Warriors Should Go After Iguodala
by duballers23 on Feb 5, 2010 5:06 PM PST
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PrintSince there have been a whole lot of Iguodala rumors, I thought I would throw out an Iguodala to the Warriors trade idea.
Maybe a trade like this
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ylhsck6
The Warriors get a dynamic overall player in Iguodala, and Dalembert who can rebound. The Sixers get Maggette to replace Iguodalas scoring, and even though Maggettes contract is fairly large, getting rid of 2 big contracts is worth it. They also get Ronny, Wright (who could eventually start for them at power forward alongside Speights, who can play center), and expirings (maybe even throw in Georges expiring, and if they had to, maybe replace CJ with Morrow).
It's really a pretty solid deal for both teams. The Sixers are able to shed some big contracts, and get some good players in return, while the Warriors get a big piece (Iguodala just turned 26) for the future, and they would only have Dalembert for one more season I believe. Iguodala would be able to take a bunch of pressure off of Monta, and would bring a different dynamic to the team. Iguodala scores in a bunch of different ways (inside, outside, upside down), gets his teammates involved (5.7 assists for a wing), rebounds great for his size (6.9 rebounds), and plays solid defense (1.9 steals and .58 blocks). No way the Warriors would be able to resign Bosh or Amare, and Iggy is already signed for 4 more years after this one. It's better than trading for Butler (approaching 30 and seems to have passed his peak), Howard (same deal as Butler and throw in some character issues), or Gay (might demand more than what Iguodala makes and doesn't do nearly as much). You guys will probably say no way to Dalembert, but having to take on his contract for one or 2 more years is worth getting Iguodala. Maybe the Warriors wouldn't even have to give up that much for Iguodala, but I think that getting him would possibly have a similar impact as when they got Baron. I'm not saying he's as good as Baron was, but he is kind of an unnoticed star a lot of the time, and he would bring another dynamic to this team to get them back in the hunt. Also, Iguodala could put up near LeBron type numbers on the Warriors.
What do you guys think?
This FanPost is a submission from a member of the mighty Golden State of Mind community. While we're all here to throw up that W, these words do not necessarily reflect the views of the GSoM Crew. Still, chances are the preceding post is Unstoppable Baby!
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Wait...
You mean the Warriors might have a defensive presence that could actually get rebounds?
I’m all for this trade. A guy like Dalembert isn’t Nelson’s style but he is needed.
I think this is more realistic
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ylrv2nx
You know I spit technique to the freshest freak
Gimme a call you will see results in just a week
With the soul of a LOST HAWK
Is there a heaven for a Rap Cat, let's talk
The two problems I see with this trade:
Dalembert and Biedrins both play C, and are really only capable of playing C. That means we will be paying our backup C at least $9 million, which is pretty ridiculous.
We would be taking on $3 million more on our payroll this year and roughly $7 million next year. If Cohan won’t waive a player to sign someone for less than $1 million that can actually help us right now, I can’t see him spending that much money in this trade. While getting Iggy would increase ticket sales, if we don’t actually start winning they will just drop back down and wouldn’t make up the difference in salary that he would have to pay.
by samuraaaaiiiiiii on Feb 5, 2010 5:28 PM PST reply actions
Forget salary
That’s all the team talks about, and where has cutting salary gotten them? Nowhere! Dalembert is only under contract for this year and next year I believe, and Iguodala has a good contract for the type of player he is. Dalembert and Biedrins can split minutes at center, just like he and Ronny do right now. Theres nothing wrong with having 2 starting quality centers, even though they cost a lot, Dalembert would be on the team for 1 whole season and then they could let him go or resign him for cheaper. Plus, they would have the option of trading one of the two centers in the future. Of course this one deal wouldn’t automatically make them a winning team, but factor in the draft (Wall, Cousins, Evans, Johnson, etc.), hopefully getting healthy, and I definitely see this team having a chance at being a playoff team for years to come (that is if they don’t make stupid moves to shed salary for garbage players like they have done in the past).
