Sources: Harrington on the Block
by pree on Jul 9, 2008 3:19 PM PDT
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PrintAfter the Maggette deal went down, I talked to as many people as I could and it sounds like Al is basically gone. His value is a bit lower than people would like, as he's seen only as a shooter now, but his deal is short and the team might be able to get something for him (like a backup PG!).
I speculated that Turiaf was on the team's radar and shortly after I published this, the news came out about an offer to him. I had no idea discussions were that far along, but it's just more signs of the obvious Harrington deal.
Some possibilities include Milwaukee, Charlotte, and maybe OKC. The Nets could be interested as well, but I have not heard that as a name that has popped up.
Expect the team to focus on this before looking hard into Keyon Dooling or Carlos Arroyo as pick up possibilities.
This FanPost is a submission from a member of the mighty Golden State of Mind community. While we're all here to throw up that W, these words do not necessarily reflect the views of the GSoM Crew. Still, chances are the preceding post is Unstoppable Baby!
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Thanks for the Info Pree
I am watching sportscenter right now and they were talking about the state of the clippers and a writer from L.A said that Shawn Marion is a possibility that the Clippers are looking into acquiring. He also mentioned that they have competition for Marion from Golden State. Is this true? Any word on Marion, and if so, why would we need more 3’s?
by JimBarnett2KevinGarnett on Jul 9, 2008 3:22 PM PDT reply actions
Marion would be a 4 in our system
he would be a better rebounding and defensive version of Harrington
I guess the way we can entice Miami is by offering to eat a big chunk of his contract. Could be possible I guess…
it would be awesome to get Shawn
Ellis, Maggette, Jack, Marion would a possible 4 20ppg scores plus the Matrix can play some D and has a great expiring contract.
Bring the Matrix to the Oracle!!
by JimBarnett2KevinGarnett on Jul 9, 2008 3:27 PM PDT up reply actions
I think it’d frankly take a helluva lot more than that. Riley may not love Marion, but he’s not gonna dump him for that little. I think we’d need to include Monta or Beans to get Marion, and as great as Marion would be for us, I dunno if it’d be worth it.
i agree it would take alot more, but wouldn’t it start at Al and Jackson just because of their contracts?
I'd be on board for a Marion pickup.
It’d probably take Al, Randolph/wright, and a future 1st, but shoot I’d do it.
Maybe not if Wright was involved, but for Randolph, sure why not?
Warriors, Stupidest franchise in the league.
I wouldn't
that would not make us that much better in my opinion… We’d have basically the same kind of player all over again when we just signed Maggette it’s just that Marion is an unorthodox 3… is the only difference… if you’re trying to get a PF then get a PF… not a 3 that people make play a 4…
Stop crying about it alright?!?! GO MULLIN.
on interesting take I read recently
suggested that the Warriors aquisition of Maggette was a great one because it enhances their strengths. The article suggested teams that dont have great balance like San Antonio or Detroit end up hurting their team when they try to fill their areas of weakness. A clear example used was the Suns, not only with the obvious trade of Marion for Shaq but also the trade of Q. Rich for Kurt Thomas. The argument is that when a team tries to improve its areas of weakness it usually ends up going away from its strengths. You could say the Warriors also did this with the JRich trade (though that was mostly financial) as they tried to go more “traditional” and get bigger. Its, if nothing else, an interesting argument. I’m not sure I really agree but aquiring Marion would certainly fit with this strategy of continuing to play to our strengths. Monta, Jack, Maggette, and Marion on the floor at the same time would be scary to teams in much the same way that Baron, Monta, Jack, and JRich were at the end of the 2006-2007 season.
Hmm...
That is actually pretty interesting. I’m not sure how true it is but I’m always willing to examine an argument that goes against conventional thinking when it comes to stuff like this. I’m guessing that teams that make trades to cover up weaknesses will come up short overall in the talent department a fair amount of times as well. Definitely something interesting to think about.
"...OlympicMike is clearly the Barack Obama of GSoM"-Sleepy
by olympicmike on Jul 10, 2008 10:55 PM PDT up reply actions
yea exactly
I’m not sure if I really agree or not, but it was definitely an interesting theory that got me thinking. I’ll try to find the article or at least the author and post it. Seems like Nellie would totally buy into that line of thinking.
Monta, Jack, Maggette, and Marion on the floor at the same time would be scary to teams in much the same way that Baron, Monta, Jack, and JRich were at the end of the 2006-2007
The only problem is there’s no ball handler like the 07 team with Boom? So the scary factor becomes a turnover feast..
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jul 10, 2008 11:01 PM PDT up reply actions
true
but you could argue there are actually 4 better scoring options-Marion and Baron being about equal, Monta as a better version of himself, and Maggette probably being a slightly better scorer than JRich in an uptempo system. Hopefully Monta and Jack can handle the ball handling duties.
interesting thought
i think its evident though that in the 2 deals that you reference the deals werent of equal value. both players that were given up were more productive than the players they got in return. in regards to jrich this deal was never finalized. what i mean by that is imo that deal was done to get kg. had this all worked out the way it was headed we would of had a pretty good team. i believe we would of had a team bd, jax, al,kg and a fill in cuz i think monte and beans were part of the deal for kg
i believe we would of had a team bd, jax, al,kg and a fill in cuz i think monte and beans were part of the deal for kg
They shoulda got that in writing before pulling the trigger!
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jul 10, 2008 11:38 PM PDT up reply actions
QRich for Kurt Thomas?
QRich was more productive for the Suns’ system but I wouldnt say he’s a more productive player. Again its not my argument, just a theory I read that I found interesting. Its certainly debatable at best, but it is thought provoking.
