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RECAP: Phoenix Suns 112, Golden State Warriors 103 -- Running on Empty


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Pants on the ground!

Final Boxscore  |  Game Thread (650+ comments)   |  Warriors Game Day Links

Blog Buddy: Bright Side Of The Sun

The Warriors had every excuse to take this game off. If this season were a car race, the Warriors would have come into this game running on spare parts and bare rims. And if this game were the last lap, the Warriors would have crossed the finish line running on empty.

The Warriors were playing a road back-to-back. Left at home was captain Monta Ellis, the latest victim of the biblical plague of injuries that has visited the Warriors franchise.   CJ Watson took his place on the active roster, pressed into service early after suffering a bad gash to his shooting hand against the Heat.  The two brand-new D-leaguers, Cartier Martin and Anthony Tolliver, both played 37 minutes. And yet this Warriors team showed up to play, and gave the Suns everything they could handle for four quarters.

Star-divide

In fact, in the first half the Warriors were the better team.  Without Monta Ellis to push the tempo, they came out with a radically different game plan. They controlled the tempo, and rarely got out on the break. Led by the phenomenal defensive intensity of their two D-league call-ups, Martin and Tolliver, the Warriors locked down on the Suns. Both Amare Stoudemire and Jason Richardson finished the first half shooting 3-9.  Who says Don Nelson doesn't coach defense? 

On the offensive end, the Warriors were paced by Corey Maggette with 17 points, and Stephen Curry with 13 points, matching his counterpart Steve Nash.  Perhaps fearful of wearing Curry out, Nellie ran very little pick and roll in this game.  Instead, Curry frequently simply dumped the ball off on the wings to initiate isolations or a motion offense. And the Warriors moved the ball beautifully, particularly on one play that featured 6 passes, ending in a wide open three for Cartier Martin. The Warriors went into the locker-room with a 5 point lead, that would have been 8 if Nash hadn't buried a last-second three.

Unfortunately, in the second half the Warriors simply ran out of gas.  Curry's jumpers started coming up short, Maggette stopped driving the lane, and the Warriors' offense stagnated badly.  On the defensive end, the tired Warriors began fouling, sending the Suns marching to the free throw line, where they essentially won this game, shooting an amazing 29-33.

Still, the Warriors battled gamely until the bitter end, gutting it out on the defensive end and on the boards.  And they were right in the game until the play that occurred at 3:12 of the fourth quarter, with the Warriors down 98-95.  You know which play I'm talking about, Warriors fans.  CJ Watson stole the ball, ran down court and went up for the layup. Goran Dragic went up with him, in what looked to me like an attempt to prevent the basket with a foul.  The replay was not perfect, but it appeared that Dragic hit Watson across his shooting arm.  I know this much at least: he did not get ball, and yet the ball came screaming off the backboard.  The Suns rebounded and scored at the other end.  Don Nelson went nuts and drew a technical, and suddenly instead of being up 1, the Suns were up 6 and this one was in the books.

Capt

Bleep. Bleep. Bleep.

This technical, by the way, had a little history to it.  Check out the play at the end of the first quarter, where CJ Watson hit the last second shot while being knocked to the floor.  Nelson went nuts on that one too, and if you listen closely you can hear him yell:  "I don't give a sh**, call the foul!"  Evidently, he said something a little stronger the second time. 

Stephen Curry:  Curry played a nice game on the offensive end, netting 25 points, although his tired legs began betraying his shot in the second half.  His defense wasn't as strong as in past games, perhaps because of fatigue, and perhaps because he was deathly afraid of giving fouls.

For those who were breathlessly awaiting his debut as the Warriors' sole point guard (I plead guilty), we will have to wait for future games.  Curry was clearly more of a scorer than a distributor in this game, finishing with only 2 assists. In his defense, I will say that it clearly wasn't Nellie's game plan for him to run pick and roll, or drive and dish.  For most of the game Curry simply dumped the ball off and played off the ball.  Probably to save his legs.

424f4d8f599b13692c1377f1b5ff5bc5-getty-90043348cp006_golden_state__medium

Uh Oh...

