Anthony Randolph status
was perusing through the game thread and noticed all the pining for Randolph. anyway here's some updates for those who haven't seen it.
"We're going to put him on ice for awhile, until the assistant coaches tell me that he's ready to play in an NBA game and my captains tell me he's ready to play in an NBA game," Nelson said after Friday's game. "He's just going to have to grow up."
http://www.insidebayarea.com/warriors/ci_11359891
also, according to Steinmetz
Fewer people in the organization are talking about Nelson not playing Randolph these days than are talking about how Randolph maybe doesn't even deserve to play. You don't have to be watching every minute of Warriors practice to realize Randolph's play and attitude have gotten worse.
This FanPost is a submission from a member of the mighty Golden State of Mind community. While we're all here to throw up that W, these words do not necessarily reflect the views of the GSoM Crew. Still, chances are the preceding post is Unstoppable Baby!
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oh snap
kids got an attidude..well yea its smart to sit him, hes got to learn to grow up, be a nba player before he can play..
i still love the kid when hes on court though
by gswfan1 on
Jan 2, 2009 10:40 PM PST
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Randolph
I just thought Nelson didn’t like Randolph or something. I had heard reports previously of Nelson telling Randolph to seek a trade.
The Ultimate Opportunist
by Rated-R Superstar on
Jan 2, 2009 10:40 PM PST
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I like his additude
but he should bring that on to the court , not in practice.
We Believe 2.0!
I know the Warriors are a lot better than the way they're playing right now.
They just have to get healthy and dig deep. THERE'S MORE TO THIS TEAM.
by RunNdGun on
Jan 2, 2009 11:11 PM PST
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i don’t get why so may GSOMers are so high on the kid, in my eyes wright is lightyears ahead of Randolph. We don’t get to see what goes on at practice, but so far this season when the 2 of them are getting thier minutes, Wright has done a lot more and is trying to fill his role. but that’s just my .02
GO WARRIORS, BELIEVE!
KARMALOOP.COM 20% OFF EVERYTHING USE CODE DO28066
by deto725 on
Jan 2, 2009 11:11 PM PST
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My thoughts exactly
I never understood why all these people were all up on AR’s nuts. He’s raw but it’s gonna take years to develop. I personally wouldn’t mind getting rid of Randolph. As for Wright, I was totally against the guy because I was so upset about getting rid of JRich, but it’s so easy to see that BW has improved and isn’t making stupid mistakes. He’s gonna take time to develop too, but at least he isn’t making worse-than-rookie mistakes like AR :X
by goldenstatelove on
Jan 4, 2009 4:43 PM PST
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The reason why people are so high up on AR is...
because the kid has the mold of a future superstar. The kid plays with passion, attitude, and determination. Whenever he’s out on the court he always plays with intensity and i like to see that in my rookies. One difference between him and Wright is that he plays with more heart. He won’t back down to no man and he’ll dive on the floor and hustle almost 100% of the time. I haven’t seen him play his hardest these last times i’ve seen him on the court and i don’t blame him. Nelson is killing his spirit and rather than working with this raw and talented 19 year old, coach Nelson is coaching him like you coach a veteran. Wake up!! he’s 19!! 19!!!! he’s gonna make mistakes, every 19 year old out of high school is going to make mistakes, even Lebron James made a few mistakes but you have to encourage the youg guys and work with them rather than tell them sh*t like “i think you should seek a trade”, or “we’re going to put him on ice until he grows up.” Now it seems like the whole world is against this kid who is trying to make a name for himself. this is one of the many things i hate about Nelson, he loves to try to get the media on his side and put the mess on his players or on his coaching staff. He’s too lazy to actually truly coach a young talent like Randolph. He leaves it up to the assistant coaches and the veterans. People can argue that Nelson developed Ellis, Beans and now Bellinelli but i’d rather credit that to those individual players for being resilient and just continuing to work at it and never give up. All 3 of those players have been in Nelson’s stupid “doghouse” along with many other players in the past. If and when Randolph develops I wouldn’t give an ounce of credit to Nelson. He is purposely playing dumb a$$ Rob Kurz over Randolph and is making it personal between him and AR. If you coach this guy (AR), there is no limit to his success. A Big man that can dribble, defend, finish, shoot (somewhat for right now) and dunk in yo mommas face and do all of those things pretty well at age 19 and this is the way you to get him to reach his full potential. Terrible! Nelson gives tough love and that’s fine but when you go out in public and criticize your players, you do nothing but demoralize them. Be a professional and keep all of that within the locker room. Everyone knows that Nelson hates rookies and I bet a lot of people guessed that AR was doomed from the start even though I really liked AR’s upside and attitude in the beginning. When asked, “what are your future goals for the NBA?” AR said “I wanna be the best player to ever pick up a basketball!” and the dude was serious as hell! I beleieve in this kid. I’ve seen flashes of brilliance, however, they were followed up by some idiotic plays but that’s where the coaches have to step in and teach this kid. call a timeout and let him play through it a little bit. give him advice, for god’s sake, Coach the kid!! you can’t expect him to be like a veteran player that can instantly produce unless your name is Lebron, but like i said even Lebron wasn’t fully mature yet. The franchise and coaching staff stood beside him and wiated for him to progress and now look at him. I ain’t saying AR is a lebron in the making but everyone knows AR has a high ceiling of talent and i feel if he was coached the right way, he could blow the roof off the motha F’in ceiling. I feel almost the same way with Wright and a few other rookies around the league. Fire Nelson and free Randolph! Amistad quote : give us us FREE!!
by ItsDatFriscoSwag415 on
Jan 8, 2009 3:25 PM PST
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AR said "I wanna be the best player to ever pick up a basketball!" and the dude was serious as hell!
That makes me question his intelligence, sounds like Montay when they ask him what part of his game he’s working on and he says “everything”. I hope Rudolf is smarter than that.
Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me
by Skeptic con Urquell on
Jan 8, 2009 3:37 PM PST
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hahaha
i guess you’re right. but i just like the enthusiasm and drive that the young kid made in that statement. I have seen times where i was like “dang…this kid is gonna be raw!” but i have seen bonehead travels and ill advised shots too but like i said, he’s a kid. he’s 19, no one knows how good this kid can actually be but with the right tools, there’s no limit. hahaha hella funny though, i had to laugh at that one. what part of your game are you working on? “EVERYTHING!”
by ItsDatFriscoSwag415 on
Jan 8, 2009 3:46 PM PST
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no one knows how good this kid can actually be but with the right tools, there’s no limit.
Oh , I agree that he has lots of promise. He’s got something I don’t see often, a certain look of a future star ,I just hope Nellie don’t spoil it, or drive him away.
Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me
by Skeptic con Urquell on
Jan 8, 2009 4:03 PM PST
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i would have an attitude if i was proving myself to no avail, too
and if i was basically told i would be traded.
and if i was 19, too.
Monta! Montaye! Montae!
by Baked Biedrins on
Jan 2, 2009 11:15 PM PST
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i would have an attitude if i was proving myself to no avail, too
This team of losers needs more attitude. Free Rudolf.
Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me
by Skeptic con Urquell on
Jan 2, 2009 11:22 PM PST
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preach that
"If you hit .440 with 20 bombs, you don't have to do s---. You don't have to bring a glove to practice, just hit and leave whenever you want. You can bring a 40 and smoke a cigarette and call me from the parking lot asking me what time the game is, and I'll tell you. You can even say 'F--- you, Steve!' Actually, don't say that, that wouldn't be very nice." -Steve Friend, Head Coach, Chabot College Gladiators Baseball
by flipgatey3 on
Jan 4, 2009 4:27 PM PST
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that's a lie
one unfounded report by chris broussard, who has never made a true report in his life, has got everyone worried. relax anthony isn’t going anywhere.
by HoLdEmUP on
Jan 2, 2009 11:22 PM PST
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Re: one unfounded report by chris broussard
Thanks for refuting Chris Broussard’s unfounded statement with your tow unfounded statements.
1.
chris broussard, who has never made a true report in his life
2.
relax anthony isn’t going anywhere.
Logic is your bitch.
Reduce your carbon footprint, commit suicide.
by bloodsweatndonuts on
Jan 3, 2009 1:41 PM PST
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Two
Spelling is my bitch.
Reduce your carbon footprint, commit suicide.
by bloodsweatndonuts on
Jan 3, 2009 1:41 PM PST
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not according to a second source
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2009/01/03/SPKT15384J.DTL
by hardcore on
Jan 4, 2009 8:29 AM PST
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even Jackson and Maggette are getting on AR for his 'tude
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2009/01/03/SPKT15384J.DTL
by hardcore on
Jan 4, 2009 8:31 AM PST
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when exactly did he prove himself? all he’s proven is that he’s a talented athlete who needs to learn to play basketball. i think he can be a good player, but don’t talk like this is a seasoned vet who’s shown on the court that he will bring the warriors to the promised land. pissing and moaning are not the way to show you deserve to play. sit him until he figures that out.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
by cap'n hack on
Jan 3, 2009 1:07 AM PST
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He's proven that he has boundless energy on the floor
more than anyone else on the roster.
At times when the play is getting lazy and uninspired, Randolph needs to be out there to at the very least pump his teammates up. Nothing gets you excited than watching your teammate posterize Yao or make a superathletic block. Besides, the more time he gets with actual NBA action, the more he can begin to mature and try to harness his emotion and turn it into production on the court.
Monta! Montaye! Montae!
by Baked Biedrins on
Jan 3, 2009 9:57 AM PST
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being excited
is not enough to earn playing time. mark madsen is always pumped to get on the floor, but he sits on the bench because he doesn’t play well when he’s out there. while posterizing yao is a great way to get everyone excited, stupid mistakes are a great way to lose games. option two seems to be much more common for him.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
by cap'n hack on
Jan 3, 2009 10:47 AM PST
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u realize
everyone on the warriors makes stupid mistakes every game… 6 turnovers by jackson?
might as well make mistakes with a guy that has tons of potential to be a threat next season…since this seasons over at least until ellis is back
by DeepS on
Jan 3, 2009 11:38 AM PST
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i'd rather
make mistakes with the guys who can help us win games. that seems more fun than crossing my fingers and waiting for randolph to suddenly figure out basketball. let him earn playing time. those other guys on the team have made dumb mistakes too and clearly aren’t setting the world on fire with their play, but they are still much better players. i don’t understand what the opposition is to asking randolph to play well before he plays lots.
and i’d guess we’re still a couple years away from randolph being a threat. that’s if he ever is. his skills aren’t completely unique and there are a lot of guys with as much “talent” as him that never made it in the league. that’s a big roll of the dice to sacrifice any chance of winning to play him starters minutes before he’s earned them.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
by cap'n hack on
Jan 3, 2009 11:59 AM PST
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who has been helping us win games?
we aren’t winning games. When you lose to the Thunder and TWolves back-to-back then it’s about time that we start doing things differently. It’s time for change. Yes we can!
by YaHeard on
Jan 4, 2009 11:18 AM PST
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and doing things differently means playing a guy who is worse than all those guys who have led us to a paltry 10 wins? you know, i haven’t been getting nearly enough pt this year and seeing as the team isn’t winning anyway, i should probably get in the game. that would be a nice change and i’d probably bloody up my teammates in practice a lot less.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
by cap'n hack on
Jan 4, 2009 12:01 PM PST
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Do you really believe that Rob Kurz, Azubuike, and Stephen Jackson are better options than Anthony Randolph at PF
by YaHeard on
Jan 4, 2009 1:11 PM PST
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pretty much everyone on the team is a better option at pf than randolph right now. (with the exception of cj, crawford, marco, and broken monta.) randolph is an awful offensive player and a mediocre defensive player at best. he only gets the “mediocre at best” tag because he blocks some shots and can rebound. fundamentally, he’s not good. he looks lost out there. all sorts of energy, not much hoops iq. if he figures it out, he can be good. until that happens, he isn’t.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
by cap'n hack on
Jan 4, 2009 5:59 PM PST
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fundamentally, he’s not good
and that’s where the coaching has to step in. People expect the world from this kid (Nelson especially). I emphasize KID because that’s exactly what he is, a kid! he’s 19 and he lacks fundamentals, so why hasn’t Nelson helped him come along? Why does Nelson choose to create a media hype with AR and a lot of his other players. Why can’t he keep that stuff in the locker room where it belongs and be a professional about it?
by ItsDatFriscoSwag415 on
Jan 9, 2009 8:49 AM PST
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I think Nelson lacks some basic “people skills”. If you mesh with his way of doing things, it can be a very successful arrangement. If you don’t…
by jae on
Jan 9, 2009 9:10 AM PST
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randolph does have awful fundamentals. the best place to work on fundamentals is the practice court. not in game situations. if he doesn’t know how to be a part of the basic offense or defense, he should learn that before he plays in games. i don’t see how saying that coaching should step in really argues anything here. of course coaching should step in. is it? i’d assume so. i’m not at practices, but it seems obvious that someone is telling him the things he’s bad at and telling how to improve. randolph is fully capable of working on the things he does poorly and that he has people to help him along. if he wants to whine and complain and pass the buck already, it’s not a good sign for his future. whether or not he does anything in his career has more to do with anthony randolph than anyone else. if he fails, it will be his fault.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
by cap'n hack on
Jan 9, 2009 10:26 AM PST
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At this point he’s got much to learn in practice. It’s going to be rare that he’ll help much in games, but his rebounding isn’t insignificant. If his touches are limited he won’t be a total detriment. I tend to downplay the contribution of “providing energy” if “energy” results in spastic, sloppy play, as it so often can. “Energy” looks great to the fans who want to see these pampered millionaires do something for their money, but as an abstract, it’s less valuable than things like “made baskets” and “not turning the damn ball over”.
