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Monta Ellis Superstar?

This is kind of a response to postings I've seen that are skeptical of Ellis' PG skills, suggestions that we trade him for a power forward or "true" point guard, complaints about his defense.

I've watched a lot of Warrior games the last couple of years.  I'm no expert but you don't really have to be to see that Monta Ellis is a rare talent, the kind that doesn't come around that often.

The game comes easily to him, it's not supposed to be this easy to come right out of high school and score at will against the best players in the world.  We haven't really had a chance to see a talent like this develop before.  We've seen some very good players - Antawn, J-Rich, Spree, Dunleavy- and been pretty tough on them (justifiably so in Dunleavy's case).  The closest thing to seeing a talent like Monta's here was Webber for one year and Arenas for two.

To put what Monta has done in perspective look at his numbers against all the other players who have come straight from high school.  With the exception of Lebron, who was freakishly physically ready, Monta has been as good as any.  If you compare Monta's first three years with Kobe the numbers are almost identical.  He's been  better than Mcgrady and equivalent to KG although they play different positions.   

Star-divide

Obviously what all those guys have in common is that they became superstars in the league.

I'm not saying he will be the next Kobe (well maybe I am sort of) but he is going to be one of the players to watch this year.  He will be the new Iverson, Wade, Carter, Kobe- the guy that you makes you buy tickets if you're a fan of an opposing team bc you want to  see what he'll do.  He's going to have some crazy games this year.  He'll be on highlight reels all the time.  He's gonna be the guy that all the kids want to be like.  I want to see him do all this in a warrior uniform.  When he's dazzling the world with 40 point games I'm just going to be laughing at all those who wanted to trade him for Marion, or whoever (like that would really help the team get closer to championship level).  Of course they will still probably be complaining about his defense.

Speaking of defense- not many players come in out of high school and quickly become top notch defenders.  Kobe (to use that comparison again) was hellof skinny and didn't really guard anyone early in his career.  There were probably those that wanted the Lakers to keep Eddie Jones for his D and trade Kobe for a power forward.  Chris Paul is known to not play much D, although he gets lots of steals, Lebron is not known for D either.  Give Monta a chance.

Some people say Monta does not have the size to guard the shooting guard position so He'll never be able to match the Kobes of the world.  Monta's not that small.  He's 6'3" with long arms and crazy hops.  He'll fill out.  I bet if you put him next to Raja Bell who plays next to Nash (who can't guard anyone) and is Known as a Kobe stopper, you would see that they are almost exactly the same size.

Monta as Point Guard- People talk about true point guards like its some mystical ability that you either have or don't.  I think that's kind of true with ordinary NBA talent but when you have someone with Monta's ability he will be fine because teams will have to adjust their defense to stop him and he has shown that he can create for his teammates.  You can see that he has the ability to make the other players better.  It's almost beside the point (no pun) what position he plays, Nellie is going to figure out the best lineup to put  around him, as a combo guard he can play either (sort of like Wade when the Heat were good, he would sometimes play with a pg like Jason Williams and sometimes with a shooter like Damon Jones or Kapono).  People look at how Chris Paul and Deron Williams have turned their teams around and everyone thinks you need a pure point guard so stupid franchises use high draft picks for "pure" point guards but it predictably fails bc tguys like Paul and Williams  don't come around often (examples- Mike Conley #4, Acie Law #11; DJ Augistin #7- when Bayliss is clearly the greater talent).  Monta's talent is on par with Williams and Paul although he probably will never average 10 assists he will do things that neither of those guys could dream of in mid-air.  It's true that they have accomplished more so far but consider that they were high lottery picks for bad teams who turned the keys over to them right away.  Monta was a second round pick out of high school playing behind a superstar point in Baron and a very good 2 in J-rich.  Of course he wasnt' going to get a chance to develop as quickly.  I think this year he will show that he is in the same class as they are.  Sorry this is long and probably tedious to read but fun to write.  I've been sort of simmering over what I see as lack of appreciation for Ellis but I've been too busy studying for the Bar to respond.  I think this team is going to be better than anyone I've read so far gives them credit for.

 

This FanPost is a submission from a member of the mighty Golden State of Mind community. While we're all here to throw up that W, these words do not necessarily reflect the views of the GSoM Crew. Still, chances are the preceding post is Unstoppable Baby!

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i pray

you are right… for our team’s sake.

by saintdee on Aug 1, 2008 2:08 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Damn,

he said Robert Pack!!! There’s a name I haven’t heard in a while.

by Hayward's Finest on Aug 7, 2008 9:57 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

You sound like a tardy Clip's fan...

If you are, go back to your tribe and suck down some slop while you watch your team get shat on by virtually every team in the league this year, scum….Robert Pack…How dare you? Monta will struggle this season, but that is all. Baron will lead the league in technical fouls, blame his teammates for being losers, blame management for not having the competence to keep Brand, fold half way through the season with a busted wheel, and then you’ll try your best to trade him while the other team laughs and spits in your eye. So now you got Dizzle crying about being dissed by the management, the rest of the team don’t want him, Paparrazi’s got his face all over the Sports page, and it reads, “BARON UP, CLIP’S DOWN!” And there’s Paul Bunyan, drunk off his ass sittin between Brad and Angelina(sticking a knife into some helpless animal) his hand on the ass of some drive-thru hollywood broad while she straddles him on the DIRECTOR chair. Good riddance. I bet your dumb ass would give Baron 50 mil…Yes, I’ll take Monta the point guard, thank you. The Warriors’ record will be nothing to boast about after this season, but I know after that 82nd go, I won’t be the one who slugs upstairs, retiring under the covers to sob like a btch. It’ll be all the Clippers fans, drowning their sorrows while watching Baron’s features on the projector, sipping scotch out a teacup, pinky-up reminiscing about hatching that “secret plan” that never happened. UG! my kingdom for a horse.. Boo hoo hoooooooooooooooo….

If your a Warriors fan….well, then I guess I just hope you’re wrong.

by Travis Bickle on Aug 10, 2008 2:48 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yes, I’ll take Monta the point guard, thank you. The Warriors’ record will be nothing to boast about after this season,

That’s damnation by faint praise isn’t it? What’s the point of all these Montay lovers? Make him point even if he’s not? What’s the attraction? I see a small shooting guard that’s decent for that position but very weak in point guard skills so why try to make him make us worse? Is this the Golden state Warriors or the mississippi state Montays? Who cares if he’s the next Iverson or Kobe? what can he do for us now is the important question.

Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me

by Skeptic con Urquell on Aug 10, 2008 10:09 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

But it's not the important question...

What he can do for us now is irrelevant compared to the remaining portion of his career as a Warrior. The only determining factor this year is how he responds to playing a different position, and if he’s able to make the adjustments. The reasons I think Monta will be able to play point guard are simple. He can blow by virtually any player in the league, he’s smart enough to make the pass after he’s lost his opponent and drawn in the D, I’ve never seen a game where he wasn’t able to finish a play to the basket against any defense, and he’s got the mid range jumpshot to keep the help completely honest. Monta pushing the ball up the court on the break is a very good thing. he’s obviously going to beat all the front court players to the other side, and no one man can stop Monta at the rim…he will either be fouled or finish over/around/under his man. Point being, somebody will be open when Monta’s going to the rim, and if they’re not, then he will score himself. It’s that simple.

Yeah, I get it. He’s not a natural distributor, he’s a scorer, the position is too complex and so on…

by JakeGittes on Aug 10, 2008 3:19 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Monta will be fine. Look at Gilbert Arenas, he wasn’t given a chance to bloom here, but once he was with the wizards, he blossomed into one of the most clutch shooters in the league today. Give Monta another year or two, and he’ll get even quicker or more explosive at the rim.

