Rick Barry calling out LeBron?
by yardbird on Jan 22, 2009 4:09 PM PST
82 comments
As you all probably know by now, Warrior great and creator of NBA sons, Rick Barry, called LBJ out on his game.
(There's the link to the story.)
In the article, Barry says,
"He's got major flaws in his game," Barry said. "He's six years into the NBA. How can a man six years into the NBA with his talent have a major flaw in his shot? How can he not use screens effectively? . . I watch the game very carefully - he doesn't use screens effectively and this is not LeBron's fault. It's the fault of the people who are teaching him. . . . There is no doubt in my mind that LeBron, if shown these things would do them, because he wants to be a great player, he wants to win a championship. As great as he is, he should be better."
I mean, as great as Ricky boy was and is, do you all think he should be calling out the league's best player insuch a way? Although he makes some fairly valid points, and if i were taking hoops tips from anyone, Barry would be pretty high on my list, but does that make this whole story ok?
CavsBlogger from over at Fear the Sword makes a pretty good point, that Rick Barry Gives LeBron Reason to Drop 50 on Warriors. (Pretty good read) What do you all think about the matchup tomorrow?
-YB
This FanPost is a submission from a member of the mighty Golden State of Mind community. While we're all here to throw up that W, these words do not necessarily reflect the views of the GSoM Crew. Still, chances are the preceding post is Unstoppable Baby!
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We’re gonna get DOGGED, what else is new? A loss is a loss whether it’s by one point (last night vs the Thunder) or by 32 points (vs the Magic). Only thing different is that we get to watch Monta’s return.
And Rick Barry does bring up some good points and how the league has been more about isolation plays as opposed to team plays where everyone gets a touch like in the European style of play, which is something i’d prefer since it’s a more team oriented style of play.
WARRIORS BASKETBALL!!! Patiently waiting for a title...I may be waiting for a long time...
Wow
that’s pretty critical of lebron if you ask me. I think Lebron knows he can be better and Rick Barry is just pointing it out. I doubt Lebron will take it super personal like how he did when Charles Barkley made comments about him talking about signing with another team in 2010 but he will take it as a challenge and he will most likely murder my Warriors tonight. Oh well, Monta Ellis is coming back and that’s what i’m looking forward to most. Hopefully Lebron could just add a couple of spectacular dunks and i’d be alright with that.
We are not the same, I am a Martian! -Weezy F. Baby! Ya Diiiigg!
by ItsDatFriscoSwag415 on Jan 22, 2009 4:15 PM PST reply actions
Rick Barry
He sure isn’t afraid to say what he feels he needs to.
The Ultimate Opportunist
by Rated-R Superstar on Jan 22, 2009 4:18 PM PST reply actions
Haha
Rick Barry is a jerk even when he isn’t trying to be.
“You people !!! How many time do I have to tell you that the call-in line and the contest line are different. If you people keep calling into 808-KNBR for the tickets we aren’t going to do these contests anymore!!”
Thing 2
by olympicmike on Jan 22, 2009 4:46 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
It is more
of an insult to the coaches.
If I was Lebron I would be like, “He Rick, lets go to the gym or the tape, and you can tell me how I should be using screens.”
And Rick Barry would respond by saying
Huh? speak english lebron
Either that or,
“I am not being paid to be your coach. I’m not even a Cavs fan”
by Nuck Chorris on Jan 22, 2009 5:06 PM PST up reply actions
he
could just give the rick barry edition of better basketball.
So I don't have a signature well these words would do! Who knew that upgrades can have downgrades too!
by 24k state fan since 87 on Jan 22, 2009 8:57 PM PST up reply actions
Guaranteed he wouldn't say that
if he was still playing.
Nelly has wet dreams about starting Monta at center.
im pretty sure he would. lebron has not yet proven that he's a better bball player than barry. sure lebron is flashier
but who shot the better pct. who has a championship ring
Don't even make the comparisons.
Lebrons wayyyyyyyyyyyyyy better than Rick Barry ever was.
