Should we try to trade for Rubio?
by b.radley on Jun 26, 2009 8:22 AM PDT
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PrintRubio expressed little interest in going to Minnesota before the draft. They took him anyway, because any new GM would rather draft the "right" player and then start shopping him than pass on a future superstar and have it haunt him for his entire career.
Now Rubio's father has suggested in the Minnesota media that if he doesn't get traded he might stay in Europe. Meanwhile, Minnesota already drafted a second "true" PG (Flynn) and basically has no shooting guards on their team... So this begs an important question that is completely realistic to consider: Should the W's try to trade for Rubio?
Last night a heated discussion broke out over the possibility of trading for Amar'e. I was skeptical at first, because I'm worried we'll end up getting bled dry of useful, affordable assets (esp. Kelenna) and bilked for a big contract. It sounds like it's a possibility, so now's the time to debate options. I have to believe getting Rubio is possible because:
- the W's run, and are a perfect match for Rubio's pass-and-run talents
- plenty of Spanish speakers in the Bay Area (new market for the W's?)
- W's would be high profile enough for Rubio to make some endorsement money in the states
- W's are chock-full-o-SGs, which is precisely the position the Wolves need to fill
- Wolves would also like a "real" center, so they can shift Jefferson to his natural position at 4
So let's think about it. Shooting from the hip in terms of what we might be able to compose for the trade, but what about some combination of:
- Curry (who the Wolves would have taken if Rubio wasn't available), so they "break even" with him
- Monta or Biedrins
- Morrow or Marco
- Kelenna
- Possibly BWright or Acie Law
In return we could expect an expiring PF to make salaries match, like Brian Cardinal or Etan Thomas or both.
The fundamental question is whether we would rather have a max-salary *current* superstar PF or a rookie contract *potential* superstar PG. Thoughts?
Oh, and yeah, I know, Dan Fegan is his agent. F#% that guy. He couldn't convince Rubio not to play for the W's for his rookie contract, and once we get rolling with a successful team then it's just a question of whether or not we pay him as a superstar... Evidently we're considering it for Amar'e, so I have to believe we'd do it for a proven Rubio too...
UPDATE: Good article on TrueHoop about Kahn's options (Minny GM)
This FanPost is a submission from a member of the mighty Golden State of Mind community. While we're all here to throw up that W, these words do not necessarily reflect the views of the GSoM Crew. Still, chances are the preceding post is Unstoppable Baby!
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I don’t think the Timberwolves are looking to move Rubio.
Meanwhile, Minnesota Timberwolves president David Kahn admitted on Thursday night that the team isn’t in full control of Ricky Rubio’s buy out situation.
"Nobody here tonight, myself especially, will be banging his fist on the table, saying, ‘He must be here!’ It’s a very complicated matter," Kahn said Thursday night. "We need to understand that we’re not in control of the situation vis a vis the buyout. … I think it’s too early to worry about that. But I said this to the agent tonight: If any team in this league can afford to wait a year, dare I say two, it’s us. Y’know? It’s us."
The Ultimate Opportunist
by Rated-R Superstar on Jun 26, 2009 8:29 AM PDT reply actions
and if Jefferson isn’t fully recovered from his ACL injury in year one (or next season), then the Twolves can go for the NBA loss record, somehow get #1, draft John Wall and run a 3 PG line up. pure win.
by homer simpson on Jun 26, 2009 11:34 AM PDT up reply actions
I must add that everyone is talking about the Knicks trying to trade for Rubio, but they have nothing to offer except Nate Robinson (another small PG, perfect fit with Flynn!), Wilson Chandler (F), David Lee (F) and some expirings (which the Wolves don’t need).
IOW, the only Knick trading chips are terrible matches for Minnesota needs…unless they do multi-team trades with folks looking to clear cap space. But do the Knicks really want to take on a bunch of dumped salaries for Rubio?
In short, I think he’s very available.
One advantage the Knicks have
Is the Kahn/Walsh relationship. We’ve seen before how important that can be (McHale/Ainge, Chris Wallace/Miami, and a ton of others)
The question is, does Ricky want to play in Minny?