Mini-Malone:   My friend Ben, who accompanied me to GSoM night after not watching the Warriors for years, came up with this nick-name for Corey Maggette almost immediately.  I think it fits him to a T.  The body-builder physique. The fearless, crashing layups.  The deadly elbow jumper. The incredible efficiency. Mini-Malone.

Maggette had a great first half, but fell of a bit in the second half when he started relying too much on his jumper. Fatigue was clearly an issue.

The Centers:  Beans and Turiaf gave a good effort in this game, combining for 13 rebounds.  Unfortunately, the Lopez back-to-back was too much for them. Robin Lopez, clearly the weaker of the Lopez twins, put up 16 and 9 by himself, including 8-8 from the line.  And Beans and Turiaf remained completely invisible on the offensive end.  Left unnoticed because of Biedrins' horrible free throw shooting problems are Turiaf's own struggles at the line. Turiaf is shooting 50% from the line this season after shooting 79% last season.  Chris Hunter was also invisible.  The Warriors desperately need more of an offensive contribution from their big men.

The D-League All-Stars:  What can you say about the defensive intensity and rebounding that Cartier Martin and Anthony Tolliver have brought to this team?  In this game, they also brought some much-needed offense.  

Martin was solid, putting up 13 and 5, and playing nice defense on J-Rich. His three point shooting is a nice surprise.  2 for 5 in this game.

A14cf3cb4e17d67883ea102ed32a81db-getty-90043348cp018_golden_state__medium

Unstoppable, Baby!

But Anthony Tolliver was simply terrific. 19 points on 9-15 shooting.  He's got a soft shooting stroke that encourages me to think that his three-point shooting will come around eventually.  11 rebounds battling Stoudemire, Lopez and Amundsen.  And the excellence of his defensive ability is startling.  He did a terrific job trapping Nash on the pick and roll.  And he was able to guard Stoudemire without fouling.  What in the world was this guy doing in the D-league?

Is it fair to ask at this point in time whether Anthony Tolliver is a better NBA power forward than Anthony Randolph? No, absolutely not. So let's do it! On the Tolliver side of the ledger: A solid NBA body, at 240 lbs. Solid defensive fundamentals. Ability to hold his position in the block, and box out for defensive rebounds.  Ability to finish his shot against big men in the paint. Shooting range out to the three-point line. And a nice jump hook to boot!

On Randolph's side: 7' feet tall. Blocks shots. Runs the floor like a deer. Handles like a guard. Runs the point center. Has the ability to force most backup centers in the league off the court.  Has the ability to be a terrific rebounder and defender, if not always the inclination. Is 20 years old, to Tolliver's 24.

And finally: That face.

One final question:  Who in the NBA scouts the D-league better than Don Nelson, errrrr... Larry Riley?  

Wonder_medium_medium_medium

Curry and Maggette were nice, but have been better.  I'm giving it to the kid fresh out of the D-league who made it happen for the Warriors on both ends of the court tonight: Anthony Tolliver.


Poll
Which Anthony is the better power forward right now?
Anthony Randolph
373 votes
Anthony Tolliver
450 votes

823 votes | Poll has closed

Comment 48 comments  |  0 recs  | 

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Comments

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Lol at the poll

Really? Are people that frustrated that a guy didn’t live up to his franchise savior predictions people had before the year? Before he went down he was playing amazing. Are you guys serious or do I just not get the joke?

Rookie: "Why did you bench me?"
Nellie: "You're a rookie"

by dubzfan on Jan 23, 2010 11:42 PM PST reply actions   1 recs

Morons

Seriously, some people are just morons. Tolliver gets back-to-back double-doubles thanks in large part to him playing 41 minutes and 38 minutes respectively and now he’s better than Randolph. Seriously, it’s ridiculous and it’s why most of these polls don’t matter at all.

The Ultimate Opportunist

by Rated-R Superstar on Jan 23, 2010 11:46 PM PST up reply actions  

My thoughts exactly.

You know I spit technique to the freshest freak
Gimme a call you will see results in just a week
With the soul of a LOST HAWK
Is there a heaven for a Rap Cat, let's talk

by LostHawkGSW on Jan 23, 2010 11:47 PM PST up reply actions  

Yes but if you call anyone a Moron you get a warning....

