RECAP #18: San Antonio Spurs 118, Golden State Warriors 98 - A Slow Death
by Fantasy Junkie on Dec 1, 2010 1:00 AM PST
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Messed around and got a triple double...15pts, 18rebs, 11asts
Final Boxscore | Game Thread | Game Day Links
Well that was fun. And by fun I mean torturous, painful, and frustrating. The Spurs do that to you. There should be a warning for Warriors fans when watching the Warriors play the Spurs - "Warning: watching the Spurs smash on your Warriors will be hazardous to your health (and any confidence you once had in them)." The Warriors have now lost 8 straight to the Spurs. The last time the Warriors beat the Spurs was nearly 2 years ago, January 8, 2008.
The Spurs didn't build a big lead quickly against the Warriors and then just cruise to a 20 point win like the Lakers do. They let the Warriors stick around and every now and then would add a point to their lead. After the first quarter, you just kept hoping for a Warriors run because the game was still within reach, but no run came. The Spurs just wouldn't allow the Warriors to make that run. The Warriors stayed close enough to have hope, but never were able to get close to be a threat.
I hate the Spurs. I wish we had their coach and their players. But then all the big men would be injured. And I would hate them all over again.
The Little Things
This game would have been closer had the Warriors done the little things better.
For instance, the Warriors actually had the lead at 26-23 with 50 seconds to go in the first. But then Gary Neal tied it with a 3, the Warriors missed a shot, and then Ginobili came down and shot a 3. He missed it, but Monta was called for the foul (doesn't that seem to happen to him a lot?) and after having a calm, polite, and respectful discussion with the ref, Monta was T'd up. 4 free throws made, the Warriors were down 26-30, and the Warriors never had a chance. Again, the little things. First off, don't foul a 3pt shooter and second, don't make it worse by getting a T.
Another example, Richard Jefferson on a breakaway and Monta fouls him resulting in a clear path foul for 2 shots and the ball. Either get back on D or let him go. And by the way, RJ is a punk. Who swings on the rim after a dunk and then tries and straddle another player. He clearly aimed to straddle David Lee when he could have just dropped to the ground. Udoh should have knocked his teeth out. If this was baseball, the next time these two teams meet, someone would get beaned. You might just see a hard foul in San Antonio when these two teams meet.
Not trying to pick on Monta, but those are two instances that stick out in my mind where the Warriors make boneheaded plays and give away points.
Business-Like
Barnett and Fitz summed up the Spurs quite appropriately as "business-like". That really is a good description of how they play.
On offense, the Spurs get to the spots they want and make open shots. They're patient. If they need to take all 24 seconds, they take all 24 seconds. They're precise. Each play is run well and the players get to the spots they're supposed to. If you sag off, they hit the open shot. If you're too aggressive, they backdoor you for a layup or an alley oop.
On defense, they keep you out of the lane and challenge every shot. Curry had trouble penetrating the paint and either settled for the floater from 12 feet or passed out to a shooter. And oftentimes when he did pass out to the shooter, someone had a hand in the shooter's face.
They're players are just so damn good.
- Manu Ginobili was tough to stop on offense and a real pest on defense.
- Tim Duncan was Tim Duncan mixed with a little John Stockton. DeJuan Blair did what you expect, get in the paint and grab boards.
- They also get help from the bench. Gary Neal? Dude had 14 points in 18 minutes.
- And then George Hill came in and got fouled a bunch of times going 8-9 from the line.
Adjusting to Monta?
Are opponents figuring out how to make life difficult for Monta? In his last 6 games he's shot over 45% just once. In his previous 12 games, he did that 10 times. I feel like teams are sending an extra defender daring the other Warriors to beat them.
Free Throws
If you look at the boxscore, there's not much of a disparity in any of the stats except assists and free throws. The huge disparity in free throws has become a common theme. The Spurs were 27-31 while the Warriors were 11-18. A 16 point difference in free throws makes such a huge difference. The Warriors foul too much and the don't get to the line enough. You can blame the refs for a few calls here and there, but when it's a consistent theme through the first quarter of the season, you have to look at the players. There are numerous reasons, but from what I see, on defense, they're out of position and reaching while on offense they get happy shooting jumpers and don't know how to draw contact inside.
