Josh Smith or Marion?
by droppin gsw _knowledge south bay style on Jul 17, 2008 3:09 PM PDT
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There has been several posts and rumors regarding the Warriors trying to grab Marion from Mia. As much as I would probably be down to persue him, it seems that it would take AL and perhaps BWright and some draft picks, maybe more. Personally, I would rather see those resources used to go after Josh Smith in a sign and trade. It would probably take a little less than all that to get him, maybe not. Either way I personally think that Smith would fit our team better short term and in the future.
Smith cannot score like Marion can, however we already have 3 20+ scorers in the starting line up, not to mention the offseason growth of Biedrins' game. At this point I think it is safe to say that Smith is a better rebounder and defender than Marion, not to mention that he is actually a PF. He is also younger than Marion and is just entering his prime. So although there has been a lot of noise to bring "The Matrix to the Oracle", I think it would be better to bring Josh Smith to the Oracle. Plus Smith would bring his high flying dunks back to the Bay, something we miss. A good #5 replacement. And if we're gonna give up a young PF with upside like BWright I'd prefer to get someone in his prime not someone coming out of it. I know all the pluses of Marion, especially since this is his kind of system. But I feel JSmith would be a better help in areas we lack.Thoughts?
This FanPost is a submission from a member of the mighty Golden State of Mind community. While we're all here to throw up that W, these words do not necessarily reflect the views of the GSoM Crew. Still, chances are the preceding post is Unstoppable Baby!
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smith
over marion in a heartbeat…..MARIONS WASHED UP PEOPLE…..anyone who thinks trading multiple valuable pieces for marion is a good idea needs a catscan
i would love
a sign and trade with the hawks for smith. he doesn’t want to play in ATL if woodson is still the coach. ill give up bwright heck ya!
i think they would do a sign and trade with us
but it would probably be for beans and someone else
uhhh no
they have al horford a C, if we trade al, wright, perovic, and a 1st rounder they would take a sign and trade.
by kaisersoulzae8 on Jul 17, 2008 3:39 PM PDT up reply actions
horford is listed as a center but he should be a pf. kinda like okafor. if they made a move it would be star player for star player.
Not enough for him
I don’t think this is enough to get him. I don’t think that ATL wants Perovic very much- they already have pachulia. I don’t think they want anything else we have – maybe randolph, but that would be too much for us to give up. I would be willing to part with belinelli, but they already have salim stoudamire.
Uhhhh yeah
as Rach said, he has it right.
Trading for Beans would allow Horford to move back to his natural position at PF.
If we could get away with Al, Wright, Filler + Lottery Protected Pick for Smooth, we’d be raping and ransacking them.
They will probably require Andris Biedrins + filler.
There would be our dilemma.
In that case. I’d deal Biedrins for Smith straight up.
thats too much for not enough!!!
al nad b wright is enough! next years class has what we need why would we give up a future lotto pick?
by hyphy cowboy on Jul 19, 2008 1:32 PM PDT up reply actions
Damn
No way I do it for Beans unlsess they have a run and gun center who can start and replace him
by droppin gsw _knowledge south bay style on Jul 17, 2008 3:32 PM PDT reply actions
I agree with the kaiser
Why dont we go for him then? Is there a better PF out there to start in our system with our players?
by droppin gsw _knowledge south bay style on Jul 17, 2008 3:44 PM PDT reply actions
Have any of you guys seen Josh Smith play? HE DOES NOT TRY!!! He does not try while he is on a rookie contract right now, and once someones gives him 75 million and removes any incentive he is just going to be Vince Carter 2.0 (attitude wise and effort wise). Look, I love to watch his dunks as much as the next guy, but let’s not be the team that pays J Smoove 75 million and regret it by game 30 of the first year.
I am not saying he is not a good player, but he has attitude and effort problems his entire career and giving him a ton of money would be a huge mistake. Any team that has J Smoove as the highest paid player on their team is just asking for problems.
I always read...
posts about should we get smith or marion, are there even any solid rumors about the dubs being interested in josh smith? I haven’t read anything on the dubs looking into him. By the way, i would take smith any day over marion. Marion is great, he’s the MATRIX, but why shoot for the now? There is no way we will compete for the title next season, so why not load our team with young talent and hope that they blossom into great players!! Smith would work perfect in our offense just like all you guys said. all i can say, though, is i can’t wait for next season whether or not we are good or bad!! Dubs for life!!
...doesn't try?
I don’t get this accusation. I mean, how the hell do you not try and still average 17 points, 8 rebounds, 2.8 blocks, and 1.5 steals per game?
If those are his numbers playing lazily for a coach that he doesn’t like, BRING HIM TO NELLIE. Can you imagine?
