It's evident we have one of the best backcourts in the NBA...but
by bojangles408 on Jan 25, 2010 8:00 AM PST
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Stephen Curry - May be on his way to obtaining the rookie of the year award if he can keep playing the way he has been lately. Currently, I believe he's the runner up for ROY. NBA.com is all over him, ESPN is all over him, GSOM is all over him... The dude can flat out play! He has great composure and really looks under control at all times besides the times when he gets hung up in the air and makes a bad pass but even Monta still does that. He can shoot from anywhere on the court as well as pass from anywhere on the court. The golden boy will surely impress us for years to come. Nellys molding him into a little Steph Nasshty. Yay!
Monta Ellis - All star caliber. That alone should be enough to describe Monta. It's been a pleasure to watch Monta turn into a rising star and it's really still his first year becoming the focal point of the opposing teams scouting report. So far he's been unstoppable and it's still his first year as the leader of a high scoring team. Next year will be so much easier for him as he'll know what to expect and he'll watch tape to counter the opposing teams traps. All Monta needs is another all star big to really open up possibilities.
Corey Maggette - Probably the most efficient SF in the league - stats wise (fg%, ft%, amount of ft's etc.) Maggs has been unbelievable lately. Seriously!! Who would have known he'd be this good?! He's having the best year of his career and has overcame the thousands of Boo's at Oracle Arena! That is just CRAZY! EVERY player that we Boo'd has wanted to run for the door crying and have nothing to do with our team but Maggs came out saying he doesn't understand it and wants to be a part of this drama queen team. He looks so much under control now and can literally get points at will. Who wouldn't want this guy to be part of your team? He's such a hustler and I love it when he smirks when he knows he got the best out of the other team from pure hustle, wits, and determination.
Clearly, there is nothing wrong with our starting back court. I would say they compliment each other very well and can compete with the best of the best. Our problem lies within our front court. Yes, they're all banged up and we never really had a chance to fairly evaluate them all together. But, to me, it's clear that for in order for our high octane offensive team to be successful, we're going to need another high scoring big man. I know we'd all like to have someone that can play defense/rebound/pass/shoot 60% from the field...(Nene, drool) don't know where you can find too many of those but as of this moment none of our bigs can adequately do this.
So is Randolph going to turn into that scoring beast we all need him to become? Maybe... What about Brandon Wright? Maybe... Can they both play defense and block shots? Yes! Without a doubt. What about Andris Biedrins =) ? Nope! He's never going to be the scorer we need down low but he sure does bring the things that are needed to win games. Block shots / Rebound / look good in a suit ... what else does he do? Oh I think that's it. So is Andris our problem? I think so!
For Nelly's teams to be successful, there has to be a scoring big man. Hence the reason why he plays everyone out of position because he needs to have a scoring big man. What if we actually had a scoring big man that plays at their natural position and can take so much pressure off of our back court? We'd be a pretty darn good team and do I dare say it? a "complete" team if we obtained a high scoring big man that could possibly be the focal point of the opposing teams defense. We already have an unstoppable backcourt so why not get an unstoppable big man that will compliment them?
So how do we do it? Bye Bye Biedrins and our expiring contracts. Flame me all you want, but to me, it's evident that Andris is our problem. Our starting $55mil big man that doesn't play in the 4th quarter is our problem. The same one that is also injury prone and soft around the rim and would rather lay it in than dunk it because he's scared to shoot free throws. The same one that hears cheers every time he shoots free throws which probably makes him more nervous. Sorry Biedrins, I love your game but you just don't fit the mold of Nelly's type of big and it hurts the teams chemistry so much. If your scared to lose our beloved Biedrins and what he brings, we'll still always have Turiaf and we can bench Randolph or Wright to make room for the 4 spot. Turiaf has been gaining more respect from Nelly lately anyways.
I'm not trying to link a certain player that we need to trade for but rather I'm trying to say we need a scoring big man, period. I hope you guys can see that's what were really lacking and that all of the elite teams have a scoring big man... But, there are a few scoring big mans that I can think of =)
This FanPost is a submission from a member of the mighty Golden State of Mind community. While we're all here to throw up that W, these words do not necessarily reflect the views of the GSoM Crew. Still, chances are the preceding post is Unstoppable Baby!
