What's our gameplan?

by dubzfan on Dec 4, 2009 12:19 AM PST

Watching the game against Houston made me go crazy when our "gameplan" collapsed and we fell apart . At least when Keith Smart was the coach we had a game plan and didn't just say screw it lets play iso. In fact I don't remember very many Corey Maggette isos the last 5 games. This games coaching was a travesty.

On the first note why does Mikki Moore still start? The coaches can't possible think he's better than Chris Hunter. Or no matter what your opinion of Anthony Randolph is he gives us more of everything than Moore, including a future. What's the point in starting him? Also yes Vlad has played great lately but we can't count on that every night. A front court of Hunter/Ronny/Andris and AR is much better than Moore and Vlad.

Now to the game. I'm tired of Maggette, I say dump him for contracts or package him the our 1st rounder. In a half court offense where everything is ran through a point guard where things will be designed for him he may be fine and that's why in LA he wasn't this bad. But an offense that thrives off ball movement he just has no place in. Now to Monta Ellis, the guy is pure all star caliber material and no matter what Vlad or Morrow did he needs help. Not just in production but in the minds of the other team. Teams think of us and put there whole gameplan on defense around stopping him while leaving one guy to try to get Morrow. Who scares anyone on our team other than these two? Also the turnovers are coming from him not be a great ball handler in a Nellie offense as the main ball handler. Remember last year with Jack? It's not as bad but could be. So why not let the better ball handler and passer Stephen Curry be the point guard he is? Having CJ in more than him creates issues where Monta has to always have the ball in his hands and when it's in CJ's hands Monta does not get involved enough. Also why would Monta play so much when he is sick? Why not spare him 10 minutes and go with Steph and CJ?

Even when talking about AR I don't see Nellie giving a good effort in developing him, he seems very uninterested. The guy can play, lots of young guys are out of control.It's just a phase in his career he will get past, so why not let him get 20 + minutes a night and gain experience? But even though he is young and still very raw he rebounds, scores, blocks shots and brings a lot of energy which we sometimes lack. This also goes back to Moore where is this supposed to be a message by starting him and benching Anthony? I just don't get Nellie's plan anymore. Or what even goes on in his mind during the game. But I know what he is thinking about at halftime when he should be making adjustments...

This FanPost is a submission from a member of the mighty Golden State of Mind community. While we're all here to throw up that W, these words do not necessarily reflect the views of the GSoM Crew. Still, chances are the preceding post is Unstoppable Baby!

Tweet Comment 29 comments | 0 recs |

Do you like this story?

Comments

- I don’t see why everyone thinks Keith Smart > Nellie, they seem the same to me.

- Maggette is going to be harder to move than Jackson, and Jackson was pretty hard to move. I’ve stated from the beginning that Maggette’s ability to slow a game down and get to the foul line doesn’t help as often as most people think, and this year he can’t even seem to get any calls.

- Monta will never be an all-star if this team doesn’t win.

- Curry should handle the ball more. While he is in there, it is clear that Nellie doesn’t think iso as much as he does without him in there.

by samuraaaaiiiiiii on Dec 4, 2009 12:31 AM PST reply actions

2 of your points

- Maggs will be tough and that’s why packaging him with the lottery pick may not be so bad or just a salary dump.

- Monta would be if we won, your right. And that’s where getting help and better players will help us win thus resulting in a possible all star on our team. I think he can be the guy if we had better surrounding guys. How many guys does Kobe have? Or Lebron? Wade? More than us that’s for sure.

Rookie: "Why did you bench me?"
Nellie: "You're a rookie"

by dubzfan on Dec 4, 2009 12:36 AM PST up reply actions

I’m thinking we might have to package the lottery pick with him just to allow the salary dump :(. I still get the suspicion that the entire staff is either blind, or Maggette does stuff for the chemistry of the team that they like, because I just can’t see them actually trading him.

The second issue, about getting better players, can be achieved two ways. We either wait for our young guys to just get better, which will be painful for now, or we trade our potential talent for actual talent, which will be painful if say AR becomes an all-star after being traded. MT-2 made it sound like there was barely anyone at the game today, and the Rockets are a decent team, which probably means Cohan is hurting money wise from the lack of attendance. I can’t see any way that the team makes a trade for anything less than an all-star while packaging the youth, because the youth is what is still selling tickets. That probably means that Monta will just have to wait for everyone to get healthier / better.

by samuraaaaiiiiiii on Dec 4, 2009 1:06 AM PST up reply actions

"And that’s where getting help and better players will help us win thus resulting in a possible all star on our team."

That’s backwards logic… All-Stars are all-stars because they help their team win games.

If other players come in (or our players get better) and our team starts winning, then is Monta really the All-Star just because he dominates the ball and takes most of the shots?