Nelly has wet dreams about starting Monta at center.
where's the proof
when did lebron avg 35ppg and 9rbg
when did lebron win the finals and become the finals mvp
When did Rick Barry
go against the type of competition Lebron goes against every game?
Nelly has wet dreams about starting Monta at center.
by StSaints408 on Jan 22, 2009 10:12 PM PST up reply actions
who's to say the fundamentally flawed athletes lebron plays against are better than the ones
rick barry played against…
i probably agree with you but regardless rick barry would be an excellent player even in today’s league. there aren’t many players that can shoot like he could.
by montamazing on Jan 22, 2009 11:53 PM PST up reply actions
the pace of the game is much faster when Rick played vs now.
to simplify, lets just look at FG attempts.
in the 70s, the average # of shots one team took in 1 game went from 102.2 to 114.2.
even if you took the lower avg shots per game of 102.2 (‘74-’75 season) and multiplied it by 2, you’d get about 204 shots in every NBA game.
the avg # of shots taken by the W’s is 86.1 and the average # of shots in a Warrior’s game is 175.4.
that mean that the average team took close to 30 more shots taken on average in the NBA back in the 70s in one game compared to the league’s current fastest team the Warriors. 30 more shots means 30 more chances for points, rebounds, and assists.
it’s actually even more lopsided in terms of overall possessions b/c there were more TOs back then (the Warriors usually averaged 20 turnovers per game… the NBA worst is around 17 these days). FT attempts have been about the same since the 70s.
The Cavs are 25th in pace of play. less shots, less chances of points & assists, misses that cause rebounds or are created via blocks, etc.
by the evil monkey on Jan 23, 2009 11:51 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Ya and he basically called Shaq a lazy fat pig!
by dungeness crabdribble on Jan 22, 2009 5:13 PM PST reply actions
I have never
said how much I love your name.
by Nuck Chorris on Jan 22, 2009 5:40 PM PST up reply actions
He's calling out his coaches not LBJ
I don’t see what the problem is. He essentially said, “LBJ is great, and could be even greater if he receives the proper training.” He just has no tact, which is nothing new for him. If he were a coach he’d get strangled faster than PJ Carlesimo at Latrell Sprewell’s hotdog stand.
I believe. I believe you have my stapler.
by exl on Jan 22, 2009 5:37 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
I ran Barry’s quotes through my “‘hasbeens’ to English” dictionary program. The program’s still got some bugs, but this is roughly what he said:
“I’m a grumpy old man who lives under the delusion that everything was better ‘back in the day’. Though there’s no evidence of it, though the population is larger, the influx of foreign talent, the money to attract top talent to the NBA away from other sports should mean that the league is more talented, I’m clinging to the rather naive belief that the game isn’t as good, the players aren’t as good and that they’d have trouble playing against the guys who played 40 years ago (with the lone exception of my sons, who play the game the right way, something they must have learned from me, despite the fact that I was an absentee dad who walked out on his wife and kids). Since I can’t argue that we had better athletes there without looking like a total moron, I’ll stick to the tired notion that players today lack "fundamentals” or don’t know “how to play the game”. Normally, it’s the players who “don’t know how to play”, but in this particular case, I can also take digs at the NBA establishment that hasn’t ever offered me a coaching job, probably because I’m really just too difficult to work with, by saying that not only do the players not know how to play, but the coaches don’t know how to coach. Deep in my heart, I may or may not believe it’s true, but when it comes down to the truth, it’s all a matter of trying to defend my quite clearly fragile ego. This also explains my hair plugs. I am deeply insecure."
by jae on Jan 22, 2009 5:42 PM PST reply actions 4 recs
yeah
an unnecessarily long paragraph that could’ve been broken up into two paragraphs.
wall of text ftl.
an unnecessarily long paragraph that could’ve been broken up into two paragraphs.
it doesnt have pretty pictures either. Seriously, what are you in like 5th grade? Thats not that long at all.