It’s tough for any player to learn much in 5 or 6 minutes, but an occasional not-garbage-time stint that long might at least keep him motivated, to see the carrot of PT there if he works hard enough. That’s probably better than keeping him completely anchored to the bench if you think he’s to be part of a long term plan.
by jae on
Jan 9, 2009 11:07 AM PST
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agreed
when he starts to practice hard and well, he certainly should play to see if that’s working out. or if the sloppy play hurts the team less than his rebounding helps it, you play him. you still need to have a quick hook if he plays terribly, but i’m not saying that if he does the right things between games he shouldn’t see some action in them. i just seem to have a very different call for patience than a lot of other people. they want to be patient with his turnovers and stupid decisions; i want to be patient with him earning playing time. if randolph could learn some patience with his court time, it would do him a lot of good.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
by cap'n hack on
Jan 9, 2009 11:17 AM PST
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according to pree's interview w/ AR, that was false.
In the past week, rumors that Nelson had asked rookie Anthony Randolph’s agent to seek a trade have turned out to be untrue, as Randolph told HOOPSWORLD that the media blew up what wasn’t a very big deal.
“I think it’s just a whole thing of a misunderstanding,” Randolph said. “Everything is fine.”
by the evil monkey on
Jan 3, 2009 1:23 PM PST
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jWrong move by Nelson...
We all know the kids got an attitude. He absolutely thinks he’s the sh..
That’s why you play him, not why you bench him though. Granted the truth is that he’s not the sh.. (yet) But it’s better that he sees how far he has to go to become a great baller by going up against competition and then feeling the responsibility of letting his team down if he continues to make careless mistakes.
Instead, all dude is doing is smoldering on the sideline. With the ego/pride this kid has, instead of realizing that he actually does need to step up his game, he’s just going to become more of a cancer because he feels like he’s being unfairly held back.
If Nelson knew how to work with young players he would just let the kid go… Give him big minutes and let him learn on his own. Instead old Don thinks he knows best & is going to play the role of disciplinarian.
Bad Move…
Who knows where this is going, but it’s looking like a Nellie v. Webber remix in 2009
"To be a great champion you must believe you are the best. If you're not, pretend you are." - Muhammad Ali
by Dubs Wise on
Jan 2, 2009 11:19 PM PST
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i have to disagree. Playing time is what all rookies want… heck it’s what all NBA players want. It’s the best thing to withhold if a player needs to be disciplined. That’s pretty basic in all sports at all levels IMO. A player with a bad attitude will not feel like he let his teammates down if he makes mistakes on the court. He will find a way to put the blame on his teammates. Egos and attitudes need to be adjusted off the court before they get back what they want… playing time.
I pray i never have to use a gun again...
...unless i'm at a strip club parking lot...
...and somebody tries to run me over with their car...
...But how often does that happen??
by ssmokinjoe on
Jan 3, 2009 1:42 AM PST
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That’s pretty basic in all sports at all levels IMO
Usain Bolt is the best sprinter in the world but got less playing time than anyone else in the Olympic finals.
by jae on
Jan 3, 2009 10:36 AM PST
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clever as always my friend.
I pray i never have to use a gun again...
...unless i'm at a strip club parking lot...
...and somebody tries to run me over with their car...
...But how often does that happen??
by ssmokinjoe on
Jan 3, 2009 6:51 PM PST
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he's just a raw rookie
once he chills on the falling over mid-drive he’ll get back on the court, relax everyone.
by HoLdEmUP on
Jan 2, 2009 11:21 PM PST
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ike was a pimp!
too bad he sucks at nba basketball
by gswfan1 on
Jan 3, 2009 12:28 AM PST
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Damn....
Past Warrior Girls? If not….can we get them? :-)
It's about heart, It's about fight, It's about being a Warrior!
by BritWarriorGSW on
Jan 3, 2009 2:18 AM PST
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beast mode
"If you hit .440 with 20 bombs, you don't have to do s---. You don't have to bring a glove to practice, just hit and leave whenever you want. You can bring a 40 and smoke a cigarette and call me from the parking lot asking me what time the game is, and I'll tell you. You can even say 'F--- you, Steve!' Actually, don't say that, that wouldn't be very nice." -Steve Friend, Head Coach, Chabot College Gladiators Baseball
by flipgatey3 on
Jan 4, 2009 4:33 PM PST
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I would <3 Ike too...
if he brought me friends that looked like that.
by Mr. Monday Night on
Jan 5, 2009 4:24 PM PST
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i would really like to
see what goes on at warriors practices and what goes on in the front office. if randolph needs to grow up, play him until he does. we just lost to the thunder and the t wolves. its not like he is on last years team and sitting.
by hoopscorer23 on
Jan 2, 2009 11:55 PM PST
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play him until he does?
why reward unimpressive play and whining with minutes? if he wants to improve his game, he should work on that in practice instead of complaining. earn it, kid.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
by cap'n hack on
Jan 3, 2009 1:10 AM PST
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i can see what you are saying and i agree
but i meant that we arent winning with the guys that are playing in front of him, so why not give him 15 or 20 min per game. and according to some he is going to be the best player from that draft class so im guessing there is something going on between him and nellie that we dont know about.
by hoopscorer23 on
Jan 3, 2009 2:22 PM PST
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"according to some"
meh. that was according to Ric Bucher, noted Warrior/Nellie hater and controversy starter.
by the evil monkey on
Jan 3, 2009 4:09 PM PST
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well
he brings back some of the swagger that left with baron and i would take young guys/the supposed to be future of our team losing than someone else losing
by hoopscorer23 on
Jan 4, 2009 7:42 PM PST
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ONCE AGAIN, I'M NOT TALKING MINDLESSLY WHEN I SAY THIS
But it sure would be sweet if our future front court was Biedrins, Wright, and Randolph.
I'm going to get banned for all these mindless comments.
by CatchAndShoot on
Jan 3, 2009 12:08 AM PST
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He needs to play....
He needs to split time with Wright at the 4 and we need to “stop” going small ball. A lineup of CJ, Morrow, Buike, and Belli is NOT going to help… sorry.
by shooter1525 on
Jan 3, 2009 12:17 AM PST
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He's playing
his best and most consistent players right now no matter what size they are.
by in for life on
Jan 4, 2009 12:03 PM PST
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nellie's a loser
and HE is the one who drafted the tallest and skinniest warrior of them all. he also trade-drafted the second tallest and skinniest the year before, so everything is nellie’s fault—no one else’s.
by nelliehater on
Jan 3, 2009 12:48 AM PST
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Except for the fact that everything in your post is technically untrue, you're 100% right.
Nelson didn’t draft either of them and he’s basically shoved Mullin out the door so he won’t have to play any more of Mullin’s draft picks.
What is your definition of loser?
- He has the 2nd most coaching wins EVER and has a WINNING record.
- He won multiple championships as a player
- He’s the only coach to get the warriors to the playoffs in like 20 years
- He’s a multi-millionaire with homes everywhere, a wife, son, hell even his son is a successful NBA GM.
By your standards, 99.9% of the people in the universe are “losers”. I’m glad you’re not my parents.
Reduce your carbon footprint, commit suicide.
by bloodsweatndonuts on
Jan 3, 2009 1:53 PM PST
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like half the people on the site are trolls though
"If you hit .440 with 20 bombs, you don't have to do s---. You don't have to bring a glove to practice, just hit and leave whenever you want. You can bring a 40 and smoke a cigarette and call me from the parking lot asking me what time the game is, and I'll tell you. You can even say 'F--- you, Steve!' Actually, don't say that, that wouldn't be very nice." -Steve Friend, Head Coach, Chabot College Gladiators Baseball
by flipgatey3 on
Jan 4, 2009 4:34 PM PST
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The other half are mental - Yogi Berra
Reduce your carbon footprint, commit suicide.
by bloodsweatndonuts on
Jan 5, 2009 12:35 PM PST
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He has the 2nd most coaching wins EVER
How does he rank in most coaching losses?
Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me
by Skeptic con Urquell on
Jan 3, 2009 3:52 PM PST
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he's at least 4th
behind the legendary wilkins, motta and fitch.
by the evil monkey on
Jan 3, 2009 4:10 PM PST
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More you coach, the more you lose
Monta! Montaye! Montae!
by Baked Biedrins on
Jan 3, 2009 4:15 PM PST
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More you coach, the more you lose
unless you are good!
Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me
by Skeptic con Urquell on
Jan 3, 2009 4:16 PM PST
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Ahaha.
Touche.
Monta! Montaye! Montae!
by Baked Biedrins on
Jan 3, 2009 4:39 PM PST
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Re: More you coach, the more you lose
He’s won more games than he’s lost so he’s not a “loser”.
1290-979 ain’t bad.
What’s Nolan Ryan’s all-time record?
Reduce your carbon footprint, commit suicide.
by bloodsweatndonuts on
Jan 3, 2009 8:23 PM PST
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324-292.
What’s Satchel Paige’s ?
Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me
by Skeptic con Urquell on
Jan 3, 2009 11:12 PM PST
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he probably won
2,000 games
"If you hit .440 with 20 bombs, you don't have to do s---. You don't have to bring a glove to practice, just hit and leave whenever you want. You can bring a 40 and smoke a cigarette and call me from the parking lot asking me what time the game is, and I'll tell you. You can even say 'F--- you, Steve!' Actually, don't say that, that wouldn't be very nice." -Steve Friend, Head Coach, Chabot College Gladiators Baseball
by flipgatey3 on
Jan 4, 2009 4:35 PM PST
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People called him a "loser" too
Until he beat the living crap out of Robin Ventura.
Reduce your carbon footprint, commit suicide.
by bloodsweatndonuts on
Jan 4, 2009 12:04 PM PST
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robin ventura is a loser
but i don’t remember anyone ever calling ryan a loser
the stop calling him "beans" movement
by pervisNeverNervous on
Jan 5, 2009 3:22 PM PST
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There were constant argumnents throughout his career that he was a .500 pitcher
and therefore wasn’t a “great” pitcher. Just a strikeout pitcher, not a “winning” pitcher. Those waned toward the end of his career, but were present throughout IIRC.
I heard that argument mostly in the 1980’s.
Reduce your carbon footprint, commit suicide.
by bloodsweatndonuts on
Jan 5, 2009 3:36 PM PST
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nellie's a loser
because, like you, he absolutely refuses to give up on the idiocy that is nellie-ball—which CAN NEVER be a successful long-term winning strategy. nellie is a poor man’s mike dantoni, and even HIS teams could not make it to the finals.
and when nellie leaves a team, he leaves it in near-ruins. even dallas is now just a second-tier team.
and he just happened to be ON championship cetic teams—like jack haley happened to be on championship teams.
and this forum is not about his life—just his total incompetence as a coach.
by nelliehater on
Jan 4, 2009 11:47 AM PST
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Nelli-ball in Dallas was playing bigs – like Dampier, so when he has bigs to play he does. He has played AB & Turiaf together this year, despite having a thin bench.
The small-ball/Euro-ball approach is built as much on our strongest players on the roster as any desire Nelson has to play lineups.
His teams are not always left in ruins – look at the teams he’s left over his career, not just one. Dallas being only one example as you yourself mention.
Recognizing you are on a crusade, and have identified yourself with being nelliehater, you’re unlikely to acknowledge some of the points on the other side of the argument, but you’ll get more respect if you back up the crusade with some evidence.
For what it’s worth, last summer I was leading your crusade and advocating 100% commitment to rebuilding. That’s not happening, and the FO is moving in the opposite direction lately.
by hardcore on
Jan 4, 2009 5:48 PM PST
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Randolph just sucks right now
I’d tell him to keep his panties on, he’ll get his chance in time like every other rookie not named Rose or Beasley or Mayo or Westbrook or Love or the other ones I forgot.
by antihero on
Jan 3, 2009 1:09 AM PST
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What is Nelly doing?
Nelly is just completely out of touch with todays player. Donnie, these guys are not blue-collar guys anymore. It’s not the 1970’s. You got to work with your guys, not carry on these long drawn out grudges like you do.
