baron: Baron, Foyle (buyout), Harrington, Jackson, Wright, and Belinelli. I have no idea how he got that ”$78mil tied up in 12 players” bullcrap. I started reading that article and saw some mentioning about Patrick OBryant and Mickael Pietrus in next years’ plans and immediately zoned out after that; Kawakami has lost all credibility in my eyes if he really believes those two are gonna be on our payroll next season.

I did make a mistake though. That proposed “28mil under the cap” we’d have would only be if Baron opted out. If he stays we’ll be more like 11mil under the cap. If we really wanted to make it work I think we could still have retained JRich and re-signed the kids.

And I must insist our post-