WARRIORS BASKETBALL!!! Patiently waiting for a title...I may be waiting for a long time...

by JustSomeName on Aug 1, 2008 2:20 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

What exactly do you mean by “wasn’t given a chance?” Arenas left after two years. In his second year, he was averaging 18ppg and 6assists in 35 minutes. That’s a pretty good “bloom”, good enough that the Wiz tossed a big enough chunk of change at him that the Warriors were unable to match it (not unwilling—unABLE).

by jae on Aug 1, 2008 4:36 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

gilbert

was given more than a chance. he started as their point for a year. And he was a stud. i mean yeah he didn’t get any PT for a while but he didn’t deserve it yet. he was a 2nd round pick and it wasn’t until he worked his ass off “to show the doubters wrong” when he deserved PT, got it, shined, and walked away and signed a big deal with the wizards because of some stupid rule.

Now wait a minute, why r u replying to this post saying “monta will be fine… etc.” ???
The poster is saying monta is a superstar

by Agent Zero on Aug 4, 2008 1:18 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I've been too busy studying for the Bar to respond. I think this team is going to be better than anyone I've read so far gives them credit for.

You better study the chapter on closing arguments again :>)

Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me

by Skeptic con Urquell on Aug 1, 2008 2:28 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

I still wouldn't put Monta in CP3 & DWill's class

They’re each deadly scorers AND top notch distributors. While they may not put pressure on defenses with their driving ability, they are still very consistent with their jumpers and long range game. Monta will become a Agent 0 type of PG, but is that really a good thing? Zero hasn’t done much of anything except score a lot in some regular season games. I hope for (and somewhat expect) the best from Monta, but he’s gonna have to find a way to deal with being the main focus of defenses this year.

by Dubs fan in Boston on Aug 1, 2008 2:47 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Yes, that would be a good thing. Besides, I see him as more of an Iverson, and that would be a better thing.

by belilaugh on Aug 1, 2008 9:29 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I hope for (and somewhat expect) the best from Monta, but he’s gonna have to find a way to deal with being the main focus of defenses this year.

I’m hoping he can get his game and rep up to the point where we can trade him for someone good but without his size/position defensive problems? I’d rather be able to play flexible positons without the worry of compensating for Montay’s size.If we could get a top point guard or a power forward in trade that would be one less thing to worry about.

Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me

by Skeptic con Urquell on Aug 1, 2008 3:02 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

What if he...

Learns to play defense (young players typically have difficulty with this and learn after a few years in the league)
Runs the team well (it’s HIS team now, not Baron’s)
Fills out (really, have you seen any tall 19YOs walking around the street who aren’t beanpoles? Really?)

You say “I hope he gets his game up”, but you want to ditch him for the same difficulties he’s having now. Isn’t part of getting better learning to, you know, succeed at things you aren’t doing well now?

by Dubs fan in Boston on Aug 1, 2008 3:23 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Can you a actually spew your crap with a straight face?

If you really want to try Cartman explains how on South Park.

Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me

by Skeptic con Urquell on Aug 1, 2008 9:52 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Can you a actually spew your crap with a straight face?

what is your fool ass talking about? Just curious?

by gsfool on Aug 2, 2008 12:07 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ali luvs monta

Awww, Im sure Montay loves you too Champ.

Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me

by Skeptic con Urquell on Aug 1, 2008 9:34 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Who’s your idea of a top point guard? Raymond Felton? No thanks.

by belilaugh on Aug 1, 2008 9:30 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Who’s your idea of a top point guard?

Magic Johnson, Oscar Robertson. Also not one of the best but one of my favs for entertainment was Jason Williams in his prime. Boom was plenty good enough . Felton would be better than anything we have now and are likely to be able to get in the near future.

Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me

by Skeptic con Urquell on Aug 1, 2008 9:42 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Felton would be better than anything we have now and are likely to be able to get in the near future.

No GM in the league would take felton over Monta. If Felton is such a good PG why did they waste their lottery pick on DJ Aug?

by gsfool on Aug 2, 2008 1:23 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

i would trade monta

for a skilled big man. they are to hard to come by. i would also trade him for a top pg. maybe you dont remember how bad we were when had pg’s like bimbo, mookie and vonteego running the team. when bd got here we were a playoff team.

by Rach on Aug 1, 2008 3:11 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Hey

dont do this to Mookie and Vonteego!! They were cool!!!

F**K REFS!!!

by faetati on Aug 1, 2008 3:17 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Maybe you're misinterpreting
skilled big man

and

top pg.

If he means Superman and CP3, then yeah, I’d do it. If he means Kaman and Chauncy, then no thanks.

Either way, these “skilled big men” and “top pgs” first have to become available. Then we can talk about whether trading Monta (or anyone else for that matter) would be worth it.

by Dubs fan in Boston on Aug 1, 2008 3:26 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

dhoward and cp3 are even more rare than montas!!!

but if they want to trade one of those guys for monta then i’ll do that trade at the drop of a hat!! but thats not realistic so im fine with monta!!!

by hyphy cowboy on Aug 1, 2008 3:51 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

agree

Monta may not be CP3 but he ain’t chopped liver either

by GeeEssDub on Aug 1, 2008 3:52 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

If we can get Bynum, Howard, Oden, Bosh, Garnett, Marion, or Stoudemire why not? I rather have a good inside presence then a combo guard. If Monta proves he can play PG with good passing abilities we should keep him. But if we are offered any of those (which is impossible) then do it.

Hasheem "The Beat" Thabeet. A Warrior in 09.

by ejdacanay on Aug 1, 2008 7:32 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

some things to take in account

Monta Ellis was rarely guarded by the opposing teams’ best perimeter defenders. Those guys guarded and focused primarily on stopping Baron Davis. Now we’ll get to see how Monta does when the defensive gameplan is catered to stop him.

by YaHeard on Aug 1, 2008 3:38 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

then

pass to mags

by saintdee on Aug 1, 2008 4:36 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

The best defender

This is a fair point but I think due to the warriors offense teams are often scrambling back in transition so much of the time that this to a degree lessens this point. On another note ive watched ellis play in many games and he gets a ton I repeat a ton of his points in transition and they are almost all layups or jumpers. I also think ellis is as good if not better at getting his shot off than davis and takes far better shots than davis does, I recall him having a month in which he shot nearly 70%. The first time I ever saw ellis play(In person)(his rookie year near mid season) I was astounded by his talent. in about 15 minutes he registered 8pts 5rebs 2blks and 2stls. and I said then that this guy will be the next AI and I think he will live up to that prediction this season. My fearless fantasy forcast is 25ppg 7ast 6reb and 2stls a game.

by The City on Aug 8, 2008 11:43 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Towards the end of last season...

it wasn’t baron they had to focus on, it was Monta…and he was doing it while Baron wasn’t on the floor at times. They even got to double and occasionally triple team him and those ended up being some of his better Assist games.