Stephen Curry with the big scoring night (32 points) or Andris Biedrins with the big rebound night (18 rebounds)? It's hard to pick between the two and it really doesn't matter with the blowout loss, but I'm going with Biedrins for the rebounds and helping keep Duncan to just 6-15 shooting. Curry's 5TO's didn't help. Curry scored a ton and kept the Warriors in the game, but if not for Biedrins rebounds, the Warriors get slaughtered on the boards and lose by 50.
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This one hurt.
And it’s not like it wasn’t expected either. Why didn’t Monta play the 4th Q? Our defense = charmin soft. Offense couldn’t penetrate our create any driving lanes. More PnR’s maybe? I dunno, we got spanked in our own yard. We lacked intensity tonight. It was nowhere to be found. I hope this isn’t the beginning of some longterm thing. Oh well, S Curry for All Star?
"I thought it was going in," Warriors center Chris Hunter said. "It looked like the invisible man tipped it away at the last second."
Speakin of the P-n-R
Anyone else notice how easy the Spurs made it look against us?
Our execution sucks!
Does the team need more practice time, a better coach, or what?!
"Trade Radmanovic. We don’t even want nobody for you, we’ll let you go. Just get off our team".
-Mistah FAB
by Duby Dub Dubs on Dec 1, 2010 3:07 PM PST up reply actions
a better coach
would make the practice time more efficient and beneficial and actually teach something to his players
"Basketball is like war in that offensive weapons are developed first, and it always takes a while for the defense to catch up." - Red Auerbach
"These young guys are playing checkers. I'm out there playing chess." - Kobe Bryant
Was at the game
Crowd was relatively small. The RJ “straddle”, live, didn’t look intentional. It didn’t help that Lee didn’t attempt to help Wright after he got screened, which led to his near facial. It also didn’t help that we were down big at that time.
At this point in the season; Monta and Dorrell are cooling off, Lee is not at 100%, Radman is being useless as usual, we have 2 injured forwards, Coach Smart is being just adequate. Curry is still the biggest bright spot.
I had low to mid expectations coming into the season. Sample size is getting larger even though the data has been skewed by the several injuries. I don’t see us getting above .500 for the rest of the season to be honest. Here’s our schedule for the next 2 and a half weeks.
vs PHO
@ OKC
@ DAL
@ SAS
vs MIA
@ UTA
vs MIN
@ POR
I see maybe 2-3 winnable games and with a little bit of luck maybe more. Barring another trade, it looks like another losing season unless this current group of Dubs get it turned around. The upcoming draft class at the moment is relatively weak as well and lady luck ain’t with us.
"I tell him straight, 'If you're going to lead, you have to be the first to practice. You have to come in, get your work down and be prepared for practice,' " assistant coach Keith Smart said. "He needs to figure out why he is having stomach problems and he's got to watch how LeBron (James), Kobe (Bryant) and D-Wade (Dwyane Wade) work. He needs to mimic that if he wants his teammates to speak volumes about him." -Keith Smart on Motna Ellis
Was there- was a BIG crowd actually.
Announced over 17,000, too. Not sure it was THAT big. Lots of SPurs fans. People sitting near our seats change every game. Lots of “fans” skiping games/didn’t renew seaons tix or something.
Anyway, Dorell Wright is trash. Total moron chucker. TERRIBLE defense and fouling. Just atrocious. Curry was abused, Monta was abused, Lee was abused, everyone was abused. Spurs let Curry shoot all he wanted and he did. Before he realized what hit him (and the fans) game was out of reach. Oh well, at least he got his stats!
Monta now turning the ball over less than Curry on the season. Nice improvement.
http://twitter.com/#!/CC_Warriors
If I try to understand what you are saying what I hear is,, " The Warriors lost the game because Curry scored a lot of points while shooting %59".
What a brilliant strategy by Pops. Hey, whatever works I guess.
I label you a hater because this makes no sense whatsoever.
Over
by cybermaldonado on Dec 1, 2010 12:20 PM PST up reply actions 4 recs
Actually it makes a lot of sense
Pop learned from Nellie.