"It’s a hobby of mine. Kind of like collecting your fingernail clippings or pooping in jars." -olympic mike
Aw.
Here’s a pretty picture, just in case…
(jae: funniest non-bloodsweatndonuts post of 2009 ftw!)
Thing 1
by Sleepy Freud on Jan 23, 2009 9:02 AM PST up reply actions
an unnecessarily long paragraph that could’ve been broken up into two paragraphs. wall of text ftl.
and the green tint is a bit overkill
Now wheres the rubbers? Whose got the rubbers?
I noticed there's so many of them
and there's really not that many of us.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jan 23, 2009 9:48 AM PST up reply actions
hasbeen beats neverwas everytime
even grumpy old hasbeens have some wisdom, even if their timing sucks for our lads, more than I can say for most of what we read here …
fundamentals matter, regardless of when the game is played or against who … fwiw, if I had LJ, I’d tell most of my players NOT to set screens and to get the hell outa his way …
relative to his generation, RB was nearly as much a star as LJ – ABA and NBA, championship with an otherwise unspectacular roster, etc.
deep in his heart, RB probably does believe what he says – insecure or not
despite all that, I agree with your sentiment – just think we should give RB more respect than even he gives LJ
I sat in front of Rick Barry at a Warrior game once...
Must have been about 14 years old. I turned and told him half-jokingly “Hey, you should get your son, Brent to come down here and play for us, we could use him.”
He looked at me like some dumb ass creature that just vomited on his shoes and stone faced said, “Then he wouldn’t win a championship!”
I raised my eyebrows a bit and said, “Oh.” Then just turned back around in time to see two middle aged fans who looked like they’ve been following the team for quite awhile look over say, “HEY RICK! WE LOVE YOU, MAN! THANK YOU!”
He didn’t even acknowledge their existence, just heard him take a deep sigh and that was all.
by Travis Bickle on Jan 23, 2009 1:42 AM PST up reply actions
LOL
He obviously holds the ownership in high esteem. No wonder they took away his radio show.
by Nuck Chorris on Jan 23, 2009 9:04 AM PST up reply actions
Today's players aren't fundamentally sound
Barry’s comments and motivation aside, he is right on regarding the lack of fundamentals in todays game. I love watching what players can do physically, but the footwork is awful, shooting form and touch mediocre and it seems traveling and carrying the ball are no longer called. The problem rests in our developmental systems. The best players are influenced more by their AAU coaches than their high school coaches. These coaches don’t bother to teach the game and don’t really care about their players, only about gathering the best players available throwing them on the court and becoming instant legends in their own minds. From there the best players either jump to the NBA or spend maybe 1 or 2 years in college at the most. Unfortunately, most colleges scout only the elite AAU or Nike tournaments and rarely pay much attention to high school games.
For those who insist on disrespecting Rick Barry’s accomplishments, the 1975 Warrior championship team achieved the greatest upset in the history of the NBA finals thanks to Barry. The W’s featured a team with a mediocre 6’9" center (Clifford Ray) and a skinny 6’7" rookie power foward (Keith Wilkes) and a cast of no name players that beat a Washington Bullets team that had finished one of the best regular seasons ever. Of course no one could run and jump in those days, well I’ll match Phil Smith (with others) against most any shooting guard today.
Todays NBA player is a superior athlete, but not a better basketball player.
Todays NBA player is a superior athlete?
No , they just have better training regimens, more time in the gym and with the chemists. If you took the best players of every era and mixed them up and dealt them to other eras they would still be the stars.
Now wheres the rubbers? Whose got the rubbers?
I noticed there's so many of them
and there's really not that many of us.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jan 25, 2009 10:05 AM PST up reply actions
surely you jest
A) admittedly, lebron has made great strides in developing his game over his career thus far, but it doesn’t take red auerbach to notice lebron’s many deficiencies. he basically is playing street ball out there. he travels almost constantly, although he is rarely called on it, takes tons of shots out of his range, and loves to terminate his dribble before he knows what he’s going to do with it. of course, these issues are largely moot in light of his athleticism and size. he can leap over everyone while bowling over his defender (which he won’t get called for) and laser a pass to the weak side most of the time.