How can you say forget salary when even you admit that is what the team talks about? I was just trying to point out that the trade is unlikely to make it past our front office in that form.
by samuraaaaiiiiiii on Feb 5, 2010 8:39 PM PST up reply actions
How can you forget salary?
It’s a pretty important thing.
by Reverend_Randy on Feb 5, 2010 11:48 PM PST up reply actions
Dalembert and Biedrins both play C, and are really only capable of playing C.
A big is a big is a big. I really fail to see where having Dalembert and Biedrins on the floor at the same time is significantly different than having, say, Randolph and Biedrins on the floor at the same time.
by Missing Barry on Feb 8, 2010 7:53 AM PST up reply actions
Probably our best defensive, and rebounding lineups.
Euro Players Rock! Go Warriors!
by monta.da.boss on Feb 8, 2010 6:55 PM PST up reply actions
Great trade for Warriors
but LostHawks trade is more enticing for Philly. Turiaf and Wright are due to make 4mill each in 2011/12 along with Maggette’s 10mill. They want cap space so with LostHawks deal they only have 13.6mill on the books next year as opposed to 17mill in your deal. Dalembert is only under contract through next season so considering we are not gonna be title contenders next year having him as Beans backup is perfectly fine since he comes off the books after that. We are not likey to land a difference making free agent this offseason so getting Iggy would be a nice pull then we can shoot for Cousins in the draft. That would leave us with a starting group for the 2011/12 season of Curry, Monta, Iggy, Randolph, and Beans. With Cousins, and hopefully Buike, Morrow and then whatever other FA pick ups. And yes next years team with relative health could contend for playoffs at best.
NBA Trade Machine
I succumbed and did a trade of my own. I was just messing around and probably got too carried away.
The Ultimate Opportunist
by Rated-R Superstar on Feb 5, 2010 7:28 PM PST reply actions
I love Iguodala
He’s been one of the most underrated players in basketball over the past couple seasons, and the idea that he is available is amazing.
However, let’s be real about this. The ‘6ers are trying to cut salary and get young talent. I highly doubt they would take on the contracts of Maggette, Ellis, or Biedrins. That means that we will have to give up some young talent. Here’s what I would do:
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yfah2sx
We get Iguodala. We give up Curry, CJ, and expirings.
Now, all of a sudden, the Warriors have a shoot first point guard in Ellis, and an unselfish, good passing, good defending, does the little things shooting guard in Iggy. (The only problem is Nellie would want to play him at the 5.)
A second option would be this:
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yzz27gb
We give up Curry, Biedrins, and expirings to get Iggy and Dalmbert. I think Biedrins to Dalembert is a slight downgrade, but getting Iggy is an upgrade over everyone on our roster. Also, I don’t like giving up our two big expirings, but this deal puts us in better position in the ’11 offseason.
And Monta's back-up will be......
………
……
………………….
………….
by A2mm2o on Feb 6, 2010 12:32 AM PST up reply actions
and that's dismissing the fact that Monta is a SG
by A2mm2o on Feb 6, 2010 12:32 AM PST up reply actions
And Monta's back-up right now is...
Dude already plays 48 minutes every other game…
Also, we suck. We’re going to get a high pick in a point guard heavy draft. Maybe will actually draft a point guard this time, and not a combo-guard who we hope will develop into a point guard.
Is this a point guard heavy draft? Outside of Wall, I can’t think of a lottery PG off the top of my head… I don’t watch too much college ball though.
by samuraaaaiiiiiii on Feb 6, 2010 1:23 AM PST up reply actions
Oh, right...
Last year was the point guard heavy draft. And we took a combo-guard who we hoped would develop into a point guard.
But anyhow, you’re right, this really isn’t a point heavy draft. I opened my big, fat mouth without actually checking, and going off what I had thought I heard.