I agree Baron added a different look to the team when the opposing gaurds had to D him up, but Magette is JUST as adept and getting to the rim as Baron was, it’ll be the same type of defensive match up for most squads this year. Minus Barons ill-timed 3 point launches w/ 20 Sec on the shot clock.

by esco41510 on Aug 1, 2008 4:22 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

i like

how you mention maggette. with him and monta in the starting lineup they could combine and do the colussus/wolverine dunk.

by 99tilinfiniti on Aug 5, 2008 4:13 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Monta will be fine with dropping dimes

In fact I think that Baron kind of ignored Beans towards the end of the year (too busy jacking up off balance 3 balls to find the open man) and it was Monta who was really running the P-n-R well with Andris.

by GeeEssDub on Aug 1, 2008 4:47 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

+1

Monta to Biedrins will be a big time pick and roll combo. I think it will boost Dre’s scoring avg and Monta’s assist avg big time. Monta’s so deadly because he can break anyone off the dribble or hit the mid range J. He’s also getting the B Diddy step back jumper too. Seriously can you imagine how many times Monta and Dre did it in practice running on the second team since their rookie years. We saw some of it last year and I’m sure its coming on full force this year.

by dxc13 on Aug 6, 2008 12:23 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

What I want t know-Help me out

I do not know of the resources or have the time to look this up so if somebody could help me out.
We talk about all of the great players who put up similar numbers to Montas in their first three years. What I want to know is if there has ever been a player who put up those kinda of numbers (similar to Montas) in there first three years at a young age and not become a star or even a very good player in the league.(Granted he is already a very good player)
Please my friends, make me happy.

Playoffs!!??

by PAWarrior on Aug 1, 2008 4:52 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

if there has ever been a player who put up those kinda of numbers (similar to Montas) in there first three years at a young age and not become a star or even a very good player in the league.(

I guess the jury’s still out on Durant. Usually it’s the opposite. They Put up crappy numbers early and 3 or 4 years later start to be productive a la Jermaine O’Neal, Travis Outlaw, Al Harrington. But it’s the really great ones that excell early, pretty much just the guys I mentioned + Amare. Chris Paul I think came out after his freshman year and pretty much smoked the league right away.

by gsfool on Aug 1, 2008 8:47 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Durant...

Played 1 year in the league, not 3. He still has two years to get to Monta’s experience level.

by Dubs fan in Boston on Aug 4, 2008 8:38 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Just a couple I can think of right now...

Kenny Anderson and Chris Jackson

John 8:44 -Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do.

by triplesix on Aug 4, 2008 3:55 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Kenny Anderson and Chris Jackson

Good call in that neither reached superstar status although Anderson had some pretty good all-star type years. Remember though that both had 2 years of college, were 21 when they reached the league, and didn’t really start making an impact until their second years in the league. Monta was much more of a prodigy averaging 16.5 pts his second year at age 20 when those guys were still playing college.

That said however it’s true that both those players were highly skilled and showed promise early and had pretty ordinary NBA careers, at least by the standards I am setting for Monta. Furthermore Jackson had kind of an eerily similar skill set to Monta- super quick, prolific(HS and college) scorer, great jumping ability, undersized at the 2- I think Monta is more explosive as a finisher and is just more of a physical specimen than Jackson-Raouf – which I think will serve him well in the league. Jackson was really slight and oddly enough also had a bit of a weight problem at times as I remember.

I think Jackson is a really interesting example to bring up bc he represents what everyone fears when they talk about tweener or combo guards- these guys light it up in college and can’t play point in the pros while their size is a handicap at the two position. I think Jackson was tried at the point and it failed. In the early 90s everyone was looking for 2s cut out of the Jordan cloth (6’6” strong athletic guys). This is still an ideal but in the interrim we’ve seen that players like Arenas, Wade and Iverson can excell. I think today’s game actually puts more of a premium on quickness than the early 90s when plodding teams like Knicks, CAvs, Jazz were very succesful.

by gsfool on Aug 5, 2008 11:56 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Mahmoud Abdul-Rauf (aka Chris Jackson)

“I think Jackson is a really interesting example to bring up bc he represents what everyone fears when they talk about tweener or combo guards- these guys light it up in college and can’t play point in the pros while their size is a handicap at the two position. I think Jackson was tried at the point and it failed.”

Another flaw of M.A.R. that Monta doesn’t have is that “Abdul-Rauf overcame the challenge of Tourette syndrome to have an athletic career.” In general I agree with gsfool that Abdul-Rauf wasn’t given a shot at the 2-guard. Though I’d offer the reminder of this that Denver did have Robert Pack another combo guard that allow them play the two off of each other. Furthermore, I think the fears Abdul-Rauf represent are the not the combo guard ones, but the ones we see from a player like Ron Artest or Vernon Maxwell (the original play charge into stands at a fan) who don’t have mental control of themselves and sometimes just freak out on the court

A Sonics fan without a team.. Though I'm auditioning GS Warriors this season.

by mcwalter44 on Aug 5, 2008 2:50 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

When...

did Abdul-Rauf freak out on the court? My memory doesn’t serve.

John 8:44 -Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do.

by triplesix on Aug 6, 2008 4:31 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

On a side note...

I realized that both had played in college and didn’t make the jump right out of HS. However, up until 10 years ago you would be hard-pressed to find an NBA’er who had w/the exception of Moses Malone. Therefore, for arguments sake, expanding the pool to 1-2 years of college will yield higher results – or at least some.

John 8:44 -Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do.

by triplesix on Aug 6, 2008 4:28 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

i thought that Mahmoud Abdul-Rauf

issues were when he became a muslim and his political views changed and his observing of ramadan. they can only eat after the sun has set for a month. he got weak from fasting and he was very out spoken in his views against the united states. protesting the national anthem and other things. that guy could flat out score

by Rach on Aug 7, 2008 11:45 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

good knowledge

several prominent NBA players have been Muslims – Kareem, Dream, and Abdul-Rauf as well as current players Shareef Abdur Rahim and Nazr Mohammed (and I may be leaving someone out) who are observant of fasting during Ramadaan. That alone is managable.

But several MLB and NBA players quietly protest US policies by not being present for the national anthem – Abdul-Rauf took a lot of blowback because he was one of the first and didn’t hide it

his LSU days were legendary

by hardcore on Aug 7, 2008 10:00 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

dj went #9

deron went through his growing pains with sloan..i wouldnt say he gotthe keys right away. and bScott is no picknick either from what player have said. i though i was high on monta but this guys might just be a tad delusional. i pray hes right tho..

by IndubitableBayAreaGM on Aug 1, 2008 4:57 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

deron went through his growing pains with sloan

Not a big Jazz fan so you are probably right about that. My Point was more that Paul and Williams were playing starters minutes right away and weren’t behind a star guard in his prime who was the franchise player (like Baron) in their first two years so they developed faster than Monta. good correction on DJ. Still think he went too high. Probably guillty on the delusional part get back to me next year we’ll see who was right. I will own up if wrong. (I thought Larry Hughes was a potential superstar too)

by gsfool on Aug 2, 2008 12:50 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

MVP

Monta will be league MVP someday. He is going to go down as one of the greatest warriors of all time.

by obiandandy on Aug 1, 2008 5:14 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Top notch Pg

For those doubters that Monta can play the point, heres something you should listen to. He’s game style is very similar to that of Tony Parker, who only averages around 6 assists and has a similar assist/turnover ratio. And even if Monta is not an ideal point guard, it should hurt our offense that much because Monta creates his own offense, Mags creates his own offense, and jackson doesn’t care if he’s open or not, he just shoots. Our top 3 scorers can score with minimal offensive support. Monta for MVP!

According to the comminsioner of the nfl, 104 people retired last year. 7 due to age, and the rest because of Patrick Willis

by montasmob69 on Aug 1, 2008 5:36 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

totally agree

Born a Warrior, Die a Warrior... That's the way life should be!

by GSWarriors4life on Aug 3, 2008 2:18 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

explain yourself

you mean he would have won championships? Other than that, what does parker have on monta?

by Dubs fan in Boston on Aug 4, 2008 7:29 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

opportunity

Duncan’s presence on the floor commanded the attention of the other defenders more than all the rest of the Monta’s warrior teammates combined, and that doesn’t include Ginobli. Parker was able to take advantage of openings and opportunities Monta never has had because of it and yes, won championships.

Imo Parker has much better handles than Monta and has proven he IS a championship caliber PG over again, while Monta MIGHT become that PG. We all hope so.

by hardcore on Aug 5, 2008 8:21 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

So...