Remember last year when we beat the Suns by “letting” Steve Nash go for 36?
http://www.goldenstateofmind.com/2009/12/27/1220678/recap-warriors-132-suns-127-big
by WheresMyChippy on Dec 1, 2010 1:58 PM PST up reply actions
Curry and Nash are different
It coulda been me, oh yeah it coulda been me.
by Reverend_Randy on Dec 1, 2010 2:09 PM PST up reply actions
Curry and Nash are different
Still, a fair comparison.
Both are really supposed to be able to get their offense when needed, but mostly facilitate other guys getting buckets. Take away the facilitation, and you end up with a one-dimensional threat. Seems easier to plan for…
Also, in support of this argument as a game plan: the Spurs kill us all the time
"Trade Radmanovic. We don’t even want nobody for you, we’ll let you go. Just get off our team".
-Mistah FAB
by Duby Dub Dubs on Dec 1, 2010 3:10 PM PST up reply actions
It's a lot harder to stop Nash, IMO.
His threat as a playmaker makes him a tougher to guard.
"I thought it was going in," Warriors center Chris Hunter said. "It looked like the invisible man tipped it away at the last second."
Actually, one could make the argument that Curry is a better scorer than distributor.
So the correct play would be to force him into being a playmaker.
The notion that our opponents want Curry to light it up is just silly. If anybody is game-planning for us that hard, it’s really obvious what the game plan is:
Get MONTA to be selfish.
Monta has a proven history of turning into a chucker at the wrong moment, of forcing shots.
I don't agree with most of your post
But your point on turnovers and Currys points are true. He tacked on a lot, when the game was near over. Won’t knock him, good shooting is good shooting. Loved his step back on Duncan, but the turnovers NEED to stop.
But your point on turnovers and Currys [sic] points are true.
The point about Curry’s points is yours, not our resident troll’s. It’s not a particularly fair point, imho, given that only 5 points of Curry’s 32 points when the game was fully out of reach. (His three-pointer at 6:48 brought the Ws within 12 points, which at the time felt at least somewhat like striking distance).
the turnovers NEED to stop.
Don’t hold your breath. Point guards turn the ball over. Curry’s currently turning the ball over at a lower rate than, for example, Nash, Deron, and Rose. A better wish is for him to get his assist rate up to the 7-8 ast/36 rate that we expect of elite point guards. I’d lay some of the blame for his shortcomings in this respect on him, some on the newness of this starting 5, and some on Smart and the coaching staff’s inability to draw up more simple bread-and-butter offensive plays. I’d guess that a few extra P&R’s with Lee and Biedrins per game would inch him closer to that elusive “true PG” assist rate. We’ll see.
There will be no extra point!
And if we wanna continue the blame train, let’s make sure to include Biedrins incredibly phobia of finishing at the rim as well. Compare it to when Biedrins was playing with Baron and that’s possibly your assist differential right there.
Though you’re right… it was the point I was trying to get at, maybe I was unclear…. the assist to turnover ratio is just not good for a starting PG.
Marking an assist also relies on having competent scorers around you. There were a few assists left on the floor with bad misses. There was also a couple of times where Steph started a good move but didn’t get the A because he was one passer off. He’s not the best PG right now but I like his development.
Yeah I'm glad you mentioned the assists with the TO rate.
I was going to rage back by saying “But those guys get so many more open looks for their guys!”
And also, I don’t see why we should be talking about Curry this game. He was the only one to show up offensively. It may or may not be Smart’s fault, but this team took the Spurs’ first punch well. But it was their second and third punch to the mouth that we couldn’t come back from. Our team folded which is really sad to see because it brings back so many memories of 1996-2006, 2008-current.
On defense I think we need to tell Andris, Lee (whoever big is out there) to put more pressure on their man when they have the ball. They played Duncan soft and voila! He had a freaking triple double for the first time since 2003. Our defense really doesn’t get into anyone’s face, so therefore I’m going to label them SOFT until I see change.
"I thought it was going in," Warriors center Chris Hunter said. "It looked like the invisible man tipped it away at the last second."
man i remember the last time we beat the spurs pretty vividly
i wasnt living in oakland at the time, i was living in florida, but i was VISITING in oakland and it was a big deal and i was glad :)
Evanz...
It would be extra cool if you posted these as a fan shot after each game.
Another unsolicited thought: it would be helpful if you posted the plain vanilla box score as well (just to provide more info at a glance on your page
but thanks!