As I did for calling out the fans booin Maggette earlier this year…

That said….

Because someone actually see’s a productivity and an ability to play a position “As Requested” they are then Moron’s for having an opinion against your boy? I guess those of us who actually understand the point Feltbot is trying to make will simply take the highway then…

Jan 16 2010 - Onlxn quote on Stephen Curry - "one of the worst playmakers in basketball"

by BritWarriorGSW on Jan 24, 2010 7:52 AM PST up reply actions  

well, right now tolliver is better. randolph is going to have a hard time winning that one on one leg.

heart of a champion, will of the warrior.

by cap'n hack on Jan 23, 2010 11:50 PM PST up reply actions  

I was thinking the same thing.

Right now? Tolliver but only because AR can’t play.

The game thread is where most knee jerk reactions happen anyway, and I must admit, it’s turned me into a “moron” from time to time. But not into thinking Tolliver > AR. No way.

Warriors, Stupidest franchise in the league.

I told Randolph that Bill Russell would tell him to keep that ball in play and start the break.

RANDOLPH: "I know. But sometimes, you gotta let ‘em know."

(MT)

by kenntoe on Jan 24, 2010 12:28 AM PST up reply actions  

peeps who voted for Tolliver...

Either work for the Dubs, can’t get enough Kool-Aid, or are just plain idiots…I love how the justitifaction for going after D-Leaguers is a great thing by felt…It’s awesome we can get D-Leaguers, who needs superstars when the team can wallow in mediocrity with D-Leaguers..YAY!!!Sign me up for the D-League dubs, your freindly neighborhood NBA franchise!

by UCdubsFan on Jan 25, 2010 7:48 AM PST up reply actions  

I thought...

Nelson said he had never seen Tolliver play in D-League? Or was that Hunter?

by DrManatee on Jan 24, 2010 12:08 AM PST reply actions  

You've got to be kidding me with the poll

Talk about cherry-picking a time to ask that question. Tolliver has his two best games in the NBA, and Randolph had his ankle snapped three weeks ago.

by randolphforpresident on Jan 24, 2010 12:16 AM PST reply actions  

Randolph vs Tolliver

I think Tolliver is the better power forward right now. To me, it looks like he understands the game, knows what he’s supposed to do, moves to the right places, understands the game plan, knows to box out, does not look lost, has not shown any hesitation, has not shown any panic while on the floor.

Tolliver looks like the kind of guy where you can tell him the defensive scheme for the night, give him tips on how to handle whatever the opposing guy will throw at him, when to rotate and help, send him to the floor, and then walk away. Randolph has a loooooong way to go from demonstrating this level of reliability.

by IQofaWarrior on Jan 24, 2010 12:33 AM PST reply actions   1 recs

I personally like his hair.

But his fundamentals are pretty cash too, I guess. Of course, if Tolliver continues to receive extended playing time, we’ll have a more accurate assessment of how he stacks up to the rest of the front-court. He’s had some good games. I hope he keeps having them.

Sample size and all. You know the song.

by DrManatee on Jan 24, 2010 12:44 AM PST up reply actions  

The thing that worries me is that the exact same thing could have been said about Hunter when he was on his 10 day contract. Now he is practically invisible out there.

by samuraaaaiiiiiii on Jan 24, 2010 1:27 AM PST up reply actions  

The fact that Tolliver actually has a game

is what made me vote for him.
What does Randolph have?
Good weak side defender, but pretty poor man to man defense.
Jumps like he’s jumpin for Jesus, but jumps a little too often, like when he’s going for a block.
His offensive game is limited to 16 foot jumpers, and flinging himself into the defense to get to the line.
I love Randolph. He clearly has a lot of upside, and he was showing a lot of his progress from the start of the season, but Tolliver has really nice fundamentals. He’s kinda like the PF version of Buike. Solid player, but not a lot of upside.
There is a good chance that I will be eating my words after a couple more games, but we’ll see.

by Reverend_Randy on Jan 24, 2010 2:39 AM PST up reply actions  

He’s kinda like the PF version of Buike.

exactly.

"If God made us in his image then he must be dumb too, and a little ugly on the side."

Frank Zappa

by qin on Jan 24, 2010 8:18 AM PST up reply actions  

He's solid as a 9-12th rotation guy.