It seems like Nelly is always having issue with some player or another. After a while, I stop giving Nelly the benefit of the doubt. He has that hang-dog look on his face every time they cut to him on the bench. He feuds with players. You don’t see Jerry Sloan in the media feuding with his guys. Phil Jackson doesn’t bicker endlessly with his players. Greg Poppavich can seem to have good working relationships with his guys. Is it so much to ask that you not have such a disfunctional team on your hands? Granted, the team is missing its best player now and also is in serious need of a big body in the blocks. That doesn’t mean the team has to implode like this. Just because the record is bad, the feeling of the team doesn’t have to be so toxic like it is. That’s on you Nelly. Its your job to maintain some order and a good environment.
I mean, after a while I stop giving Nelly the benefit of the doubt with all these issues. I have to rethink the Al Harrington situation. I rethink the times Baron didn’t get along with Nelly and wonder if that had anything to do with him leaving. I absolutely question how he treats Randolph, that situation has been a complete debacle and should be grounds for his firing. He doesn’t seem to treat his players with that much respect as far as from what I have seen and read. Treat the players with some respect and maybe they will do the same to you. He sits and plays guys so on a whim, its like a he’s a king sitting on his thrown, having jokers come in and dance for him. For some he says “off with their heads” and that guy is on the bench for 10 games. That’s not good working conditions.
That’s why I say he’s completely out of touch with today’s player and today’s game. They need to fire him and move one of the assistants for interim head coach.
by runandgun on
Jan 3, 2009 2:52 AM PST
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yea, Nellie got along so much worse with Baron than every other NBA coach Boom has had…………………
by sam23 on
Jan 3, 2009 7:42 AM PST
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actually
Sloan feuds w/ players a lot. Boozer, AK47, Giricek (why he was benched and subsequently traded), Almond, Fesenko (repeatedly calls him fat & lazy) in the past few years.
Phil’s had his share w/ Shaq & Kobe – even wrote a book about it. he’s actually had one going with Bynum for some time now – getting better, but at least up a week or so, he has rarely played Bynum in the 4th quarter this season, i don’t know if that’s still going on – since i hate the lakers and don’t follow them. he used to belittle Vujacic calling him a 10 am player or something like that. this was in regards to him only playing well in practice.
Pop is kind of like Nellie. he berates his players and criticizes them, but for whatever reason, TD, TP, Manu accept it – plus winning always helps. along with having a mostly veteran team – i’m sure any young guy on that team… are there any other than George Hill?… wants to play and is probably upset that they aren’t getting minutes.
not that Nellie isn’t accountable or isn’t at fault (i think Harrington’s comments are very poignant, if you’re not one of his guys, you’ve got that much steeper a hill to climb) – it’s just all coaches have these problems. it’s just very few of them get huge media attention. unless you read through the various local papers, how many knew of the Rip Hamilton vs Flip Saunders debacle last season? or even Flip vs the Wallaces? if it doesn’t make it to ESPN like Sergio vs Nate, Larry Brown vs everyone, do ppl even know of PJ’s conflicts with the OKC players or Blatche and Eddie Jordan? what about Sean Williams and Lawrence Frank?
you can usually read other cities papers on prosportsdaily.com if you don’t know the name of their local papers or don’t feel like googling for it.
by the evil monkey on
Jan 3, 2009 11:39 AM PST
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actually
Those coaches do not feud to the say degree as Nelly and its not even close.
You know how I know? Because those coaches teams are never imploding on themselves and the coaches always get the most out of their guys. The guys know its all for the benefit of the team when the coach challenges them. It seems Nelly is all about doing ti to satisfy his massive ego. Because all of his feuds haven’t helped the team one bit, just alienated players and made players leave because of him.
That’s not good and he should be fired because of it.
by runandgun on
Jan 5, 2009 10:28 AM PST
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no coach
ever gets the most out of ALL his guys. it’s just not possible. the makeup of the roster dictates the style of play a team can potentially play. there will always be a couple of guys who suffer for it. ak47 definitely was not playing his best ball during his feud with sloan, but that happens. he was playing out of position and his numbers took a hit. feuds with players happen all the time and there’s nothing you can do about it. it does hurt the player, because it has to.
most feuds between coach and player happen for the benefit of the team. including the randolph incident. it might not look like it benefits the team, because the team is bad, but there are certainly things that can make the situation worse. randolph is one of those things right now (here’s hoping that changes, but for now, that’s how it is). if he’s recklessly elbowing teammates in practice to the point where captains, not just nellie, say “sit him down,” i tend to think he might be bad for team chemistry. not to mention the fact that he hurts the team when he’s on the floor with his irratic, clueless play. it seems pretty clear that randolph should have been playing very little before the incident with kurz, and none after that, until he gets his head on straight. it doesn’t sound like nellie picked a fight to satisfy his ego, as you put it.
i don’t really see a team “imploding” here. i see a team that doesn’t have many good players not winning many games. which is exactly what you’d expect.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
by cap'n hack on
Jan 5, 2009 10:48 AM PST
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just b/c Bucher, TK, Skip, Cohn and company tell you this is how it is
doesn’t mean it’s true. it’s akin to gossip. or the boy who cried wolf. where’s Felton? KG? Sabathia? Teixeira?
it’s like your chick friends and those dance & singing shows. they like who they like until a judge tells them why to like this instead of that. then they start acting like they knew it along. but at least these judges are experts – the media is not. they’re basketball knowledge comes from pick up games and watching sports – it’s not like they’ve ever played organized ball at any level. and their agenda is to keep you coming back for more.
most feuds are all the same. the difference comes from whether the team is winning or not. winning can even solve Terrell Owens and Randy Moss level problems. the Pistons feud was pretty bad last season, but since they were still winning games – it didn’t devolve into a huge problem. whereas b/c they were a 15 or so win team, Larry Brown did implode with the Knicks.
feuds + frustration from losses is what sometimes causes implosions. but good management doesn’t let that override decisions.
and only dumb management makes moves because of player demands. wasn’t Webber still restricted even after opting out? you didn’t see Utah trading AK for Shaq. or the GM before Kerr in Phoenix give into Marion’s trade demands. the Bulls never gave into Scottie after Phil “disrespected” him in the playoffs and Scottie pouted by refusing to play at the end of that playoff game that one year MJ was off playing baseball. the Lakers didn’t give into Kobe and his trade demands or his demands that Bynum be traded for Kidd. you do what is best for the team no matter what the cost. too often, teams can’t handle the media attention of alienated players like Artest, AI, Gasol, Baron in NOH, etc or even the role players. if guys like Spree don’t accept your offer, it doesn’t mean you offer them more. no need to give into the Marbury’s of the world.
is this team imploding? the media says yes. but it’s really just a bad, young team who struggles on the road that’s just frustrated with the losses. it’s what happens when you lose your two best players – the difference between KG and crap (Minny) vs either KG and Pierce/Allen (Celtics) or KG and Cassell/Spree (one year when Minny went to the WCF).
management may have already imploded, but that was more Mully vs Rowell. the media says Nellie picked Rowell over Mullin (kind of like picking dad over mom for monetary purposes), but it could be Mullin was already basically out and Nellie didn’t pick anything. it was Rowell or nothing.
i’m not a Nellie fan, but i do realize he’s successfully rebuilt the Warriors twice, the Bucks and the Mavs. even if he can’t get us from B to C, he can get a team from point A to B… . and he’s pushing 70 so once he passes Wilkins he’s likely gone. contrary to what the media tells us, it’s not going to crush the franchise if he’s around for 2 or 3 years.
let’s not be so dramatic and make more of this than what it is (like these media types would have us believe) just b/c we want to see the young guys more (which the media uses to manipulate us into a fervor, creating more blog hits). as his career has shown, nellie’s an above avg coach. no decent coach would play young guys over vets or trade all their vets away for kids – that’s how you get an OKC (or Minny) situation. just b/c they beat us doesn’t mean i want to be 4-30 and contending yearly for worst record ever.
by the evil monkey on
Jan 5, 2009 1:01 PM PST
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he’s successfully rebuilt the Warriors twice,
and tore it up twice so he’s a net big ZERO right now.
Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me
by Skeptic con Urquell on
Jan 5, 2009 3:07 PM PST
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in some ways true, but grossly missing the point.
anyway, “tore it up” is still harsh.
i’d still say there was no reason to not let Webber just sit around and waste his career it’s not like he could of gone to Europe a la Josh Childress… he’s still restricted. i still think Bucher’s liable – if things were as bad as he said it was, there is no way Webber and Nellie could have teamed up last season. it was more of a he said, she said with Bucher playing the role of Iago filling Webber with innuendos… if Bucher was in Phoenix instead of Nellie/Webber it’d of been D’Antoni/Stoudemire.
the 2nd time was Rowell/Mullin who orchestrated the JRich trade for financial purposes and let Baron go for financial reasons. Cohan deserves mention only b/c these moves were financially driven. if we’d of had JRich still, chances are extending Baron becomes more likely – since it’s likely 2 playoffs in a row, we’re still win now mode, as an added bonus, Monta may have come cheaper (think Barbosa) since i doubt he’d of broken out playing behind JRich.
so far, Nellie’s only really responsible for Harrington – and that wouldn’t of spiraled like it had if not for TK exposing that Al had wanted out and Al foolishly confirming it to MT2. if word of Al’s discontent doesn’t come out, we’re probably all still complaining about how TMNT plays too much and we want more BW.
by the evil monkey on
Jan 5, 2009 5:19 PM PST
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some of you guys act as if we got Derek Rose or OJ Mayo in the draft...
GO WARRIORS, BELIEVE!
KARMALOOP.COM 20% OFF EVERYTHING USE CODE DO28066
by deto725 on
Jan 3, 2009 11:13 AM PST
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Nelson is the problem, not Randolph
Nelson is just horrible right now. Granted, we’d be a better team with Monta and Maggette, but for God’s sake, those two guys are just going to put Randolph further into the hole. Since we’re losing to OKC and Minny, we need to give the kid some minutes, even if it’s 5 minutes a game.
We forget he’s like 19. Yeah he’s immature, but what 19 year old isn’t? That’s why some players don’t respond to Nellie. He tears them down and strips them of confidence. Some just hate him for it.
Anyway, I wrote a blog about this crap… it’s just getting out of control. Check out my link in my sig. May God help us all…
Check out my blog at www.dantheman85x.blogspot.com
by dantheman85x on
Jan 3, 2009 11:54 AM PST
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Don’t confuse your hope that he’ll be something special and the desire to see this with sound strategy for developing a player and a team. 5 minutes in a game doesn’t do much if anything for a player. Players tend to play better with extended runs where they get a chance to get into the flow of the game and learn things about the other players. Token minutes allow someone to go in rushed, trying too hard (yes, it’s possible) and making mistakes that they don’t ever get a chance to correct.
Don’t get me wrong. I do think that Nelson is mis-managing this team, but failing playing Randolph, a guy who was a project when drafted and has demonstrated that all of the questions about him were accurate, isn’t part of Nelson’s faults this year. Randolph needed another year or two in college with a competent coach who could sit down and explain to him that the flashy “guard skills” would work better if they were a complement to a solid, high efficiency post game, taught him something about shot selection (if that’s possible) and didn’t allow him to get into positions where he was going to turn the ball over so readily or allow him to rely on a rather inaccurate jump shot. Of course, that didn’t happen. Instead he was drafted with the lure of the great athlete with unlimited ‘potential’.
by jae on
Jan 3, 2009 12:59 PM PST
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I hear ya
It’s just frustrating. We can’t win with our starters, we can’t win with our rookies. I don’t know what to do…
Check out my blog at www.dantheman85x.blogspot.com
by dantheman85x on
Jan 3, 2009 1:02 PM PST
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remember it could be worse …
we traded Wilt away and won only 17 games the next year
but
we also drafted a ROY and got back to the finals thereafter
by hardcore on
Jan 4, 2009 5:51 PM PST
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Randolf is very immature it seems
and it doesn’t help that Mullin drafted him as Nelson is an a quest to discredit his old friend at every turn it seems.
I look for AR and Wright being traded at some point this year or next.
by SFzig on
Jan 3, 2009 12:18 PM PST
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i ran into anthony randolph the other day and he was a bit of a douchebag
I just quickly said hello in passing and said that i was a big fan and he totally didn’t give a shit. I mean come on! When I ran into Andonal Foyle he at least shook my hand and talked to me for a few minutes!
by dancingchiapet on
Jan 3, 2009 12:30 PM PST
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Hell yeah!!!
Next time he is a free agent lets pick ‘em up for the league minimum and use him as our 3rd center. Seriously i think it would be awesome, if he’s cheap. He owes us, so maybe he’ll try to do something.
by T-Money on
Jan 3, 2009 1:55 PM PST
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the kids 19
i wouldn’t know what to say if a local fan saw me and i know that all this crap is going on about not playing and stuff. Now if i were playing and smashing on people then i’d shake your hand and say whats up.
by bojangles408 on
Jan 3, 2009 12:59 PM PST
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No Randolph is just being an ass
He seems like one of those guys that think they’re all that and a bag of fritos. The guy didn’t even ask for an autograph, the least he could do was say Thanks or something. Sheesh.
by Calamity on
Jan 4, 2009 1:05 AM PST
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Nellie
needs to realize were not going to win the Ship this year. So why not play Randolph. Who cares if he has an attitude, every star/wanabe star has one. Benching him just makes his attitude worse. He is the only one i see, besides turiaf and some other players that actually goes out there and plays his heart out. Yes he does kind of play for himself but i mean hes getting benched so IMO i would too.