"Trade Radmanovic. We don’t even want nobody for you, we’ll let you go. Just get off our team".
-Mistah FAB
by Duby Dub Dubs on Dec 1, 2010 3:16 PM PST up reply actions
Smart's offense really sucks.
And we could definitely use Maggette right now.
by GovernorStephCurry on Dec 1, 2010 7:57 AM PST reply actions
Yeah.....
No….
The San Francisco 49ers, inventing new ways to lose every week!
Mike Singletary: Doing the same thing week in and week out expecting a different result.
by Badly Browned on Dec 1, 2010 8:13 AM PST up reply actions
Smart's defense really sucks too
We could use Jack right now
by diggitydawg510 on Dec 1, 2010 8:23 AM PST up reply actions
Maggette Love = Cred Fail
I staged a long Maggette signing defense back in the day over on RealGM. It was epic. I still feel dirty. I was postings ROWELL then and saying Salary Protection good, Everything’s Fine, we’re headed in the right direction under Bobby Rowell’s watch.
No. But he’s still running the show.
http://twitter.com/#!/CC_Warriors
We could use...
Dorell and Biedrins not acting like they are in the WNBA when they go to the rim.
So much shying from contact from the whole team, but particularly those two. It’s one thing if it’s Curry or Monta who finish at elite levels when creating seperation at the rim. Everyone else should look to draw contact.
Heck if you’re gonna miss it atleast get some free throws!
our free throw differential is just gross
no excuses, our guys are just NOT good at drawing the type of contact that gets a foul called. Even more frustrating is the fact that there is a lot of contact on most of the Steph and Monta drives
"Trade Radmanovic. We don’t even want nobody for you, we’ll let you go. Just get off our team".
-Mistah FAB
by Duby Dub Dubs on Dec 1, 2010 3:12 PM PST up reply actions
Gov Steph?! I think your account may have been hacked
WTF?
"Trade Radmanovic. We don’t even want nobody for you, we’ll let you go. Just get off our team".
-Mistah FAB
by Duby Dub Dubs on Dec 1, 2010 3:17 PM PST up reply actions
Maggs was really, really good at getting to the line. Aside from his bad contract, he would be helping us a ton coming off the bench right now.
Sittin in my scraper watchin Oakland goin wild, ta-dow!
oh sure, not saying that he wouldn't contribute
Just suprised that the Gov is giving him any love at all.
Maggs as a 6th man?
…ok. Seems like we are asking Reggie to pretty much fill that role
"Trade Radmanovic. We don’t even want nobody for you, we’ll let you go. Just get off our team".
-Mistah FAB
by Duby Dub Dubs on Dec 1, 2010 4:56 PM PST up reply actions
I don’t like him that much, but for 20 minutes a game off the bench, he’d be perfect. But i’m glad he’s gone. Way too much money.
by GovernorStephCurry on Dec 1, 2010 7:16 PM PST up reply actions
Maggs! Im glad his gone too
Not only the money but he is one black hole to our offense. It is good we got to the foul line and penalty situation. But closing out game Maggs is not the man you can count on. The Bucks are little bit learning that right now. That they can’t have Maggete during crunch time. Because being Maggs try to get a foul on a crucial time but ref did not blow his whistle the offense fail.
Win Or Lose Warriors For Life.........
Maggete
You act like it was your money. Better one Maggete than a plethora of Rads, Wrights and wrongs.
If we were talking about this year only, I'd agree with you.
But I’d much rather have the flexibility/cap space after this year.
Teams are keeping 2-3 guys on Monta
Forcing him to shoot jumpers, we need our other guys to start scaring teams, mainly our bench. Curry and DW can only hit so many jumpers and Lee isn’t really going to carry an offense .
We need to start running more again to open it up, but mainly make a trade with expirings for a 6th man.
"There is nothing like a wise phrase or quote to help convince others that your decision makes sense." - Anon
"If you're ever in a fair fight, then your tactics suck." ಠ_ಠ
If Monta is really getting double teamed every play, he shouldn’t be shooting at all. He doesn’t have the skill or talent to beat that much defensive attention by himself consistently.