AR is still the guy I’d rather go with. He’s got the things you can’t teach—size, quickness, athleticism. While Tolliver is more safe, and doesn’t stand out in any area. AR has put up good stats while not really knowing what to do out there or doing it consistently. Imagine what this guy can do when he figures it out.

Why wouldn’t we play AR over Tolliver anyway, we’ve only won 12 or so games.

Warriors, Stupidest franchise in the league.

I told Randolph that Bill Russell would tell him to keep that ball in play and start the break.

RANDOLPH: "I know. But sometimes, you gotta let ‘em know."

(MT)

by kenntoe on Jan 24, 2010 1:18 PM PST up reply actions  

Agree

Tolliver just looks more polished. Randolph is more exciting – his blocks, dunks, etc. But honestly Tolliver is the better player now. The only thing that makes me think Tolliver is better is because he isn’t hesitant, rather consistent with a jump shot. Randolph had so many opportunities this year to shoot an open jump shot and he either passes it up like Morrow or thinks about it and misses.

Let’s not underrate Tolliver just because he came out of the D-League. I feel Randolph has more fans on this site just because he was a 1st round pick and he’s exciting (i.e. J-Rich). But honestly has J-Rich become a star as we all thought? No. He’s a good 6th man, but everyone thought he was soo awesome cause he was an exciting dunker and player.

The Time Is Now! Win Warriors Win!

by ballin on Jan 24, 2010 1:15 PM PST up reply actions  

J-rich was above average here. He was the only good thing we had on a crappy team.

Hind-sight here is filled with that rose colored tint when people think about Jrich. He had heart and soul yes, but didn’t he also beat his GF? People forget about that.

Warriors, Stupidest franchise in the league.

I told Randolph that Bill Russell would tell him to keep that ball in play and start the break.

RANDOLPH: "I know. But sometimes, you gotta let ‘em know."

(MT)

by kenntoe on Jan 24, 2010 1:22 PM PST up reply actions  

Tolliver...

Here we go again. I appreciate the way the guy has come in, worked hard and found a way to produce, but let’s not get carried away again. The guy is playing for his basketball life right now, and he’s doing a fair job so far, but he hasn’t shown himself to be anything special up to this point.

I’ll give the guy credit, he had a great game tonight. Hunter had some nice games too… so did Vlad Rad… Rob Kurz… POB… Ike Diogu… Zarko Cabarkapa… Josh Powell… Chris Taft…

I’m going to bed. Warriors history is depressing.

"I could be chasing an untamed ornithoid without cause."

by olympicmike on Jan 24, 2010 1:43 AM PST reply actions   1 recs

MVP MVP MVP!

Rob Kurz.

by Cpt. Jack in the Box on Jan 24, 2010 1:44 AM PST reply actions  

I think Curry

Is doing a good job without Monta. Like Tyreke in absence of Martin

Win Or Lose Warriors For Life.........

by mykelala01 on Jan 24, 2010 2:00 AM PST reply actions  

Theres a difference

Monta isn’t an on the court cancer like Kmart.

Rookie: "Why did you bench me?"
Nellie: "You're a rookie"

by dubzfan on Jan 24, 2010 2:32 AM PST up reply actions  

I know it is too soon

But his productivity is way of the chart or he might be gaining his confidence everyday

Win Or Lose Warriors For Life.........

by mykelala01 on Jan 24, 2010 12:00 PM PST up reply actions  

I'm a suns fan..

And Tolliver looks like a real keeper. A suns player actually. He is 6’9", rebounds, looks like he plays solid team defence and has a quality outside shot. And he shot .371 in the D-league from 3, and has only hit 2-17 so far for the Warriors.

He looks to me, if he gets the chance to develop veteran tricks in the NBA, at worst, a solid rotation player and, at best, if he can hit anywhere close to .370 from 3, a slightly better rebounding Channing Frye. That’s a pretty sweet deal, for a minimum contract player.

by MMotherwell on Jan 24, 2010 4:09 AM PST reply actions  

Sssshhhhh you cant say that here....

The Randolph lynch mob will start lighting torches, as keeping Tolliver would probably restrict Randolphs minutes..