I dont know about that KG deal either
I think JRich wouldve been part of a deal for KG. I think once they dealt JRich to Charlotte it was pretty clear we werent getting him. Monta OR Beans, plus JRich and a draft pick or two was always the deal I heard rumored.
my bad
i should have said were referenced insteasd of you reference. i didnt take it as your agument.my bad. i remember the deal kg deal was to be ellis AND beans, bwright and foyle to have the $$$’s match. that was what fitz said on knbr the deal was to be and at the last minute they went with boston instead
probably right then
Fitz would remember better and have better info than me, thats for sure. that wouldve been a lot to give up.
alot to give up?
kg may have been the piece that could have got us to the finals. w/out kg the celts dont win it all. bd ,kg jax, al, and buike better 5 than lakers, spurs, pistons, suns. that would have been very good TEAM and balanced .ahhh mchale sucks
thats not a better 5
and there is NO depth to that team at all. I love KG, but I dont know if that wouldve been a good deal.
keep in mind
this deal is done before ellis has his breakout. and your right a bench of cro, mb, mp, lasme and bellie isnt one that you get excited about. i just feel that kg would have been one superstar to rival bd cuz jax isnt.
thats not a better 5
im just a big buike fan and think that if given a chance he could put up good numbers
They probably would have made the playoffs
But not more. The only wild card is how much KG would have inspired BD. If he is somehow able to tun BD into a 100% commitment player on offense and defense, they might be able to make the finals. That’s a pretty big if though. And even still you’d have to hope BD makes it the whole way without injuries. I suppose that if you add Posey, House, and PJ Brown the depth improves… but we’d still have a tough time with any of the western conference playoff teams.
by Dubs fan in Boston on Jul 11, 2008 11:39 AM PDT up reply actions
Good point
about the inspiration factor. IMO the Celtics didn’t win it all just because they had a ton of talent. You could tell that these guys bought into playing defense with intensity the entire year. A big part of that was KG’s slightly crazy intense nature. I would have been interested to see what he could have done on this team.
"...OlympicMike is clearly the Barack Obama of GSoM"-Sleepy
Even with a 100% Booom
I dont think they make the finals. Not even close to enough depth and when Al Harrington is your best AND only option at center I think youll struggle to win a playoff series.
im not sure...
i know that the warriors are still around 10 mill under the cap so they could absorb the 7-8 million more dollars that Marion’s contract has compared to Harringtons. The question is how much it would take to get him, but i felt like the heat didn’t care much if Marion opted out. He isn’t part of their long time future, so maybe Harrington/Belinelli/future picks might get it done. IT might cost us one of our young guys Randolph/Wright/Belinelli but out of the 3 i hope its Marco.
by JimBarnett2KevinGarnett on Jul 9, 2008 3:56 PM PDT up reply actions
Pargo
I would sign him in a heartbeat as a starter and back him up with CJ
i agree
i really like pargo but i also wouldn’t mind arroyo or dooling
by JimBarnett2KevinGarnett on Jul 9, 2008 3:33 PM PDT up reply actions
hey pree
what about jax? any word on moving him or maybe packaging him with al to get a more higher profile player.he had a career year last year and he has a movable contract.
NO WAY.....Keep StackJack.
He’s a solid player…I would package Bellinelli/Harrington and next years first round draft pick for Chancy and call it a day.
I'd keep him as long as he takes care of the ball more...
I hate how he tries to do too much sometimes by forcing the issue either with him just straight up going for it just trying to bulldoze his way through and get to the line and often times he doesn’t even get the call… Other wise a great player who has does a lot of intangible things on the court.
Stop crying about it alright?!?! GO MULLIN.
he has good handles for a forward but he takes the ball into trouble way to much and that high dribble is a killer. thats where maggs will help us out he’s better at scoring inside paint than jax and has more credablity when it comes to getting fouled than jax. the scarry thing is that with me and maggs in the paint jax will jackin em up like crazy.
I actually prefer Stack Jack bombing from outside...
Than driving constantly, dribbling off his foot or getting his ishh thrown from behind or even worse, complaining about a no-call. I think his chances of getting kicked out of a game is proportional to the time he spends driving the lane.
Besides, I think his erky jerk handle loses its hypnotic effectiveness the more the defender sees it. Kind of like a pitcher’s out pitch in baseball…
"I am the CHOSEN ONE"
by Tim&ChrisBurger on Jul 9, 2008 9:00 PM PDT up reply actions
Take it to them!!!!!
I happen to like it when he forces his will and puts some pressure on the defence. Other than Baron, he’s the only one that does that…and we need that with all the skinny post players we have that don’t want to bang in the paint.
No
He’s too important to move right now – he’s really the initiator on offense.
Definitely an option
Especially when you look at Warriors’ needs.
But I’m not sure when Dooling and Maggette played together?
Marion
I love that we got Maggette. I know Baron wants back in, especially if we somehow acquired Shawn Marion. I say trade Harrington & Ellis for Shawn Marion/Mario Chalmers/Ricky Davis.
I think the heat would take it. I know people wouldn’t like the idea of Ellis leaving. But then we can pay Andris something nice. Marion/Davis/Jax/Maggette/Biedrins/ and let Chalmers run the damn point. So when the vets move on, Chalmers can get chemistry going with Randolph/Wright/Bellinelli in the meantime. I think Chalmers is going to be a stellar Point Guard.
I can’t imagine having Shawn Marion/Corey Maggette/Stephen Jackson/Ricky Davis/Mario Chalmers. Now thats some small ball! With Wright, Randolph & Biedrins coming off the bench. Like?
Jayar P.
no way
we cant trade monta..he’s the biggest brightspot and the franchise
by JimBarnett2KevinGarnett on Jul 9, 2008 3:45 PM PDT up reply actions
marion!? awesome!
nothing would thrill me more than the opportunity to watch marion launch those flawless, signature jumpers night in and night out!
I'm keen on the professional basketball club The Golden State Warriors. I don't fancy other clubs.
by The Bimbo Coles Experience on Jul 9, 2008 3:45 PM PDT reply actions
Don Nelson says
A shot is only ugly when it misses. :P
I love Marion’s shot specifically because he throws it up all weird and stupid yet the ball still goes in like a textbook jumper.