It coulda been me, oh yeah it coulda been me.
by Reverend_Randy on Dec 1, 2010 2:12 PM PST up reply actions
Minnesota game he had 10
The thing is the jumpers aren’t really bad shots, it’s just they take away the drive
"There is nothing like a wise phrase or quote to help convince others that your decision makes sense." - Anon
"If you're ever in a fair fight, then your tactics suck." ಠ_ಠ
They're bad shots if he isn't wide open.
He’s taking 6.7 long twos a game and only connecting on 39% of them.
It coulda been me, oh yeah it coulda been me.
by Reverend_Randy on Dec 1, 2010 5:47 PM PST up reply actions
All the doom and gloom
My take in looking at the schedule is we have a matchup problem with a handful of teams like the Lakers, Celts, and the Spurs. Other than that we can play and beat everyone else. Phoenix at our house? OKC? scare us? Portland? Minnesota? Come on. Hell we even already beat Utah. Point st other than the Spurs in SA, all the other games are winnable. I expect us to beat Phoenix at home. We have no match up problems with that team. Looking at the standings we are 1/2 game out of 8th in the West and the teams we are battling for the 8th spot ALL have issues and problems, so I am not ready to throw in the towe. Not when we are about to get back Amundson and Udoh and our rotations will be much better and our bench will be able to bring it.. Ok? So back away from the ledge. Things are actually looking better than you would think.
by OmnipotentOne on Dec 1, 2010 9:01 AM PST reply actions 1 recs
Exactly.
Right now, the very elite teams are better than us.
This is news to anyone? It’s not a cause for panic. Even the most optimistic Warrior fans didn’t expect us to be championship contenders this year. (Although I admit that I’m really impressed by how the Spurs are holding on – I expected them to slip).
If the Spurs are healthy they have a real chance at knocking off the Lakers
Their big 3 (Duncan, Manu, Parker) are old vets who have been playing together forever, who did not have any offseason basketball, and a coach to absolutely emphasizes playing basketball the right way.
No real reason to panic losing to these guys. Even without Duncan we’d be knocked silly.
The San Francisco 49ers, inventing new ways to lose every week!
Mike Singletary: Doing the same thing week in and week out expecting a different result.
by Badly Browned on Dec 1, 2010 11:32 AM PST up reply actions
In my opinion, Pop is the best coach in the NBA
And you forgot Richard Jefferson rediscovering his game. .642 TS% from RJ, wow
And who says the Spurs are boring?
Almost every scrap player they get does pretty good in their defined role.
Spurs are still my second favorite team. They probably won’t even need to rebuild after Duncan retires. They have such a deep squad it’s ridiculous.
"I thought it was going in," Warriors center Chris Hunter said. "It looked like the invisible man tipped it away at the last second."
Spurs are still my second favorite team. They probably won’t even need to rebuild after Duncan retires
I must have missed it but who is Duncan’s replacement?
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Dec 1, 2010 9:32 PM PST up reply actions
THIAGO SPLITTER!
But really, he was the most hyped player to come from Europe since Scola and before him, Ginobili. He’s been off to a slow start, but with Spurs international track record, his track record overseas I have a hard time seeing him not being atleast a compitent NBA starting big. Duncan? No, but he could be good.
Besides no training camp (injury) his per 26 isn’t bad… 14.4 ppg, 7.8rpg and a .573 ts%.
Though his european rebound totals have also never been impressive,, he does have a variety of nice offensive post moves, protects rim reasonably (from what ive seen) well
Although I admit that I’m really impressed by how the Spurs are holding on – I expected them to sli
Why? Them and Boston if healthy are as good as any team in a 7 game series. Health of course being the key issue, but people overrate the age issue when it becomes playoff time. Game every other day, slower pace.. favors the vets.
Age.
I expected Manu and Duncan to decline a bit. Duncan, in particular, was looking like he was starting to slip last year. RJ seemed like a desperate stopgap last year.
Instead, RJ has integrated himself into the offense and looks great, and Duncan even looks sharper than he did last year. Manu is being Manu (man, I hate that guy – I’m not remotely convinced Monta touched him on that end-of-the-half foul, but he jerked his arm like he was fouled).
I love Manu, so crafty and intelligent. And he’s been amazing this year. (Note: No Bias, he’s carrying my fantasy team right now)
But in all seriousness, Manu looked excellent last few months of last year when he was healthy. The signs pointed to him bouncing back as he’s not a player based on athleticism.