Folks act like he has no right to choose, but remember: his club buyout means he’ll basically be playing for free his two plus years — paying his entire NBA salary to his former team.
Why would you make that kind of sacrifice to go to a city you don’t want to go to, with crappy (cold) weather, in a small market with extremely limited marketing potential?
The only way he makes any money the next few years is through endorsements; Minnesota is a black hole for endorsements, and has no significant spanish-speaking community. The reason he wanted Sac-town had to be directly tied to endorsement potential within the Hispanic community throughout California. That’s not happening in Minnesota, which means he’d literally be playing for free. In Minny.
he doesnt want
Why not BOTH?
Curry + future 1st for Rubio
Biedrins, Belinelli, & Wright for Amare
Rubio
Ellis
S Jax
A Randolph
Stoudamire
thats a $$$$ lineup!
now THATS
a sick lineup. if only we could do this, we would be a very nasty team to deal with.
You know I spit technique to the freshest freak
Gimme a call you will see results in just a week
With the soul of a LOST HAWK
Is there a heaven for a Rap Cat, let's talk
by LostHawkSJSU on Jun 26, 2009 10:18 AM PDT up reply actions
I can’t imagine the highlight reels of Rubio’s slick passing to the slashing Ellis, soaring Randolph and rim-rattling Stoudemire.
The Ultimate Opportunist
by Rated-R Superstar on Jun 26, 2009 11:30 AM PDT up reply actions
and the 30 wins they produce
while the other team is making the same highlights, only more often cause none of these guys play defense.
mmm Nice lineup,nice bench.
Corey,Morrow and Turiaf.
Its time for a change...
by RunNdGun on Jun 26, 2009 12:59 PM PDT up reply actions
the only problem is...
There’s probably little chance that Rubio plays much, immediately, under Nellie. That’s just my gut. So we’re really picking him up more as a long-term bet than an immediate contributor. At least, that’s my guess. I could be wrong.
No Monta or Biedrins or Randolph
in any deal for Rubio. Minnesota then proceeds to hang up.
i'm not sure about that
i think this is why they drafted flynn. they need to trade rubio, sounds like he will go back to spain if he isn’t traded.
You know I spit technique to the freshest freak
Gimme a call you will see results in just a week
With the soul of a LOST HAWK
Is there a heaven for a Rap Cat, let's talk
by LostHawkSJSU on Jun 26, 2009 10:18 AM PDT up reply actions
Nice diary, BRad.
I’ve been wondering the same thing since the Wolves’ extremely curious pick of Flynn at #6. It seemed to me like such a no-brainer for them to pick Curry at that spot. His game seems to complement Rubio’s really well; whereas Flynn + Rubio = WTF. Never, on any planet, will Rubio and Flynn harmonize, unless one of the two demonstrates that they’re a career backup, which surely isn’t part of Kahn’s strategy.
It just seems like another shoe has to fall. If you were a Wolves fan, and the Warriors offered up, say, Curry, Belinelli and Wright for Rubio and an expiring right now, would you refuse?
Thing 1
You don't think it's because of the buyout uncertainty
Maybe Flynn is the Plan 1B in case Rubio decides to play out his contract with Juventud (sp?) and come over after a year or two.
Exactly my thought. They had already decided Flynn was their PG.
I think Minny was shocked that Rubio was still around, and basically had to take him as BPA. Now they have to figure out what to do with him…
It's pretty solid strategy
Pick the BPA, stockpile assets, extort stuff from other teams.
The extortion part, of course, would involve acquiring Belinelli, Wright, and Curry for an unwanted contract and a Spanish dude who doesn’t want to play for you and plays a position you already have filled. Do it, Kahn.