More to the point, this team isn’t going anywhere as it’s presently constructed. If need be, pull CJ out of the deal. Here’s another one: http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yjaqk8l
I don’t like that one as much as the first, as it gives up our two big expirings, but it keeps CJ to back up Monta. Also, the original trade I proposed, the Sixers can throw in Royal Ivey, who is relatively useless but woudn’t play more than 10 minutes a night, and the trade will still work: http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yf8xhp7
And Monta’s back-up will be……
Who cares? Backups have such a minimal impact on winning games, is this really something we should care about?
by Missing Barry on Feb 8, 2010 7:55 AM PST up reply actions
ehhh...
I kinda like the idea of curry and igudala playing together I would much rather see monta go because he shoots too much an is a ME first player.
I havn’t done trade machine( so I don’t know the salaries of the players) on these but these are a trades i like:
Maggete, Wright, Ellis, cj for Dalembert and iggy
What do you guys think?
by YoMamaIsAgiant on Feb 6, 2010 12:35 AM PST up reply actions
That would be idea, but not realistic
The Sixers have made it clear that they want youth and cap relief. Monta and Biedrins give some youth, but no cap relief. Maggette gives them neither.
Cap Relief
We can certainly offer that with guys like Claxton, Bell and Radmanovic.
The Ultimate Opportunist
by Rated-R Superstar on Feb 6, 2010 9:16 AM PST up reply actions
Trade
I think we’re thinking along similar lines.
The Ultimate Opportunist
by Rated-R Superstar on Feb 6, 2010 9:24 AM PST up reply actions
I would much rather see monta go because he shoots too much an is a ME first player.
While I also think Monta shoots to much, I think it’s just unnecessary to turn that into “he’s a ME first player”….
by Missing Barry on Feb 8, 2010 7:55 AM PST up reply actions
even better!!!!
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yhhguxo
I can deffinetaly see the Dubs making this trade!!! This would be awesome!!!
ftw!!!
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yjbeso8
There will be no extra point!
by Sleepy Freud on Feb 6, 2010 1:08 AM PST reply actions 1 recs
hahaha
by far the best trade proposal so far.
by YoMamaIsAgiant on Feb 6, 2010 1:13 AM PST up reply actions
RE: ftw!!!
I went the opposite route.
by samuraaaaiiiiiii on Feb 6, 2010 1:34 AM PST up reply actions
The "Weren't we awesome in 2003" trade
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yfrvhew
We just need to get Musselman to coach.
I'd like Iggy but only for expirings and Buike
He’s not that good, if tier 1 is Lebron Kobe and Wade, tier 2 CP3 , Dwight etc tier 3 Monta, Joe, Pierce, tier 4 is Iggy. He’s a nice player but is not worth Curry, Monta, Beans, or AR. Also Sammy is just bad, don’t look at his stats. He’s just bad….
Rookie: "Why did you bench me?"
Nellie: "You're a rookie"
Crocodile tiers..
Paul and Howard are not on a tier below Kobe and Wade. And Iggy is not on a tier below Monta. If anything, your tiers need to be flipped.
There will be no extra point!
I’m curious how Monta is as good as Paul Pierce. Paul Pierce is a better player NOW in his 30’s than Monta is around 25. No disrespect to Monta, but Pierce is amazing.
Secondly, Kobe is not a first tier player in my opinion. The reason the Lakers are so good is they have the best frontcourt we have seen in the last 10 years ( my opinion). Kobe is an average efficiency scorer, he takes an abundance of highly contested mid-range jumpers, and he doesn’t seem to recognize when his shot is off, as he shoots 12-34 way too often.
Lebron, Wade, Bosh, Howard, Paul, D-Will, Duncan, Gerald Wallace, Gasol, Josh Smith, Nash, and even Rondo rate higher than he does in many of the more important factors in winning basketball. I would say he is the 13th best player in the NBA. Probably most skilled, toughest, and devoted player, but not the most effective. No comparison to Lebron. You put Lebron on Lakers, greatest team of all time in my opinion. You put Kobe on Cavs, you probably see a 45-50 win team in the East, bounced in the first round of the playoffs by the Celtics, Magic, or Hawks.