B) i find it offensive that anyone would take issue with criticizing lebron. i suppose this is a bi-product of living in a country full of uneducated, self-policing peons, but lebron is not the pope, he’s a basketball player. kudos to ricky for saying what most “analysts” don’t have the stones to…
shawn marion's jumper makes me want to crap a book on how to puke.
by The Bimbo Coles Experience on Jan 22, 2009 5:47 PM PST reply actions
I agree that everyone has a right to their opinion
but LeBron is not playing street ball – the guy has a very balanced games (look at his rebounds and assists) and he has an incredible handle and passing abhility for his size. He understands the game. There are A LOT of guys in the NBA that are extremely athletic but none have his skill set. The guy is amazing!
ok , streetball may be a bit of an overstatement
the guy obviously has a skillset far beyond most upper echelon athletes, but you have to admit, he has some really bad habits. that’s not to say that a lot of nba stars aren’t guilty of some of the same things, but it’s still frustrating to watch. i mean, the guy really seems sincere about wanting to win, so why does he not do extremely fundamental things, like get his damn elbow in when he shoots!!! argh!
shawn marion's jumper makes me want to crap a book on how to puke.
by The Bimbo Coles Experience on Jan 23, 2009 7:12 PM PST up reply actions
read between the lines
He’s basically saying:
“If I was LeBron’s coach, he’d be a much better, more complete player.”
It’s just him trying to get a coaching gig.
Barry already has one plus a Finals MVP
Yeah, I think Barry deserves the benefit of the doubt. He’s proved his skil unlike those here who dis him.
Now wheres the rubbers? Whose got the rubbers?
I noticed there's so many of them
and there's really not that many of us.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jan 22, 2009 8:20 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
He has proven his skill as a player. That is not the same thing as proving one’s skill as an analyst of the game.
or not to mention
skills that enable you to interact with the world without 95% of the people calling you an asshole. But I guess that’s irrelevant if we’re just talking basketball.. Too bad for him it’s not irrelevant enough or he might have landed a coaching job say, 20 years ago.
by Travis Bickle on Jan 23, 2009 9:49 AM PST up reply actions
But I guess that’s irrelevant if we’re just talking basketball..
Yeah pretty much so. Look at Nellie he’s not a people person but he’s still here. Barry is just another version of Nellie. I like Barry’s honesty better than Nellies lies so I’d be glad to see what he can do with Lebron or our team.
Now wheres the rubbers? Whose got the rubbers?
I noticed there's so many of them
and there's really not that many of us.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jan 23, 2009 9:56 AM PST up reply actions
seriously?
you’d really prefer Barry to Nellie as coach?
"It’s a hobby of mine. Kind of like collecting your fingernail clippings or pooping in jars." -olympic mike
you’d really prefer Barry to Nellie as coach?
WTF not? We couldn’t get any worse.
Now wheres the rubbers? Whose got the rubbers?
I noticed there's so many of them
and there's really not that many of us.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jan 24, 2009 6:56 PM PST up reply actions
That is not the same thing as proving one’s skill as an analyst of the game.
no it’s not but his Lebron comments do make a good cause for his analytical skills.
Now wheres the rubbers? Whose got the rubbers?
I noticed there's so many of them
and there's really not that many of us.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jan 23, 2009 9:53 AM PST up reply actions
LeBron’s game makes a good case AGAINST his analytical skills.
"It’s a hobby of mine. Kind of like collecting your fingernail clippings or pooping in jars." -olympic mike
LeBron’s game makes a good case AGAINST his analytical skills.
Just cause you don’t see them doesn’t mean the flaws are not there. Last night was a perfect example , Lebron dicked around for 47.99 minutes and almost let us steal a game that should have been no contest. Do you think he should be dribbling out on the perimeter or taking weak trips to the basket instead of just powering his way to the rim and leaving total devastation in his wake?