The basis of your opinion is that Parker has better handles and thus is better than Monta. If you’re including Duncan, then is Bill Wennington is better than Patrick Ewing because Jordan’s presence on the floor commanded the attention of the other defenders? Sure, it’s a stretch, but I’m using it to prove a point.

We’re evaluating Parker vs. Monta. Not SAS vs. GSW. Parker certainly has better handles and has been the starting PG on multiple championship teams. But Monta has never had the chance, as he’s always had BD on his team. Parker’s the more trustworthy PG. But, if you were choosing teams for one pickup game, would you really pick Parker over Monta?

by Dubs fan in Boston on Aug 5, 2008 8:35 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

DFB, our differences begin in how we attempt our analysis – First, I do not think we can distill differences without addressing some of the pertinent contexts of the teams around the players, among other variables (nor whether I’d choose one or the other first in a pickup game). So, yes, we HAVE to include SAS & GSW rosters’ impact on these players’ opportunities. That’s also partly why I do not fall back to merely citing stats when I share my observations.
Second, if you want to elaborate on how BD made Monta better be my guest – imo Baron’s presence actually may have hindered his development as much as he helped it in the past two years.
Third, I don’t usually play hypothetical games but – imagine if Mullin had “read” the BD situation accurately and traded him for a very good (but not Duncanesqe) PF rather than losing him for cap space which he couldn’t use to land that PF – would that have helped Monta’s game more than having BD on the floor?

To answer your question – if I had to choose between Parker and Monta in a pickup game I’d choose Parker because I’m the SG and need a PG to feed me the rock!

by hardcore on Aug 5, 2008 8:53 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

From what I took away...

The crux of your argument is that the Spurs are better than the Warriors. No duh. But I bet that if you replace Tony Parker with Monta Ellis, the Spurs are a better team.

So who’s better Al Horford or Kendrick Perkins? What about Jose Calderon or Rajon Rondo? What about LBJ or Robert Horry?

Every player in the combinations above who hasn’t won a championship would be considered better, but they haven’t played with Tim Duncan, KG, Hakeem, Shaq, or Kobe. The worse players have, which is why they’ve had the “opportunity” to use their limited skills while the stars were getting double teamed to win championships.

Your Tony Parker/Monta comparison cites almost no evidence about the actual players in question (just that Parker has better handles). The main point of your argument is that one plays with Tim Duncan and the other does not. So is Parker better than CP3? Is he better than DWill?

by Dubs fan in Boston on Aug 5, 2008 9:52 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

the crux of my argument is that Parker has PROVEN multiple times he can run the team from the PG position at a championship level while Monta has proven he can SCORE from the SG position for a team in the same conference struggling to get to the playoffs – what’s the argument against that? in short, some people here (posted above) are assuming Monta is going to be as good or better a PG than Parker -fine, all I’m saying is that remains to be seen, and that he’d be more likely to succeed at a high level as a PG if he had someone, like a Duncan, to take some of the pressure and defensive attention off of him.

If you offered SAS a straight up trade of Parker for Ellis as their starting PG, you think they’d take that offer? I don’t think it’s as sure a bet as you suggest, not that it matters any. Speaking of evidence, where’s yours?

by hardcore on Aug 5, 2008 1:46 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Great...

So Tony Parker is a better PG. I get it. Now explain where this PG comparison came from:

monta>parker

or how

if he had Duncan ya he could be

is in any way relevant to the PG discussion.

I fully understand how having Duncan on your team makes you a more productive PG, but another player does not make you an inherently better PG (unless you’re suggesting that Duncan is somehow teaching Parker how to be a PG).

by Dubs fan in Boston on Aug 6, 2008 6:09 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

DFP, did you get up on the wrong side of the bed two days in a row or do you just have an axe to grind?
I didn’t make the first claim – it’s in combination with the comment posted immediately above it that I commented about, and I explained that several times – which you now get.
Now you want to quibble between productive & better? fine, you’re right, you win, productive is better …

by hardcore on Aug 6, 2008 8:21 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

you want to quibble between productive & better? fine, you’re right, you win, productive is better …

The distinction is between quantity and quality.Productive might be worse but more numerous or a player might be a better player but is more team oriented so his superior play never gets the hype the ball hogs of the world get?...

Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me

by Skeptic con Urquell on Aug 6, 2008 9:26 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ugh...

I’m stopping after this one…

monta>parker

is from the original poster. You were the one who decided to make it about PG skills without clarifying it. Reading comprehension.

by Dubs fan in Boston on Aug 6, 2008 5:03 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Reading comprehension

Try again: “I didn’t make the first claim – it’s in combination with the comment posted immediately above it that I commented about, and I explained that several times – which you now get.” Look for yourself.

by hardcore on Aug 6, 2008 5:47 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

So...

You decided to change the argument to one you wanted to have… great. Good for you. Kwame Brown>Monta Ellis. He has better Center skills.

by Dubs fan in Boston on Aug 11, 2008 5:22 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

It’s still a maybe. We need to see his halfcourt game before you compare him to current superstars.

Hasheem "The Beat" Thabeet. A Warrior in 09.

by ejdacanay on Aug 1, 2008 7:43 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Finishing ability

Monta’s finishing ability is in a class of its own. For how small he is and how well he can finish is insane. Notice all of the and 1’s he has in games-maybe that’s why he agreed to a deal with And 1 shoes haha. Great post by the way. No doubt he has superstar written all over him!

by Captain Jack on Aug 1, 2008 7:51 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Could go either way

Yes – he is a rare talent and the game comes easy to him
However, the superstars you mentioned all worked harder than anyone else, outsmarted others, developed their game each off season and came back with something new. Monta may have Kobe’s raw talent – but I have yet to see the hunger and desire Kobe has. Maybe his role as the main man and his new contract will give him the confidence to know the skys the limit for him.
I’m not to worried about hi passing either – I worry about his handles, his defense, and his mentals. – These should come with time.

Warrior fan for life - where we are "always just a big man away" from total domination

by buttafingas on Aug 1, 2008 9:52 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

However, the superstars you mentioned all worked harder than anyone else

Good call. You are totally right that to get to the Kobe/KG level it takes raw talent + determination, hard work, smarts etc. I guess what I was saying is not that he was a lock to get to that level, but more that he has a chance to. But at the same time he seems pretty much a lock to get to the Vince Carter/Iverson/Arenas level where he might not be all-time elite player status but still more fun to watch than Elton Brand/Josh SmithSean Marion/( crazy talented but whiner asshole that noone wants on their team even though he has crazy talent if you can’t appreciate playing for the Suns with Nash will you ever be happy)/whoever fools want to trade him for. Plus he has a chance to even transcend that. There’s something about his determination and quiet confidence, even though he’s not that articulate, that tells me he will continue to work on his game + he just has a great feel for the game. He has already added that midrange jumper to his game and I think he will keep adding dimensions. Maybe I’m doing the biased homer thing and I know I’ll get shite for this but it just feels like he’s more like Jordan than super talented prima donnas like Arenas/Baron- Although I love those players as well-

by gsfool on Aug 1, 2008 11:46 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

another huge intangible: COMPETITIVENESS

There are many players in the league who earn their first big payday and just seem to be content with the money. They fade away into obscurity despite their god given talent and become irrelevant in the NBA, guys like Kwame Brown, Nene, Darko, QRich, and Luke Ridnour come to mind. It all comes down to competitiveness. Are Monta Ellis and Andris Biedrins still going to bust their asses to compete and improve even though they have a bed of money to come home to now? I sure hope so.

by YaHeard on Aug 2, 2008 5:36 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Agreed on the Monta>Parker

First off, he is nearly as adept at finishing as Parker is, though Parker does draw a little bit more fouls than Monta. Monta also has an uncanny ability to get to the rim, instead of keeping his game to layups and teardrop shots. At 20 ppg 5 rpg and 4 apg, he was performing better than Parker (18.8 ppg 3.2 rpg and 6 apg), who most would consider a true point guard. Though Monta’s assists are lower than Parker’s, it was mainly because he wasn’t required to pass as often due to other playmakers (Jackson 4.1 apg, Davis 7.9 apg) His defense, though not spectactular, was at least up to par with average guards (he averaged 1.5 spg last season).