Hmm
In terms of the Heat, I don’t think they’re looking to bring in ANY long term contracts at the moment. With Wayde and his opt-out clause in 2010, they need to keep as much cap space open as possible the next couple of years in order to give their man a lucrative extension. But Marion is someone that flew under the radar and now that he’s been brought up, it’s getting me a bit excited.
Harringtons deal
ends in 2010 so its perfect.
boozer will be a FA next year
assuming he opts out. wouldnt you? the year after has too much competition for contracts. if i’m miami i DO NOT take on a long term contract, and i probably keep marion PRECISELY BECAUSE he is a big expiring. turn around next year and put his money into an offer to boozer, move beasley to the 3, and re-sign wade the following year…
Personally I don't think Beasley can play the 3 because of his size...
He’s too big of a body to take away from the block and he’s very effective there anyways… but ehh maybe…
Stop crying about it alright?!?! GO MULLIN.
I agree
I think Marion/Beasley actually will work really well together as they can be kinda interchangable at the 3 and 4. But 17 mil is a lot to tie up in one guy when they have so many other holes to fill so I can see why they might like to move him.
Trade For Marion
Trading For Marion Would Be The Better Than Having B Davis Back.
Seriously, Marion For JAX/Harrington&2nd Round Pick.
If They Don’t Like That Than Screw Em.
That Sets Up Monta/Maggette… On Second Thought, Lets Not Do This. We Lose 2 Starters & Get One Back Thats Only A Temp… Add A PG And Call It A Day
"Going To Be An Interesting Year"
ppl
how about Al for hinrich. he is one of the best pg that is on the move. and with derrick rose running point in chi-town. they both got the salery per a yr. hell, he give you 16,6 and steal. he could run point for us. Forget Marion, he only great with Nash. that it.
PGs are hard to come by all of a sudden
Gordon I thought would be the odd man out as well since Chicago does only have 2 PGs.
Stop crying about it alright?!?! GO MULLIN.
all of a sudden?
How quickly we forget. remember our massive PG struggles between Timmy and Baron? No coincidence that the team struggled so much during that time.
Charlotte???
do i see a possobility for j-rich to come back to the bay?
how about this situation:
Al+Beans+maggs for J rich and Okafor
What if Jrich didn't want to come back?
With Mullin pulling the seat from underneath him. Ever thought of that?
Warriors, Stupidest franchise in the league.
Complicated
It would have to be J-Rich for sign-and-traded Beans then Okafor sign-and-trade for Al. HAHAHA
Like Pree said before
why don’t we trade Al Harrington to OKC for Wilcox and Ridnour.
Even if we had to add a pick to the deal it would give us an
experienced PG a solid addition to our front line and we’d get some
value for Al since the Sonics seem to be willing to part with both
players. This lineup looks pretty good
Monta/Ridnour/CJ Watson
Sjax/Monta/Bellinelli/Demarcus Nelson
Maggette/ARandolph
Wilcox/BWright/Hendrix
Biedrins/Turiaf
Don’t get me wrong though. If we can trade Al + picks for S. Marion. Lets do it. I think this OKC trade would really help us out.
That'd give us a whole lot of big guys.
Whoa, is this a warriors team? Bigmen and Warriors don’t go hand in hand…
In all seriousness, I think I’d much rather go full bore in getting Kirk Hinrich. I know, I know, he comes with that terrible contract, but it’s not like we’ll have the cap room anytime soon to sign someone better.
We now know that the Warriors are trying to stay competitive in this WC, and not going full bore into tank mode. Go get a decent PG, so that Monta can be used the best way possible.
Hinrich can also adequately guard SG’s. But defense needs to be addressed this year. I don’t know if the defense was terrible due to bad/lackadasical coaching on the warriors part, or if it was due to a “follow the leader” type deal where if Baron’s not giving 100%, then the rest don’t either.
But now if we can get Wright and AB on the court at the same time, that’s a lot of length on the court to cover holes in the defense. We’ve seen with New Orleans’ style defense, that if the perimeter guards can take away their man’s strong/preferred side, and shuttle them into traps, then it can be pretty effective (I’m talking about Peja’s defense). Their guards know they have a beast behind them, so they know their covered.
Warriors, Stupidest franchise in the league.
-1
Getting a real-deal starting PG makes no sense with the Maggette signing. Unless we trade Jax or Maggette, or Maggette comes off the bench. With a PG, Maggette and Monta play the same position, and/or our positional balance is all off…
was his defense bad under skiles?
if you arent motivated to play d for skiles then i dont think you got it in you.
I am Greg Oden, i am goingz to be trade to The Warrior. hoooray.
Warriors for life. Raiders till death. And The A's when i get free tickets.
by STIX on Jul 10, 2008 5:43 PM PDT up reply actions
no way on ridnour
that dude is just a terrible ball player. he doens’t have the bulk, height or the handles to play PG + why wilcox when we got an up and comer in bwright?
the stop calling him "beans" movement
by pervisNeverNervous on Jul 9, 2008 5:28 PM PDT up reply actions
I like Ridnour
as a back up .. his contract is reasonable and if he comes with Wilcox, it would be a formidable lineup. You’re trading one bad contract for two better ones and they fit needs. It’s not bad.
I like the Kristic and M. Williams deal better
but the OKC deal seems much more feasible….Its probably as good as we are gonna get for Al.
well....
I don’t think Ridnour would fit in our team, I would rather have alston or someone instead.
by Ali luvs monta on Jul 12, 2008 10:24 PM PDT up reply actions
+ 1
I’d Love That Trade For Wilcox And Ridnour. Ridnour Is SSOOOOOOOOOO Underrated And He Would Flourish Given The Options Of Monta,JAX,Bellinelli/Maggette Inc
"Going To Be An Interesting Year"
-1
I used to think the same thing, til I had him on my fantasy team last year and watched him struggle (via NBA League Pass) to compete with Earl Watson for the starting spot at SEATTLE. My revised verdict: :P
actually, i'm not
that’s the problem. 3 years ago he looked like a rising, under appreciated talent. now he just looks more like unfulfilled potential.