Thing 1
by Sleepy Freud on Jun 26, 2009 10:03 AM PDT up reply actions
I was thinking that in 60 days -
Gomes/Rubio/Cardinal
for
Speedy’s insured expiring/Belinelli/Wright/Curry
could look pretty attractive to Minny, and it leaves us with
Monta/Rubio
Jack/Morrow
Buike/Maggette
Randolph/Gomes/Cardinal
Biedrins/Turiaf
and Minny with
Flynn/Curry/Telfair
Curry/Ellington/Belinelli
Carney/Brewer
Love/Wright
Jefferson/Thomas
Thing A
"no homo"
Something like this has to be the plan
We can put together some pretty attractive packages at this point, but I have a feeling nothing will happen immediately
Sittin in my scraper watchin Oakland goin wild, ta-dow!
thats about a 40 win TOPS line-up.
we’re not deep enough.
Its time for a change...
by RunNdGun on Jun 26, 2009 1:02 PM PDT up reply actions
Uh...
two deep at every position with 10 guys who could all potentially start? How is that not deep enough?
Sittin in my scraper watchin Oakland goin wild, ta-dow!
+ versatility
Jack, Maggette, Monta, Buike and Randolph all play multiple positions.
also
I agree that its a pretty solid strategy, I don’t quite understand why everyone is being quite so hard on Minny. At #5 they took the clear BPA and at #6 there wasn’t really a clear BPA, but took the guy highest on their board instead of going for need. It seems like a whole lot of draft “experts” preach BPA and then blast teams for drafting guys who aren’t the best fit. Minny obviously had to do something to address the backcourt, and they certainly cleared up one of the toughest positions to fill. Sure they used two picks to do it, but considering the success rate of draft picks I don’t really blame them. With those two pick they should now feel confident about all the PG minutes. They still have big holes at the wings, but those seem to be the two easiest positions to fill, and I think the Ellington pick proves that you can get some pretty good talent at those spots a lot easier than you can at PG. I don’t dislike their strategy at all, the only problem I see with it is if it upset Rubio putting them in position where they are forced to deal him without as much leverage as they may have had on draft day.
Thing A
"no homo"
The “good news” is that Minny doesn’t really have any horrible contracts anymore — basically all their bad contracts expire this year. They are shopping for youth, which we have.
Sam’s right to key in on the insured part of Speedy’s contract — if it is applicable. That could make him very appealing, and boost his trade value. However, if I remember correctly I think I heard that he tried to return at the end of last year. Not sure where that leaves him…
Honestly, F—— Rubio, F——his dad, F—- Fegan! They are acting like little bitches. I don’t want him playing for us anymore.
Keep Curry and roll with who we got.
Possible 3-Way?!?
GSW send Stephen Curry to NYK
GSW send Marco Bellinelli and Brandan Wright to MIN
NYK send Wilson Chandler and Nate Robinson (via sign-n-trade) to MIN
NYK send Jordan Hill to GSW + future draft pick
MIN send Ricky Rubio to GSW
MIN send Jonny Flynn and Wayne Ellington (or Henk Norel) to NYK
MIN gets: N Robinson, W Chandler, M Bellinelli, B Wright
NYK gets: S Curry, Jonny Flynn, and Wayne Ellington (or Henk Norel)
GSW gets: R Rubio, Jordan Hill + future draft pick
I don’t know if you can actually do that or if the figures add up, but it makes sense based on team needs and playing style.
Or alternately, what about something like this...
Ricky Rubio, Filler (e.g. Claxon/Law) → NYC
David Lee → GSW
Steph Curry + ?? → Minny
No Rubio, but it gets us Lee as a backup plan if we don’t trade for Amare.
I’m not all that eager to trade Curry for Lee straight up, much less Curry+another young piece. If we’re paying the bulk of the price for Rubio I’d much rather actually get Rubio than send him to NYK for Lee.
Thing A
"no homo"
I agree
But it’s a play-now versus play-later thing. If we can’t get a big guy (Bosh/Amare) then we’d be most-helped over the next 2-3 years by Lee, most likely. Which might appeal to certain head coaches who might be considering retiring soon… So while it might not be ideal, it’s not terrible and could be possible, that’s all I’m saying I guess.
i can see that, but then you’d have Wright, Randolph, Lee, Biedrins and Turiaf? I’m not sure you can get all those guys very many minutes, I think you’d have to work hard to get Randolph 20+ minutes even if you were able to move Wright for another wing or guard.