- iBall, do you?

by iBallGSW on Aug 1, 2008 9:58 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Monta>Parker

Are you factoring in Eva? She’s worth about 20 points per game.

Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me

by Skeptic con Urquell on Aug 1, 2008 10:12 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Have you seen her

without makeup? You wouldnt say that if you did….

F**K REFS!!!

by faetati on Aug 1, 2008 10:19 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Have you seen her without makeup?

No but I’d like to lick it off her.

Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me

by Skeptic con Urquell on Aug 1, 2008 10:25 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

You wouldnt say that if you did….

Dang, Now you got my curiosity up, how did you see her without makeup?

Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me

by Skeptic con Urquell on Aug 1, 2008 10:29 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Just surf the web and

you will find pictures of her without makeup… You´ll be very, and I mean VERY surprised!

F**K REFS!!!

by faetati on Aug 1, 2008 10:59 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

you will find pictures of her

Pictures don’t count. You gotta see her in person to really know.

Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me

by Skeptic con Urquell on Aug 2, 2008 10:16 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Can We

Wait before crowning him Superstar/MVP caliber? I don’t think it’s kind of fair to compare to compare him to the other players that young because the KG’s, Kobe’s, & DHoward’s out of high school became the franchise player as soon as they were drafted and that wasn’t the case with Monta. I wouldn’t mind seeing him do well but it will be interesting to see how it is to have some of the best defenders guard him. The main focus last year was Baron and now with Monta having to run the show, I think by mid-season we can than grade him because it would be a fair amount of time to see how he has adapted being the “franchise player” with Baron leaving.

"Get Er Dun!"

by YayArea510 on Aug 1, 2008 10:13 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

+10000000

Hasheem "The Beat" Thabeet. A Warrior in 09.

by ejdacanay on Aug 1, 2008 10:24 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

monta is gonna be a shooter guard playing point

he’ll be allen iverson in his prime in a couple of years with or without the decent 3 point shooting. as for running the point, as long as monta doesnt isnt one of the turnover league leaders and gets at least 5 or 6 assists a night i’d be happy with that.

by gswLLBatman on Aug 1, 2008 10:28 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

With a better FG%!

by Psion on Aug 2, 2008 11:16 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Great article, but I'm still skeptical of Monta taking the point.

I’m not saying Monta will struggle at the point next year, but Monta is a definitely a natural scoring guard. The last second-round/superstar-potential/nartural scoring guard the Warriors had was Gilbert Arenas. Arenas is currently a superstar, but imagine how much his teammates like playing with a point who scores 30 ppg but only gets 6 apg. And if you remember, the Wizards were better last year playing without Arenas.

Monta could handle the ball sometimes last season, but he wasn’t the primary ball handler and was never really the focus of the opposing teams’ defense. And even if we play uptempo again (which should theoretically make it easier for the ball handler), you have to remember the team will push the ball WHEN THEY CAN. When you run and gun, you aren’t necessrily running on all the possessions, just mabye about half of them, when it’s possible for you to make a fast break. Monta must develop true half-court point guard skills the other half of these possesssions in order to be effective as our main ball handler and distributor.

I’m not saying Monta will struggle next season becasue I’ve seen many players succeed in unorthodox situations, and I don’t want to say anything is set in stone. Nellie knows Monta’s skills better than I do, and if Brandon Roy has shown us, a 2-guard can turn into a 1. I just think Monta is so much more effective playing off the ball and is definitely not a natural point guard. It wouldn’t surprise me, though, if he handled the pressures of being the main ball handler and did well next season. Again, great article, but I’m just skeptical of how a natural scorer, being depended on to distributed the ball, will work out.

...

And on another note, about my favorite non-Warrior, Chris Paul, he IS known for his defense. Paul made 2nd-team All Defense this past season. Had to make a correction for my favorite non-Warrior player, ha.

by The Daydreamer on Aug 1, 2008 10:43 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Chris Paul, he IS known for his defense.

Chris Paul is dope as F*ck. I was going mostly off that Hornets website where they kind of bitch about his D. I didn’t realize he got voted 2nd team all-D. I wasn’t even watching his D that much bc i was too busy watching him torch us on the offensive end. Either way if you are that great offensively D is sort of a bonus is my point.

by gsfool on Aug 2, 2008 12:00 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

He really isn’t that good at defense. The NBA all defensive team isn’t exactly the most credible measure of a player’s defensive prowess, they often reward players based on reputation. In Paul’s case they saw he had a lot of steals and decided that made him a good defender. In the NFL having a lot of sacks makes you a Pro Bowl player, but it doesn’t necessarily make you a good defensive end. Stats are good, but they can’t measure everything.

by belilaugh on Aug 2, 2008 12:09 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

The NBA all defensive team isn’t exactly the most credible measure of a player’s defensive prowess,

True. And in any case Hornets had great defensive team regardless of whether their superstar ofensive player who gave them 21 points 12 assists and 3 steals per game was a great one on one defender. It drives me crazy that people want Monta to be some defensive stopper when you know that other teams are going to be messin with their whole defense to try to stop him. By that standard the only guard worth signing to a long term deal would be Michael Jordan.

by gsfool on Aug 2, 2008 12:25 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I hold the honor to be pretty credible...

...The Defensive teams are chosen by the 30 NBA head coaches – coaches who have watched their players get stopped by guys on the All-Defense team.

But anyways, I guess for the Warriors system, defense hasn’t really been a necessity. For example, we got into the Playoffs two years ago with a very poor defensive team, with Pietrus being our only notable stopper. If we want to be in the business of winning rings, though, I think it would be helpful to look at the defensive-minded Championship teams like the Celtics, Pistons, Spurs, and Jordan’s Bulls. On an individual level, defense has been important, too. All the guys on the First and Second All-Defense teams made the Playoffs.

by The Daydreamer on Aug 2, 2008 2:33 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

somewhat disagree

Defense was what made our second-half 06-07 playoff team better than our 07-08 squad. Barnes came in and played solid defense for us, to everyone’s surprise. Stephen Jackson was the defensive leader and motivated everyone else on the court to give effort on defense, including Baron Davis. We still had a big guard in Jason Richardson to guard the other teams’ shootings guards. Pietrus was logging effective minutes and wasn’t in Nelly’s doghouse. Andris Biedrins was one of the league’s better shotblockers that year. Alot of that went out the window last season.

by YaHeard on Aug 2, 2008 5:47 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

If we are going to have that level of defense it is not going to be extended over the course of a full season. It worked in 06-07 because since everyone was injured and took a few games off everyone was fresh for the stretch run. Only the best athletes could play top notch defense all the time in this system for 82 games.

by belilaugh on Aug 2, 2008 6:44 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ellis' Defense

I know he’ll never be a “defensive stopper” in this league, but when he’s giving up 30 point games to guys like Chris Duhon and Roger Mason Jr., then there’s something very very wrong here. No guard in the league known as a “star” should ever let that kind of thing happen.

And there are plenty of offensive guards in the NBA who play solid, respectable defense as well: Kobe, Baron (when he wants to), TMac, CP3, Josh Howard, Iguodala, Deron Williams, Jason Kidd, Hinrich, Billups, Wade, etc.