Thanks Pree
Well, it has been pretty well assumed Harrington would be moved this coming season. I’m wondering if Memphis has an interest in Al. They have three legit PG’s (other than Mayo), any one of whom I’d take. I guess my personal choice would be Lowry from what I’ve read. Perhaps with our extra cap money, even if we sign Turiaf, we could do what is necessary to make a trade like that work.
Do you see any possibility of getting our future PG from Memphis for Al (or if necessary, even Jax)?
CWebb is undoubtedly the answer but I forgot the question.
I proposed
Al for Jaric and Crittenton or something to that affect, but it seems like they’ll just bring in Marc Gasol and let the kids run. Al doesn’t necessarily fit what they need: a bruser.
I don't know about Ridnour...
A Luke/Monta backcourt would give up 50-60pts nightly. Ugh.
In terms of available PG options, my preference would be:
1. Hinrich – Can defend 1’s and 2’s, tough, will distribute the ball, is a better shooter than showed last year. Bigger contract, might push us close to the Luxury next year.
2. Lowry – Can play uptempo, young, probably big enough to hold his own in the post against 2’s ala BD, not a good shooter
3. Crittenton – Young, big, raw, more of a long term project
4. Livingston – Why not take a flyer on him, even at 80% he’d be great
5. Ridnour – Would flourish offensively, be a mess on D especially with Nelly asks his guards to switch.
You may run like Hayes. but you hit like sh**!
Yikes!
You’d have a hard time putting them together, for sure.
You’d only see them together when Jackson needs a break, I think. Won’t be for more than 8-10 minutes a game.
144 minutes/game
At the 1, 2, and 3, and you gotta figure Monta and Jack are good for about 75-80 of those. With Maggette and Belinelli, anyone else wouldn’t figure to get that much more playing time right?
by 408 on Jul 9, 2008 6:51 PM PDT up reply actions
Thanks for the great read Pree...
I still remember the 1st comment I left you… I was so embarresed… it went something like this: “Thanks Pree you sure know a lot about the Warriors, are you a towel boy or something?!?” than you told me what you really were all about and linked me to hoops world! Thanks for the memories!
I Personally
Don’t See That Much A Difference Between Hinrich And Ridnour Except That The Contract Is Cheaper W/ Ridnour And He Dishes Better. Lowry Would Be A Nice Commodity To Back Up Monta But If We Could Get Livingston It Would Be Worth The Risk. He Is A Person Who Can Switch Off Without A Problem But The Only Concern Is His Knee.
"Going To Be An Interesting Year"
At his best, Rindour’s outside shooting looks like Hinrich’s worst. Hinrich is a more efficient scorer and a better shooter (separating these to avoid any confusion). Remarkably similar assist, turnovers (Ridnour’s better dishing isn’t pronounced in the stat sheet), steals. Hinrich grabs an extra board a game. That’s worth something.
by jae on Jul 9, 2008 5:33 PM PDT up reply actions
plus the winner mentality also. salaries aside heinrich is a more athletic, more competitive, and a winner. he was a winner in kansas, and he took the bulls deep in the playoffs. stats are stats but what we see with our eyes on the court is obvious. don’t even compare ridnour to heinrich.
Winner?
Like Derek Fisher or Forest Gump?
Storage is for business, or for family.
by bloodsweatndonuts on Jul 9, 2008 10:51 PM PDT up reply actions
Don't forget Hinrich is an excellent defender.
He made 2nd team All-Defense a year ago. But if what Pree said is true, that people are getting low on Al, it might be even harder to trade Al for Hinrich. It would be REALLy nice right about now to trade Al for Ridnour and Wilcox. Although neither players from OKC are great, they’d give our team added depth at our most shallow positions. RIdnour can be the backup point (our current biggest need) and Wilcox could be our starting 4. Supposing like most new teams, that the Sonics want to save money, OKC might do the trade because it gives them a relatively young 4 who can shoot, and if things don’t work out Al’s contract is expiring after the year. It would be nice if we could trade Al for Ridnour and Wilcox, but honestly, it could be a stretch, though.
by The Daydreamer on Jul 9, 2008 5:56 PM PDT up reply actions
Agreed
However, do you need yet another shooter on this squad or someone that can just come in and stop gap for you? I’m being honest here: I take Ridnour and his less abilities and better contract because this team doesn’t NEED Hinrich’s abilities.
Now, the chances of getting Hinrich: small. That’s probably why I keep talking him down.
If we're looking for a stopgap...
I think Ridnour is a pretty expensive solution. I think he still has 2/$13 left. Plus we’d give up one of our most valuable assets – Al’s expiring contract.
Hinrich’s contract isn’t that horrible. In fact, it’s one of the few NBA contracts that does not escalate, he’ll make $8 mil in the last year of the deal.
You may run like Hayes. but you hit like sh**!
i'd be willing to trade a first rounder
with harrington for hinrich, especially given our terrible drafting record in the mid-lottery.
by dso on Jul 9, 2008 8:14 PM PDT up reply actions
Lottery protected, natch.
But I agree with you. The hate Hinrich gets on this board is comical. He’s coming off one so-so season which is a good thing, since that’s the only thing that might make him semi-available to us. It’s General Management 1A to try to buy low on guys coming off outlying bad seasons. I mean, other than Hinrich’s iffy last season what’s not to like? He’s big and quick, young but experienced, hard-nosed, a good rebounder, an excellent defender, a great FT shooter, and a good shooter from beyond the arc (a sine qua non for us if TNMT leaves). Kind of a big contract at 4/$36M, but not that big for what he provides.