Euro Players Rock! Go Warriors!
by monta.da.boss on Feb 6, 2010 6:05 PM PST up reply actions
Lebron, Wade, Bosh, Howard, Paul, D-Will, Duncan, Gerald Wallace, Gasol, Josh Smith, Nash, and even Rondo rate higher than he does in many of the more important factors in winning basketball.
The number of rings?
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Feb 6, 2010 7:13 PM PST up reply actions
Have you considered that he wasn’t the best player on any of those teams.
Euro Players Rock! Go Warriors!
by monta.da.boss on Feb 6, 2010 11:22 PM PST up reply actions
Have you considered that he wasn’t the best player on any of those teams.
Have you considered eye surgery?
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Feb 7, 2010 9:39 AM PST up reply actions
Snark aside, are you arguing that Kobe was the best player on the Kobe/Shaq Lakers championship teams? Or (snark allowed now) did you lose track of what you were arguing?
There will be no extra point!
by Sleepy Freud on Feb 7, 2010 10:42 AM PST up reply actions
are you arguing that Kobe was the best player on the Kobe/Shaq Lakers championship teams?
no , I wrote that he has more rings than most of those darlings so maybe he’s doing something right?
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Feb 7, 2010 12:20 PM PST up reply actions
Or maybe he has one of the best coaches, and front offices in the league to surround him with amazing talent.
Euro Players Rock! Go Warriors!
by monta.da.boss on Feb 7, 2010 1:54 PM PST up reply actions
maybe he has one of the best coaches, and front offices in the league to surround him with amazing talent.
which means he’s doing everything right to stay in that situation. Say what you want about the skills of Shaq and Gasol but the big constant feature on the Lakers championship teams is Kobe. If Phil Jackson didn’t think Kobe was better he’s have let him go by now.
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Feb 7, 2010 3:10 PM PST up reply actions
Actually, that isn’t what you wrote. You replied to a poster who had suggested specifically that Kobe might not have been the best player on any of his championship teams by asking if he had considered eye surgery. Clearly implied in this bit of snark is that anyone who would consider Shaq and/or Pau better than Kobe is not very perceptive.
Seriously, Skep, if you’re just going to regurgitate the same 4-5 points over and over, can you at least try and make them correspond to the content of the post you’re replying to? If not, you might as well set up an auto-script on your browser to post those 4-5 points, and go out and enjoy the lovely Bay Area…
There will be no extra point!
anyone who would consider Shaq and/or Pau better than Kobe is not very perceptive.
Well Shaq and Gasol are two separate issues but Kobe is the constant of the Lakers dynasty so yeah it looks like bad vision.
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Feb 7, 2010 3:36 PM PST up reply actions
How was your vision in the three years between when Shaq left and Gasol arrived?
There will be no extra point!
And still had Odom, Bynum, and Caron Butler ( the first year)?
I don’t think Kobe isn’t a great player, he just has proven he needs a lot of frontcourt help to win games.
Euro Players Rock! Go Warriors!
by monta.da.boss on Feb 7, 2010 8:32 PM PST up reply actions
How was your vision in the three years between when Shaq left and Gasol arrived?
Same as it is now, aware that it’s a team game and front court help makes even the greats better. Was that the stretch where Kobe layed in 81 points BTW or did Gasol help him out on that one?
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Feb 7, 2010 8:44 PM PST up reply actions
Didn’t they win only 45 games in the season he average 35.4?
Tells you something. He wasn’t helping the team that much.
81 points is amazing, but we shouldn’t forget 3 seasons because of one game.
Euro Players Rock! Go Warriors!
by monta.da.boss on Feb 7, 2010 9:23 PM PST up reply actions
and front court help makes even the greats better.