Now wheres the rubbers? Whose got the rubbers?
I noticed there's so many of them
and there's really not that many of us.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jan 24, 2009 7:04 PM PST up reply actions
also
show me an NBA player EVER who had NO flaws in his game. I’ll show you a liar or an idiot showing me a flawless player.
"It’s a hobby of mine. Kind of like collecting your fingernail clippings or pooping in jars." -olympic mike
show me an NBA player EVER who had NO flaws in his game. I’ll show you a liar or an idiot showing me a flawless player.
and this applies to Barry how?
Now wheres the rubbers? Whose got the rubbers?
I noticed there's so many of them
and there's really not that many of us.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jan 25, 2009 10:07 AM PST up reply actions
it applies to your last statement about LeBron being flawed. Sure he has some minor flaws in his game, but no player is flawless and LeBron is already one of the all-time greats. He’s also only 24 years old so improvement is certainly not out of the question. LeBron is pretty much the last player Barry should be calling out, and it shows that he’s a simply a bitter and jealous old man who will do anything to not be forgotten.
"It’s a hobby of mine. Kind of like collecting your fingernail clippings or pooping in jars." -olympic mike
Sure he has some minor flaws in his game, but no player is flawless and LeBron is already one of the all-time greats.
Duh, isn’t that exactly what Barry said?
Now wheres the rubbers? Whose got the rubbers?
I noticed there's so many of them
and there's really not that many of us.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jan 25, 2009 3:12 PM PST up reply actions
“He’s got major flaws in his game…”
“Major flaw” was the quote, (as well as insinuating a major flaw in his shot). Not minor flaw.
"Major flaw" Not minor flaw.
They’re only major cause he’s bigger than life.
Now wheres the rubbers? Whose got the rubbers?
I noticed there's so many of them
and there's really not that many of us.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jan 25, 2009 8:42 PM PST up reply actions
Barry being Barry
If you watched the entire interview when the reporter brought up LeBron, Barry said LeBron was special player and can do amazing things, but that the kid has never been taught what Barry thinks are some of the fundamentals of basketball. Yeah, LeBron has been coached by a lot of good coaches in AAU and such, but Barry knows hoops and knows the little things that seperate pure athletes from great basketball players. He said it himself. Barry wasn’t discrediting LeBrons game. I think people’s reaction might be a little taken back because everyone praises LeBron and never doubts any particular facet of his game. Its classic Rick Barry being Rick Barry. We all know LeBron is a freak of nature, I think Rick knows it too.
He wants to be LeBron's coach
That’s all it is….
by lightz0ut on Jan 22, 2009 10:21 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I can't believe I read all the way down here before I found somebody with a brain
You get a rec. Barry is a tired old fart who wants a coaching gig, he wanted to teach Shaq how to shoot FTs underhanded, now he wants to teach LeBron… I do notice that it’s always the best player in the NBA he calls out.
"No no Nene!"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zB5DxNl4EB0
by Dubs fan in Boston on Jan 23, 2009 7:25 AM PST up reply actions
why
didn’t you come up with it first then, brain?
by Travis Bickle on Jan 23, 2009 9:08 AM PST up reply actions
naaaaah
he just got one flaw. crab dribble.
I'm going to get banned for all these mindless comments.
its rick's opinion
and as an NBA legend he is entitled to one. It wouldve been different if it was David Wood or Felton Spencer doing all the talking
warriors dont fish they hunt!
by VonteegoCummings on Jan 22, 2009 10:10 PM PST reply actions
Are you suggesting that because he was a better player that somehow he’s a better analyst?
Players not as good as Barry: Dean Smith rode pine in college. If he was in a game it meant the game had been decided long ago. Jeff Van Gundy was cut from his college team. Roy Williams maxed out at college JR varsity. None were as accomplished as Barry, but I’d trust their opinions over his any day.
Players better than Barry: Bill Russell is quite clearly one of the best to ever play the game. As a GM, he was a total failure. Michael Jordan’s track record for understanding the talent of others has been less than stellar. Both have shown that when it comes to someone else’s game, they’re lacking.
