Nothing for something: another wasted trade by the Warriors
Well, it finally happened. You knew after all the whining and complaining Stephen Jackson did that he'd eventually get traded, and sure enough, he's now a Charlotte Bobcat. The Warriors have now made two major deals with the Bobcats in about 18 months -- first they traded Jason Richardson, a 20-point scorer, for Brandon Wright, who has become irrelevant with the Warriors thanks to the draft selection of Anthony Randolph. And now, in replace for Jackson, another 20-point scorer, Golden State gets Raja Bell and Vladimir Radmanovic.
Let's examine for a second just how dysfunctional the Warriors are. They are the only team in the NBA that actually regresses when they try to win. They're the only team in the NBA that falls into rebuilding mode.... by accident. Since June 2007, the Warriors have lost Baron Davis, Jason Richardson, Al Harrington, Stephen Jackson, Jamaal Crawford, Mickael Pietrus, Matt Barnes and Marco Belinelli. And in return they've received.... what exactly? Raja Bell, Devean George, Speedy Claxton? D-rate role players?
Think of what they could have done with those players, the games they potentially could have won. Think of who they could have at least traded them for. With all that talent they could have at least gone out and gotten Chris Bosh or Amar'e Stoudemire or ANYONE. Instead, they've practically given them away.
And this is why the Warriors are a horrible franchise -- it's the mentality that the people running the team have. This is a club that hasn't been to the finals in thirty years and has made the playoffs only once in 15 years. This is a team with an incredible fanbase that is just dying for a winner RIGHT NOW. And what does management do? They play for the future, they rebuild. For some reason, this team -- which hasn't had a future in years and years and years -- is convinced that the future will bail them out. Chris Cohan and Larry Riley are always telling us that eventually they'll do something right.
You know why the Boston Celtics are the best team in the NBA? It's because they dumped that mentality in June 2007 -- right around the time the Warriors started to collapse. The Celtics actually took the initative and did something daring. They traded more than half of their team and all of their current draft picks to the Sonics and Timberwolves for Ray Allen and Kevin Garnett. And what did they get out of it? Rings baby.
Let's look at this Warriors roster for a second. This is a team so loaded with talent at the guard position that on Saturday's game against the Bucks, Don Nelson actually played Corey Maggette at center down the stretch. If Danny Ainge were running this team, I guarantee you the first thing he'd do is he'd trade half of those guards and most of the centers and he'd get a real bigman, someone like Bosh or Stoudemire or even an Al Jefferson. Would Larry Riley do it? Nah. Wright and Biedrins and Randoplh are going to be great. Don't you worry.
The saddest part about this Jackson trade is that they could have used him to good effect and they didn't. They could have bundled Azubuike and Jackson and Biedrins and Curry and Watson and Law and Wright and George and ANYONE and they could have gotten Chris Bosh or Stoudemire in a heartbeat, but they didn't do it. They settled on Vlad Radmanovic, a player whose season once came to an end because of an in-season snowboarding accident. This Warriors team has nothing to go on. Step 1 in winning a championship is having a superstar that you can build around -- Baron was that player and they let him go. Ellis and Curry and Morrow are nice players, but they're role players, not leaders. The saddest part is that there are leaders like that available for trade at this very second, but the Warriors would never make it. They'd never throw all their chips on the table. After all, why would they? The future, as we all know, will be better.
Until they drop that mentality, and until they actually try to do something in the present, there is no future for the Golden State Warriors.
This FanPost is a submission from a member of the mighty Golden State of Mind community. While we're all here to throw up that W, these words do not necessarily reflect the views of the GSoM Crew. Still, chances are the preceding post is Unstoppable Baby!
1 recs |
36 comments
Comments
-1
This didn’t make any sense to me:
“They could have bundled Azubuike and Jackson and Biedrins and Curry and Watson and Law and Wright and George and ANYONE and they could have gotten Chris Bosh or Stoudemire in a heartbeat”
Where are you getting this? What are you even talking about?