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Man
Why did I even include the front office… that’s messing up my poll. That wasn’t supposed to be a huge factor! arrrrghh
i had to go with injuries
wright, buike,bell,moore all out for year plus biedrens,turiaf,watson,vlad,morrow,randolph all missing significant time its been absolute nightmare trying to stay healthy this year. But yeah front office would be next
How much better do you really think we would be without all the injuries?
I would guess that we would maybe have about 3 more wins and still not even be close to a playoff contender.
by freerandolph on Jan 25, 2010 3:11 PM PST up reply actions
i’d guess somewhere around .500. wright and buike are both very useful pieces, turiaf hasn’t looked healthy at any point during the year and biedrins (one of our 3 best players) has only recently looked like the biedrins of old. we could be a lot better than we have been with a healthy team.
and next year, with another year of curry and randolph progress along with a high draft pick, there’s no reason to think this team shouldn’t be in the playoff hunt.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
Front Office
Sixteen years and one playoff berth says it all, really.
The Ultimate Opportunist
by Rated-R Superstar on Jan 25, 2010 11:30 AM PST reply actions
We already know that and theres already been plenty of polls for that!
My point was the front court..
by bojangles408 on Jan 25, 2010 12:11 PM PST up reply actions
The thing is, if we had a different front office you wouldn’t hear all the things about players not wanting to play here.
by samuraaaaiiiiiii on Jan 25, 2010 11:35 AM PST reply actions
I think plenty of teams know we have a really great young core
We just need a star to take us to new heights.
He’s never going to be the scorer we need down low but he sure does bring the things that are needed to win games. Block shots / Rebound
well, rebounding is incredibly important to winning games, and considering that our backcourt is never going to be phenomenal at keeping players out of the paint (they can be pretty good, but guys are still going to get to the cup), i don’t see why we should undervalue biedrins’ skill at one exceptionally important part of the game, one somewhat important part of the game, all while completely ignoring that he’s a decent defender, and efficient scorer who doesn’t need the ball in his hands, just because he’s not a traditional back to the basket scorer or doesn’t have a jumpshot. the offense is fine. switching out biedrins for a volume scorer who probably won’t be the rebounder that andris is (few players are) will not make us better. to call biedrins “the problem” indicates that you must have an ineffective “solution” in mind.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
It's not ineffective I can guarantee you that
It’s more like getting the players we need to become successful. If you take a look at all of the leagues elite teams, they all have big men that can score. Should I list them out? Fine:
East:
1) Cavs – Shaq and rising Hickson which they are trying to trade for a scoring big man (Amare)
2) Boston – KG
3) Atlanta – Smith and Horford
4) Orlando – Dwight / Rashard
5) Miami – Beasley / Oneal
6) Toronto – Bosh
West:
1) Lakers – Pau / Bynum
2) Denver – Martin / Nene
3) Dallas – Dirk
4) Portland – LaMarcus / Oden
5) San Antonio – Duncan
6) Utah – Boozer
7) Phoenix – Amare
8) Houston – There is a reason why they are only 8th place…
See the picture more clearly now? They all have a scoring big man that takes the pressure off of their allstar caliber back court. So what I’m trying to say is… we’ll never be an elite team without a scoring big man. We’ll always be a team looking to the 8th spot only to get our asses handed to us if we don’t have a good big man.
by bojangles408 on Jan 25, 2010 1:36 PM PST up reply actions
Now look at the rest of the teams that didn't make the list
And see what they are lacking… I don’t have to tell you it’s a well established scoring big.
by bojangles408 on Jan 25, 2010 1:38 PM PST up reply actions
some more teams with scoring bigs that seem to meet your criteria as listed above: memphis (zach randolph), nets (brook lopez), knicks (gallo), sixers (brand), bulls (miller), pistons (charlie v), pacers (troy murphy), bucks (bogut), wizards (jamison), clippers (kaman/camby), kings (hawes), hornets (david west), wolves (al jefferson). not loving that solution.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
Put one of those players in a Warriors uniform
I bet we’d be a helluva better team =)
by bojangles408 on Jan 25, 2010 1:59 PM PST up reply actions
in exchange for biedrins? no way. i’d take biedrins over zach randolph, brand, miller, charlie v, troy murphy, bogut, jamison, camby, kaman, hawes, west, and jefferson.