I think, Parker and RJ particularly are reason Duncan looks so sharp. He really doesn’t need to expend much energy on offense of play in the post. So he can just score in rhythm and save his energy for defensive end. Add DeJuan. McDyess, Bonner and Splitter in the post. He has more help than he’s had in past, so they can limit his minutes a la Garnett.
I’d love to see them knock of Lakers, just to hear Phil cry after losing to Pop (coach he hates)
The only time I root for the Spurs is when they're playing the Lakers.
Otherwise it feels like rooting for the clock to tick.
I really hate the way they basically cheated their way past the Suns a couple of years back. Bruce Bowen was one of my least favorite NBA players, and I generally hate the way Manu brings soccer-style flopping to basketball.
I absolutely freakin’ hate the guys who flop and yell to get calls – Manu and Kobe are two of the worst offenders, in my opinion. Also, Duncan’s bug-eyed, “What, how could you possibly call a foul on me?” attitude annoys me – I’ve seen games where Duncan did that after every freakin’ call.
(I have no problem with players who argue foul calls when it’s a marginal call – but you know what, when you foul the guy and the ref blows his whistle, take your freakin’ medicine. Besides which, I think it’s bad strategy: back when I played organized sports, I took the attitude that if you developed a reputation for not arguing calls, when you DID argue one the ref would think he missed a call and be more likely to give you a make-up call.)
I hate the Spurs. I hate the way they play. I hate Ginobli. I would hate Duncan if hating inaminate objects made sense. I root for the Lakers when they play the Spurs. Grrrrr. LGW…still.
Sittin in my scraper watchin Oakland goin wild, ta-dow!
really?
I don’t know if I “love” the Spurs, but I respect the hell out of them. They play the game exactly the way it should be played.
I don't consider Manu to be a player who plays the game the way it should be played.
Nor Bowen, but of course he’s retired.
Make sure to wash after rooting for the Lakers. Don't know what you might catch.
Hatin’ on the Spurs?! Whaaat? I guess you like Supafishal basketball.
JP man, Spurs are awesome. They’re like the Patriots of basketball. They just run their franchise the right way. Maybe their organizational philosophy is “what wouldn’t the Warriors do, and we’ll do that”.
"I thought it was going in," Warriors center Chris Hunter said. "It looked like the invisible man tipped it away at the last second."
. I root for the Lakers when they play the Spurs
me too but only because the lakers are from cali and the spurs from tejas.
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Dec 1, 2010 9:35 PM PST up reply actions
I don't think Duncan was slipping last year.
He just played around 30 minutes or so, right? Sure he’s not 20/10 anymore, but per 36 I am sure there’s not a huge difference.
"I thought it was going in," Warriors center Chris Hunter said. "It looked like the invisible man tipped it away at the last second."
Sure. But that's slipping.
If you used to play 35 minutes a game and now you play 30, that’s a big part of it.
'matchup problem' goes deeper
if the opposing 2 guard out scores Ellis, the team will have trouble getting an edge elsewhere. Deng in Chi, Salmons in Mil aren’t considered ‘stars’ on Ellis’ level, but essentially neutralized GS’ usual advantage. The team could use a strong d, veteran wing to take some minutes from both Ellis and Wright #1, but only have Radmanovic and Carney.
Music is the Healing Force of the Universe (a.ayler)
We definitely need wing depth
But I’m undecided if we need a scorer type or a defender type. Ideally someone who does both well, but that sounds like a starter.
Well Phoenix beat us
Now the schedule will get alot harder
"I tell him straight, 'If you're going to lead, you have to be the first to practice. You have to come in, get your work down and be prepared for practice,' " assistant coach Keith Smart said. "He needs to figure out why he is having stomach problems and he's got to watch how LeBron (James), Kobe (Bryant) and D-Wade (Dwyane Wade) work. He needs to mimic that if he wants his teammates to speak volumes about him." -Keith Smart on Motna Ellis
Well that was fun?
Yeah, always nice to watch a team that really knows how to play the complete game.
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Dec 1, 2010 11:08 AM PST reply actions
Even better if the team they’re playing “really knows how to play the complete game” as well.