Sittin in my scraper watchin Oakland goin wild, ta-dow!
by Supafishal on Nov 16, 2009 10:55 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
I love the 7 for 1 trade proposals
Especially ones with zero plausibility.
by dprodigy19 on Nov 16, 2009 11:41 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
No way
There is no way the suns would trade Amar’e for Jackson and one other person, and neither would the Raptors with Bosh. Jackson is a punk with an attitude, only desperate teams like the bobcats or contenders like the Cavs (who think their locker room would keep Jackson tame) would even consider signing him.
by Jmicro on Nov 16, 2009 12:40 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Keep that close at hand Sam, I have a fealing you will be using it a lot in the up comming days/posts.
This house is full of m, m, madness!
This house is full of m, m, mistakes!
by qin on Nov 16, 2009 1:27 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I thought the trade wasn’t too bad We got rid of a horrible contract and got a useful center who fits in our system and one of the best defenders in the league.
by zeisenbe on Nov 16, 2009 11:01 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
When has Radmanovic been useful?
He’s a 6’10 small forward who does nothing!
by Rocky63215 on Nov 16, 2009 12:05 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Incorrect. He shoots. He might not do anything else, but that’s at least one useful thing he does. Radmanovic is not a C, though (he’s not even a PF, he’s really a 3 the way he rebounds), and doesn’t play much D…
by Missing Barry on Nov 16, 2009 12:14 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
We had Jax playing the 4 for the most part recently...
So how exactly is having Radmanovic play the 4 any different compared to recent Jax?
by samuraaaaiiiiiii on Nov 16, 2009 2:07 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
He certainly shoots
.333 FG% this season.
"I never watched baseball on TV. It's slow and boring. I'm not a fan. Never was." - Jeff Kent
by Yoyo on Nov 17, 2009 12:12 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Why bother looking at his career .384 3PT% on over 2100 career 3PTA’s when we can look at 42 shots from this season…
by Missing Barry on Nov 17, 2009 10:51 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
You know why the Boston Celtics are the best team in the NBA? It’s because they dumped that mentality in June 2007 — right around the time the Warriors started to collapse. The Celtics actually took the initative and did something daring. They traded more than half of their team and all of their current draft picks to the Sonics and Timberwolves for Ray Allen and Kevin Garnett.
…narrowly outbidding us for Garnett, so, uh…
They could have bundled Azubuike and Jackson and Biedrins and Curry and Watson and Law and Wright and George and ANYONE and they could have gotten Chris Bosh or Stoudemire in a heartbeat, but they didn’t do it.
Unless you’re talking about retired pro wrestler “Photogenic” Chris Bosh and current Grizzlies assistant Damon Stoud*a*mire, I don’t think I’m buying this one.
by onlxn on Nov 16, 2009 11:12 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
I’d trade George for Damon Stoudamire… He’d be a decent teacher for Curry, though he was never really a 3-pt threat.
by samuraaaaiiiiiii on Nov 16, 2009 2:10 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
This post
is far too positive for me.
Let’s spin it another way.
Biedrins is no top notch big man sure, but he is still a child. He is also one of the better blockers and rebounders in the league. Maybe not an explosive offensive force, but certainly a nice building block moving forward.
I don’t see the Warriors in this gloom and doom situation.
If a player is here that doesn’t want to play here, it’s not that simple to trade him for equal or in the case of this post, better talent. GM’s around the league know that the Warriors are in a weakened position because Jackson wants out, and the Warriors want him out as well.
Are Radmonovic and Bell are perfect solution ? No.
Bell is a solid player and will give the Warriors some veteran presence. Radmonovic , who knows, maybe he can shoot the lights out under Nellie.
The bottom line here is that the Warriors are hardly in a position of strength when making trades, because most of the players they have tried to trade have had tags on them.
I think the Warriors need to conitnue building a young core of players and then, when the situation calls for it, land that key inside post guy they have long sought for.
They don’t grow on trees.
Not to mention that other NBA teams aren’t going to cough up a Bosh, Stoudamire or Jefferson for problematic players.