Rick Barry was a very, very good athlete and basketball player who undoubtedly worked very hard. He was also a very mediocre CBA coach. As a media personality, he was sometimes insightful, sometimes insensitive or bigoted, and sometimes simplistic. He clearly had a lot of inside experience from his playing days and isn’t a fool or a moron, but didn’t do much to convince me that his understanding was as other-worldly as his playing ability. He certainly has some issues getting along with people and knowing when to shut up.
Where does Barry fit in among others in his ability to accurately critique other players? I dunno, but what he did as a player doesn’t make me think that he has some special gift or entitlement that lesser players don’t. Maybe David Wood knows more than Barry. Wood didn’t have as much talent to work with. Perhaps he had to think more carefully about the game than someone like Barry.
exactly
I’m as big a Jordan fan as there is but I dont want him anywhere near a Warriors front office position. Similarly I dont want Barry even considered for a Warrior bench gig.
"It’s a hobby of mine. Kind of like collecting your fingernail clippings or pooping in jars." -olympic mike
Rick Barry
shoulda been a Laker.
"It’s a hobby of mine. Kind of like collecting your fingernail clippings or pooping in jars." -olympic mike
Wow
Let us put aside the simple fact that Rick Barry is a somewhat delusional, self-righteous personality and look at the numbers. Last time I checked they don’t lie-
NBA Rookie of the Year Award after averaging 25.7 points and 10.6 rebounds per game in the 1965-66 season. Wow, now that is a rookie campaign if there ever was one!
Career totals-
Points 25,729
Rebounds 6,863
Assists 4,952
Not too shabby, huh?
* 1975 Finals MVP
* 1967 All-Star Game MVP
* 1966 Rookie of the Year
* 1x NBA Champion (1975)
* 6x All-NBA First Team (1966, 1967, 1974, 1975, 1976)
* 8x All-Star (1966, 1967, 1973-78)
* 3x ABA First Team (1970, 1971, 1972)
* 1973 All-NBA Second Team
* NBA’s 50th Anniversary All-Time Team (1996)
Are those not the numbers of an ALL TIME GREAT, a Warrior through and through?
Also, what about the four game sweep of the Bullets in the ’75 finals, the series that highlighted a huge upset in professional basketball history. The Bullets had posted a league-high 60 victories that year. Pretty Ricky was We Believe before Baron could walk.
If loud mouth Barkley (who, I coincidentally love) is allowed to bash everyone why isn’t a proven gamer, winner and basketball legend allowed to do the same about a young player still struggling in certain aspects of his fundamental game?
by SinceRunTMC760 on Jan 23, 2009 11:39 AM PST reply actions
why isn’t a proven gamer, winner and basketball legend allowed to do the same about a young player still struggling in certain aspects of his fundamental game?
cause most these kids think god created the world in 1990 and can’t relate to anything before their time.
Now wheres the rubbers? Whose got the rubbers?
I noticed there's so many of them
and there's really not that many of us.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jan 23, 2009 11:48 AM PST up reply actions
And on the 2nd day
God created Reebok pumps…..
by SinceRunTMC760 on Jan 23, 2009 11:54 AM PST up reply actions
I don’t think that anyone is arguing that he’s not an all-time great. He was. How exactly this translates to his critique of Lebron is the issue.
He’s got every right to offer his opinion. He may even be right. But the tired cry that players today don’t know ‘the fundamentals’ sounds damn close to “get off my lawn”.
sounds damn close to "get off my lawn".
If you have a lawn you’d understand it?
Now wheres the rubbers? Whose got the rubbers?
I noticed there's so many of them
and there's really not that many of us.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jan 23, 2009 3:42 PM PST up reply actions
Maybe
LeBron doesn’t even belong on the lawn yet.
by SinceRunTMC760 on Jan 23, 2009 12:22 PM PST reply actions
nellie's a loser
and couldn’t win a championship with barry AND lebron IN THEIR PRIME.
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