Golden State of Mind: Unstoppable Baby!
by Fantasy Junkie on Dec 1, 2010 1:05 PM PST up reply actions
Even better if the team they’re playing "really knows how to play the complete game" as well.
haha, we take what we can get…
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Dec 1, 2010 9:36 PM PST up reply actions
I don't think people realize
Spurs if healthy, are legitimate title contenders. Manu, Parker and Duncan look healthiest they have in years. Richard Jefferson finally meshed to there system (people forget how good he is), and then there ‘role players’ are awesome. What I’d give for DeJuan Blair and George Hill on this team (pretty sure if we had those two on our bench we have minimum 3 more wins)
If Splitter can just be a solid rotation big, I take them over the Lakers. (Without him, and assuming Bynums healthy, I think LAL will just wear them inside as Duncan can’t go 38 minutes and blair, as aggressive and good as he is, is undersized and can’t match up on Gasol, Odom and Bynum for long stretches)
RC Buford is a man I want. Yes they got Duncan…. Manu, Parker, Hill, Blair all selected outside top 25. Now THATS impressive drafting.
i think it has more to do with the lack of competitiveness in these games vs the Spurs and Lakers. the Twolves at least took the Spurs to OT and played the Lakers respectably one out of two times, the dubs were blown out b/c of their lack of defensive fundamentals in regards to rotations and principles. simple things like not warning a guy that someone is about to screen him from behind then exacerbating it by not body bumping the guy who is coming off the screen to give the man who got screened a chance to recover.
by the evil monkey on Dec 1, 2010 2:23 PM PST up reply actions
Last nights lack of competitiveness can be chalked up to an awful bench
Minnesota and Memphis have better benched than us (sad but true).
We were down 4 at end of first and really should have been up if not for a dumb mental lapse at the end. Then what happened. Bench came in, San Antonio stretched it to double digits and really never looked back (it tussled between 8 and 14 rest of way)
the starters are the ones with the -18’s (Monta, Dorell) and -14’s (Andris, Curry). (DL -9). the things Sean Elliot was pointing out were primarily on them. Lee and Andris repeatedly did the above simple thing that I mentioned, giving up numerous Richard Jefferson dunks. guys repeatedly did not rotate down, allowing Duncan to get easy assists. (the 3-4x it was pointed out happened to be Monta and Carney) – i also remember Curry being late once and ending up on Blair’s backside, making him unable to cut off the pass or even take a foul.
by the evil monkey on Dec 1, 2010 3:02 PM PST up reply actions
A lot of defensive mistakes all around for sure.
Either the Spurs were fooling them all night or the Warriors weren’t playing with their heads in the game. The starters, for the most part lacked that extra “oomph” in their game, and didn’t handle business while the Spurs certainly did. I don’t think the Warriors pressured the Spurs at all. They laid back and played off their man too much all game. The spurs killed them with either clear passing lanes or the open shot.
"I thought it was going in," Warriors center Chris Hunter said. "It looked like the invisible man tipped it away at the last second."
The bench is part of it ...
… but I have to say that we already seem to have displayed a knack for folding once things get tough.
It seems like we tend to pack it in if we don’t think we can be competitive, though. And that bothers me.
Biedrins gets to the line 1.5 times per 48 minutes
The LEAST of any starting center in the NBA by a large stretch. ONLY Channing Frye and Big Z are close (1.8), and they sit on outside and shoot.
So frustrating
on a positive note he did have 18 boards.
by OmnipotentOne on Dec 1, 2010 1:35 PM PST up reply actions
Not an excuse
He can be so much better, but he isn’t right now, minus a random outbreak v. memphis
Not an excuse
He didn’t present it as such. I think it’s fair for him to bring it up as a “positive note” in light of the fact that (a) you have a rich history on this site of hating on Biedrins, and (b) rebounding well is perhaps the single most important quality in a big man — more important than fta. I’d also note that AB for the most part did a solid defensive job on Duncan and Blair.
Clearly, getting to the line more (and sinking his FTs at a better than 50% rate) would take his game to another level. It is frustrating that he can’t seem to take that step. But even if he continues to do what he’s been doing, he’s still a huge net positive for this team, and (imo) well worth his reasonable contract. I’d be happy to trade him for — or supplement him with — someone better, but what available players are there out there who bring his combo of youth, rebounding, defense, and efficiency? And if the answer is “I don’t know” or “no one,” what’s the point in continually beating up on him?