Although I do hear you re: the dangers of having him be the top paid player on the team, and in particular I’d be worried about how Monta took it if JS was suddenly brought on. I’d think we’d have to pay Monta more immediately just to make him feel loved.
But damn, we’d be a fast breakin’ machine if we did add him..!
I think I'd trade BWright, but not Beans...
...but if I’m the Hawks, I want Beans. That’s my read. I agree with Rach—I’d shift Horford to the 4 and put Beans at 5. The only reason Horford is playing 5 now is because they have Smith but no real center…
Wright but not Andris
I guess it depends on whether or not we get Turiaf from the Lakers. I still wouldn’t like the idea of trading away our one true center but it might be more tolerable with Turiaf around. Andris is a proven commodity while Wright, while showing some flashes, still has to prove that he can be a force.
I also don’t understand why some people are saying that he is a lazy player. He fills up a stat sheet better than 90% of the guys in the NBA. If that’s being lazy, I need some lazy pills. Maybe if he comes to the Warriors, Nelson can beat the laziness out of him and he can get 20/10 to go along with 3blks and 2stls per night. :)
If all it take is Al Harrington, Wright, Perovic and a pick as kaiser mentioned earlier, they you gotta get him.
how the hell do you not try and still average 17 points, 8 rebounds, 2.8 blocks, and 1.5 steals per game
Ask Vince Carter
Seriously though, I have league pass and I probably watched at least 20 Hawks games last year (In college and I really don’t study that much, so I have the time). The guy is a loafer. There is no way he should be taking the amount of 3’s he takes. He looks for the highlight play every single time, and is only a good defender when focused. That said, he is amazingly talented. I will not deny that. For 8-10 million a year, I would jump all over him. But we would be paying him in the neighbor hood of 13-15 million a year. That would be overpaying him by too much and severely crippling our team. I just do not believe in giving players that type of money that are not cornerstone players. As skilled as he is, the Boozers, Amares, Dirks, Duncans, and Wests would eat his lunch every time. I do not want to give 15 million a year to someone who would be the 6th-7th-8th best power forward in the conference.
AGREED!
I couldn’t agree more. I like Marion and I loved watching him in Phoenix but it makes a lot more sense to get Smith. He is younger and at 22 he can add to the core of players that we already have (Beidrins-22, Ellis-22). I don’t like the idea of giving up Wright but if they have to do it to get Smith, then DO IT!
Smooooooooooooooove
Marion’s probably a better player right now, but I’m a huge sucker for youth, upside, and crazy hops. JSmooth really is the poor man’s LeBron. Plus the whole lefty-lefty-lefty-lefty thing would be very cool.
Unfortunately, we’re not getting either. Now I’m depressed. :-(
Sign ^^^^ !!
Crappy situation for the Hawks
...if it’s true that Smith really doesn’t like Woodson. I mean, what do they do? If they trade him, the fans will go nuts and likely boo Woodson every game. If they sign him, do they have to buy out Woody’s contract? Or do they just hope everyone plays nice and gets along?
Coach VS. Player
Most of the time the player is the one that comes out on top. Coaches tend to be easy to replace but an impact player is much harder to come by.
That's exactly what I was thinking.
Doesn’t matter Woodson just signed the extension. People keep saying they won’t fire Woodson, they won’t…blah blah blah. Smith is the one who matters here.
If you commit $4-5M to Woodson, and commit $60M to Smith over 5 years, which asset are you going to protect?
Tough situation for ATL
But as we’ve seen, Brand going back home to the East Coast. Baron going back home to Hollywood.
Smoov went to Oak Hill and was born and raised in Georgia IIRC, so he’d have to be really pissed off at Woodson to want to leave, especially come out all the way over here.
If they threw mad money at him, let’s say 5 years $60 million which is an upgrade from the 5 years $45 they threw at him last year, I think he’d change his tune and put up with Woodson until they eventually butted heads again.
Where have you guys been this whole time?
WRIGHT IS NOT GOING ANYWHERE…is that not clear to you by now? and anybody who thinks the organization is going to trade Wright is absurd. If it was going to happen, it woulda happen last year when we were making a playoff push. So, why would we do it now that we are rebuilding. Stop the madness, please.
Never say never...
It’s all about value. Last year his value was lower than this year, and it will probably be higher again next year. More to the point, its also about what we can GET for him. I wouldn’t trade him for someone mediocre, but I WOULD trade him for Smith.
JOSH SMITH
is stronger, more athletic than BWright, who is still 30 lbs away from being an average PF,if ATL wants to trade, I’d definitely first offer Al, BWright, and Belli, depending on how bad we want him either AB or a future pick but we would need to keep Buke and Turiaf.