So you don’t think the players in their frontcourt are greats?
Just players around Kobe, or maybe Kobe is the player around them?
Just a curious thought.
Euro Players Rock! Go Warriors!
by monta.da.boss on Feb 7, 2010 9:25 PM PST up reply actions
I wrote that he has more rings than most of those darlings so maybe he’s doing something right?
Yep, resigning with the Lakers (rather than the Clippers, for instance, remember that rumor?) and playing with guys like Shaq and Pau is definitely doing something right. :)
by Missing Barry on Feb 8, 2010 7:57 AM PST up reply actions
Wow
I think Iggy is probably the 3rd best shooting guard in the league behind Kobe and Wade, and stats and objective analysis will back me up pretty will on that claim. He’s definitely better than anyone on our current roster.
Lol I saw that
But still, Miller is so annoying
Rookie: "Why did you bench me?"
Nellie: "You're a rookie"
I think so
Roy’s good, but AI2 (since he doesn’t like Iggy, apparently, and Iguodala is a pain to type) is a much better defender, a better rebounder, and almost as good as a shooter.
Random aside
Am I the only one who wants to pronounce Brandon Roy’s last name as “Wha”, like goalie Patrick Roy’s last name?
Probably…
he's an elite defender....
2 steals per game, OVER a 2 to 1 assist to turnover ratio (5.7 to 2.6!?!… go look at monta), and he rebounds well…. oh yeah and he puts in high teens points, until this year pretty efficiently. Whats not to like? Only criticism i have is he isn’t a good 3 pt shooter, but otherwise he’s everything we wished jack was (great passer, low turnovers, rebounds, defense)
He's way to inconsistent to be considered better than Monta
Ask 6er fans, a lot get tired of his inconsistent play.One night he will be amazing, the next he will put up 10 points…
Rookie: "Why did you bench me?"
Nellie: "You're a rookie"
the next he will put up 10 points…
… 8 boards, 9 assists, 4 steals …
Sorry, I don’t buy the consistency line at all. Unless and until you can prove both —
1. That he is actually less consistent game to game than Monta; and
2. That it makes a whit of difference in terms of his team’s wins whether he scores 30-10-30-10 or 20-20-20-20
— that’s a total dead-end line of argument.
There will be no extra point!
Just as 6er fans
They love Iggy, and sometimes hate him. I’d love to have him but he’s not as good as you guys think he is.
Rookie: "Why did you bench me?"
Nellie: "You're a rookie"
Ha, I see what you’re doing here. They can’t ask a Sixers fan because there’s no such thing!
(On the other hand, if you ask an Eagles/Phillies fan who watches the Sixers when they have nothing else to do and the Flyers aren’t playing, they won’t know much about basketball, but those are the exact things they’ll say about Dalembert, Igoudala to a much less degree)
by Missing Barry on Feb 8, 2010 8:01 AM PST up reply actions
Given I live in Philly, I don’t really need to….
by Missing Barry on Feb 8, 2010 9:39 AM PST up reply actions
Jeesh
It must suck for the sixers. They are the joke of town.
Euro Players Rock! Go Warriors!
by monta.da.boss on Feb 8, 2010 6:56 PM PST up reply actions
It would take me like 10,000 words to accurately describe how pathetic the support for the Sixers is, and how funny it is when compared to how big the support for the Eagles/Phillies is….
by Missing Barry on Feb 8, 2010 7:10 PM PST up reply actions
If the Sixers went to the finals, would that be bigger than an Eagles-Cowboys game?
Euro Players Rock! Go Warriors!
by monta.da.boss on Feb 8, 2010 7:19 PM PST up reply actions
I haven’t been living here that long, I dunno, supposedly they had decent support the one year they went to the Finals, but from everything I’ve been told even when they’re that successful they’re still on a tier below the Phillies/Eagles….
by Missing Barry on Feb 8, 2010 7:43 PM PST up reply actions
I’ve been told even when they’re that successful they’re still on a tier below the Phillies/Eagles….