There will be no extra point!
If you want to talk value per contract
Dwight Howard
Al Horford
Joakim Noah
Tim Duncan
Brook Lopez
Emeka Okafor
MArcin Gortat
Andrew Bogut
Marc Gasol
Roy Hibbert
Tyson Chandler
Javale McGee
Nenad Krsic
And thats off top of my head. IN MY OPINION. , yes I’d rather have those players for there dollar amounts over biedrins “great value” as our third highest paid player.
I don’t dislike Biedrins but he has so many holes in his game which he shouldn’t. Forget natural limitations, I’m talking self imposed ones like his phobia of the rim. I’m not going to treat him with kid gloves, he’s been in NBA long enough.
I’d agree with much of that list, less Lopez and Krstic (you can’t be serious with Krstic). I’d throw Bynum on there as well. Now, re-read my post — which of these guys are available?
There will be no extra point!
Funny, Even with that....
If we take Krstic off the list. and I think we can all agree on that. There are 12 centers on the list. That leaves 17 other teams who have inferior centers. What tafkasam has clearly shown is that Andres is better than most other centers in the league. Infact if all 30 teams have 2 centers. That makes 60 centers in the league. The list shows 12 centers better than Andres representing 20% of all centers in the league. So what he was really saying is that Andres was better that 80% of all centers in the league. Looking at it that way, he’s pretty good.
by OmnipotentOne on Dec 1, 2010 3:18 PM PST up reply actions
Can I have a healthy Andrew Bynum please!
If this happens I’d be vindicated of some, not all of my frustrations these last TWO decades. I imagine a heathy Bynum, DLee, Udoh frontline with Curry and Monta (depends). Although I’d really do any trade for him that allows us to keep Lee and Curry.
Riley make it go.
"I thought it was going in," Warriors center Chris Hunter said. "It looked like the invisible man tipped it away at the last second."
Would you trade for Bynum?
It’s intriguing. I think for the Lakers a guaranteed healthy Biedrins MIGHT entice them enough vs. his risks.
On our side, it’s all high risk/high reward.
Super high risk.
Andris definitely would not be enough for them, still. I’d say Monta, but The Lake Show prolly says no to that.
"I thought it was going in," Warriors center Chris Hunter said. "It looked like the invisible man tipped it away at the last second."
So what he was really saying is that Andres was better that 80% of all centers in the league. Looking at it that way, he’s pretty good.
or 80% of the centers in the league are really bad?
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Dec 1, 2010 9:39 PM PST up reply actions
I said off the top of my head
And my point was that for 9 mil, he’s not that great a ‘value’.
$9 M is about the going rate for an Andris Biedrins
It coulda been me, oh yeah it coulda been me.
by Reverend_Randy on Dec 1, 2010 11:18 PM PST up reply actions
And
Krstic isn’t good at any price point.
It coulda been me, oh yeah it coulda been me.
by Reverend_Randy on Dec 1, 2010 11:19 PM PST up reply actions
Krstic? He sucks, dude. that’s the only one I can really really take issue with.
It coulda been me, oh yeah it coulda been me.
by Reverend_Randy on Dec 1, 2010 2:56 PM PST up reply actions
Hmmm..
We need a miracle to get passed the next 6-7 games
PFortyy :)
'11 Champs!
not really
3-4 should be had without overacheiving. We start with win No. 1 tomorrow. Home game, Phoenix. No prob!
We've just had bad luck in that we haven't been healthy
Like the moment David Lee comes back, we start an impossible stretch. We haven’t really lost any games that I really expected to win.
On that note, I hope we surprise a couple teams and play better basketball. It’s so frustrating how we go to the line the least and foul the most. I see a bunch of contact too, and no call. If David Lee didn’t get bitten we would probably be like 12-6 or 11-7 right now. This young team is probably affected by this recent slump.
Can we just have one night where the entire team shows up? It seems like Curry and Lee are the only ones constantly any good, then maybe just maybe one of Monta, Beans, and DoorL shows up. Usually Monta. It’s not enough, we’ve gotta compete.
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