Don't we all hope
that in 3 years, Batman resembles J-Smoov? Isn’t that what we ultimately want him to end up as?
Al + Wright + Pick for Smith is a no brainer. It’s literally rape.
When they ask for Beans however, it’d be tough but you have to do it IMO.
Who would have a better chance of being an all-star. Biedrins or Smith? From top to bottom who’s more talented? Who’s more limited?
Could you imagine Tay, Randolph and Smoov together?
But as Sleepy said, it’s not happening. And we all go back to being Warrior fans. =(
Major problem though: who's gonna play center for us?
With the team we’re building, we NEED an athletic center (so does Atlanta). They are very hard to find. We’d end up with two power forwards (same situations as ATL now). Our concern is that we need some bulk; they need some height. All said and done, I’d keep Beans, but I’d trade Wright. They won’t do that deal for the same reason we won’t. When all is said and done, guys like Beans are harder to find…
Of course we all want Josh Smith more than Marion
THATS WHY IT WOULD BE HARDER NOT EASIER TO GET HIM. he is younger, bigger, more athletic, and he doesn’t possess the worst looking jump shot in the history of basketball. I don’t even think that the Hawks would go for Harrington, B Wright and draft picks (that would most likely end up being in the mid teens)
I’m not gonna claim i started the Josh Smith Movement or anything but I as well as many dub faithful have dreamed for years of having Josh Smith in the bay running and gunning as the ultimate Nellie 4.
I’m all for getting him, but i don’t believe that it will be possible. It would most likely take monta and more.
Harrington in ATL
The Hawks had Harrington a few years ago. He scored well but only through shooting a bunch. As their power forward, he was a pathetic rebounder and the team performed better when he went to the bench, much better.
They made absolutely zero attempts to retain him when he became a free agent. I don’t remember even the slightest hint that they were interested in extending his stay.
I’m pretty sure that they’d laugh at an attempt to pawn him off on them for Josh Smith.
ill take js..........
but it aint gonna happen unless i find my pipe and fall asleep…....
Ellis to the rim!
by Sprewell4President on Jul 17, 2008 11:38 PM PDT reply actions
I cant believe this is a recomended post....................
What have we become GSOM tell me, I need anwsers!!!!!!! and a solid back up point guard cause we gotta let Monta play a little wing once in a while
Ellis to the rim!
by Sprewell4President on Jul 17, 2008 11:46 PM PDT reply actions
Why is this a recommended post?
Well that’s easy to answer. The Warriors as they stand now are not a playoff team. PERIOD. And I don’t think anyone will deny that unless they are pretty delusional. In order for the Warriors to duplicate the success that they had making the 07 playoffs, some changes need to be made.
Most of us have been die hard Warrior fans for years and have suffered through years of miserable seasons. We all got a taste of the playoffs and we liked it. We want more! Moves have to be made to keep this team competitive. There are only a couple of possible moves the Warriors could make to make a playoff push now that Baron Davis abandoned us. Josh Smith seems to be the most plausible prospect. If Mullin is even a semi-decent GM, he is looking at Josh Smith too. He needs to explore every possible trade and see what might work out best for the team. There is a good chance that there isn’t a trade out there that makes this team better and nothing happens this offseason.
I’m not saying a trade such as this is likely to happen. I’m not even saying that there is a remote chance of it happening. What I think is most likely to happen is that Smith signs the qualifying offer and stays with the Hawks and then gets traded or they fire their head coach to appease him to stay. And if he has asked for a trade next season, the Warriors could get him for even less than it would cost to get him now. Everyone knows that when a star player asks or demands a trade, it’s impossible for a team to get equal value in return. Atlanta might not want Harrington as a player but his contract expires at a convenient time which will be appealing to them. Toss in Wright who has a ton of upside and a pick or two and I think the Hawks go for it.
So...
You’d recommend a post about LBJ coming to the bay, even though it’ll never happen?
I don’t get it. JSmoove isn’t remotely acquirable unless we want to S&T players we need. He’s an RFA, so we can’t just go sign him. There aren’t “possibilities” outside of S&T with Beans, S&T with Monta, trade Wright+picks+Al (it’d probably have to be multiple first round picks). None of these really make the Warriors better. ATL holds the upper hand with Josh Smith unless we want to way overpay for him.
by Dubs fan in Boston on Jul 18, 2008 9:29 AM PDT up reply actions
i agree
you also have to think, the ATL organization loves smith. There’s all this talk about smith not liking Woodson. When it comes down to it, when its coach vs star player, maybe future all star, player wins. ATL will most def keep smith. They would be stupid to get rid of him
by Young Moolah on Jul 18, 2008 11:00 AM PDT up reply actions
Crazier things have happened
1.) The Warriors trade Robert Parish and the #3 pick in the 1980 draft (Kevin McHale) to the Boston Celtics for the #1 pick (Joe Barry Carroll) and the #13 pick (Rickey Brown).