lopez and gallo are the only two i’d look at if offered for biedrins. i’d take brook in a heartbeat, but in the end would probably pass on gallo, who just doesn’t rebound well enough and is probably better suited to play the 3.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
You wouldn't want
Bogut / Camby / Kaman / David West on our team? Are you kidding?!
by bojangles408 on Jan 25, 2010 2:05 PM PST up reply actions
Instead of Biedrins? Absolutely not. Maybe Bogut, but definitely not the other two. Biedrins is better than they are.
by Missing Barry on Jan 25, 2010 2:07 PM PST up reply actions
Ok i'm not only talking about giving away Biedrins now...
I’m talking about our front court.
by bojangles408 on Jan 25, 2010 2:08 PM PST up reply actions
not for biedrins. camby is old and in decline, kaman is an inferior rebounder and doesn’t score as efficiently, bogut is closer in terms of rebouding, but still lacks biedrins’ scoring efficiency and isn’t any better on defense, and if you want david west on this team, you just haven’t been watching david west for years. he doesn’t rebound, he doesn’t score efficiently, he doesn’t pass well and he’s not a good defender.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
smith/horford aren’t really a “scoring bigman” tandem. they are a rebounding, defense tandem and a very effective one at that. KG’s biggest strength is far and away his rebounding and defense. beasley spends a lot of his time at the 3 and jermaine o’neal has been dead for years. martin/nene, again, it’s about defense, rebounding and scoring efficiency. boozer isn’t even the best power forward on his own team and might not even be the 2nd best.
there are plenty of models to win basketball games. if your backcourt scores as well as ours does, you just need a big man to make shots when gets them (andris does), rebound like crazy (definite check for andris), pass the ball well (yep) and play some d (andris does, but if we could replace him with a better defender who meets the other criteria, that’d be fine with me). andris isn’t the problem.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
Ok but are we actually willing to get rid of Randolph or Wright?
I would think we’ll all go crazy if we traded Randolph away. I do somewhat remember a poll saying that a majority of people would like to see a major trade go down… And all I could see is trading away one of our front court players.
by bojangles408 on Jan 25, 2010 2:04 PM PST up reply actions
every avenue should be considered to make this team better. we have no untouchables.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
No untouchables
as good as those two are/are going to be, there are still no untouchable pieces on this team.
by Reverend_Randy on Jan 26, 2010 12:47 AM PST up reply actions
I’ll accept an argument that Randolph is the most untouchable piece we have because of his potential (but he is still touchable, he just isn’t that good right now)….but Curry? Not even close.
by Missing Barry on Jan 26, 2010 6:52 AM PST up reply actions
The Cavs have a scoring big man?
Shaq is scoring a whopping 11 points a game. Hickson a whopping 7. Both are substantially below average players.
Shaq hasn’t been “Shaq” for quite some time. Cleveland would trade Shaq for Biedrins straight up in a heartbeat. They’d throw in Hickson, too.
Garnett is scoring 15 a game. He’s never been a great crunch-time scorer.
Dirk’s offensive game is essentially that of a small forward. He’s not a traditional post player. Jermaine O’neal is also not really a “scoring big man” at this point in his career.
wow your kidding about that shaq trade right?
The cavs are an exception. They have the king… obviously.
by bojangles408 on Jan 25, 2010 8:55 PM PST up reply actions
Not at all.
Cleveland is not happy with Shaq, he’s to big and not in good enough shape to run with LeBron. Shaq also hasn’t really learned how to deal with the fact that he’s not the alpha dog.
They would look at Biedrins and say: Wow, he rebounds like a madman, plays solid defense, and finishes at a very high rate whenever LeBron dumps him the ball.
The cavs are an exception. They have the king… obviously.
Hahahahahahahaha.
Haha ha.
You didn’t list them as an “Exception” above. You said they had big men who could score. You used them to buttress your argument, and now you’re backtracking hard.