A couple of days ago MJ even said this:

Q: Who would win in a one-on-one game — you or Kobe?
MJ: Kobe would win because I’m older. In my prime? Not even a contest. Let’s just say I have a better chance of stopping him than of him stopping me.

Don’t go poo poo’ing on the importance of defense now.

by YaHeard on Aug 2, 2008 6:01 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Monta did not get Superstar Dollars

He got 11 Per for Six Years. I am confident this will be a steal down the line but I am not sure he is a superstar. More likely, he will be an all star for a few years in a very good career.

by terryteagle on Aug 1, 2008 10:52 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

monta

is going to be a great point guard for this team. Someone mentioned iverson, i agree, but obviously much bigger and just as quick. So, we should be looking at the advantages monta will have against most point guards in this league, causing other teams help on him and freeing his teammates.So by that alone, monta could be a very successful pg for this team. His only issue really is inexperience, and we’re all gonna have to deal with his mistakes. But in the long run the only point guard monta will have problems with is d-will.

by KeepdaCore on Aug 2, 2008 9:15 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

and

Baron of course

by KeepdaCore on Aug 2, 2008 9:19 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Baron of course

Yeah, true. But those matchups are going to be great. Man, I can’t wait for the season to start. Who would have thought that Ws/Clips games would have one of the most intriguing matchups in the league. I can picture Baron and Monta going back and forth with neither one being able to stop the other and both having huge games. Who knows maybe Kellena can be the “Baron Stopper”

by gsfool on Aug 2, 2008 11:24 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Monta Ellis = Raw Dawyne Wade

If Monta went to college, his game would be pretty much the same was D Wade’s. He lacks the handles and defensive prowess but everything else about his offensive game is eerily similar to D Wade’s

by ThermoElectro on Aug 2, 2008 11:04 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Yep.

I’ve been saying it since I’ve 1st seen Monta play. While people compare him to Parker more often because of their size, speed, finishing ability, and lack of 3 pt range…. Monta reminds me more of D Wade than Parker.

Parker uses floaters and finesse to score in traffic (will probably age better than Monta), where as Monta ATTACKS the rim in the same manner of D-Wade. They both create contact, have great upper body strength and control, and both seem like they’re trying to dunk it each time.

That’s why there is NO REASON that Monta doesn’t become a superstar. His offensive ability with his driving, finishing, and mid-range game make him an ELITE offensive player.

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by FLAxwless on Aug 2, 2008 11:28 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

They both create contact, have great upper body strength and control, and both seem like they’re trying to dunk it each time.

Nice. Remember in the finals in 06 when Wade would just take it to the hole everytime in the fourth quarter and Dallas would foul or he would score everytime? Good comparison + Magette can do some of that too. I see serious foul trouble for Ws opponents this year.

by gsfool on Aug 2, 2008 11:35 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Monta a superstar????

hella naw. The last superstar we had was spree and that was 10 yrs ago. Monta probably be make 3-4 trip to the all star game, but that it. MVP, probably not likely to happen. As for him playing PG? He will be bust. His lack of handles and passing won’t suits him at point . That is my opinion. I predict in 3 yrs everybody here will say he is getting overpaid for not taking us to the playoff.

by warriorfan4life on Aug 2, 2008 12:04 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Thank God

You don’t know what your talking about. Spree was never a superstar! In 3yrs everybody here will be saying what a discount we have in Monta!

by Psion on Aug 2, 2008 5:54 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

3-4 all star appearances and he’s not a superstar? I’m not sure I follow. Maybe if he only made it once but if he makes it all those times then it is because he has the name recognition and star quality that people will vote for/coaches will vote for.

by belilaugh on Aug 2, 2008 6:49 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well....

Spree was a 4 Time All Star so does that make him a superstar?

"Get Er Dun!"

by YayArea510 on Aug 2, 2008 9:35 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Spree

made 1st team nba and defenese team. I don’t any warriors could really done that ever since. Monta is good,but i don’t think he could play D or make 1st team like Spree thou. Plus, Spree was the fourth or fifth best sg in the 90’s. Everybody know the first 2.

by warriorfan4life on Aug 3, 2008 3:02 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Anyone who uses the language like

hella naw, shouldn;t post and then you say Spreewell is a superstar? Your funny.

by smearthebeard on Aug 3, 2008 9:57 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Your funny?

your funny what?

Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me

by Skeptic con Urquell on Aug 3, 2008 11:48 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Hello pot, meet kettle.

Anyone who doesn’t know the difference between ‘You’re’ and ‘Your’ should keep quite about what language people would like or not like to use. Thanks.

by Amoc on Aug 4, 2008 2:57 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

quite or quiet???

John 8:44 -Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do.

by triplesix on Aug 4, 2008 4:06 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

beautiful

the hits just keep on coming.

by cap'n hack on Aug 4, 2008 8:33 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

A typo is a typo. A grammatical error is not knowing the difference.

by Amoc on Aug 5, 2008 4:12 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

This is probably...

the worst string of blogging (grammatically) I have read in a long time… I am honored to post in it!!

John 8:44 -Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do.

by triplesix on Aug 4, 2008 4:08 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

every time i see him take off, I kind of squint, hoping his knee doesn’t explode. i just say to myself, “no one can go that fast for that long…his body is gonna give out.”

if it doesn’t (knock on wood), then he will be a star in the league. I’m scared, guys

by wavetoyou on Aug 2, 2008 6:19 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

I agree, but at the end of this contract he will be like 28. Eventually, unless he learns to play smarter, his body will give out, but I can’t see that being a problem under this contract.

by belilaugh on Aug 2, 2008 6:50 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

i hope so maaaaaan,

but i’ve done a lot of work with knee-related mishaps (med student), and all it takes is one mistake…whether he’s 15, or 50yrs old. But overall wear’n’tear, then yeah, we won’t see the effects until his 30s

BTW, anyone see an interview he had with Steimetz…saying he’s adding a new weapon to his offensive arsenal? It was a pre-game interview late last season…i’m assuming it’s either the 3pt shot, or pg dribbling. Either one will benefit us. Plus, he’s a coordinated athlete…therefore i’m sure within a few hardcore offseasons, he can develop pg skills.

by wavetoyou on Aug 3, 2008 2:00 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

hell yeah

hes gonna pwn next yr
watch this off season hes been training on the pg position

by rayce on Aug 3, 2008 10:59 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

this off season hes been training on the pg position

He’s probably been buying big gaudy diamonds and exotic gas guzzlin cars with all that new money.
When do they get paid for the season? Part each month of all at one time?

Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me

by Skeptic con Urquell on Aug 3, 2008 11:51 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

i think

we will be so much better off with monta at point and jackson at SG as opposed to monta at SG and Jackson at SF.

by Agent Zero on Aug 4, 2008 1:22 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Thank you

That was a very well written piece and an enjoyable read, its nice to see some well thought out positive support for our dude Monta. Thank you for taking the time to write such a good post. And good luck on the Bar exam.

by Aware1 on Aug 4, 2008 7:50 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

good luck on the Bar exam.

Yeah, the world definitely needs more lawyers.

Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me

by Skeptic con Urquell on Aug 4, 2008 9:54 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

yo mean montay, don't you?

Yeah, That’s just some wanker wantin to ride the the urquell bandwagon. I guess I should franchise it?

Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me

by Skeptic con Urquell on Aug 4, 2008 8:49 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

you must be proud

this has to be the first bizzaro world gsom profile created, and it’s in your honor. congratulations!

by cap'n hack on Aug 4, 2008 9:02 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

this has to be the first bizzaro world gsom profile created. congratulations!