I honestly wouldn’t be surprised to see him outperform BD over the the life of Baron’s contract. The only annoying thing about having him here would be watching Skeptic con Urquell misspell his name 100 times a day… ;-P
Sign ^^^^ !!
by Sleepy Freud on Jul 9, 2008 10:15 PM PDT up reply actions
other than Hinrich’s iffy last season what’s not to like?
“The only annoying thing about having him here would be watching Skeptic con Urquell misspell his name 100 times a day”
?? How the hell do you spell BORING? Sleepy you forget that this is entertainment. Guys don’t get on my good side with mere numbers. A guard has to bring superior style along with some skill. Hindrick gives off a vibe similar to Dunleavey, remember how glad we were when that was over? If we want a chicago guard lets get Rose instead of Hinridck, A Rose by any other name would be as sweet!
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jul 9, 2008 10:44 PM PDT up reply actions
I wonder
What has Dunleavy done since leaving the W’s. Thats right he actually became pretty good. Sometimes a change of scenery makes a player even better. Also, why does a guard need to bring superior style? This isn’t Rucker Park, we don’t need hot sauce shaking guys.
Yup, I'm no fun.
Hinridck is exactly the same as Dunleavey. For obvious reasons. You’re right, let’s get Derrick Rose instead. ;-P
Sign ^^^^ !!
by Sleepy Freud on Jul 9, 2008 11:54 PM PDT up reply actions
Hinridck is exactly the same as Dunleavey
Not exactly the same, Similar in their annoyingness. I need to enjoy the player to enjoy the play to enjoy the game. They don’t pay me to sit there and be annoyed.
Are you still in Japan? It’s midnight here on the bay what time is it over there?
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jul 10, 2008 12:05 AM PDT up reply actions
I never got why everybody hates the Spurs.
They won 4 of the last 10 Championships and are the winningest NBA team of the last decade. I always thought the Spurs’ picture-perfect team-play and fundamentals would really be more appealing to the die-hards.
by The Daydreamer on Jul 10, 2008 3:33 AM PDT up reply actions
dirty
they are the dirtiest team in the nba, that’s why i hate them. bowen is completely unlikable, cheap shot bob’s levelling of nash, manu’s flopping, i guess parker’s not dirty, but something about the guy really bothers me. that last one might not be reasonable, but ask around the nba, you won’t find too many folks who don’t think bowen is the dirtiest player or that manu flops consistently. if they’re being honest, of course.
by cap'n hack on Jul 10, 2008 11:41 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Duncan
Always asking/looking for a foul from refs… and he’s never committed a foul, either.
by Colorado Fan on Jul 10, 2008 2:48 PM PDT up reply actions
tim duncan
the elusive combination of whiny, boring, and absurdly talented. i think it was chuck klosterman that called him the eric clapton of basketball.
jealousy mostly
I dont particularly like them, but I think its mostly jealousy. And they dont have any great personalities that draw fans from outside of SA.
contract aside
unless Stallone Jr. steps up big this year we should consider Hinrich, point guard skills aside, would be the best 3 point shooter on the team
His D isn’t bad either
they are both white and arent great shooters
thats about where the similarities end. Hinrich is a little more steady, plays a little bigger and is a better defender. Ridnour has a little more flash to his game and seems to like the uptempo a bit more.
janny just talked to nellie
echoing a lot of what pree said…
the stop calling him "beans" movement
by pervisNeverNervous on Jul 9, 2008 5:33 PM PDT reply actions
When Comparing Hinrich To Luke
We Are Trying To Get A Distributor, Its Nice He Can Penetrate And Dish Out To The Outside. We Aren’t Trying To Get Another Person Who Can Score. We Want One Who Knows How To Do Something In The Open Court And Run What Little Plays Are In The Book. And Lets Not Get It Twisted, The Bulls Got Their Because Of Deng & Gordon. I Would LOVE To Get Hinrich For Al But If We Can Get A Guard AND A PF Out Of It I’m All For It! Thats The Only Reason I Would Pick The OKC Thing Over Just Hinrich
"Going To Be An Interesting Year"
Keep Al and his Expiring Contract for 2009/10
No point in a fire sale. Let’s be smart here, for once. He’ll be worth 3x next year with his expiring contract – esp. heading into the big 2010 free agent class. I hope we don’t knee jerk and trade him this year “just cuz”.
Unless we get a real-deal player, we should keep him. I like him as an energy guy off the bench, and/or a starting 4; he gives 100% every night—you have to give him that.
I agree
I know we’re in the minority here, but it does make more sense to keep him at least until next year when his expiring contract is more enticing to the LeBron/Wade chasers.
Expiring Contacts will be GOLD next year.
Don’t panic and regret it next year. Everyone will be looking for cap space at the end of next season. NO FIRE SALE. Everyone please read this and think about it for a second. This year we might get Wilcox and Ridnour, next year we will get WAY MORE. Let’s not look back and regret it…
agree, agree, agree
If we can add PG depth without moving Al, we should… he’s not worth much now, but will be a real commodity in a year. Plus, it’s not like the guy’s not useful, if you know his limitations.
The only real downside in keeping Al would be the risk of Nellie continually giving him big minutes at Wright’s expense… Nellie always seems to go with the shooter when he can. But that’s the sort of thing that management ought to be able to handle in-season.
Thanks Capt. Obvious! hehe
I’m still hoping we can lure Randy Foye or Mo Wiliams…but yes, I’m dreaming.
We Believe!!!
Ah
That would be way better to get Randy Foye, way better than Luke Ridnour.
by Ali luvs monta on Jul 12, 2008 10:29 PM PDT up reply actions
why ridnour/wilcox is better than hinrich
With the Corey maggette signing we are looking for depth at the 4 and a backup 1. Monta will be starting at Pg so we just need a good backup who can come in and keep the flow going. Luke Ridnour would be a great backup pg, especially with our run n gun team. Maybe he sucked last year, but that should be expected considering his squad was young and shitty. In the year the Sonics made the playoffs he averaged 11 and 7. Maybe he isn’t as good of a scorer or defender as hinrich, but he is definitely a good backup.