Uhhh
To say Shaq isn’t a scoring big man is just stupid because he actually looks for his shot. And they got Shaq for a reason… to defend bigs like Dwight Howard. Do you even know anything about other teams than the Warriors?
by bojangles408 on Jan 25, 2010 11:06 PM PST up reply actions
He looks for his own shot
but he only takes a handful of them a game. It’s hardly fair to count him.
by Reverend_Randy on Jan 26, 2010 12:48 AM PST up reply actions
Eh he still does score at a decent rate, it’s more that he just doesn’t play that many minutes a game…
by Missing Barry on Jan 26, 2010 6:53 AM PST up reply actions
But that amounts to the same thing ...
It means the majority of the game, they don’t have a scoring big man on the floor.
Yes. Have you noticed Shaq's mobility lately?
Or, rather, his lack of mobility? He’s not much of a defender anymore.
Disagreements:
Steph is a very promising rookie, but he’s still a rookie and still figuring the game out. I love his potential.
Monta is not playing anywhere near all-star level, he’s missing way too many shots.
Maggette is playing very well, But the most efficient small forward in the league? Really? Let’s look at some other small forwards int he league:
Paul Pierce. LeBron James. Lamar Odom. Kevin Durant. Andrei Kirilenko.
Now, don’t get me wrong – that’s a pretty august group of players. So, yes, the list of guys who are playing better than him is pretty small.
I said efficient
I didn’t say better. Look at their shooting percentage and get back to me on that one.
by bojangles408 on Jan 25, 2010 1:42 PM PST up reply actions
I believe Maggette is leading the entire NBA in scoring efficiency, so that would be correct if efficiency is specific to scoring efficiency…
by Missing Barry on Jan 25, 2010 2:05 PM PST up reply actions
I think Mags might have the highest TS% among all players in the NBA
not just small forwards
by Reverend_Randy on Jan 25, 2010 6:31 PM PST up reply actions
That list is pretty funny considering most of those guys aren’t much offensively, or even if they are, don’t provide much of a post presence. Ironically enough, Houston actually DOES have good interior scoring between Scola and Landry. Biedrins is not the problem. Sure, we’d be better off if we found someone better than him, it’s certainly a worthy goal, but he does a lot to help us win. Scoring points is only one of many things a player can do to help his team win, and Biedrins even did that fairly well last season, scoring a very respectable 14 points per 36 minutes with very high efficiency. More than a bum like LaMarcus Aldridge can say. It’s better than Hickson has ever done. It’s better than what Beasley does. It’s fairly comparable to Horford. It’s better than what Kenyon Martin does. It’s not much worse than Jermaine O’Neal….and that’s all just in terms of scoring. If Biedrins gets back to the level he was at last year (do you see any reason why he won’t?), he easily matches a number of those players in terms of scoring, and is better than them at the other things that help us win games. Repeat aftrer me: Andris Biedrins is not the problem.
Ok so if you think Biedrins isn't the problem then
our Power Forward has to be the problem. Then get rid of Randolph and Wright and get a veteran presence. Are we actually willing to do that? No, probably not but then were just going to have to wait it out because there isn’t really anything else we can do. Why even try to mess with our back court that is doing tremendously well. If you guys aren’t willing to make a move then why do we even care about getting a new owner? Geez…
by bojangles408 on Jan 25, 2010 1:56 PM PST up reply actions
we need an upgrade, sure, but to say that we need more scoring is crazy. we need better rebounding, defense and to get healthy. i think we should look to upgrade every position, but singling out biedrins doesn’t make sense. we just don’t have a #1 guy on the team. we have no untouchables and if anyone on this team could be dealt to bring in a “best player on a contender type” you do it. bosh is the closest we’ve seen to that, but considering that he might not resign after this season, we’d have to be very, very cautious about that.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
Our two biggest problems are 1.) health and 2.) we don’t have a superstar. Your 2-3 best players determine how good you are. We’re still looking for someone that can be the man. Our backcourt doesn’t have it. Our frontcourt doesn’t have it. 5 decent players don’t make for a good team. 2 superstars and 3 scrubs make for a better team.
by Missing Barry on Jan 25, 2010 2:06 PM PST up reply actions
exactly!!