Do you guys remember how he played against Chic. Yes he screwed the game with that miss lay up but he was blocking shots everywhere. He is a freak. Nellie is killing are franchise by not playing our draft picks. His just in it for the money
by cjwatson23 on
Jan 3, 2009 1:33 PM PST
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If Randolph seems to be the kind of guy who learns from his mistakes and requires the challenge of a real game to do this, then playing him is a good idea, but that’s not always the case. Playing a guy with bad habits when you know they’re bad habits and they’ll need to be corrected runs the risk of these just being reinforced. The sort of mistakes that Randolph makes are also ones that detract from the rest of the team. Turnovers and ill-advised jumpers mean that other players are not involved, and these are his biggest problems.
“Heart” is not the single greatest asset if he “heart” repeatedly puts him in a position to putting more effort into things that aren’t particularly good. Playing hard is important. So is playing smart. Playing hard when you’re playing in a way that is detrimental to the team reinforces bad habits.
Some players probably need game time to figure this out, to get feedback that what they’re doing isn’t working. But some don’t put 2 and 2 together, especially if they find ways to continue to score, even if it’s with low efficiency shooting that is to a greater detriment to the production of teammates.
I don’t know about Randolph’s personal psychology. I don’t know if he is the type to be able to figure this out and if he is, if he’s the type to figure it out in games or if he can do so with coaching in practice. My fear is that Nelson also does not know this about Randolph.
by jae on
Jan 3, 2009 1:41 PM PST
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Why wouldnt the kid be angry and have an attitude problem with nelson.
Im pissed at nelson, so i can only imagine how he feel
by THIZZ-A-LOT on
Jan 3, 2009 2:38 PM PST
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Everyone who says he's a liabilty when hes in the game is right, but
Everyone is playing terrible; making many of the same mistakes and turnovers that get him benched for a few games, were still losing games; so him being a liabilty really makes him no worse than having the other guys who are losing the games now, if we do have a chance to be good next year dont you want most if his growing pains to be gone and dealt with this losing season; so he’ll be able to start or be a possibly great bench player when we have Ellis and our unboubtably good draft pick.
So not playing him, so we “win the games” really isnt working out to well guys=10-25.
by THIZZ-A-LOT on
Jan 3, 2009 2:54 PM PST
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I agree.
Let’s find new ways to lose!
We’re already pretty good at it with a CJ, Kelenna, Jack, and Crawford lineup. Why not try it with a AB, Wright, Randolph, Marco lineup?
I think Nellie’s just covering his own ass with all the crap-tacular lineups he pukes out there.
Warriors, Stupidest franchise in the league.
by kenntoe on
Jan 5, 2009 3:54 PM PST
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Nellie's leadership
Nellie says he’ll play Randolph, when his assistant coaches and team captains give him the go ahead. This sounds like very sound strategy to me and doesn’t sound at all like a grudge. It sounds to me as if the team captains take issue with Randolph’s play and/or attitude as well. Randolph is a BOY. I don’t know about you guys, but when I was 19, I was immature as hell and needed discipline. I think this will only HELP Randolph be a better PERSON and player. Teams need good chemistry to win. Without leadership and discipline coming from a coach, rather than pacifying the babies in the team, your team chemistry and unity will be destroyed.
by Naticus on
Jan 3, 2009 3:00 PM PST
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its not the players job to decide another teamates playingtime. Not to mention this might cause some Jack-AR friction
sounds like another Nelson bail out.
Cant blame me on the poor defense; Their in charge of that.
Cant blame me on the Rookies playing time; Their in charge of that.
So what the hell is he doing?
by THIZZ-A-LOT on
Jan 3, 2009 3:22 PM PST
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did you read the article?
Jackson yelled at Randolph because he gave Rob Kurz an unnecessary elbow and busted his chin open (dude got a nasty scar now)… said it was “b.s.” and that he should be doing that to opponents in games not teammates.
by gobigg415 on
Jan 3, 2009 4:33 PM PST
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said it was "b.s." and that he should be doing that to opponents in games not teammates.
Maybe he could if Nellie would let him play a while?
Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me
by Skeptic con Urquell on
Jan 3, 2009 7:10 PM PST
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Re: So what the hell is he doing?
Delegating.
He’s the “Head” Coach who has “Assistant” coaches and “Captains” that he’s in charge of.
Reduce your carbon footprint, commit suicide.
by bloodsweatndonuts on
Jan 3, 2009 8:31 PM PST
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so when your head coach you just deal with the captains? and give orders to them for the other players to follow?
I dont get it? nelsons only in charge of the assistants and Captains? I dont think thats how its supposed to work….
by THIZZ-A-LOT on
Jan 3, 2009 10:17 PM PST
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He's in charge of everybody, so he can choose people he's in charge of to be in charge of other people too
That’s delegating . . .
Reduce your carbon footprint, commit suicide.
by bloodsweatndonuts on
Jan 4, 2009 12:13 PM PST
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thats so ridiculously stupid i cant tell if your trying to be ironic...
if your serious, then you people are even more out there than i could ever imagine
by THIZZ-A-LOT on
Jan 4, 2009 6:35 PM PST
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You don't understand delegation?
You’re right. Obama sucks. He’s building a cabinet to help him make decisions and tell his subordinates what to do and they’re hiring interns to do his work. He’s totally crap.
"No no Nene!"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zB5DxNl4EB0
by Dubs fan in Boston on
Jan 4, 2009 7:25 PM PST
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Umm . . . ok. Seriously though, I didn't invent the concept of delegation.
I was giving you a serious answer.
Let’s look at it in reverse:
If the head coach was doing everything involved in instructing and monitoring the players, there would be no assistant coaches and no team captains. What would they do?
They’re his staff. They do what he tells them, up to and including running practices and coaching games for him.
Captains even run practices form time-to-time.
Reduce your carbon footprint, commit suicide.
by bloodsweatndonuts on
Jan 5, 2009 12:51 PM PST
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head coaches are ultimately responsible though
which i took to be THIZZ’s point, which he points out that nellie isn’t. nellie, it seems, likes to shirk duties. and we end up with doodies.
head coaches can’t be expected to do everything. but they should be responsible for everything that’s going on. having a coach say, “he’s not playing until he proves to me that he deserves to.” sounds like a coach that is taking ultimate responsibility. on the flip side, a coach that says, “he’s not playing until other people (captains, assistants) say he can.” sounds like a coach that doesn’t want to take responsibility.
saying that, i don’t believe a thing nellie says, so who knows which way is up. which, coincidentally, may be hard for a 19 year old rookie to adjust to.
the stop calling him "beans" movement
by pervisNeverNervous on
Jan 5, 2009 3:36 PM PST
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I don't think he ever shirked the responsibility though.
He even said it was his failings as a defensive coach that prompted the move.
It’s not like he went all corporate/political B.S.and said “In order to optimize our defensive results I am promoting Keith Smart to defensive coordinator in order to better identify ineffecies in our point accumulation prevention processes and furthur our goal to be the leading organization in our industry”.
He basically said, “I’m not doing this well because I’m old and I don’t have the time/energy so I’m empowering Smart and Moncrief with the full defensive authority”.
I guess you could say he’s trying to sluff off responsibilty for future failures, but I don’t buy that because it’s his experiment to have defensive coordiantors. He said (paraphrase again) “It’s effective in the NFL but it’s a new thing for the NBA”. So if it fails, is anyone going to blame Keith Smart or Sideny Moncrief? They’ll blame Nelson.
As far as having Jackson deal directly with Randolph . . . He treats every player different. It’s a classic Nelson pscological ploy (and those don’t always work) But he’s not sluffing blame on Jackson. You think he’s going to go blame Jackson if Randolph wants to go A.W.O.L.? Who do you think is going to have a better chance of getting through to a 19-year old rookie? Nelson or Jackson? He’ll blame Randolph if the situation blows-up, as he should. Randolph hasn’t earned anything yet and he makes stubborn, bone-headed mistakes.
If you noticed, this is like approach # 3 with Randolph. He’ll keep changing them up until one sticks or he gives up on the kid or Randolph demands out.
I think he’s delegating wisely as well as taking respnonsibility along the way.
Reduce your carbon footprint, commit suicide.
by bloodsweatndonuts on
Jan 5, 2009 4:08 PM PST
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I trust the Assistant Coaches
If Kurz is playing better now – then play him. When AR beats him out of the spot, then AR can play. Players dictate their minutes through their efforts in practice. I think it will make him a better player – which is what we really need.
by terryteagle on
Jan 3, 2009 3:00 PM PST
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I trust the Assistant Coaches
Cause of their sterling winning record?
Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me
by Skeptic con Urquell on
Jan 3, 2009 7:13 PM PST
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Kurz can makes shots, that’s about all he can do.
by YaHeard on
Jan 3, 2009 8:53 PM PST
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what? kurz is a shot blocking machine! he blocks more shots per minute than Andris & Wright!
by the evil monkey on
Jan 3, 2009 9:07 PM PST
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CRY BABY
I cant stand looking at Randolph and his pouty face!! Act like a man and maybe you’ll be treated like one.
by gobigg415 on
Jan 3, 2009 4:34 PM PST
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you sure about that
I haven’t been here for a month, and my boi get all those negetive comments. I know he is young, but has skills are raw enough to be to play point forward if he reach his highest limits. I was first person to point out he was next coming of pippen, but for that to happen he need a need new coach, or pippen himself to makes him realizes how good he really could. He is only a rookie right now, but he isn’t that bad at all. He is pretty good overall for all the playing times he gained so far.
by warriorfan4life on
Jan 10, 2009 2:05 AM PST
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Its pretty obvious that Nelson wants to trade AR, does he think ruining his value is the wat to do it?
by THIZZ-A-LOT on
Jan 3, 2009 4:41 PM PST
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hm. i don’t know. up until 3 games ago, AR was playing – on 4 nights in Dec, over 20 minutes….. reading about the incident that Steinmetz mentioned happened before they went on the road game to the Lakers (last AR game)…..
http://www.examiner.com/x-441-Golden-State-Warriors-Examiner
(8th paragraph for the above italicized date)
then all of a sudden, AR doesn’t play for the next 3 games and Nellie makes the statement of assistant coaches and captains deciding when AR is mature enough to be a professional NBA player.
if you look at it objectively, i’d say that this probably isn’t the 1st practice incident and some of the assistants and captains said something to Nellie.
by the evil monkey on
Jan 3, 2009 5:14 PM PST
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But after the Game against MIN.
Jax saiid he did not know why AR did not play. Now if Steinmetz is corretc Jax would know exacty why AR did not get playing time, becuase Jax would be the one holding him out of the game
by shooter1525 on
Jan 3, 2009 5:24 PM PST
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or
jack didn’t want to talk to the press about a team conflict. i’m going out on a limb and saying that jack knows exactly why randolph isn’t playing, and probably would know that even if it wasn’t just randolph being immature.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
by cap'n hack on
Jan 3, 2009 5:54 PM PST
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I have never known Jax to sugar coat thins...
by shooter1525 on
Jan 3, 2009 6:48 PM PST
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which is probably why
he said that the elbow to kurz was bs. it’s not sugar coating to want to avoid the topic later on; it’s just the obvious decision.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
by cap'n hack on
Jan 3, 2009 7:16 PM PST
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technically, he “sugarcoated” his injury for some time. saying it didn’t have anything to do with his shooting.
and although he later admitted it, he initially denied that Nellie had called him out for his poor play and that he had stormed off missing the remainder of a shoot around.
jack’s more blunt than most, but he’s wising up to the fact that you have to be somewhat political when it comes to the media. look at how Boozer got blasted for being honest about opting out or Tyrus Thomas for his dunk contest comments. it’s just smarter to say the politically correct thing ala Baron and deny, deny, deny. deny you have a problem w/ Dunleavy or you’d rather be traded.
this is one of Nellie’s problems too. if he were more p.c., he’d probably have less problems with players. but he insists on calling out guys for not rebounding or being soft or being immature via the media. which you just can’t do in today’s NBA where ‘showing lack of respect’ is the greatest crime known to man and the media is always looking to stir up drama..
by the evil monkey on
Jan 3, 2009 8:54 PM PST
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I agree with
what you’re saying but I also don’t think Nellie is the type to say something to the media that he hasn’t already said to the players face to face.
by in for life on
Jan 4, 2009 12:19 PM PST
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if that's the case...
then why would jax say anything to steinmetz about the incident in the first place?
by the wingless one on
Jan 3, 2009 11:45 PM PST
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because there were reporters at the practice when it happened. he can’t just pretend that nothing happened. also, seeing as he got asked about it right after the incident, i’m sure he was a little pissed. after a little time to cool down, it’s easier to not talk to the press about it.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
by cap'n hack on
Jan 4, 2009 10:29 AM PST
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I suppose
I can buy that argument, but something is still off. If Nellie already said he’s leaving it to his asst coaches AND captains to make the decision when AR is ready to play, why should jax deny any knowledge of what is going on?
by the wingless one on
Jan 4, 2009 10:36 AM PST
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wow really
Friday night’s contest against the Minnesota Timberwolves represented Jamal Crawford’s 20th game with the Warriors. And so far, both he and coach Don Nelson are happy with how he’s adjusted to his new surroundings.