If we trade al for hinrich, we lose al at PF meaning we’d have to start BWright. Don’t get me wrong, I want to give BWright a shot, but I don’t think he’s fully ready to start at the 4. IF we made the ridnour/wilcox trade we’d get wilcox who could start at the 4 and split time with wright. He’d give us a big physical presence inside to complement biedrins style (hustle/length). Two years ago playing 30 mins a game. Wilcox averaged 14 and 8.
I agree taht hinrich is better than ridnour, but i think that adding wilcox and ridnour would be a much better option.
If wright matures quickly we are looking at a pretty sick lineup with:
monta/ridnour
sjax/belinelli
cmaggs/ARandolph
Wilcox/Bwright/Hendrix
Biedrins/Turiaf
i'm sorry, i'm a racist
but there’s something unreal about a white point guard defending NBA 2’s to the point where he makes second team defense. plus, even out of his natural position he still picked up decent assist numbers, and it wasn’t too long ago when he was a constant threat to pick up a near-triple double.
in that sense, ridnour and hinrich is not comparable in that ridnour is a freakin sieve on defense. do you remember what chris duhon did to us last year hitting like 5 threes in a row because monta was too weak to go over the screens? Imagine having both guards being such huge defensive weaknesses… it would be a disaster.
The last two seasons we’ve been a terrible defensive team… but even though our problems in the paint are well documented, we were equally liable at the guard positions as well. Case in point: we couldn’t stop deron williams from penetrating, which often led to easy buckets for boozer. With Baron gone, we have a chance to upgrade our gaurd D if we get Hinrich, not make it worse with stick-nour….
by dso on Jul 9, 2008 8:13 PM PDT up reply actions
I disagree
a big dude who can run the floor…..he’s not the most skilled guy, but he could get a few minutes and ease Wrights transition from mop up duty to full time starter.
this could work
trade al for felton now we have pg. then we go bwright and a pick for nene and we got a legit pf. denver makes this move to avoid the luxury tax. i think nene is more dueable than a melo deal. then we would have to throw in me and take kmart’s crazy contract either way they they need cap relief and we can take advantage of that like we did with ronny and the lakers.
this would be a strong starting 5
me
jax
maggs
nene
beans
or if we go small
felton
me
maggs
jax
nene
I want in on the team...
I’ll play on the bench for free.. Just give me a jersey and a number
by Mr. Monday Night on Jul 9, 2008 9:46 PM PDT up reply actions
(back up point guard)... how about
a starting point guard!!! Great, we got maggette. We got another 20+ scorer. Who the # is the playmaker on this team now??? As much as I wish for Monta to be the future point guard of the Warriors, I recall turnover after turnover last year…. the Denver game pops into my head. Don’t get me wrong, the kid can score at will. But can he create for others??? Can Jax or Mags do it either? Without a legit point guard, next year will be a project year for Monta at the point. And as Nellie says, Monta can be great at the 1. If not, he’ll be really good. Wouldn’t you think the Clippers/Grizzlies/Sixer/insert team with cap room would throw money at Monta if he is so versatile? As a Warriors fan, I do hope Monta can succeed at the 1. As a realist and an observer of Warriors management since the Run TMC days, without a playmaker, this team will be in trouble, down the stretch, in close games.
i agree about monta but
i don’t see how we could get a starting pg and run a lineup of
pg
ellis
jackson
maggette
biedrins
i know nellie likes going small but that’s rediculously small
We played a line-up that small in the Playoffs.
Also, the run leading up to that we played Al at center. Doesn’t get any smaller than that. Also, its not like we won’t have any size. Does Hendrix, Turiaf, and Wright ring a bell?
That only worked in the playoffs because we were playing a weak Dallas team
They had no talent down low, and Dirk doesn’t count because he was easily shut down by Jackson. We were able to take advantage of the mismatches, while they were not due to their lack of talent down low. End of story.
by Dubs fan in Boston on Jul 10, 2008 7:49 AM PDT up reply actions
dirk
is essentially a wing player who is tall enough to be considered a pf. he doesn’t have a ton of post game, so when teams go small against him, he doesn’t have the quickness to get by those guys. and of course dampier isn’t exactly an offensive force, so you’re right, going small was the best way to take them out, and i’m looking forward to having a couple guys on the team who might be able to guard true post players. let’s hope it works out.
Gotta edit that story.
If we can get a really good PG and Brandan hasn’t improved much than we go small. If we end up with a back-up PG, and Brandan has improved than we go orthodox. We just have to put the line-up that will give us the best chance to win. We mainly beat Dallas because Avery Johnson couldn’t figure out the W’s that season, but they had no problem with us the year after, with the exact same team. Also, don’t say that we couldn’t beat them last season because J-rich was gone, because he played PF in many of those games.
You're downgrading from JRich to Al/Pietrus/Barnes in 07-08
They were the same team who couldn’t attack our weakness at PF. Switching from JRich to Al/Pietrus is a downgrade that hurts us offensively.
Plus, they were amped every time they played us and we were missing Jack for one game, and split the other two. It’s a wash. We were 1-2 against them in 07-08 (1-1 with Jack) and we were 4-2 against them in the playoffs in 06-07. It’s not that different. In the regular season, I’m sure Dallas wasn’t completely focused in the games we played against them as they had the #1 seed locked up the whole time and we were way out of the playoffs for most of the season.
by Dubs fan in Boston on Jul 11, 2008 6:41 AM PDT up reply actions
We might have downgraded.