But I personally fully agree with your view, he does actually look like a excellent player to have in your squad and a key defensive player that the Warriors have not had for a very long time. As a 7th 8th even 9th man…I agree he looks like a keeper, but then again, I would actually like to try and keep Bell for next year too!

Jan 16 2010 - Onlxn quote on Stephen Curry - "one of the worst playmakers in basketball"

by BritWarriorGSW on Jan 24, 2010 7:56 AM PST up reply actions  

When AR comes back,

I wouldn’t mind keeping him, just because he’s a bigger body. I’d cut Cartier Martin first before Tolliver.

Warriors, Stupidest franchise in the league.

I told Randolph that Bill Russell would tell him to keep that ball in play and start the break.

RANDOLPH: "I know. But sometimes, you gotta let ‘em know."

(MT)

by kenntoe on Jan 24, 2010 1:24 PM PST up reply actions  

Suns fan:

What’s your take on Curry? do you any Nash comparisons? as I’m understanding he is the reason the W’s backed out of the Amare deal..

by Cryptic on Jan 24, 2010 5:42 AM PST reply actions  

Tolliver is a nice guy, but...

I do not see him get better than that. Is it because he does not have star potential or is it because he has learned every skills of a PF? He can shoot mid-long range jumper, he can rebound and play D, does not make silly TOs, knows how to play w/o fouling. Conclusion: He is reliable.

Let’s look at AR and compare. I can see star potential in AR. I can see improvement and process in AR. He can make big play and create incredible moment. He is very athletic, runs like a train. He can jump to get rebound, but has not learned how to box out. He ends up w/ bad position that can hurt himself. He does handle well, but sometimes make silly TOs. He plays ok D. Conclusion: He is exciting.

For the poll. It is clearly Tolliver is a better PF right now for the dubs. I hope he can keep up his consistency.

by Minh Phan on Jan 24, 2010 8:56 AM PST reply actions   1 recs

lol at the poll

Of course Tolliver is better, AR has a broken ankle and broke it just when he seemed to be calming down. AR has talent and athleticism, but Tolliver has the hustle, sort of the poster d-league player really. I also can’t help but wonder how many points AR would have had with no Monta chugging up shots, though maybe he’ll have a chance at a lot of offensive rebounds (jk jk :p)

Don’t get me wrong, I like Tolliver, but I just do not see any room for him in the future (like next season) once we get our healthy bodies (AR & BWright) back. For this season, unless Hunter really explodes I would say buy him out asap and sign Tolliver to a contract.

So let me get this straight... Maggette is the healthy guy.
"Winning is not enough. All others must lose." - Larry Ellison

by Badly Browned on Jan 24, 2010 10:55 AM PST reply actions  

Hustle
AR has talent and athleticism, but Tolliver has the hustle, sort of the poster d-league player really.

Yeah, Randolph doesn’t dive for loose balls or any of that stuff. That’s all Tolliver’s territory.

The Ultimate Opportunist

by Rated-R Superstar on Jan 24, 2010 11:07 AM PST up reply actions  

Well, I was thinking more like making sure he boxes out to get rebounds and such.

So let me get this straight... Maggette is the healthy guy.
"Winning is not enough. All others must lose." - Larry Ellison

by Badly Browned on Jan 24, 2010 11:45 AM PST up reply actions  

Rebounding

Randolph averages 6.5 rebounds in less than 23 minutes per game. Give him 35 minutes and it’s near 10 rebounds per game. Randolph rebounds.

The Ultimate Opportunist

by Rated-R Superstar on Jan 24, 2010 12:03 PM PST up reply actions  

Great

I don’t care if you box out as long as you grab the ball.

The Ultimate Opportunist

by Rated-R Superstar on Jan 24, 2010 12:50 PM PST up reply actions  

I'd rather him do both.

Boxing out is a fundamental mindset that every great rebounder should do instinctively.

But hey, we’re the warriors. We’ll take anything we can get.

Warriors, Stupidest franchise in the league.

I told Randolph that Bill Russell would tell him to keep that ball in play and start the break.

RANDOLPH: "I know. But sometimes, you gotta let ‘em know."