“Each game, each practice, it continues to get better and I’m going to get more comfortable with these guys and they’re going to get more comfortable with me. Hopefully, we can get a full team here soon and see what we have out there,” said Crawford, who finished with 11 points and three assists in Friday’s 115-108 loss.
So we just lost to the two worst teams in the whole league, Jamal Crawford is firing and bricking away (while not trying to guard anybody), and Coach Nelson is “happy” about the way things are going? Is anybody else as confused as I am?
by YaHeard on
Jan 3, 2009 6:33 PM PST
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actually if i were Nellie, i’d be saying more PC things like this. i actually think he is too honest and calls out players way too often in the media. you just can’t do that in today’s NBA where “showing a lack of respect” is the worst thing you can supposedly do to a player. combine that with the media attention being so much greater than 20 yrs ago and an endless number of “journalists” looking for a “story”.
by the evil monkey on
Jan 3, 2009 9:15 PM PST
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contrary to popular opinion
Nelson isn’t a fool, he can see that the season is going poorly and knows fanning the flames of the fire could only engulf him and the rest of the team too – it’s one thing to berate immature 19 yr old rookies about their lack of professionalism but it’s dangerous to publicly castigate the $10m/yr veterans (who you can’t trade easily) because you risk losing whatever cohesiveness remains from the shredded playoff hopes … I’d expect a whole lot of players are going to start trying to get their own numbers (some already are perhaps) from this point on … imo it’s still 50-50 Nelson finishes the season
Had GSW been winning, and AR was doing the exact same stuff, we’d all be on his case rather than Nelson’s. Too many fans here are playing blame games, and Nelson is the easiest to blame because he’s in the public eye. Blame lies in the FO but that’s such a disfunctional group that we can’t even tell who to blame what on (case in point, Rowell’s nixing of resigning Baron for $39/3yr). Yes, Nelson is a participant in that, but to what degree?
It’s safe to blame Nelson some for the Harrington debacle, but the drafts? He’d never even seen Marco play, that was 100% Mullin’s call. Now Marco, in his second season, is showing signs he’s going to be able to be a rotation player – do we credit Nelson for bringing him along? Wright? If we’d made the playoffs last year my guess is most people here would’ve hailed Nelson’s ability to balance going for the playoffs with nurturing the young’ns. We missed by one game, with 48 wins. Now that the wheels have fallen off the roster only Nelson is to blame?
Last summer most GSoMers scoffed at the suggestion that it was time to focus on rebuilding, and for Nelson to move on into the Maui sunset. Now the bandwagon has caught up, but the FO is going the opposite direction – extending Jackson, moving Riley to the FO, letting Mullin’s contract expire, extending Nelson – all point to Rowell’s directing the franchise in concert with Nelson if he serves out the contract. The silver lining in the very dark cloud is the FO should be more cohesive as we move forward. Hopefully, we’re not moving toward a cliff …
by hardcore on
Jan 4, 2009 9:05 AM PST
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Well said,
this problem isnt about Randolph its about the disconcert from the top of the orgizination to the bottem. The one thing about your silver lining is it assumes that Nellie hasnt or wont burn down whatever ‘alliance’ Nelson and RR have at the moment. The best move would be to NOT make any trade and at the end of the year hire a general manager and give him contol of basketball operations and move forward from there. The problem is that RR hasnt shown an aptitude to make the best descisions for the orginization and he is way to drunk on power to hand back the reigns he has snatched from Mullin.
What is the status of our petitions to fire Robert Rowell and have Chris Cohan commit Hari Kiri, or at least sell the team?
by warriorsscore110 on
Jan 4, 2009 8:43 PM PST
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playing blame games
man, but we can’t even win those, can we?
the stop calling him "beans" movement
by pervisNeverNervous on
Jan 5, 2009 3:40 PM PST
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as for Randolph
I can’t blame the guy at all. I understand why he’s frustrated. He’s raw, but he’s the most talented big man we have. He helps us on the court more than he hurts us, and he’s the only big we have who rebounds AND plays defense.
And then Nelson goes and starts Rob Kurz over him.
I’m siding with Anthony Randolph on this one. He’ll probably end up getting traded away for nothing and end up being a really fine player somewhere else. Just like Chris Webber. Thanks Nellie
by YaHeard on
Jan 3, 2009 6:43 PM PST
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Uhhhhmmmm.....Andris Biedrins?
"Monta is the MAN." -Bob Fitzgerald
by WarriorForLife on
Jan 3, 2009 9:58 PM PST
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Biedrins
I really appreciate his rebounding and hair, but does this look familiar to you:

Yeah that pretty much sums up our defensive anchor
by YaHeard on
Jan 4, 2009 10:29 AM PST
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Uhhhhmmmm.....Andris Biedrins?
He said talented, not tall
Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me
by Skeptic con Urquell on
Jan 4, 2009 9:04 PM PST
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the only big we have who rebounds
really?
by chakdephatte on
Jan 4, 2009 12:36 AM PST
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Wright does not rebound well, Turiaf does not rebound well, Biedrins does not play defense well
Randolph does both well
I’m not saying Randolph doesn’t do really stupid things on offense, but he does rebound and defend the paint very well (especially for his age). A big man that can do the big man things? What a novel idea
by YaHeard on
Jan 4, 2009 10:34 AM PST
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i disagree. unless you’re idea of good d is making highlight plays, he’s pretty bad on defense. he always goes for up fakes and gets blown by for dunks every time… this has happened so often that i’m sure my mentioning it has jogged your memory.
he’s the worst position defender among the big men. position defense is what makes the Spurs so good even though none of their players have great NBA athleticism. who jumps out of the building on that team? other than Turiaf, Kurz is sadly our second best big man at this. AR is the worst.
he can’t hold post position (part of this is weight, at 197, of the dubs only Monta & CJ weigh less than him) and doesn’t meet opposing bigs early enough or fight to hold his ground. often times, after his man catches the ball in the paint, he just stands there straight up and does nothing. even if you’re a foot from the basket and therefore screwed, at least give the illusion you’re going to jump – it might provide enough hesitation for someone to come from behind and strip the ball.
he’s slow on regular rotations, over rotates on shot blocking attempts. just b/c he blocks shots doesn’t mean he “defends the paint well.” it’s that Chris ‘Birdman’ Anderson / what Joel Przbilla used to do thing of over rotating and selling out for blocks. probably why Birdman leads the league in blocks per minute or is 2nd (haven’t looked in awhile) even though he’s not really a great 1-on-1 shot blocker like Turiaf. that’s not good defense. that just leaves your big man wide open – and since you weren’t supposed to rotate in the 1st place, most of the time no one rotates to your man.
he has no idea how to defend basic sets like princeton, zipper, ucla (high post rub), horns, power, etc… more often than not, he won’t be in the proper angle to deny entry passes or he won’t hedge screens on the correct side. basic ass stuff that you usually learn in college, if not HS – he really needed to stay in school – though i don’t know if LSU’s program would of helped him any… from what i assume, one of the bigger adjustments comes from the # of rotations you have to provide at the NBA level – which you don’t see in college b/c there aren’t the elite athletes like Lebron, Kobe, Dwight who are constantly breaking down teams or require the attention of all 5 guys being aware of how to rotate (combined w/ the difference in ground defenses have to cover, since you can’t just zone a man in the key and you have to defend out to 23’9" instead of 19’9").
by the evil monkey on
Jan 4, 2009 11:36 AM PST
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With Trent Johnson at LSU, the program looks to be in good shape (12-1 on a patsy schedule, but playing well). Randolph would have learned a bunch had he stayed there.
Randolph has always been the best athlete on the court in HS and at LSU. He’s at times the best athlete on the court in the NBA, though the differences are much, much smaller. But that isn’t enough. He got to college after playing on a losing program in HS. With an athlete of his caliber, any sort of coach should have been able to produce a moderately successful team in HS, so I suspect he may have been absently coached then. The situation at LSU last year was a joke, so he learned nothing there either. Now we’ve got a monster athlete with highlight skills but no real roadmap to put it all together. Tossing him into the fray is unlikely to do anything but reinforce bad habits.
by jae on
Jan 4, 2009 12:05 PM PST
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maybe that HS coach was trying to work on his attitude? some of them do still ;)
by hardcore on
Jan 4, 2009 5:53 PM PST
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Randolph appears (in limited time) to rebound well and to block shots well. Whether or not he plays defense well is not something that we know nearly as much about. He does some things well (like rebound) but he also seems lost in many sets. Intensity is not the same thing as being effective (e.g. Foyle, Adonal who for years showed himself to be ‘active’ but the activity resulting in chasing blocks that took him out of position, that caused him to open up the lane for easy buckets if he didn’t block the shot).
I don’t expect most rookies to be good defenders. It seems it takes a while to learn the tendencies and speed of the league. I like that he’s shown himself to be a good rebounder and that helps defense a bunch as someone needs to collect a defensive rebound after a miss, but overall, his contribution to defense at this point is limited.
What we do seem to know more about is that he’s the absolute worst on the team at turning the ball over per minute on the court. Yes, he’s worse than Jax, who’s not very good at avoiding turnovers, but has the ball in his hands most of the time. Randolph’s ability to turn the ball over is rather impressive given that he’s not tasked with trying to distribute and run the offense. A turnover is very costly. It’s a defensive stop for the opposition, guaranteed. We also know that he has had a real hard time actually making shots. The turnovers and low FG% were the red flags that made him “slip” to #14. They were known to be his weaknesses, so it’s unlikely that what we’ve seen in those respects is merely a small sample size. And these weaknesses are very, very costly. He’d have to rival Bill Russell’s defensive ability to be neutral in his contribution right now, given just how costly his play on offense is.
by jae on
Jan 4, 2009 11:59 AM PST
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I blame Randolph
you’re a baby in this league, trying to make it. you have to earn everything. Monta freaking Ellis barely ever got off the bench his rookie year, but I never once heard Monty saying that he had a bad attitude in practice because of it.
Randolph may be annoyed at his inconsistent minutes, but that should make you practice HARDER, not less.
We are a team trying to make it on hustle and unselfishness. I love Randolph’s game, but there’s no place for anyone with that attitude.
by bradyk2 on
Jan 4, 2009 9:43 AM PST
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I would agree with you EXCEPT
The “attitude problem” they’re referring to seems to be that Randolph is practicing TOO hard. They can’t have it both ways, they can’t tell the guy that practice is what is going to get him into games and then call him out for practicing as hard as he’d play in a game.
by the wingless one on
Jan 4, 2009 10:32 AM PST
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I'm hearing that
He doesn’t practice hard, he just took some cheap shots to Kurz. Nellie has made comments suggesting that he’s lazy and has a poor attitude in practice.
by bradyk2 on
Jan 4, 2009 11:54 AM PST
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"We are a team trying to make it on hustle and unselfishness"
That must be a joke.
by buky on
Jan 4, 2009 10:32 AM PST
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We suck, and our staple is offense
When you suck, your only hope is trying to outhustle/scrap your opponent. When you play offense and no defense, you damn well better move the ball.
by bradyk2 on
Jan 4, 2009 11:54 AM PST
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We are a team trying to make it on hustle and unselfishness. I love Randolph’s game, but there’s no place for anyone with that attitude.
Rudolf seems to bring more hustle than any of the other players except maybe Marco so what’s the proplem? Marco gets to strut his ugly mechanics for 20 minutes a game so why not Rudolf? It has to do something with Nelsons personality dis-order or his desire to make everything harder than it has to be?
Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me
by Skeptic con Urquell on
Jan 4, 2009 11:18 AM PST
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We have no idea what's going on in practice
If Randolph is hurting the team in practice, why should he get playing time in the games? This is professional sports…you need to be professional, and that means mature, and doing what your boss asks of you.
by bradyk2 on
Jan 4, 2009 11:55 AM PST
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If Randolph is hurting the team in practice, why should he get playing time in the games?
So he can hurt the other team. Duh?
Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me
by Skeptic con Urquell on
Jan 4, 2009 2:28 PM PST
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Yeah AR can play D, BUT....
then they go on offense and the second he touches the ball, the game plan breaks down and it’s ALL ABOUT HIM and GETTING HIS.