What do you expect from people that think cheese steaks are good food?
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Feb 8, 2010 10:54 PM PST up reply actions
Ha, I do love cheesesteaks, though I gotta say I mostly avoid them because it’s so unhealthy. They’re also proud of their “soft pretzels”, which has always been funny to me. I didn’t realize making soft pretzels was difficult or that some people did it better than others….
by Missing Barry on Feb 9, 2010 6:42 AM PST up reply actions
They’re also proud of their "soft pretzels"
maybe the soft one’s can hold more fat?
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Feb 9, 2010 9:36 AM PST up reply actions
Does this trade make too much sense:
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yzyv46c
You know I spit technique to the freshest freak
Gimme a call you will see results in just a week
With the soul of a LOST HAWK
Is there a heaven for a Rap Cat, let's talk
or this (Jaimison instead of Butler):
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yl3g7m3
You know I spit technique to the freshest freak
Gimme a call you will see results in just a week
With the soul of a LOST HAWK
Is there a heaven for a Rap Cat, let's talk
76ers
Nearly every trade listed here involves Maggette to the Sixers. I guess none of you follow that team b/c they are NOT acquiring Corey and his contract. Not gonna happen.
If you were Philly, and apparently there are a few decent offers on the table (Amare, T-Mac etc), then why would you add salary in the form of Maggette?
That team is looking to drop salary, and they are NOT gonna add any long-term contracts unless they acquire a superstar.
From the W’s perspective, adding Sammy D is not a good idea. They already have a C, Nellie doesn’t like big guys anyway so he’ll probably just rot on the bench, and when he’s in, Sammy can be very frustrating to watch.
Confused Warriors fans ITT.
I don't think they would do that trade
That is almost like a video game trade where we dump all our scraps for a near star player. I would think they would want Monta in exchange for Igoudala. Iggy would thrive in a Warriors uniform and would probably be a 20 pts 8 reb 7 assist guy on the Warriors. And he plays good defense. Hmmmm him next to Curry but he would probably play SF anyway
Throwing my hat in the ring of trade ideas
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yf8ketz
Why we do it – Ellis, Iggy, and Curry? That sounds incredible. Also Maggs is Ellis’ closest friend and if he left for someone not as good as him I think he’d go crazy and pull a Jack. Also this opens up cap space to resign Buike then we can draft Whiteside or Cousins who can eventually take over for Beans. Beans then can either be like Camby off the bench or traded.
Why Philly does it – They want to lose Sammy, they need an upgrade up front and seem to be shopping Iggy.They get Amare and Amundson which is an upgrade over Brand and Sammy and Amundson provides deph and allows them to play Young at the 3. Barbosa can come in and be a nice 6th man.
Why suns do it – Some people in Phoenix want to move Barbosa badly, they won’t get much for him so him with AMare is there best bet. They don’t have a great rebounder so Sammy helps them, Wright may eventually be there starting 4 and Maggs can come in and be that spark plug off the bench. Bell is cap relief and getting him back is more of a moral gain.
Rookie: "Why did you bench me?"
Nellie: "You're a rookie"
"hy we do it – Ellis, Iggy, and Curry? That sounds incredible."
No, it doesn’t.
Igloudala would be the best of the bunch, no question, but the problem is this:
We now have three guards who’s natural position ISN’T the 1. We know Monta isn’t a 1. Curry … well, we’ll see. It’s still an open question. And Igloudala is the only one who you can get away with playing at the 3.
So I like that deal IF we then turn around and do something with either Monta or Curry, to address our lack of a 4 and a 1.
Why trade for a player who plays the same position as one of our best players?
Seriously?
Curry is fine at point and has great court vision. No way he’s a 2, Iggy is fine at the 3 and Ellis is the 2. Our biggest weakness after this would be the 5.