I’m still skeptical of Monta’s game. He’s been scoring alot of points, but we already knew he could do that. He’s strung together a couple of good defensive efforts, but anybody with his athleticism should be able to D up once in awhile. Consistency will prove whether he really is a good defender or not. He’s still a bad passer and a bad ball handler. And that’s not a good thing for somebody who’s only 6’3".

"We Deserve"

by YaHeard on Dec 4, 2009 1:26 AM PST up reply actions

Michael Redd was an all star

It’s not like he took his team anywhere, neither did Tmac. My point is you can be an all star and don’t have to take your team anywhere. Also the whole winning argument is more of the voters mindset cause he has played like an all star but some people think you have to be on a great team to be a all star. The same thing happened to Kevin Durant last year. Bad team, great player.

Rookie: "Why did you bench me?"
Nellie: "You're a rookie"

by dubzfan on Dec 4, 2009 11:05 AM PST up reply actions

lol

Tmac had a billion people.

by bojangles408 on Dec 4, 2009 11:22 AM PST up reply actions

And still couldn't do anything

Rookie: "Why did you bench me?"
Nellie: "You're a rookie"

by dubzfan on Dec 4, 2009 11:43 AM PST up reply actions

+1

Just because he could dunk.

Marco Belinelli's Biggest Fan

by montadaboss on Dec 4, 2009 3:03 PM PST up reply actions

It does seem like backwards logic but

Thats the way it works in the NBA! Kobe isn’t MVP until he has Gasol, Bynum, Oden, Fisher, and Ariza to play with. Did he get better? Was his impact on the team greater then before when they were a 500 team? No and No. B Roy got an allstar nod over Baron a couple years ago when the Blazers played surprisingly well even with Oden injured.
Its backward logic, I agree with that. It makes no sense. But thats how the NBA does things.

by freerandolph on Dec 4, 2009 4:42 PM PST up reply actions

I don’t see why everyone thinks Keith Smart > Nellie, they seem the same to me.

With Smart, he at least prefers a traditional lineup with a real Center and PF in there. Smart is willing to go small ball, but also knows when it’s really not working and will revert back to the traditional lineup when the small ball’s not working. Whereas Nellie, he seems to think he must stick with it even when it’s obvious that we’re losing with it. His ideal seems to be to live and die by the small ball. And tonight, we died by it.

WARRIORS BASKETBALL!!! Patiently waiting for a title...I may be waiting for a long time...

by JustSomeName on Dec 4, 2009 12:42 AM PST up reply actions

I haven’t seen any of what you described though. Smart played some small ball while he was coaching. There are games where Nellie doesn’t do super small like he did tonight. Who’s to say that Smart wouldn’t have gone super small if Nellie wasn’t there tonight? I’d like to think that he would have played a traditional line-up (though we lack the players to really do so right now anyway), but I see no evidence that he wouldn’t do the same things that Nellie does.

by samuraaaaiiiiiii on Dec 4, 2009 1:09 AM PST up reply actions

I’ve stated from the beginning that Maggette’s ability to slow a game down and get to the foul line doesn’t help as often as most people think, and this year he can’t even seem to get any calls.

Man, tough crowd. Maggette’s only averaging 23 points per 36 minutes with very good efficiency (.577 TS%, which is just a little similar to his career….577 TS%). Maggette has his faults, and probably shouldn’t play the 4 any more than he has to because of injuries, and he may not be good for ball movement, but he does score a lot, and he does score very efficiently. I don’t know why you don’t want to give him credit for that. I don’t care if he doesn’t seem to be getting the calls, he’s still just as effective, so it’s not particularly important.

by Missing Barry on Dec 4, 2009 7:14 AM PST up reply actions

Maggette has his faults, and probably shouldn’t play the 4 any more than he has to because of injuries, and he may not be good for ball movement, but he does score a lot, and he does score very efficiently.

Then move him to a different team, where he won’t have to play the 4 and they play in more half-court situations where his scoring efficiency will be more rewarding. Our team is all about quick shots and spacing the floor, neither of which are Maggette’s strong suits. His defense would also probably look better on more respected teams because all those flops would start being called as charges.

by samuraaaaiiiiiii on Dec 4, 2009 12:49 PM PST up reply actions

Or if our big guys were healthy he’d be playing the 3 and his defense would look better (though still not good) because he’s matched up against guys he should be matched up against…

by Missing Barry on Dec 4, 2009 1:03 PM PST up reply actions

But Maggette was playing the 4 last year too, even when our bigs were healthy, because they don’t play the way that Nellie wants them to play. In this system, Nellie is always going to try and play Maggette at 4 because he thinks that is more of a mismatch than Maggette at 3.

by samuraaaaiiiiiii on Dec 4, 2009 2:39 PM PST up reply actions

I’m still optimistic if we had all 4 of our big guys healthy Maggette would get most of his time at the 3….

by Missing Barry on Dec 4, 2009 5:13 PM PST up reply actions

I want to be optimistic, but it’s hard :(.

by samuraaaaiiiiiii on Dec 4, 2009 5:22 PM PST up reply actions

well they're play relatively well recently.