2.) The Sonics trade Scottie Pippen on draft night to the Bulls for Olden Polynice.
3.) The Baltimore Colts trade John Elway to the Broncos for Mark Hermann, Chris Hinton and 1st round pick.
4.)The Red Sox trade Babe Ruth to the Yankees for $100k and a $300k loan.
5.) The Nets send Julius “Dr. J” Erving to the 76ers for $3 million.
6.) The Warriors trade Wilt Chamberlain to 76ers for Paul Neumann, Connie Dierking, Lee Shaffer and cash in 1965.
If the Warriors don’t make an offer for Smith, they will never know if the Hawks would be willing to take it. We all know that Mullin is cooking something up right now. He knows that this team isn’t going to go very far without someone to help make up for the loss of Baron Davis. You could argue that Smith isn’t going to solve the PG problem but I don’t think the PG problem is that big a deal. Monta will play the point guard and we can easily find a back up PG to work with Watson to play as Monta develops. My suggestion would be Sam Cassell, a veteran PG with championship experience that can teach Monta the fundamentals of playing the PG position. Many people like Shaun Livingston but the Warriors need someone that can play now and don’t really have time for him to recover if he ever can. If he were 80%, it would be a no brainer to grab Livingston.
If people want to post about the possibility of Lebron James becoming a Warriors, let them dream. If they had to live through the playoff drought like I did and are still Warriors fans they deserve to dream about even the slightest of possibilities.
I’m not saying a trade for Josh Smith is on the verge of happening. In fact I am saying that a trade for Smith probably won’t happen this offseason. What I think is the most likely situation is that with all the major teams with cap space out of the market (Clippers, Sixers, Warriors), Smith has no place else to go but to stay with the Hawks. If he really doesn’t want to stay in Atlanta, he probably won’t sign a long term contract and will instead choose to take the qualifying offer and choose to be an unrestricted free agent at the end of the following season. The Hawks won’t want to see him walk away without getting something in return and will try to trade him before he becomes a free agent. If the Warriors show interest in him now and make a less than equitable offer, they probably will revisit the offer when they are looking at Smith walking away. Wouldn’t they prefer to get Harrington and his expiring contract, Wright with huge potential, and a pick or two over nothing if Smith becomes an unrestricted free agent?
I have no idea what the Hawks will do, but the panic trades to get something rather than nothing usually don’t work out for the team desperate for something. It’s often that something is worse than nothing.
The Hawks had Harrington. They made no attempts to keep him. They weren’t enamored with his play. His contract isn’t expiring this year. It’s got two years left. Player they didn’t want with two years left?
Um....
I Would Take Smith Because He Would Fit In Our System No Doubt.. And Um, I Don’t See A Problem Trading Wright For Smith. Beans Belleneli & 1st round is the most im giving up. Yeah We’d Have A Soft Line But We Could Spread The Floor And Make It Work With
Monta
Maggs
JAX/AR
AL/WRIGHT
J-Smith
Trade AL for Ridnour & Wilcox And It Makes It Better
Monta/Ridnour
Maggs
JAX/AR
Wilcox/Wright
J-Smith/Backup C
Not Bad Lineup If We Can Spread The Floor!
"Going To Be An Interesting Year"
Another Center
If you trade Andris to get Smith, you better have another center in your hip pocket. Turiaf is a power forward that can play a little center every now and again. I know Nelson likes to play small ball but having Turiaf as your only legit center is a bit of a stretch.
The only other center options if they were to trade away Andris are, and I hate to say it, Kwame Brown, Francisco Elson, P.J. Brown, Jamaal Magloire, Theo Ratliff, Dikembe Mutombo, David Harrison, DJ Mbenga, Alonzo Mourning, Adonal Foyle, Lorenzen Wright, Kurt Thomas, and Primoz Brezec. That makes for a pretty pitiful list.
You can probably take half of these guys off the list just because the Warriors wouldn’t want them at any price. Kurt Thomas would be my first choice but I am sure he will get offered more by another team. After that, it’s a toss up who the Warriors would get with the little money they would have left to sign someone. Most likely they would call up someone from the D-League to be our starting center. Pretty sad if that becomes the situation. So what it boils down to is even if the Hawks were willing to give up Smith in exchange for Andris, I don’t think its likely the Warriors would do it.
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