[img]http://cache.daylife.com/imageserve/0eTH2sm73rf3u/610x.jpg[/img]
by Peterman700 on Nov 16, 2009 11:16 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
-1
You’re right that the Warriors are dysfunctional, you’re right that they have some talent at the guard position, but that’s about it.
I’m assuming that by bringing up the JRich trade, you are using that and the Jax trade as examples of how inept the front office is. There are two totally different set of circumstances behind both trades. In hindsight, yes the JRich trade was a bad move, but the Jax trade was nothing but positive at this point. It was due to the FO’s ineptness that prompted the trade, but we’re not talking about how we got in the situation, but how we’re dealing with it.
What’s a shame is how this team got to this point, but to call this a wasted trade is inaccurate. If anything, this is one of the first positive things that this team has done in a while.
by barrance on Nov 16, 2009 11:20 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Lots of false statements in this fanpost.
First, let’s start off with some truth.
how dysfunctional the Warriors are
Yes, Chris Cohan still owns the team. Yes, we are a dysfunctional organization.
Now, on to the untruths.
first they traded Jason Richardson, a 20-point scorer, for Brandon Wright, who has become irrelevant with the Warriors thanks to the draft selection of Anthony Randolph
Brandon Wright is irrelevant because he is hurt. There is no way to know who’s going to get hurt and who isn’t, that couldn’t be helped. A healthy Wright, right now, would be getting a ton of PT. We need big man depth, and he is a young, productive big man with tons of upside. That is a good thing. Also, JRich has scored 20+ ppg once in the last 4 years (counting this year), because he was on the Bobcast and they had no other offensive options. He’s not an impact player on offense, and his skill (mostly shooting) we have in excess.
Since June 2007, the Warriors have lost Baron Davis, Jason Richardson, Al Harrington, Stephen Jackson, Jamaal Crawford, Mickael Pietrus, Matt Barnes and Marco Belinelli. And in return they’ve received…. what exactly?
A lot of flexibility for the future? Not being weighed down by terrible long term contracts to old players that aren’t the future? Have you ever wondered how a team like the Suns doesn’t end up with Joe Johnson? It’s because they have so much of their money tied up already when it’s his turn to get paid. That could have been us with Randolph, or Morrow, or Curry, or Wright…sometimes it takes some planning to make sure the future doesn’t suck.
Think of what they could have done with those players, the games they potentially could have won. Think of who they could have at least traded them for. With all that talent they could have at least gone out and gotten Chris Bosh or Amar’e Stoudemire or ANYONE. Instead, they’ve practically given them away.
False. Nobody in the league would want to trade for Baron Davis right now, unless it was for an equally bad or worse player/contract combination. Signing guys to long term, over priced contracts makes them unattractive as trading chips. Trading in the NBA is about a lot more than current talent – teams do actually plan for the future in trades, and do take guaranteed contract status into consideration.
They play for the future, they rebuild
Yes, planning for the future is good. It’s how you avoid getting into terrible situations down the road for small gains now.
You know why the Boston Celtics are the best team in the NBA? It’s because they dumped that mentality in June 2007 — right around the time the Warriors started to collapse. The Celtics actually took the initative and did something daring. They traded more than half of their team and all of their current draft picks to the Sonics and Timberwolves for Ray Allen and Kevin Garnett. And what did they get out of it? Rings baby.
Well, they only won once as of now. We also were making every effort to get KG, so I’m not sure what’s so different about the Warriors and Celtics in that regard, other than we didn’t have the pieces the Wolves wanted as much as they did? Not to mention the fact that McHale did his best to gift wrap it for the Celtics? Also, as far as I can tell, they’ve once won one ring, unless the plural comes from having more than 1 player on the team, I guess…?
This is a team so loaded with talent at the guard position that on Saturday’s game against the Bucks, Don Nelson actually played Corey Maggette at center down the stretch. If Danny Ainge were running this team, I guarantee you the first thing he’d do is he’d trade half of those guards and most of the centers and he’d get a real bigman, someone like Bosh or Stoudemire or even an Al Jefferson. Would Larry Riley do it? Nah. Wright and Biedrins and Randoplh are going to be great. Don’t you worry.