You think Maggette’s a black hole?!?!? AR is ridiculous – the W’s are trying to get him to learn offense (which is more than just taking and creating shots for yourself).
However, it appears he’s not a willing pupil. The benching is an attempt to get an attitude adjustment. If it doesn’t work we might as well trade him for whatever we can – maybe get our conditional draft pick back from NJ (from the Marcus Williams trade – talk about another problem.)
by joegiant on
Jan 4, 2009 11:11 AM PST
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i see your point how oncce he gets te ball its all about him taking quick shots. But he is trying to prove himself to the coaches. He plays his heart out but he doesnt leave it on the floor. I can see why he frusterated.
by cjwatson23 on
Jan 4, 2009 11:17 AM PST
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Benching Randolph for that is hypocrisy.
Maggette and Azubuike do that all day long and they know better.
by YaHeard on
Jan 4, 2009 11:29 AM PST
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Maggette and Azubuike do that all day long and they know better.
they have also proven to be able to play consistently within the coaches system. Everyone knows Randolph has skills, what he needs to prove is that he is willing to work with what the coaches, this includes the assistants, are trying to teach him and get him to do in games. At this point I think they’d rather see that he can execute their game plan then just flash his skills.
by in for life on
Jan 4, 2009 12:33 PM PST
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the obvious reply to this is that they are relatively successful at it
AR is not. according to David Thorpe’s piece, AR shoots under 30% from 8 ft and out… that’s incredible… in a bad way.
i can’t recall actually seeing him take a contested jumper outside the key… defenders usually sag off him. i can’t imagine any average joe who regularly players basketball couldn’t hit 30% of uncontested jumpers 8 ft & out in games even if they switched and shot it with their left (or off) hand. i’m confident enough that i would put money that i could even hook shot it and hit 3 out of 10 (30%).
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/columns/story?columnist=thorpe_david&page=Rookies-081223
for some perspectice, the FT line is 15 ft from the hoop (backboard).
by the evil monkey on
Jan 4, 2009 2:30 PM PST
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About a moanth ago Don Nelson was talking about another
player stating that the player was not very good in practice but very good in games. He said at the time that some players are simply not very good practice players and come alive during real games. In my opinion Nellie needs to listen to his own statements. In my opinion no one on the w’s tries harder in games than AR and while erratic, he is one of the few players that has the skill set to be something special. Could be he is not the best practice player but his effort in games can not be denied. Last year we had a one man fast break in Monta Ellis. Some fans seem to think our fast break was because of Baron. This couldn’t be the farthes from the truth. Baron was actually best in half court sets posting up smaller guards. Monta was our fast break. i think when he gets back it is going to be very exciting to see him and AR together ont he floor at the same time. AR running like a gazelle. Don… forget practice, look at what he brings during games. Effort, legnth, excitiment and a reason to watch the game.
by sigmund floyd on
Jan 4, 2009 12:37 PM PST
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I cant say anything about randolph in practice, but when i see him in games he is not THAT impressive. yes he’s tall but hes also unbelievably skinny. He tries on offense to create his own shot, but I think the best way for a rook to get PT with the warriors is to hustle and play D, which i dont believe AR does. I think the W’s should redshirt him and let him get some meat on those bones. I also think that the W’s shoulda kept Hendrix now that wright is out and AR is in the doghouse
anybody else think that marcus williams doesnt get any PT because of what he does in practice?
by xsjsharksx on
Jan 4, 2009 9:43 PM PST
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I really can't say what Marcus does in practice...
But I do think it is odd that we never ever play him. He really is the only true PG on this team and I think he can help out our ball movement problems, despite his reputation I think he could still be a good player for us.
I think the one knock on him was hustle on defense, but that seems like our whole team. I don’t think he can be any worse than CJ.
by shooter1525 on
Jan 4, 2009 10:05 PM PST
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from what i've read and the interviews i've listened to, it sounds like he has 3 problems
it seems Marcus Williams has had trouble figuring out our sets. which is pretty important for the PG position seeing as how the PG puts everyone where they need to be offensively. kind of mind boggling really – especially since this is his 3rd year. probably why the Nets preferred Dooling ahead of him.
and secondly, he’s supposedly out of shape – though what kind of shape you need to be in to play 15 minutes a game, i don’t know. i’ve read he’s had a reputation for being lazy.
thirdly, like Randolph, he apparently doesn’t know his limitations and from what i gather, Nellie seems to think that if you get them young enough you can “teach” this via practice. once they’ve been around, it’s too late. it’s subjective. and really up to the individual player – does he see this as a double standard? or do they realize that while it’s too late for guys like Jack & Maggette to change their ways, they’re still young enough to do it?
by the evil monkey on
Jan 5, 2009 11:47 AM PST
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So what is the real problem...
Nellie says if you get them young enough you can teach them. Marcus is not that old… matter of fact he is quite young…
I don’t care if he is the size of tractor trailer…. he can pass better than anyone else on our team… Nelson’s instincts are sh*t. He nearly trades Marco for a now D-League PF and now that he was FORCED to play him he has earned a spot. We know how to lose already, why not see if Marcus can help or if he gives us a new neat way of picking up a big L. What is it really going to hurt.
by shooter1525 on
Jan 7, 2009 10:25 AM PST
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agreed. season lost might as well have given him a shot in January.
though when Monta comes back, giving him a shot to run the point and seeing if he can do it is an experiment Nellie should look into.
if he can, it solves a lot of our problems.
as to what it’d hurt… could be the difference between going 28-54 or 22-60… to us, who cares, right? more ping pong balls. but to Nellie, it could be the difference between keeping the job and getting fired… unlike us he sees them in practice.
if we got to see MW or RH or AR in practice, chances are there would be less clamoring for them in games. since we too would have a good idea of what they can do. if our job depended on us getting to 30 or more wins, we’d probably all be holding these guys back as well (assuming Nellie doesn’t want to get fired).
by the evil monkey on
Jan 14, 2009 11:41 AM PST
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Hendrix
I read that Hendrix got 18 rebounds in a half, a game or two ago in D-league. Boy, do I wish we had him, too, now. Also, I agree, AR isn’t that impressive in games. He’s kind of dumb. He makes very poor decisions, as in LOW basketball IQ. Letting this guy play would show weakness in the coaches, allowing disrespect to spread to the rest of the team. SOME people around here think kissing the talent’s @ss will NOT lead to total disrespect of the @ss kissers. Those who are demanding that Nelson kiss some punk kid’s behind in front of the whole world have NO IDEA how to coach. You can’t coach, when you’re not respected. When some kid won’t follow instructions and elbow Rob Kurz in the face in practice and thinks he’s more important than other players like Jackson and Beans, you show them who is boss. Period. There is no other way to show leadership.
by Naticus on
Jan 5, 2009 2:32 AM PST
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yeah i'd much rather have Hendrix than DeMarcus Nelson.
and i’d seriously consider having another talk with AR and his agent about possibly heading down to the D-League for some more instruction.
by the evil monkey on
Jan 5, 2009 11:52 AM PST
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So he can clunk 8-footers to his heart's content?
From AR’s track record it sounds like he’s underachieved against bad competition for long enough.
by antihero on
Jan 8, 2009 1:01 AM PST
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PREE!!!!!
WE NEED YOU!!! TELL US WHAT REALLY HAPPENED!!!!!!
We should get some sort of Pree Signal or something.
Nelly has wet dreams about starting Monta at center.
by StSaints408 on
Jan 4, 2009 1:27 PM PST
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nellie's a loser
and his better half, mike dantoni, has made al harrington into a star—30 pts and rebounds today against the celts.
what a coach that nellie is.
by nelliehater on
Jan 4, 2009 10:44 PM PST
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Developing Randolph
I’m one of the guys who likes Randolph’s “potential”. I won’t rehash too much, but I like his athleticism, length, and comfort with handling and shooting. I think he could be a special player. That said, young guys need to be shown what to do to become successful. For AR, it’s going to be playing closer to the basket, realizing he’s not a 3, and working on his post game and mid-range consistency. Among other things, such as defensive fundamentals and setting up teammates. As a 19 year old, he has an especially steep learning curve, which also includes maturity.
I would much rather see Nelson bench Randolph than continue to allow him to handle the ball 30 feet from the basket and take contested 18 footers. The kid needs to get discipline and focus his energy on the things that will make him a successful player. Now, I’m not sure if our coaches are developing him, if they’re insisting on discipline, accountability and low post play. I don’t have info on what goes on in practice. But I do think that what I’ve seen so far in the games is very dangerous. Letting him get away with that type of play is going to ruin him, imho.
If developed well, he’s a couple years away still, but he could be very good. If he isn’t developed well, or if he is just big of an a-hole to learn what he needs to do, he’s going to be a waste. With the current coaching philosophy and the upside down front office, I’m getting very nervous.
by jmaaan on
Jan 4, 2009 10:54 PM PST
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Hear hear
He thinks he can do way more than he actually can. He’s the antithesis of “Know your limits”. He does things outside his limits just well enough that he thinks he can do it all. Every now and then, he’ll knock down that 20 footer. Every now and then, he’ll get a layup on a dribble drive off an isolation move. Hopefully somebody can get through to him and turn him into a smarter player and hopefully he can learn to play smart while keeping up the motor, but we’re still a ways away and part of that growing process for him is to realize that he’s hurting the team by playing the way he does. He does some amazing things because of his physical abilities, but he needs to get his mental and emotional game in check to maximize the productivity of his physical attributes.
"No no Nene!"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zB5DxNl4EB0
by Dubs fan in Boston on
Jan 5, 2009 7:37 AM PST
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And I do believe that he could become something special, but he’s not there yet and he hurts the team when he’s out there right now. I do believe that he was a decent pick at #14, but in 3 years, if he hasn’t turned into a superstar, we’ll have to deal with a few “OMG, I can’t believe we picked Randolph over JaVale McGee, Courtney Lee, or 2nd rounder X who’s turned into a gem, the Warriors drafting sucks!!! Waaaahhhhh!!!!”.
"No no Nene!"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zB5DxNl4EB0
by Dubs fan in Boston on
Jan 5, 2009 7:42 AM PST
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he hurts the team when he’s out there right now.
This team is beyond any possibility of Rudolf hurting it. We might as well enjoy his show than watch Nellie’s favs lose nightly. A good coach would inspire this kid not turn him off.
Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me
by Skeptic con Urquell on
Jan 5, 2009 10:56 AM PST
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+1
Nothing to lose. Sky’s potential to gain.
All the vets should log around 30 minutes max and let the kids get at least 15-20 minutes so they can learn in a real environment. Practice and shootarounds only do so much.
by misterjennings on
Jan 5, 2009 11:05 AM PST
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This isn’t entirely true. Avoiding the discussion of his alleged ‘potential’ or how anyone evaluated it in the first place, there is a cost of playing someone when he’s not ready. It is possible to reinforce bad habits and slow someone’s growth as a player by shuttling him onto the court when he’s making fundamental mistakes. Intermittent rewards (e.g. making 40% of your shots) does reinforce the behavior even if overall, it’s a detriment. If Randolph keeps making the same mistakes, giving him more PT is not guaranteed to fix them at all and could have the effect of making him internalize his play as somehow good despite the mistakes.
by jae on
Jan 5, 2009 11:47 AM PST
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if we were winless
the team would be beyond possibility of randolph hurting it. for now, i’d rather not sacrifice every potential win by playing a guy who his teammates are pissed at and who doesn’t play basketball well. i for one, do not want to tank this year. if we play randolph, all that we’ll be saying is “good job elbowing kurz in the face. why don’t you go shoot miserably and turn the ball over constantly? then when you’re on defense, make sure you get confused by basic defensive sets. above all, you need to make at least one impressive play per game. a block, a dunk, whatever, just keep everyone enamored with your potenital.” i think i’ll wait for him to learn how to play basketball before throwing him to the wolves.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
by cap'n hack on
Jan 5, 2009 11:12 AM PST
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if we play randolph, all that we’ll be saying is "good job elbowing kurz in the face.
Elbows are part of basketball, I’ve had my share from team mates and I got over them.
We don’t have to turn Rudolf loose on the court but some regular playing time with follow up critique would be very useful to his development and to the team’s future. If we don’t have a winning core we need to get something out of everyone to keep up a minimal level of interest. Nellie just doesn’t understand motivation or making each player perform to his best potential. Look at the way he handled TMNT , or MarcusWilliams, or Foyle? All of them have specific skills that could contribute to wins if Nelson had used them correctly. Unless the starters are all allstars and winning nightly sticking with a short rotation makes no sense. It takes more effort and flexibility to get the most from a squad but it shows better coaching than just doing the same old thing over and over again.
Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me
by Skeptic con Urquell on
Jan 5, 2009 11:25 AM PST
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of course elbows are part of basketball, but when the rest of the team and coaches stand up and say that it’s uncalled for, it seems like it wasn’t an accident or at least was unnecessarily reckless.
the guys on the bench presently are guys i don’t want to see play. marcus williams can’t defend anyone, is out of shape and struggles to run the offense. he gets some assists, but for the most part he tries to do way more than he is asked to or should do. randolph simply isn’t good right now. sorry, but he plays clueless basketball. he can learn how to be a part of the offense and pick up defensive sets in practice. let him do that first. while he’s at it, maybe he can practice a jump shot. his atrocious shooting percentage from outside of the paint means that he either needs to practice or needs to never shoot a jumper during a game.
i have no idea what the specific feud with harrington was about. my guess is that harrington was mad about playing the 4 when he’s a better 3. but unfortunately, we just didn’t have bigs around, so you do what you can. if that’s what spiraled out of control, it sucks, but happens. nothing you can really do. i can understand his frustration, but he gets paid to play basketball for a living. i don’t care if they make him play a position that he didn’t want to play because the team needed him to play it. it could be something entirely different than that, and if that’s the case, i’d like to hear the story before making a call on it.
the in-game rotation has been short, but for the most part, everyone has gotten a shot in certain games. kurz has played big minutes when the matchup was right, so has demarcus (before getting cut), and the rest of the guys lamenting their end of the bench status. nelson gave those guys their chance this year, it worked out for some, not for others. his rosters have been exceptionally varied this year. so, i wouldn’t say that is just doing the same thing over and over.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
by cap'n hack on
Jan 5, 2009 1:15 PM PST
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Nellie just doesn’t understand motivation or making each player perform to his best potential. Look at the way he handled TMNT , or MarcusWilliams, or Foyle?
Foyle? guy can’t get past Marcin Gortat as the 3rd big man off the bench in Orlando.
according to Hollinger, Marcus Williams was replaced in favor of Darrell Armstrong last season. and it appears he was made expendable by the Nets when they signed Keyon Dooling to back up Devin Harris seeing as how Rod Thorn swung Marbury for Kidd and last season got Harris for Kidd, i’d say he probably has a good feel for PGs, much better than the typical dubs fan who pines for Marcus Williams to play more.
in terms of basketball, i actually think TMNT was handled perfectly. 25-30 minutes shooting 3’s to space the floor… what D’Antoni’s doing has lowered Al’s shooting percentages, rebounding rate, assist rate, steal rate, etc etc. Al just gets more minutes and more shots in NY, not necessarily a good thing.
it’s all conjecture. what’s best? is it better to start the QB right away? or sit him and let him learn by watching? a lot of injured guys say they see the game in a whole new light once they are forced to sit out, so just watching isn’t a zero. in the NBA, no good coach throws out young guys unless they help them win. coaches who do sport losing records and don’t last very long – the nba is littered with coaches in the tim floyd, winters, brooks’ and wittman mold.
by the evil monkey on
Jan 5, 2009 2:24 PM PST
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I wouldn’t have a problem with Randolph getting pt and making mistakes in the rotation if it were handled as Skeptic suggested. Some pt with critique, and if it appeared Randolph was taking that to heart and working on what he needs to do to become a good player. However, what I’ve seen is a guy not progressing much, seeming to work on parts of his game that are still way too advanced for him, and not working on the fundamentals that he needs to in order to become a good player. So at this point I don’t think playing him is helping. It’s like jae said, reinforcing bad habits.
Sitting isn’t bad, otherwise all the good young players would be in the NBADL. There is still the perception, right or wrong, that practicing with NBA coaches and scrimmaging with NBA players takes a guy the final 20 yards. So if Randolph can take coaching, and if our coaches can put the right structure in place, he can develop quite nicely without getting into games yet. Once he has his head on straight and is improving in the areas he needs to, then reward him by giving him minutes and letting him make mistakes against game competition. Then bring him along like Skeptic suggests. But he hasn’t shown thus far that he’s at a place where that pt will be helpful.
My concern isn’t winning now, it’s seeing Randolph be developed in such a way that he fulfills his vast potential. I think sitting him, working on his attitude and game before giving him more pt makes sense. Monkey’s qb example is right on. Bad organizations seem to ruin #1 qb’s while good organizations develop them. If the qb is mature enough to start and has good support he can benefit but if not, he’ll be ruined. In that case he should sit for a year or two. But bad organizations seem to always thrust the guy in there before he’s ready and reinforce or create bad habits. Randolph got some pt, showed he isn’t ready, and throwing him out there at this point would be detrimental to his development, imho.
by jmaaan on
Jan 5, 2009 3:46 PM PST
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+1
I agree, since the Warriors are struggling this year theres going to be a greater desire to see the young guys get PT even though theyre not ready. Although, in the past couple games, no big really gets an opportunity to play much except Biedrins and Turiaf
by xsjsharksx on
Jan 5, 2009 4:42 PM PST
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my dream team
- Ellis / Bellineli
- Randolph / Morrow / Bellineli
- Azubuike / Randolph
- Wright / Turiaf
- Biendris / Hendrix
waive / release / throw away Jackson, Crawford and Maggette (or trade them for someone or something)
the idea is to have on the court, all the time, at least 3 big guys. Since Randolph has good ballhandling, this is possible w/o losing ball movement/handling
bow down to this lineup!
=Gaucho=
by Gaucho! on
Jan 6, 2009 2:40 PM PST
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By good ballhandling, you must mean something other than ‘handling the ball without turning it over’.
by jae on
Jan 6, 2009 4:17 PM PST
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And by shooting guard, you must mean something other than “guard who can shoot”…
by antihero on
Jan 8, 2009 1:07 AM PST
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my dream team
Baron / Jasikevicius
JRich / Ellis
Jackson / Pietrus
Harrington / Barnes
Biedrins / Patrick O’Bryant
by YaHeard on
Jan 6, 2009 9:13 PM PST
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my dream team
Damn, that would be sweet. No way someone could put that together.
Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me
by Skeptic con Urquell on
Jan 6, 2009 10:04 PM PST
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Harrington
never wanted to play for nelson, looks what he’s doing for D’Antoni!
I hate him so much!
=Gaucho=
by Gaucho! on
Jan 7, 2009 10:30 AM PST
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the same thing he was doing here. he’s just taking more shots.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
by cap'n hack on
Jan 7, 2009 10:31 AM PST
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plus
he’s actually connecting them – and he’s motivated
=Gaucho=
by Gaucho! on
Jan 9, 2009 8:29 AM PST
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Actually, his scoring efficiency is not any better and his rebounding isn’t any better. His actual value to wins and losses is more or less identical to what it was for us for most of his time here. His play has looked superficially better because he’s scoring more points, but if he does that simply by taking more shots, everything else equal, he doesn’t change his team’s chances towards the positive most of the time. The Knicks aren’t benefitting from his play. They were 7-6 when they acquired him and have since won a whopping 6 of their next 20. When you look at more than ppg, he’s not playing well, much like he didn’t regularly play well here. If that’s the result of his ‘motivated’ play, I’ll pass. That kind of motivation leads you back to the lottery year after year after year.
He does improve his chances of some sucker overpaying him if he opts out, since the easiest way to get paid is to up your PPG. Constructing a team based on this alone is not generally a good idea, but it happens all the time. D’antoni isn’t doing anything wonderous with Al other than helping him get a raise in the off season.
by jae on
Jan 9, 2009 8:49 AM PST
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txs for the clarification
from now on I’m your #1 fan
=Gaucho=
by Gaucho! on
Jan 14, 2009 11:32 AM PST
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HE WATCHED MY JV GAME!!!!!!
How was his attitude, did he throw things?
Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me
by Skeptic con Urquell on
Jan 6, 2009 10:05 PM PST
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More Randolph
Examiner had an interview with AR. Not totally forthcoming but I was surprised he agreed to an interview at all with the drama going on around him. He says he doesn’t have a bad attitude, his body language is being misunderstood and other coaches on the W’s like Smart understand this. He says he’s having trouble not playing since he’s always been the best at every sport his played and always was the go to guy, getting plenty of pt. Finally, he says he thinks he can help the team and when he’s been out there he’s proven this.
Don’t kill the messenger, just reporting the facts. Also in another interview Nelson said Randolph has had 3 good practices in a row, and he thinks he’s starting to understand what he needs to do in practice. He said if Randolph continues to have good practices he’ll get better. Didn’t say anything about playing him. I also remember Nelson saying that Williams was having better practices and getting into better shape quite a while ago, haven’t seen him on the floor as a result, though. So hard to read too much into it…..
by jmaaan on
Jan 7, 2009 10:41 PM PST
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Randolph's game in L.A.
I was happy to see Nellie happy with Randolph. It looks like the gap is being bridged. I’m excited that Nellie appears able to coach Randolph. I’m also happy to read jmaaan’s post about Randolph’s comments. Let’s hope it keeps up!
by Naticus on
Jan 8, 2009 12:51 AM PST
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Forced to Play...I Love It!
Its too bad that SJax is hurt and now Brandon Wright as well(dislocated shoulder). The good thing is we can actually have Randolph further devlop his game. I went to the Laker game last night and against the best team in the NBA, he looked pretty good. Yes, he had a couple bad fast break choices, yes he messed up on a couple passes and yes he missed some shots, but the kid had some good moments and ended up having a decent game.
Im glad to see that the Warriors are forced to play Randolph because I think he has a lot of upside. Sitting him for a year or two just prolongs the development and we as Dubs fans deserve to see a draft pick play. People learn from thier mistakes. If Randolph is never given an oportunity to mess up, how is he going to learn to be a solid NBA player? Sitting on the bench? Hells no. I can’t wait to see more.
by gabezgsw on
Jan 8, 2009 8:19 AM PST
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development is made in practice...
The more you practice, the better you get. Poor practices = no burn. They did say that Randolph had strung together 3 good practices before last night’s game. Thank the loard too because Kurz SUCKS!
by Mr. Monday Night on
Jan 8, 2009 5:16 PM PST
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not really forced...
technically they can play Kurz and Davidson ahead of him if they want to.
by the evil monkey on
Jan 9, 2009 12:21 AM PST
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The last thing a raw and uderdeveloped rookie with a huge ego needs is to be coddled and catered to by his own coach… especially in the big leagues. If Nellie backs down to a rookie that isn’t yet a star much less even a starter then he loses his authority with the rest of the team. Butting heads with Randolf might sour him on Nellie and the Warriors altogether, but i believe that Nellie is handling it the way he has to.
Do y’all let your kids tell you how late they’re gonna stay up or what time they’re coming home? Do they give you attitude and then expect the car keys from you the following night?
Punishment and reward. That’s what Nellie is doing. It’s the fair way and it’s the right way. He’s 19 and he’s playing in a grown man’s world. He better learn how to exist in that world on and off the court.
I pray i never have to use a gun again...
...unless i'm at a strip club parking lot...
...and somebody tries to run me over with their car...
...But how often does that happen??
by ssmokinjoe on
Jan 8, 2009 8:42 PM PST
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you're right
but i think it should have never gotten to this point. If Nelly wasn’t such a stubborn S.O.B. and he was more of a determined coach that works with his players, then this situation may have never occured. Nelson relies on his players for him to look good. He hates rookies and that’s a known fact, so why would anything be different for a 19 year old who has the makings of becoming a future star. Nelson expects his players to produce right away and AR is a project, as is B. Wright, Marco and as was Project O’Bryant (i’m not saying he could have been a star, not at all). Nelson is lazy and I can bet that he doesn’t work with his young guys on any type of fundamentals. Randolph is 19 and he doesn’t have all of his fundamentals down yet and that’s why you have to work with him more than you would with a veteran if you want things to pan out nicely. Nelson doesn’t do that. AR said it himself and i’ve heard it from other youngsters on the team that it’s the assistant coaches and the veterans that are helping them get through a lot of stuff. I never heard Nelson’s name come up unless they were talking about being unhappy.
I do agree that if Nelson were to back down now and give in to AR and all of the media hype that he would lose all remaining authority with the team, but if you notice, he doesn’t hold as much authority as he has had in the past. Players come out publicly and criticize him, saying they’re unhappy. I notice little things in the huddles where bench players are kinda just goofing around and sometimes when Nelly’s screaming something at someone, they just let it go in one ear and out the other. you can see it in the expression of their face. It’s unfair for young, up and coming players to have to have such a huge hurdle (Nelson the rookie hater) in their way. Nelson was a good coach but at this point in his career it looks like he lost his touch and with this young warrior team (one of the youngest,if not, the youngest in the NBA) i don’t think Nelson is the right coach for the job.
by ItsDatFriscoSwag415 on
Jan 9, 2009 8:35 AM PST
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nellie's a loser
and this is NOT recent. go back to his first tenure with the w’s—he was always screaming right on tv during the timeouts, at poor old sarunis (who probably didn’t even understand half of what nellie was screaming), or mario ellie, or vince askew, but NEVER yelled at mullin or especially hardway (who committed plenty of bonehead mistakes).
fortunately for them, mario, sarunis, and askew left the idiocy that is nellie ball, and all became much better with their new teams—ellie even significantly helped houston win its 2 championships.
by nelliehater on
Jan 9, 2009 9:08 AM PST
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I remember people voicing the same complaints about Nelie not playing BWright last year. But look how he’s come along. He looked HORRIBLE in spot action last year, but he looks like a competent, entirely average NBA player. I think Nelie deserves some credit for the way he’s brought along Brandan, and a similar waiting game might be just what Randolph needs.
by rjnarayen on
Jan 10, 2009 12:55 AM PST
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I didn’t think Wright looked horrible at all last year. Perhaps you can clarify what looked horrible about him. Perhaps you remember things differently, but in limited action he came in, rebounded (better than he has this year as it was), and kept his shooting to the sort of shots he could make. He played very much within himself, not making things look spectacular, but not making glaring mistakes. He had some issues with defensive placement and he wasn’t a particularly good fit with Andris as both were used to making their living on the close to the basket high percentage stuff and there was only so much to go around, but the problems he had were more the sort of problems almost all rookies have getting used to the speed and skill of other plays when on defense. I think many people look at the ‘per game’ totals, see that he wasn’t hitting double doubles and assume he must have been horrible, not at all paying attention to the per minute productivity that was fairly reasonable.