(MT)

by kenntoe on Jan 24, 2010 1:26 PM PST up reply actions  

That's all I'm saying

it’s important for his development as a player that he learns to box out.
He can’t out jump every body.

by Reverend_Randy on Jan 24, 2010 1:46 PM PST up reply actions  

Tolliver

When healthy, he’s the 13th player on the roster at best so that means that he wouldn’t even be on the active roster should we be healthy.

People are having these quick reactions to Tolliver’s rebounding totals because he played 41 minutes and 38 minutes respectively. Give those minutes to Randolph and Wright and they’ll be pulling down just as much.

The Ultimate Opportunist

by Rated-R Superstar on Jan 24, 2010 11:09 AM PST up reply actions  

If we gave those minutes to Randolph...

He is likely to foul out the game long before he completes his quadruple double! and while you think that boards are all that matters…..just consider the fact that for all the boxing out he does not do, the other team is likely to get an easier look at the basket as thus he is less likely to get a board as the shot is easier….unless he happens to block…

All power forwards have got to combine the ability to grab rebounds WITH the ability to box out…with the occasional beast block for good measure!

Jan 16 2010 - Onlxn quote on Stephen Curry - "one of the worst playmakers in basketball"

by BritWarriorGSW on Jan 24, 2010 4:17 PM PST up reply actions  

Give those minutes to Randolph and Wright and they’ll be pulling down just as much.

Well Randolph would (provided he doesn’t foul out), but last season Wright rebounded at a rate of 12.4% which is closer to Vlad’s 11.5% than Tolliver’s 15.3%. Tolliver also clears the highest rate of defensive boards 24% vs AR’s 21.7% & BW’s 15%. While defensive rebounds always mean the opponent didn’t score on that possession, offensive rebounds don’t necessarily mean that you scored on your possession.

The real ? is whether this is his true rebounding rate or a product of playing 2 poor rebounding teams in NJ & Phoenix. Though he did rebound at the best rate vs the Bulls who are 8th in the NBA in terms of rebounding rate.

On a side note, because AR doesn’t block out – among the big men, the team rebounds as a whole the worst when he’s in the game. This is based on a stat that shows you what percentage of rebounds the team clears when the given player is in the game and goes back to last year.

This year he’s the worst on the team at 45.6% (2nd worst last year at 46.6%). Basically, the team rebounds better as a team even with guys like Kurz (48.2%) & Wright (47.4%) in the game last season and Mikki (46%), Vlad (46.9%), & Hunter (48.8%) in the game this year (even thought they aren’t as good rebounders individually) b/c they block out their man allowing others to get the ball while keeping their man away. Even Maggette has better #’s. This is in spite of the fact that AR is a much, much better offensive rebounder. The gap is even bigger at the defensive end where he has been the worst on the team both years.

Still prefer AR b/c of his youth, but just b/c he’s like Maggette and gets his, doesn’t mean that the team is suddenly going to start winning more b/c he’s in the game instead of somebody else.

by homer simpson on Jan 26, 2010 10:07 AM PST up reply actions  

I have one problem with one of our D-Leaguers

and it pertains to Cartier Martin. I’ve been watchin his game and……..the dude doesn’t like to pass. He looks for his own shot all the time. I mean, it’s kind of like all he’s playin for is a contract, not winning. Add that to the fact that is fg% is 36.7, and we’ve got a problem.

Living for a magical 8th seed run

by KashRocks on Jan 24, 2010 11:22 AM PST reply actions  

True I agree

he is like a Junior blackhole

Win Or Lose Warriors For Life.........

by mykelala01 on Jan 24, 2010 12:05 PM PST up reply actions  

Yea

I don’t really like Cartier that much….I like Hunter only cause he’s huge, but nothing more.

The Time Is Now! Win Warriors Win!

by ballin on Jan 24, 2010 1:18 PM PST up reply actions  

From the limited time I saw the D leaguers I thing Cartier is the most skilled but yeah still remains to be seen

by dubtown on Jan 24, 2010 4:34 PM PST reply actions  

On a side note I appreciate nelly’s coaching a lot more I think We’ve been playing decent with the D league lineup.

by dubtown on Jan 24, 2010 4:37 PM PST reply actions  

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