But Ellis was a non factor in the Playoffs and last season he more than filled J-Richs role. How the hell is 1-2 in the regular season the same as 4-2 in the playoffs. Totally different animal. Also, I go along with your logic, then the Mavs were 2-0 against the W’s with Dirk. If you remember the game we won was when Dirk was on the shelf. Plus you can’t just make assumptions that a team is on an emotional high. Does that mean the W’s were not when they knew that every win counted and that those two games they lost would have gotten them in the playoffs?
You know what I’m tired of debating with you. All you do is use stuff that’s already been said and do it in a way that makes you seem like your talking down on ppl. Your like Jesse Jackson without the “I wanna cut off his nuts comment.”
Does that mean the W’s were not when they knew that every win counted
In a way they played all last season pretty low compared to the last half of the playoff year. I still think the JRich trade destroyed the team chemistry and spoiled a good thing. I wish Mullin and Nelson wouldn’t try to think so much and had just let the good team run with it for a while. The more Mul-son try to think the more they outsmart themselves.
Keep it simple, an allstar point guard, a home grown dunk champion, an unwanted thug and his sidekick, , a misplaced footballer, and a geeky young center took us a long way, why get so antsy to blow it up? Does Nellie have a fatal flaw,an uncontrollable need to fail?
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jul 11, 2008 10:41 PM PDT up reply actions
what about starbury?
stephon marbury anyone? the warriors are good at reviving players and marbrury might be the perfect fit… plus the knicks will be paying a lot of his contract if they waive him…
starbury
ellis
maggette
harrington ( not for long )
beans
60+ wins i see
60+ wins?
did i miss the sarcasm here? if so, i am willing to offer a sheepish apology, but wow, that is an absurd statement. getting marbury is a great way to kill team chemistry and give pt to a guy who was done years ago.
-1000000000
I gave the last guy who suggested him negative points, so I’m just staying consistent.
i'm with you
marbury to the lakers might be the most effective move for the warriors at this point. all of the sudden the pacific division opens right up.
and i am aware that phoenix is still exists, but injury risks abound on that team. they could miss the playoffs if things go poorly in that regard.
i thought about Starbury too...
But as much as I love the dude, his best games are behind him. Seems like he lost his mojo when his pops passed away. And he hasn’t proved he is a winner. He used to be Mr. Fasha nd Dash, now he’s just a flash in the pan. Only way I see him signing is if we can get him for cheap. Doubt he would wanna move all the way to the wesside away from NYC though. He’ll prolly stay in the East, if anything.
We Believe!!!
by crossphaded on Jul 10, 2008 12:21 AM PDT up reply actions
No player that consistently makes the team he goes to worse deserves to have “Star” in his nickname.
On a similar note...
Nobody is allowed to give themselves a nickname. This is why Tory “Big Game” Holt gets made fun of with a similar, slightly offensive to a certain culture, nickname.
by Dubs fan in Boston on Jul 10, 2008 7:51 AM PDT up reply actions
That self-giving nickname rule sucks
Sometimes nicknames are undeserved, regardless of who appoints them.
If the Knicks waive him
and he accepts 3M for a one year contract with 2 years of team option… sure, why not. Other than that, no thanks.
by Dubs fan in Boston on Jul 10, 2008 7:52 AM PDT up reply actions
Shaun Livingston and other possible additions to the roster......
The Clippers just renounced rights to Shaun Livingston. I know he is another lanky player and he is coming off of a knee injury that makes me sick to my stomach every time I see the video of it but he has some good point guard skills and is a pretty good defender.
The Clippers might be just trying to free up some extra cap room to make a big offer to Josh Smith that the Hawks can’t or won’t match. They could still re-sign Livingston but the Warriors might be able to get in there and grab him up.
I don’t think the Bulls will part with Hinrich now that Duhon is a Knick. Rose isn’t going to play 48 minutes every game and Hinrich is not worth his contract right now considering the awful year he had last season. Luol Deng is the Bulls biggest priority right now. Ben Gordon is most likely the player that won’t be wearing a Bulls uniform next season but I don’t see the Warriors being interested in him. I do like the idea of getting Stephon Marbury. Yes, he seems to have attitude problems that hurt team chemistry but everyone was saying the same thing about Baron Davis when he came to the Warriors. If the Knicks release him, the Warriors have to grab him even if he only backs up Monta at the point guard.
I don’t like the offer that the Warriors are making to Ronny Turiaf. He’s a younger Adonal Foyle and while I loved Adonal, I knew it was a huge mistake to sign him to that large a contract. Turiaf isn’t worth more than $2m/year not the $4m he is most likely going to get since the Lakers probably won’t match it.
I gotta say something about Josh Smith. If you ask me, Once the Warriors were out of the running for Elton Brand, they should have skipped over Maggette and went for Josh Smith. He is young, hugely athletic, can play much bigger than he is, and he’s a great shot blocker and rebounder. He brings all the things that the Warriors need and I think would have a great future with the rest of the young players. Maybe there is still a very slim chance of adding him to the roster. If the Warriors don’t get Turiaf, they should have about $9m in cap space. Even if Josh Smith accepts that, which I doubt because he can get more from the Clippers, Atlanta will probably match it and keep him.
Hinrich = Overrated
Simply put, the dude is not that good. Check out his numbers, besides his ONE good year two years ago, he has been a marginal player. He was just putting up descent numbers because he was getting 36 mpg of burn every night. For the talk of being a good shooter, he has never shot better than 37% on threes more than once in his career, yet he still feels like jacking threes up at a Stephen Jackson like pace year after year.
I will give him props in that he is a hard-nosed, pesky defender. However, He does not have the size too consistently guard bigger players in this league, which he would have to do if paired with Monta.
However, let’s face reality. With the Maggette signing, having to pay Hinrich all that money is dumb. We would have alot of guards/wings making a lot of money. Furthermore, wouldn’t the Bulls rather have Hinrich over Ben Gordan? I think so. A backcourt of Rose/Hinrich sounds better for them.