Randolph is a different case. He’s come in and done a couple of things real well. He seems to have a much better rebound instinct, but he has had horrible results when he’s tried to do much of anything else. His shot may look pretty, his ball handling may look like he can do it, but the results indicate that he is not competent at either.
by jae on
Jan 10, 2009 10:10 AM PST
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you can’t compare last year to this year. Last year the team had a legit shot at the playoffs, so playing young players could hurt those chances. This year the playoff hopes are done and the team should be in rebuilding mode. Playing rookies and letting them develop is fine because squeeking out a few extra wins by doing that is almost bad for you because your lottery position would be worse.
Team should be in total rebuilding mode, unloading sluggish veterans with bloated salaries and developing all the young talent. Why do they not realize that?
by runandgun on
Jan 10, 2009 11:02 PM PST
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well
unloading the bloated salaries doesn’t really have anything to do with randolph. and developing talent is not necessarily something that we see during games. playing randolph when he’s playing miserably won’t necessarily make him better. if he practices hard and gets better, then you play him. his problems won’t go away by pushing him into games before he plays well.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
by cap'n hack on
Jan 11, 2009 12:35 AM PST
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I'm going to have to say
Balderdash. On the smear job Nelly and the front office have tried to do in the media about Randolph and him “Not being ready to play in the NBA.” To me it looks like a PR move on their part after Nelly foolishy and unconscionably told Randolph it wasn’t working out and to tell his agent to seek a trade. The fans didn’t like that much along with the lack of playing time for an obviously talented young player on a team that should obviously be developing that talent.
I don’t buy this “not ready for the NBA” stuff either. Its so freaking fish. Randolph gets some decent minutes early in the season, then he is suddenly “not ready for the NBA”. What? If he was not ready, then why did you play him so early. When playoffs were still a hope you played a rookie that wasn’t ready for the NBA? What? And then when the playoff hopes are pretty much done you don’t play your most talented rookie? What? And you come out in the media about Randolph “not being ready to play in the NBA” after Nelly completely stuck his foot in his mouth and infuriated all the Warriors nation? They had patience after all the other tiffs Nelly has had with other players that are not “Nellies guys”, gave Nelly the benifit of the doubt, but this was the last straw, the needless and foolish fued that broke the fans patience and broke Nelly’s good will. At that time you come out in the media about “Randolph not being ready to play in the NBA.” Hmmmmmmmmmm. All seems pretty fishy to me.
I’m not buying it. I’ve seen Randolph play, he gives a great effort, shows tremedous skill on both ends of the court, yes, he makes mistakes. Those need to be worked out. So you don’t play him the entire game. Give him 5 minutes here, 5 minutes there, get him 20 – 30 minutes a night. Encourage him. Have an assistent coach sit down with him on the bench after a mistake and go over what the mistake was and how to fix it. You got to nurture the guy, he’s a 19 year old still developing in many ways, have a fatherly attitude with him.
But don’t alienate him, strongarm him in the media because you know Randolph can’t really talk about it because he will make himself look like a team killer or problem guy, tell him its not working out and to ask his agent for a trade, basically tell him he sucks and he will never be good on this team. That’s not right, its not ethical, its horrible coaching, a firable offense as far as I am concerned. The sooner they do that the better it will be for the entire team.
by runandgun on
Jan 12, 2009 11:42 PM PST
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the problem is
that we have no idea how accurate the “ask about trade options” situation is. it was reported, then went away and not much has been made of it since. i agree that if that were true, it’s a dumb decision, but i have no idea if it’s true.
second, ‘great effort’ is not reason enough to play someone. he can fix his major problems on the practice court. let him do it there, instead of keeping us from winning games (and i am aware that the team has a losing record, but not winning many games is different than not winning every game, which giving randolph 20-30 minutes per game would essentially guarantee). playing someone for 20-30 minutes when they are bad at playing basketball is a bad idea. i understand that he’s young and makes mistakes, but seeing as he looks lost on both ends of the court, he needs to learn the offense and the defense before playing much. right now, all he can do it rebound, turn the ball over, lose his man, and sometimes turn in a highlight reel play. leave him on the bench until he figures the nba out. he’ll be able to make progress in practice. that’s sort of the point.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
by cap'n hack on
Jan 13, 2009 5:24 AM PST
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I'm not buy your soap
You are willing to explain away everything in regards to Nelly and the situation with Randolph. I think you are being obtuse and willingly blind.
I think the report about telling Randolph that it isn’t working out and to seek a trade is probably true because 1. The timing fits, at around that time Randolph saw his playing time being cut for no apprent reason. 2. Why would a reporter just make something up like that out of thin air? There had to be a source, whether Randolph or his agent or someone close to them. Just because the reporter didn’t reveal his source doesn’t mean its not true. 3. After the Warriors and Nelly saw how much those reports infuriated fans, THEN they came out with the PR move of having Nelly denying it and then having team sources say about how the coach and other players say he is “not ready for the NBA”, questioning his attitude and coachability, basically calling him Terrell Owens. So what can Randolph do then? He can’t further the thing by saying what he wants to say or defending himself because because then he would like the Terrell Ownes they are trying to paint him to be. So he neither confirms or denies the reports about Nelly telling him its not working out and to tell his agent to seek a trade.
I don’t know how much you pay attention to things like this, but when someone says he doesn’t confirm or deny something, that is code for “It happened, but I just don’t want to be the one to say it happened”
Also “keeping us from winning games” What?! What games are you talking about? Are you watching the same season as I am? Because last time I checked, they weren’t winning many games. I don’t agree with you that playing him 20 – 30 minutes would guarentee a loss (what are you the biggest Randolph hater out there?)(or are you Nelly in disguise?).
Give me a break with all this, you sound like you are part of the Warriors front office spin machine. I don’t buy it.
by runandgun on
Jan 13, 2009 9:06 AM PST
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well
first off, i don’t hate randolph, i just don’t think he’s an effective basketball player yet and the things he needs to improve can be improved in practice without hurting the team in games, which he does. he turns the ball over constantly and doesn’t understand the sets we run. he’s good for hustle and highlights and i think he’ll improve. i just don’t see why we should play him over half the game when he’s not playing well. and he isn’t playing well, no account of his potential changes that. i’m not willing to tank this season, even if we don’t get to the playoffs. i know this isn’t a playoff team, but i’d rather see the team play the games as though they wanted to win them, not tossing in raw talent and hoping they figure it out.
second, reports like broussard’s happen all the time. some of them true, some of them not. if it happened, it was dumb. nelson screwed up. i just don’t care unless it actually affects a personel decision. should tomorrow come and we trade randolph for junk, it’ll be a problem. until that happens, randolph can sit on the bench until he plays well. i’m sorry if i’m a hater for thinking he should play well before he plays 20-30 minutes (which is a ridiculously high total for almost any rookie, particularly one that has shown that he is NOT nba ready yet, he might get there, but he isn’t yet).
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
by cap'n hack on
Jan 13, 2009 11:10 AM PST
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well you don’t sound like Nelly then because he threw in the towel 2 months ago. You are wanting to play every game like its a playoff game. Its not. Teams have rebuilding years for a reason, because rebuilding years actually help your team be better for the upcoming years. Year where you can actually have a chance, not like this one because it is done.
I don’t agree with you on Randolph, you seem to think he is terrible. I think the coaches have severly mismanaged him and would him up so tight he overplays at times. Those things need to be worked out on the court. Yes you can learn at practice, a game against a different team with refs with fans with the spotlight is different. You can’t simulate everythign in practice, give him his minute, this season is done, its just flat out stupid not to.
by runandgun on
Jan 13, 2009 12:10 PM PST
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Teams have rebuilding years for a reason, because rebuilding years actually help your team be better for the upcoming years.
I’ve wondered about that. I’m not sure it’s true and I’m not sure it’s false.
It seems to me that most turnarounds don’t come from developing the product in house, but by acquiring fresh talent from somewhere else. This isn’t always the case, but it’s much easier to find examples of bad teams getting good from personnel additions than from “playing the kids to let them develop”.
by jae on
Jan 13, 2009 1:45 PM PST
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i don’t think he’s terrible. i think he’s a project. that was the consensus when he was drafted and he hasn’t done anything that would change minds about that. i think he’s a very interesting piece two years from now, but things that are interesting in two years aren’t necessarily good ideas right now. he can learn the skills he needs and learn the team’s gameplan in practice. i’m fine with waiting for that. i want to be patient with him and not toss him out there just yet. at least not for 20-30 minutes a game. rewarding good practices with a few minutes of game time seems like the right strategy for now. i’m willing to wait for him to get better. i don’t see what is “flat out stupid” about that.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
by cap'n hack on
Jan 13, 2009 6:36 PM PST
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+1
He needs to earn time. He needs pt to be a reward for working on something, not a birthright for being a talented (but flawed) player on a terrible team. He’s got bad habits that simply playing through may merely reinforce. If he scores 15 a night on 14 shots (entirely possible right now), the immediate feedback isn’t that he’s failing, though repeating this is a way to lose a bunch of games.
I also worry when I hear people envisioning him as a Scotty Pippen point-forward. While it might play to work-out film skills, it does not play to the areas he’s had success in either here or at LSU. If it happens, fine, but that’s not where he’s shown the most promise and I can easily see Jonathan Bender/Darius Miles like results. His greatest strengths have come near the basket where he shows signs that he could be a very good rebounder and shot blocker. Can someone load Marcus Camby game footage on his iPod and make him watch it over and over and over again? No, it’s not the most exciting prospect, but it would be a very successful one that would help the team immensely.
by jae on
Jan 13, 2009 6:51 PM PST
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i’ve been confused by the “next scottie pippen” label thrown on him, too. where is that coming from? camby footage would be brilliant for him because it would show randolph all the things that he is currently good at, and what can happen if he sticks with that, instead of firing up long distance sure-misses or trying to take guys off the dribble. my hope for him is something of a josh smith type guy. he’s got the athleticism and can rebound and block shots. considering the commotion for signing smith earlier this summer by the gsom community, that seems like an exciting prospect.
it concerns me to see randolph try to do too much and if he forces his game, he won’t get to that level. he’s not kg, i don’t ever see him playing point forward in a conference final or anything. that doesn’t seem to be his game, but there are a lot of very successful guys who can do all the hustle things and provide good offense by simply being better athletes than their defenders. that’s what i want to see from him.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
by cap'n hack on
Jan 13, 2009 9:41 PM PST
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i’ve been confused by the "next scottie pippen" label thrown on him
Me too, cause that would mean we have Michael Jordon hidden somewhere on the bench? Marcus??
Till I get free
I live my life in the Walmart
Cholesterol chasin me
by Skeptic con Urquell on
Jan 14, 2009 9:44 AM PST
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scottie had some good years in portland without michael. but i think that we can all agree that marcus is definitely the next jordan.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
by cap'n hack on
Jan 14, 2009 10:44 AM PST
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Camby footage...
I’d also like him to watch Tyson Chandler footage of his rookie year back to back with more recent game tape. That is a guy that came into the league trying to play out on the wing as a “skilled big-man” and had little success until he realized he was better off grabbing rebounds, blocking shots (but not trying to block every shot) and throwing down CP3 lob passes.
It seems like it took him a year or two to improve his rebounding, but it took him four or five year to completely accept his offensive limitations. You can see his turnovers trend down and his FG% trend up as he figured out his place in the league. His foul rate also came down significantly with the change of scenery, but without watching enough of him I can’t really say if this was personal restraint or more a product of the new defensive system.
I’m still hopeful that Randolph can find a way to play to his strengths. Maybe he just needs a strong voice from an authority figure telling him what kind of player he really is (something he may not have had yet in his young basketball career). I’m not counting on a transformation by any means, but he could be a very effective player if he can figure this stuff out (no easy task, I know).
Thing 2
by olympicmike on
Jan 15, 2009 12:11 PM PST
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