Thing A
"no homo"
rubio? no thanks.
everything ive read, seen and heard says this kid isn’t nba ready and won’t be for a LONG time.
Good idea
I’d give up any combination of Marco/Wright/Maggette/Azubuike to get Rubio.
"We Deserve"
Please get Rubio! Do it! Screw Amare!
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would you really rather have rubio than Amare?
i don’t get that at all, the only thing rubio is good at is passing, and i think half the fancy passes he throw, which is why ppl like thim and think he’s pistol pete, would get picked in the NBA. He’s not going against slow soft defenses like in Spain where he was one of the quicker players out there. If he plays i think his stats would be 8 points 6 assist and 5 t.o per game, and he demands the ball in his hands without the ability to make the ppl around him better. I just don’t like him at all, and i hate his haircut even more.
i don’t get that at all, the only thing rubio is good at is passing,
So his excellent ball-handling skills, court vision, basketball IQ, leadership skills, quick hands on defense, ability to put pressure on his man, work ethic and many other things are nothing, right?
The Ultimate Opportunist
by Rated-R Superstar on Jun 26, 2009 11:36 AM PDT up reply actions
Yes.
Considering the estimated costs I’d rather get Rubio over Amare.
I think the price for Rubio would be Curry + Marco/Bukie. I could be way off and if it’s anymore than that then the T’Wolves can take nothing for their 5th pick.
I’d love to get Amare but I wouldn’t give up more than Biedrins, Wright, and Marco. Anything more would be too much IMO considering we got BD for Speedy and Dale Davis. Phoenix has painted themselves in a corner and as time drags the deals for Amare will only get worse. RIght now they’re getting $1 for $1 IMO, eventually it will become $0.40 on the $1.
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In Spain,
the defenses are much better. Teams in Spain play much more team ball instead of just one-on-one basketball. Defense is stressed much more in Europe.
Yeah…I don’t know about that. People romanticize the fundamentals of overseas basketball and hate on the defense played in the NBA so much, but what they fail to realize is the individual talent in the NBA would make any defense look terrible. If Kobe played in Europe, he’d probably have an easier time (I say probably because Kobe’s a weird case where he likes better defenders to be on him because he considers it more of a challenge, not because European defense is better). If James played in Europe, he would be averaging like 50 ppg. Hell, if Ellis played in Europe, he would average what, 30 ppg? European offenses are not that good compared to NBA offenses, because the most offensively skilled European players go to the NBA anyway.
If there's a guarantee that he won't go back to Spain, yes.
If not, I don’t want the diva.
Welcome to the Warriors, Stephen Curry, the 2009 NBA Rookie of the Year.
Conductor of the "We're Back!" Bandwagon!
i may be in the minority here
but i want to see curry in a dubs uni. the idea of curry, morrow and buike shooting 3’s is very exciting. those three can really stretch the floor. they could be the top 3 3pt shooters in the nba next year.
be the change you wish to see in the world.
if we didnt get curry
then i would try to make a move rubbio.
be the change you wish to see in the world.
This is apparently the latest surrounding Ricky Rubio.
The Ultimate Opportunist
by Rated-R Superstar on Jun 26, 2009 11:53 AM PDT reply actions
No.
Nellies style is to have as many scorers on the floor. curry is scorer & passer.
Feelin like Chauncey I'm just tryin get my Bills Up
by P-40 the Ballatician on Jun 26, 2009 3:22 PM PDT reply actions
It's cool that we COULD get Rubio
We’re in a better position than any other team. At this point, Kahn just needs to save face. Curry + (whatever) for Rubio allows Kahn to do that.
I want Rubio, but not for the cost of getting Amare though.
If Curry is not package in the Amare trade, I go for it. Trade Curry, and a hot spanish girl aka Eva Mendes for him. It sound crazy, but it might work. lol
by warriorfan4life on Jun 27, 2009 12:11 PM PDT reply actions
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