First, why do you think Maggette was playing C? Could it be because 3 of our 4 big men were hurt? How were we supposed to forsee not just a rash of injuries at the same time, but all to the same position? It could have just as easily happened to our wings, and all of a sudden we wouldn’t look so loaded at wing. So what? Second, Biedrins is better than Al Jefferson. Al Jefferson is just not that good. Bosh and Amare are good, sure, but what happens when they walk next year and we’re left with exactly what you’ve been complaining about – nothing?
Step 1 in winning a championship is having a superstar that you can build around — Baron was that player and they let him go
Have you seen Baron’s work down in LA? That’s not exactly superstar play. In fact, it’s closer to the other end of the spectrum.
The saddest part is that there are leaders like that available for trade at this very second, but the Warriors would never make it
Like who? Guys who are free agents next year? Cool, that leaves us with nothing after this season. Plus, give me good players, I’ll take talent over “leadership” any day.
Until they drop that mentality, and until they actually try to do something in the present, there is no future for the Golden State Warriors.
Really? We have Biedrins, Ellis, Randolph, Curry, Morrow, Azubuike…all of them are 24 or younger (except 26 year old Buike), we can keep them around for a while, that looks like a future to me. A lot more of a future than one that involves giving up all our talent for a one year rental and being left with nothing after the year. Long term planning is good. For once, we actually have some semblance of a long term plan in place.
by Missing Barry on Nov 16, 2009 11:20 AM PST reply actions 6 recs
ok
I totally agree with everything except that Beans is better than Jefferson. Jefferson has a brighter future an is a way better offensive and defensive player than beans may ever be
by the bay area on Nov 16, 2009 10:08 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Nope. Jefferson is one of the most overrated offensive players in the NBA. Yes, he scores points at a decent rate, I understand that. He also scores at an average to below average efficiency. Basically, for every time Jefferson shoots the ball, if one of his teammates (assuming his teammates are average, which isn’t true since he’s on the Wolves, but oh well, the general concept still works) shot instead of him, the Wolves would do better offensively. And it’s not like he’s positively affecting his teammates – have you seen him play? He’s a bigger black hole than Corey Maggette. Except when Corey Maggette shoots, he helps his team. When Al Jefferson shoots…eh, it’s pretty neutral. Biedrins scoring ability helps a team win more than Jefferson’s, even though Biedrins doesn’t score at a high rate.
Probably the biggest thing a big man can do is rebound. It’s very important. Al Jefferson is a good rebounder, I’ll give him credit for that. Biedrins is much better at this than Jefferson. This makes a huge difference.
Finally, defense. Well, neither are great defensively, if you want to say Jefferson’s a better post defender cause he’s stronger, that’s fine, Biedrins blocks more shots and gets more steals. I think it’s fair to call it a wash and recognize neither are that good at that end.
So overall we’re left with Biedrins – more productive offensive player, more productive rebounder (this is the most important point), and similar defensively. Biedrins > Jefferson. I don’t even think Jefferson has a bright future. His scoring efficiency hasn’t shown any positive trend over time, he’s still a huge black hole and just doesn’t have much offensive basketball IQ, even if he does have some good post moves/skills. He’s not much of a defensive player…I could easily see him being a watered down version of Zach Randolph in the future.
by Missing Barry on Nov 17, 2009 10:59 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
We got two guys that actually play defense?
Oooohh NOOO!!!
by Sricko on Nov 16, 2009 11:22 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Huh?
This is a team so loaded with talent at the guard position that on Saturday’s game against the Bucks, Don Nelson actually played Corey Maggette at center down the stretch.
Here you are confusing “having a lot of players who play one position” with “having a lot of talent at that position.”
In the NBA, except in rare circumstances, you can’t trade multiple average players for one significantly above-average player, especially if you are trading small players to get big ones.