Furthermore, Wilcox/Ridnour are both pretty bad. Wilcox give some hustle out there, but I really don’t believe him to be better than Harrington in the first place. Ridnour is just plain bad. He’s very weak defensively and seems to play with no passion.
The Warriors need to go after Dooling as a backup PG and as someone who could potentially play along side Ellis for a few minutes a game. He was known in Orlando as their primary defensive stopper on the wing, so he can match up with either PGs or SGs. he can probably be had for pretty cheap (maybe 4-6 mil/year). He is pretty much the only viable free agent option out there, barring a trade, and is a proven commodity in this league
by It's Prounounced Mon-Tay on Jul 10, 2008 1:57 PM PDT reply actions
he was guarindg two gaurds
cuz duhon was playing the point.
For the talk of [Hinrich] being a good shooter, he has never shot better than 37% on threes more than once in his career…
This prose is pretty difficult difficult to decipher. It sounds like you’re trying to say that he’s only shot over 37% in one season. This is factually inaccurate. In 03-04 he shot 39% from beyond the arc. In 06-07 he shot 41.5%. On a larger note, he’s never shot below 35% for a season (and has a career mark of 37.7%). A 35% shooter from beyond the arc is usually helping his team with that ability. Shooting better than this is an asset. He has, in all but one season, shot better than this.
It doesn’t appear you did a basic fact check before writing. When you implore people to “check out his numbers” I’d suggest you do the same yourself. Failing to get facts right when you then try to make an argument using the stats tends to wreck credibility.
Dooling and Hinrich are almost exactly the same size according to their listed height/weight. Hinrich’s measurement is correct (6-3 in sock, 6-4 in shoes). I do not know about Dooling’s, though the tendency is for player heights to be inflated rather than the other way around.
No On Hinrich
Not Another Shooter Please No… He Can Take Over By Shooting. Just Get A Backup PG Because If We’re Starting W Monta @ The One We’ll Need A Real PG When He Comes Out The Game That Can Somewhat Distribute. I Think Watson Is Ok But We Need A Ridnour And If We Can Get A 2 For 1 In Al For Ridnour AND Wilcox Than Lets Do It So We Don’t Have To Worry About The Rest Of The Offseason And We Can All Give Our Hands A Good Little Rest
"Going To Be An Interesting Year"
nO waY dudE
you’rE jusT talkinG crazY talK now. forgeT thE aL foR ridnouR anD wilcoX ideA. aS I keeP sayinG, aL wilL bE wortH waY morE nexT yeaR…
You forgot to capitalize "noW"
Good one though.
by Dubs fan in Boston on Jul 11, 2008 6:43 AM PDT up reply actions
HE WAS ALWAYS ON THE BLOCK BUT ON THE UNDER
A COUPLE SUMMERS AGO AFTER THE BIG PLAYOFF RUN VS THE MAVS, THE WARRIORS WERE LOOKING TO FOR A WAY TO REDUCE THE PAYROLL TO MAKE ROOM FOR THIS SUMMERS RFA’S IN MONTA AND BEANS.THE FIRST GUY THEY TRIED TO MOVE WAS AL AND A DEAL NOT TOO MANY PEOPLE KNEW ABOUT THAT ALMOST WENT DOWN WAS HIM AND JARRIED JEFFRIES FROM THE KNICKS. GOT TURNED DOWN LAST MIN CUZ OF THE PLAYERS KNICKS WANTED TO INCLUDE. REMEMBER ISIAH LOVES THIS GUY. MY SOURCE: BD’S AGENT
IT'S SO FUN TO TYPE LIKETHIS!!!!!!!!!!!1
"Monta is the MAN." -Bob Fitzgerald
by WarriorForLife on Jul 11, 2008 7:30 PM PDT up reply actions
No one on this blog cares
The one player that we need to package AL with a youngster and draft picks for is JOSH SMITH. Sign in trade.There is no way that the NBA will allow for us to ever sign a LeBron or DWade. We need to take Al/Randolph/maybe Bellinelli and some picks and go after Josh Smith. AL played one of his best seasons in ATL the fans liked him, they’ve seen all his capabilities, ATL would be suckered by his soon to be expiring contract and they would like the prospect of Randolph or Belli. It would allow them cap room to dream in the coveted summer of 09/10. AL would fit there style of play and character. Josh Smith is EXACTLY what we need. He is big athletic with good offenxive skills and killer defense. As far as everyone trippin out over the “need” of a pg. I guarantee that Monta has been working on being a PG since the end of last season when Baron was in limbo. We do need a solid backup Livingston or Dooling would be best, size and can start if needs be, if not i like Watson. But if we obtain Josh Smith we could have
M.E./Livingston or Dooling/CJ
Jax/Buike/Belli
Maggs/Buike/Barnes?
J.Smith/Wright
Biedrins/Turiaf?
Seems like a hella bomb lineup that fits Nelie Ball perfectley and is poised to make the playoffs and do well, even in the west. They’d probably finish 2nd in the pacific, at least. Cheaper than the Matrix better for our team. We need shot blocking not more offensive minded players who can use quickness to steal
by droppin gsw _knowledge south bay style on Jul 11, 2008 4:50 PM PDT reply actions
After watching AR in the summer league game today...
I say no way I’m trading him. Not yet. Too soon, and he looks good. I was on the GET JOSH SMITH bandwagon up until about 3 days ago, and then I started to think that he might not be the best fit. I mean, if he really does have character questions, I’d prefer to avoid him…
All that being said, I might do BWright + Al + pick… But he’s redundant with BWright, so it would have to be one or the other. Randolph looks like he can play “three”, so we should keep him and he could, in theory, play beside Smith… Could work as a sign-and-trade, but I doubt they’d do it. Hawks fans would probably hate it. Not sure how they feel about Al. He already played here once…
were not getting anybody
i think were done with dencent players
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