I feel more optimistic then I have all season, but I know what you mean :~/

by freerandolph on Dec 5, 2009 10:41 PM PST up reply actions

why not let him get 20 + minutes a night and gain experience?

AR gets 21.4 minutes a night.

An empty barrel makes the most noise.

by antihero on Dec 4, 2009 12:51 AM PST reply actions

but his minutes are very sparadic, and his minutes per are even that high if there weren't injuries. Nellie would rather start Moore..

by freerandolph on Dec 4, 2009 4:44 PM PST up reply actions

For what its worth about smart

If you watch the sidelines, especially last night, i think at the very least the players respond to Coach Smart more, and appear to be more in tuned. He seems to be more motivational than Nellie too.

by ef_werd on Dec 4, 2009 7:06 AM PST reply actions

Don’t get me wrong, I want Nellie gone asap b/c of how stubborn he was in the 4th about leaving Maggette on Landry and CJ on Brooks when they were getting blown up -

But in fairness, they ran way more structured sets last night than they had in the last 5 games – which really helped Vlad be much more involved. Nellie has been calling more plays this year (in year’s past, he usually lets his PG or Point Fwd call the play – fyi that’s part of the “freedom” in this system that players talk about).

Stating that Maggette got a ton of iso’s makes me question whether you know the game at all and whether you know what an Iso set even looks like. Nellie usually draws up good plays out of timeouts and whatnot. He’s just senile when it comes to his rotations (He also has that stupid veteran coach mentality of playing vets who he trusts over young players he doesn’t).

This game was about how he stuck with the Maggette vs Landry match up for too long. He should have brought Vlad or Hunter or both back in as soon as Maggette stopped getting lay ups. Even if he was right about the looks still being there and it was just Monta & CJ not making the pass and settling for the jumper – the fact remains they were getting killed by Maggette’s incessant need to flop and they were no longer benefiting offensively.

by homer simpson on Dec 4, 2009 9:21 AM PST reply actions

I thought the Warrior Wonder was beer for a second.

Warriors, Stupidest franchise in the league.

I told Randolph that Bill Russell would tell him to keep that ball in play and start the break.

RANDOLPH: "I know. But sometimes, you gotta let ‘em know."

(MT)

by kenntoe on Dec 4, 2009 10:41 AM PST reply actions

Uh...

where did you gather that Curry is a better ball handler than Ellis? His handles may LOOK pretty, but the kid gives away the ball with his sloppy dribbling.

by FishStix on Dec 4, 2009 12:37 PM PST reply actions

but the kid gives away the ball with his sloppy dribbling.

Are we talking about Ellis, or Curry here? ;)

by Missing Barry on Dec 4, 2009 1:04 PM PST up reply actions

He must be talking about Ellis…

by DubsFan408 on Dec 4, 2009 1:30 PM PST up reply actions

No he telegraphs passes

Rookie mistakes but he has less mental lapses with the ball than Monta. Monta is still better but why not let the point guard be the point guard?

Rookie: "Why did you bench me?"
Nellie: "You're a rookie"

by dubzfan on Dec 4, 2009 2:11 PM PST up reply actions

I trust monta more under pressure

any pressure and Curry can’t handle it yet. Monta at the end was dead. If we could have got him 8 or so minutes it might have made the difference. buy him 4-5 in first half, and a few in second

by tafkasam on Dec 4, 2009 4:27 PM PST up reply actions

Moore is better than this season anyway I saw him play on the Nets

Moore says he has a bone spur digging in his heel and he can’t move right but ‘the Warriors need him’. For about 10 more days. Then we can package him off and he can shut it down for several months. Also if Bell is due to play by like late Feb or early March we could get McDyess. The Spurs are loaded up front they don’t need McDyess they have Bonner and Ratliff. Really McDyess was just insurance for their low draft pick but Blair is doing great he’s boarding like heck and have you seen his spin move? Imagine San Antonio’s perimeter. Parker Bell Ginobili Bogans Jefferson Finley Mason Hill they could make another trade pare it down and get even better. That calls for a 2nd rounder for us for doing them the favor. They could go like Ginobili and Ratliff for Nene and a 2nd rounder or two, and be prime contenders next year as well without any major offseason moves.

Dump Maggette get a pick go shopping in 2011= NBA Champions 2013

by polar on Dec 5, 2009 3:35 AM PST reply actions