It just doesn’t work that way.
When trades like that do happen, it’s because a star player has demanded to be moved: eg, Kevin Garnett, Baron Davis. Unless you have an unhappy star, you simply can’t pull off that sort of trade.
And even then, you have to give up something of value. Now Al Jefferson isn’t KG, but he’s an athletic young big man with legitimate all-star potential, and that was the key to the KG trade. Boston – wisely, as it turned out – sacrificed their future to win a ring. And the Ray Allen trades was part of that strategy, too.
by Ronaldinho on Nov 16, 2009 11:24 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Yaaaa
If you haven’t heard, Jackson did want to be traded…
by the bay area on Nov 16, 2009 10:03 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Wait a minute, you're saying that Jackson is the "star player?"
Jackson is not a star. Never has been. Never will be.
by Ronaldinho on Nov 17, 2009 10:56 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
adsf
Man it’s not like it matters who we get, we suck and always will as long as you know who still owns the team and his little butt buddy runs the FO.
by JRich4MVP on Nov 16, 2009 11:24 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
The thing is about trading for bosh
The warriors would have to give up Randolph and probally Ellis to make it work and feasible to Toronto. Now thats a huge risk because this is Bosh’s last year on his contract and who really wants to stay with the warriors?
The team if that trade was made Randolf, Ellis for Bosh
Curry
Ammo
Bell
Bosh
Beidrins
That may be good enough for a 7 or 8 spot, if things go right.
by Oracle Junkie on Nov 16, 2009 11:25 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Giving up Randolph for a rental would be
moronic!
by Rocky63215 on Nov 16, 2009 12:06 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Warriors SUCK i'm tired of being a Ws fan i'm becoming a Kings fan!
Natural Go Getta!
by slamson on Nov 16, 2009 11:54 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Not that you were ever a Warriors fan, considering you’re a troll from StR.
by WYK on Nov 16, 2009 3:28 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
It was a move that needed to be made
We get an upgrade in size and depth at the forward position. We didn’t have to give up a pick to unload Jack’s contract. I really don’t see why the trade is bad. Short term we are possibly losing a few more games, but I could really see this young team develop considering the young talent.
by dong4ce on Nov 16, 2009 2:24 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
yeah and thats really fine with me
At this point i want to see maggette go too, and lets get 20 mil this summer. The more games we lose, the better pick we get. What is the point of making the playoffs anyway if we aren’t going to even contend for a title, conference nor let alone finals.
Look, i want to see us succeed as much as the next Dub fan, but over paying third option players is not the way to do it. Lets pay these draft picks they’re tiny contracts, and use that money for a difference maker. We always complain about playing for the future, but for once, lets really let this organization do it. I am giving them two years to do this. Thats is enough time to let the majority of our contracts expire, and to restructure this roster the way we need to. If maggs is moved there are only legitimate youth like ellis and biedrins signed long term. Larry Riley has to more seasons to fix this team in my opinion. So far i agree with almost every move LR has made. He seems committed to undoing Rowell’s and Mullin’s mistakes, and has done alot to fix our cap situation. I have no problem waiting another season or even two to get the team we deserve.
As always, Lebron to the bay 2010!
by Bleezy88 on Nov 16, 2009 2:51 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Dude
ur an idiot. The only thing the warriors could get were raja and rodmonavich, one because of Jackson’s salary, and 2 because of his attitude. I would have traded him in the exact same way. They get a decent raja bell, and two big expiring contracts so they can get a good free agent in the stacked 2010 free agency
by the bay area on Nov 16, 2009 10:00 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Well at least we have a good flopper again
after Baron left, we were pretty light on floppers
by centerre on Nov 17, 2009 12:43 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
at least W's get something
to put on Ginobili
31 Y 6.5 ft 250 lbs 0 IQ
Fire Nellie! Fire Cohan! Fire Gregory! Fire David Stern! No need for explanations, just fire em all!
by Missing Barry
by Lat We N Trash on Nov 17, 2009 1:08 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

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