If we can land a superstar big man our team can really rise to new heights.
by bojangles408 on Jan 25, 2010 2:07 PM PST up reply actions
same can be said about adding a superstar backcourt player.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
In a couple of years Monta and Curry
Will be our star back court players :)
by bojangles408 on Jan 25, 2010 2:10 PM PST up reply actions
they should be good, but i do not expect either one of them to be “lead a team to the finals good” at any point in their careers. it’s a nice backcourt, not an untouchable backcourt.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
We can't give up on our back court
No way we try and trade Curry and Monta away after all this drama they put us through. No way I’d give up now on those two… A movie can be made about the drama that’s happened between these two and how everything has panned out up to today. We love these two guys too much to see them go and they still haven’t reached their potential.
by bojangles408 on Jan 25, 2010 2:16 PM PST up reply actions
i’m not saying “give up on them” just that if a monta and biedrins for chris bosh signed to a reasonable extension, i’d do that. trading two good supporting players for someone who cuuld be The Man on a great team is worth considering.
a bosh/randolph/maggs/morrow/curry with wright/ronny/buike/draft pick/cheap backcourt addition looks better than biedrins/randolph/maggs/monta/curry and the same bench. of course, i think that the warriors should be able to compete for the playoffs next year with what we have (plus a clean bill of health). an upgrade from that puts us in pretty good shape.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
oops, typo:
if a monta and biedrins for chris bosh signed to a reasonable extension deal became available, i’d do that
important to note that such a deal doesn’t seem particularly likely, just that if it was on the table, i’d take it.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
Wow actually I would love that trade
If we can guarantee Chris Bosh sign with us our team would actually have the size and firepower to have very good shooting compliments to surround Bosh.
by bojangles408 on Jan 25, 2010 8:57 PM PST up reply actions
WOW
Bosh has yet to be winner in this league and to give up our starting center and Monta is just too much. Steph isn’t quite ready to be a 20ppg scorer. Turiaf and Monta plus expiring, sure. But no way Beans and Monta. If Bosh goes somewhere and still has to be considered their center they’re not gonna be contenders. He needs to be playing with a center who plays D and stays out of his way when he’s posting up. Biedrins would be great along side him.
It’s not like the Raptors have made the playoffs 2 of the last 3 seasons or anything, including a 47 win season (before they got all those horrible rebounding white dudes who can’t play defense). Yeah, Chris Bosh has yet to be a winner.
by Missing Barry on Jan 26, 2010 8:47 PM PST up reply actions
Yeah, I’m not sure that Bosh will ever be the #1 guy on a contender, but I think he’s got a fair shot at it. I have no such confidence in Monta or Andris, so I’ll roll the dice on a trade that brings us a guy that as of right now, is a borderline superstar.
Also, doesn’t a Randolph/Bosh frontline sound great to you? Super long, athletic, quick. I’m in for watching that night in night out.
heart of a champion, will of the warrior.
I’m not sure he’s good enough for that, either, at least not without a couple of other pretty decent talents around him, but I don’t think it takes much talent around Bosh to at least give you a perennial playoff team….and man, would that be a welcome change for a Warriors fan…
by Missing Barry on Jan 26, 2010 9:53 PM PST up reply actions
Dude they play in the EAST
He stays in Toront and he’s liable to be the next T-Mac. Both playoff appearances were first round exits and theres no reason this year will be different cause they are nowhere close to being better than Boston, Cleveland, Orlando, or Atlanta. Do you consider T-Mac a winner? Bosh is a great player but he’ll never be as valuable to a team as KG is/was because he doesn’t have that defensive ability. Therefore if he is not playing beside a defensive center he may as well be playing with your boy Al Jeff. I would love to have Bosh here but no way at the expense of Monta and Beans. Would you rather have Turiaf or Beans? I know Andris is more limited offensively but i’d rather have him starting alongside Bosh than Ronny. With Randolph as the backup pf/c we’d be lethal down low.