Thanks, I guess someone has more time on their hands and even less to say than I do?

Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me

by Skeptic con Urquell on Aug 4, 2008 9:34 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

And on a similar note...

I once had TWO people separately come up with the idea of going to a Halloween party as me, with me there.

by Dubs fan in Boston on Aug 5, 2008 6:38 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I once had TWO people separately come up with the idea of going to a Halloween party as me, with me there.

did you go as yourself too ?

Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me

by Skeptic con Urquell on Aug 5, 2008 10:38 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think I went as one of those retro flying airmen

got a green jumpsuit and bought one of those leather hats with goggles. And a fake mustache. Oh yeah baby!

by Dubs fan in Boston on Aug 5, 2008 11:21 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

thank the academy...

Why can’t it just be female groupies instead?Where’s my Monica Lewinsky?

Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me

by Skeptic con Urquell on Aug 5, 2008 10:39 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Eeeewwww

You can aspire to better than that.

by Dubs fan in Boston on Aug 5, 2008 11:20 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Thanks for the support!

Till I go pee
Live life at KMart
Foot in mouth chasin me

by Skeptic Con Urquel on Aug 5, 2008 11:55 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

You can aspire to better than that.

Not according to my wife, she says my aspirations can never rise above zero.

Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me

by Skeptic con Urquell on Aug 5, 2008 2:27 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Monta

was one of the premier 2-guards in the league last year. Off the top of my head, I can only think of Kobe and Manu as better 2s. Remember that magical month in which he averaged 24/6/6 on 60% shooting? Regardless of numbers he is simply a good offensive player. Automatic from midrange and a creative finisher. He reminds me of the Spurs’ guards, the catalysts for championship contenders year after year and that’s not a bad place to start for a young guard.

by antihero on Aug 4, 2008 7:33 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Wade, Redd, Martin

Wade would probably like to forget ‘07-’08 altogether; definitely not elite in the league last season.

Redd honestly I have seen very little of, but inferior ppg, rpg, apg, fg%, steal, block #s.. plus his team just sucks and as the star you’re supposed to make your boys better.

Kevin Martin completely slipped my mind- fine player, I’d call it a toss-up.

by antihero on Aug 6, 2008 7:45 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Despite it being a year he'd like to forget...

DWade still averaged 24.6/4.2/6.9… he was still elite, he just played only 51 games due to injury and draft reasons.

Redd, yeah, I’m not too much of a fan. But he was the star on that team, Monta wasn’t. And you can’t just compare Monta’s best month to the years other players had. In Feb Redd had 26/4.5/4.5 with 40% 3PT shooting…

by Dubs fan in Boston on Aug 6, 2008 5:10 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

haha "draft reasons".

the heat best not win the championship next season…..

How many T-mobile commercials would we have to endure then?

by antihero on Aug 7, 2008 7:54 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Monta is the best in the world

Till I go pee
Live life at KMart
Foot in mouth chasin me

by Skeptic Con Urquel on Aug 5, 2008 8:14 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

People don't relaize that I am a huge lakers fan

AND a Dallas Cowboy fan. What people can’t figure out is why I post on a Warrior board?
Can anyone help me out here? Why would I do this?

Till I go pee
Live life at KMart
Foot in mouth chasin me

by Skeptic Con Urquel on Aug 5, 2008 8:16 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

<< rimshot >>

Dude, as Dubs Fan in Boston said, it was kinda funny the first time. Now it’s about as fresh as Gallagher performing at a Motel 6 in Reno. And it’s mean-spirited to boot. Isn’t there something more productive you could be doing?

Don't mess with ^^^^ !!

by Sleepy Freud on Aug 5, 2008 8:28 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah...

What he said
;-)

Yes. I do have better things to do. But for some reason this is more fun.

by Sleep Froid on Aug 5, 2008 8:42 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

And I'm better at it than you

“Skeptic Con Urquel”... or whoever you really are.

by Sleep Froid on Aug 5, 2008 8:44 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Haha

Your webpin is blurrier than mine …. nyah nyah ….

So: you actually took the time to make a screenshot of my page, upload it to flickr or whatever, and turn it into your webpin? You’re a strange dude, Sleep Froid… ;-P

Don't mess with ^^^^ !!

by Sleepy Freud on Aug 5, 2008 11:03 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I actually just right clicked on your icon

Copied it to my desktop and uploaded the image. Not that hard. And yes, I am a strange dude.

by Dubs fan in Boston on Aug 5, 2008 11:19 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Doh!

Cover’s blown! Regroup! red team out! red team out!!!

by Dubs fan in Boston on Aug 5, 2008 11:19 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

good times

on the gsom boards today. how long until ‘dubz fan in boston’ makes an appearance?

by cap'n hack on Aug 5, 2008 11:31 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Wow this place has gone to the dogs!

Till I go pee
Live life at KMart
Foot in mouth chasin me

by Skeptic Con Urquel on Aug 5, 2008 12:17 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

flipgatey3 is that you?

I know that skeptic’s unwillingness to spell Monta right irritated you, but dang, it looks like he sent you over the edge.

"...OlympicMike is clearly the Barack Obama of GSoM"-Sleepy

by olympicmike on Aug 5, 2008 4:15 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

hahahahaha

man i leave the boards for a couple days and now this

"If you hit .440 with 20 bombs, you don't have to do s---. You don't have to bring a glove to practice, just hit and leave whenever you want. You can bring a 40 and smoke a cigarette and call me from the parking lot asking me what time the game is, and I'll tell you. You can even say 'F--- you, Steve!' Actually, don't say that, that wouldn't be very nice." -Steve Friend, Head Coach, Chabot College Gladiators Baseball

by flipgatey3 on Aug 5, 2008 4:30 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

and to answer your question

the day i make an alias on a message board is the day i kill myself

"If you hit .440 with 20 bombs, you don't have to do s---. You don't have to bring a glove to practice, just hit and leave whenever you want. You can bring a 40 and smoke a cigarette and call me from the parking lot asking me what time the game is, and I'll tell you. You can even say 'F--- you, Steve!' Actually, don't say that, that wouldn't be very nice." -Steve Friend, Head Coach, Chabot College Gladiators Baseball

by flipgatey3 on Aug 5, 2008 4:32 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Haha

Good, I thought you might have lost it. Hmm… so the mystery remains.

"...OlympicMike is clearly the Barack Obama of GSoM"-Sleepy

by olympicmike on Aug 6, 2008 12:03 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

seriously

this is the most compelling and annoying thing going on right now. i’m interested as to who it is. maybe it is skeptic himself

"If you hit .440 with 20 bombs, you don't have to do s---. You don't have to bring a glove to practice, just hit and leave whenever you want. You can bring a 40 and smoke a cigarette and call me from the parking lot asking me what time the game is, and I'll tell you. You can even say 'F--- you, Steve!' Actually, don't say that, that wouldn't be very nice." -Steve Friend, Head Coach, Chabot College Gladiators Baseball

by flipgatey3 on Aug 6, 2008 9:59 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Wow this place has gone to the dogs!

Speaking of which, I was surfing utube and found a snippet of Baumerworld playin soccer with steve kerr.

Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me

by Skeptic con Urquell on Aug 5, 2008 2:43 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

what kind of loser posts with multiple screen names on a NBA teams site he is not even a fan of?

Dang, the drawer is just full of dull utensils.

Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me

by Skeptic con Urquell on Aug 6, 2008 9:31 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

he bought them

from Walmart obviously

by misterjennings on Aug 6, 2008 9:38 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

i totally believe that you're all three of the skeptics

until you prove otherwise

"If you hit .440 with 20 bombs, you don't have to do s---. You don't have to bring a glove to practice, just hit and leave whenever you want. You can bring a 40 and smoke a cigarette and call me from the parking lot asking me what time the game is, and I'll tell you. You can even say 'F--- you, Steve!' Actually, don't say that, that wouldn't be very nice." -Steve Friend, Head Coach, Chabot College Gladiators Baseball

by flipgatey3 on Aug 6, 2008 10:00 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

i totally believe that you're all three of the skeptics

We gotta get a knife sharpener

Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me

by Skeptic con Urquell on Aug 6, 2008 10:09 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ouch.

So first some weirdo (Smearthebeard?)

1. Steals the guy’s screen name and webpin
2. Pollutes the board with lame fake posts attributed to him
3. Continues to do so long after the “humor” of the act has worn off
4. Succeeds in fooling half the board that he IS the Skeptic (including the mods, presumably, who still haven’t taken action).

...And now Skeptic himself is taking the blame for his BS? Holy crap.

Bickle: there is freaking ZERO CHANCE that Skeptic himself created the alternate identities. First of all, it’s not remotely in his character, such as I know it. Second, even if it were in his character, it’s not unlikely that he’d have the computer skills to pull it off. I mean, the dude still hasn’t worked out how to use the quote tool… ;-P

Seriously, Smearthebeard or whoever you are: cut the crap. If there’s such thing as a bannable offense, this surely qualifies. Mods, where are you?

Don't mess with ^^^^ !!

by Sleepy Freud on Aug 6, 2008 10:31 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Don't go draggin my name into this crap!

I will admit Skeptic is a piece of work. He is an admitted Laker fan posting on this board. How he has any allies on this board is amazing. Unless you and him are one in the same. It occurs to me that everytime I see him post you do too so maybe Sleepy is sleeping with Skeptic? Whatever dude! I have nothing to do with Skepic 1, 2. or 3. The fact that he is a Laker fan creates his own issues. Don’t blame me for it. Skeptic or Sleepy or whoever you are?

by smearthebeard on Aug 6, 2008 11:06 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Drat!

You’ve discovered the GSoM love affair that dare not speak its name…!

Seriously, I used the question mark after your name to imply that you were a “person of interest,” not necessarily the culprit. If it wasn’t you, I’m sorry.

Not sure why you think he’s Lakers fan. AFAIK, he’s never “admitted” to such (maybe you should ask him to be sure?) More importantly, even if he is, who gives a freaking crap? Last I checked “being a fan of another team” wasn’t grounds for banning. I mean, I’m a Celtics fan: can I get some flame too?

Don't mess with ^^^^ !!

by Sleepy Freud on Aug 6, 2008 11:25 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sleepy, when you click on your name it says in your profile your a fan of the Warriors

not the Celtics. When you click on Skeptics name it says he is a fan of the Lakers. Ya Sure he can post here but a Laker fan posting on a Warrior board gets NO LOVE dude. And his psots will get no CRED! Plus his posts always suck! They are not constuctive and they normally wouldn’t be since he is tainted by his jaundise yellow views. I think I speak for all Warriors fans when I say F the LAKERS and while I’m at it F the Celtics!

by smearthebeard on Aug 6, 2008 11:38 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

sleepy

i was joking about him being all three…but i could see where no one would take it that way.

sorry for continuing the madness.

"If you hit .440 with 20 bombs, you don't have to do s---. You don't have to bring a glove to practice, just hit and leave whenever you want. You can bring a 40 and smoke a cigarette and call me from the parking lot asking me what time the game is, and I'll tell you. You can even say 'F--- you, Steve!' Actually, don't say that, that wouldn't be very nice." -Steve Friend, Head Coach, Chabot College Gladiators Baseball

by flipgatey3 on Aug 6, 2008 1:49 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

No worries

It was clear to me that you were joking.

It was our friend Travis Bickle (“YOU SUCK AT LIFE!”) who seemed to be taken in by the False Skeptic ruse. But maybe he was joking too?

Yes, I’m talkin’ to you, Mr. Bickle… ;-)

Don't mess with ^^^^ !!

by Sleepy Freud on Aug 6, 2008 4:37 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

yeah

bring Mohawk in

build a team & destroy the roof

by Lat We N Trash on Aug 6, 2008 4:51 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

The other Travis?

Were you talking to me?. I’m the guy who hates Rick Hamlin and that scumbag, that would-be smoothie Skeptic… wherever the hell he’s sleeping tonight. But I try not to be too “negative” on here because it hurts people’s feelings and they become depressed. I have an alter ego, see. Love = JakeGittes Hate = Travis Bickle…not to be confused with TravisBickle

Just out of curiosity, whatever happened to OptionZero?

by Travis Bickle on Aug 10, 2008 1:47 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

that was tongue in cheek man

sorry for making it a big thing…for real though.

"If you hit .440 with 20 bombs, you don't have to do s---. You don't have to bring a glove to practice, just hit and leave whenever you want. You can bring a 40 and smoke a cigarette and call me from the parking lot asking me what time the game is, and I'll tell you. You can even say 'F--- you, Steve!' Actually, don't say that, that wouldn't be very nice." -Steve Friend, Head Coach, Chabot College Gladiators Baseball

by flipgatey3 on Aug 6, 2008 1:47 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

guilty until proven innocent?

FWIW look above to see how easy forging someone is, and who illustrated it …

by hardcore on Aug 6, 2008 10:24 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

it was tongue in cheek

and i apologized just now. sarcasm fail on my part

"If you hit .440 with 20 bombs, you don't have to do s---. You don't have to bring a glove to practice, just hit and leave whenever you want. You can bring a 40 and smoke a cigarette and call me from the parking lot asking me what time the game is, and I'll tell you. You can even say 'F--- you, Steve!' Actually, don't say that, that wouldn't be very nice." -Steve Friend, Head Coach, Chabot College Gladiators Baseball

by flipgatey3 on Aug 6, 2008 1:47 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I mean, the dude still hasn’t worked out how to use the quote tool… ;-P

What he said.

Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me

by Skeptic con Urquell on Aug 6, 2008 10:54 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Sorry the "skeptic" dude I was pissed at is known as...

Skeptic Con Urquel (lookup his name and read the posts he has been putting up) – notice he only has one L in the last part of the name… he tried to copy your name and well it worked in getting me to think you were him.
whatever these dudes who come on here and post stupid comments about the Lakers need to move on, I have no issues with other fans on this site if they have good takes and don’t just sit here saying how much better the lakers are than GSW’s.
So sorry for getting you two confused you are the NYY fan his profile says he is a LAD fan anyway the guy with one L still sucks and I’ll have to go Bickle on him later.

by TravisBickle on Aug 6, 2008 5:24 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

sorry for getting you two confused you are the NYY fan his profile says he is a LAD fan

No problem. I’m actually an A’s fan but my daughter lives in New york and sends me free Yankees gear so If you see a guy with a Warriors cap and Yankees sweatshirt chances are it’s me :>) The bizarro Skeptic is a Dodger fan? All right! Go Manny !!

Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me

by Skeptic con Urquell on Aug 6, 2008 9:19 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

If only he can

develop a 3-point shot, Ellis will be a premier guard in the League. His handles don’t quite compare to AI’s, but his quickness is on par (or even quicker) with Iverson. His defense also needs to improve, but he’s athletic enough to be a defensive asset for NellieBall. He’s also an above average rebounder and his athleticism is perfect for the Dubs. For all you fantasy heads, Monta shouldn’t be drafted after the 3rd round. If so, it’s a steal.

by SuperFly on Aug 7, 2008 12:18 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Monta Ellis will be...

Allen Iverson in his prime in like 3 or 4 years which isnt even his prime yet.

by gswLLBatman on Aug 7, 2008 1:33 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

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