I’m not sure what we’re really even talking about anymore. Bosh is a much, much better offensive player than Al Jefferson. No, he’s not the best player in the league, or top 5, but he is good. He can’t help it if most of his teammates are awful. If you replaced KG with Bosh….Boston would still be a very, very good team, so I’m not sure what the point of looking at how good his team is. So…anyways, I guess that’s all I have to say.
by Missing Barry on Jan 28, 2010 7:13 PM PST up reply actions
I just want a superstar in general, though I’d prefer it to be a big man rather than a guard.
by Missing Barry on Jan 25, 2010 2:25 PM PST up reply actions
+1
I forgot to mention that all the teams I listed has a superstar/star
by bojangles408 on Jan 25, 2010 2:26 PM PST up reply actions
Our power forward spot IS the problem ...
Because the team keeps running Maggette out at that position, where he gets horribly outrebounded.
We don’t need to "get rid of " Randolph and Wright … we need to get them on the floor as see what they can do.
As you might have noticed, Nellie doesn’t like traditional lineups very much. Notice how few minutes we’ve seen Biedrins and Randolph on the floor together? Or Turiaf and Randolph? Even when everyone was healthy.
Wright, of course, has been injured all year.
Coaching AND FO
Also some defense would be nice
Rookie: "Why did you bench me?"
Nellie: "You're a rookie"
Curry ROY?
Don’t count on it bojangles!
Tyreke “Too Easy” Evans is Rookie Of The Year!!!!
"I dont just go tatoo any muthafucka on my chest! dis is ma life line! my LEGACY!!!
Golden Curry
Will beat him to it buddy! If we go on a run and catch up to the Kings, Curry will take it!
by bojangles408 on Jan 25, 2010 8:59 PM PST up reply actions
Simply will not happen bojangles!
Tyreke is averaging 20.8 points a game! 5 rebounds and 5 assist! Only 3 other rookies ever to average that in the history of The NBA = Oscar Robertson, Michael Jordan, and Lebron James. Tyreke also has 2 game winners under his belt!! Curry might become second runner, but Tyreke is definitely the favorite!
"I dont just go tatoo any muthafucka on my chest! dis is ma life line! my LEGACY!!!
The return of Speed Racer signals the end of Tyreke's massive statistical dominance
by Reverend_Randy on Jan 26, 2010 1:51 AM PST up reply actions
Don't Think so Reverend!!
Kevin knows it’s Tyreke’s team…
It’s that simple, Tyreke will still continue his massive statistical dominance!
"I dont just go tatoo any muthafucka on my chest! dis is ma life line! my LEGACY!!!
boooooooooooooo!!!!
We’ll see tonight Slamson!
by bojangles408 on Jan 26, 2010 9:08 AM PST up reply actions
Haha see Slamson
Told you Steph is better!!! He wins!!
by bojangles408 on Jan 27, 2010 10:27 AM PST up reply actions
We should give the existing roster a chance
before looking for another trade. Let’s wait for the existing team to be 100% healthy and give it a chance to mold together. I REALLY BELIEVE THE PLAYERS WE HAVE NOW CAN COMPETE WITH THE ELITE TEAMS. THEY HAVE PROVEN IT NUMEROUS TIMES. Management once again, in my opinion, is REACTING as oppose to being PRO-ACTIVE. There were many close games that could have gone the other way (a win for us), but did not. But the fact that those games were close is a testament that the existing roster can compete with ANYONE in the NBA. Many of the games we lost were also attributed to “self-inflicting” turnovers… it is not like we got beat because we suck. I also believe that if the team was at least 80% healtlhy, more than 50% of the games we lost would have been wins. Not only does this team have quality talentS, the players seem to really get along with each other. There are NO EGOS to nurture… and SOONER than later, that spells “SUCCESS” in the very near future.
As far as Biedrins is concern, I disagree with your assesment. I think he is doing what he is suppose to do and that is to defend, rebound and block, anything more is extra. We have more than enough players who can score.
Let’s wait for the team to be 100% healthy and then talk about trades.
In the poll, notice how few think Nelson is the problem?
Thank god some sanity is being restored to the blogosphere.
Good because it isn't his fault
It’s all of the injuries and young bball IQ of this Warrior team. Come on, we all smack our heads every single game and wonder how the hell can they do that?!
by bojangles408 on Jan 26, 2010 9:12 AM PST up reply actions
Nellie is a problem, he just isn’t the biggest problem.
by Missing Barry on Jan 26, 2010 9:34 AM PST up reply actions
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