Rookie: "Why did you bench me?"
Nellie: "You're a rookie"
Curry MAY turn out to be a true point guard.
But even so, that doesn’t solve the problem.
That leaves us with Monta, Igloudala, and Morrow as natural “2s.”
Igloudala only makes sense if we turn around and trade Monta.
AI2 can easily play the 3…no?
Euro Players Rock! Go Warriors!
by monta.da.boss on Feb 7, 2010 1:55 PM PST up reply actions
Iggy can play 3 just as well as 2
That’s a non issue
Rookie: "Why did you bench me?"
Nellie: "You're a rookie"
If Igloudala can play the 3 ...
That completely moots the trade for Philly. This is a superstar league – why would they downgrade their best player in exchange for a backup center and a guy who’s shown almost nothing in three seasons?
If you want a team to accept a trade in which they’re giving up the best player, you’ve got to offer somebody else who’s at least a quality starter. Otherwise, why bother? You don’t downgrade your starters to get a mildly better bench in the NBA.
But it’s worse than that. This trade has Philly giving up their best two players by WP48 … for what? Playing SPeights over Dalembart is a major downgrade, and sure, Speights may improve, but why on earth do they make this deal?
Because they want Amare and are trying to get him
Don’t ask why it’s just what there doing and they have offered Iggy. You tell me why they want him , I’m just doing what they seem to be looking at. It all depends on how they value him. And apparently they seem to value Amare at the same level as Iggy. Also Sammy just isn’t very good despite being able to block shots and grab boards (which sounds great) but people in Philly don’t think he’s very good and prefer Spreights. They make this deal cause they think Amare can do what Brand couldn’t, be the all star big they have been wanting since Webber.
Rookie: "Why did you bench me?"
Nellie: "You're a rookie"
but people in Philly don’t think he’s very good and prefer Spreights
Definitely true that they’re not Dalembert fans here, but also true that not a single person in Philly knows a thing about the NBA. Speights does have flashes where he looks great, and he’s a good athlete….I do think it’s the right move for the Sixers long term to move Dalembert and start getting Speights more time. He could really turn into a player.
by Missing Barry on Feb 8, 2010 8:04 AM PST up reply actions
Isn’t that why Iverson’s first couple of nights back it was sold out, then it went back to 8,000 or less crowds after they realized Iverson sucks now.
Euro Players Rock! Go Warriors!
by monta.da.boss on Feb 8, 2010 6:58 PM PST up reply actions
It was really just his first night. The Warriors were in town very shortly after he arrived and it was the most pathetic crowd I’ve ever seen.
by Missing Barry on Feb 8, 2010 7:11 PM PST up reply actions
Yeah
watching that game on TV, i didn’t even hear cheers the entire game. Maybe 3500 people were there…. at tops.
Euro Players Rock! Go Warriors!
by monta.da.boss on Feb 8, 2010 7:20 PM PST up reply actions
Basically, it was dead silent. I got $170 face value tickets for $29 each….
by Missing Barry on Feb 8, 2010 7:45 PM PST up reply actions
Great Date night :)
Euro Players Rock! Go Warriors!
by monta.da.boss on Feb 8, 2010 7:58 PM PST up reply actions
I got $170 face value tickets for $29 each….
That’s actually a pretty good side benefit of having a band wagon fan base.
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Feb 8, 2010 10:56 PM PST up reply actions
Right ...
And getting rid of their best guard, as well as getting rid of their best rebounder and replacing him with a career backup is EXACTLY the sort of thing that will make Amare pick them.
Guys like Amare understand the value of guys like Dalembeart. D means that Amare doesn’t have to guard the biggest opposing player, so he works less hard on defense. D cleans up some of Amare’s misses, so Amare wins more and looks better.
You don’t attract free agents by making your team worse.
I think you’re off on your perception of Dalembert/Speights here. Speights is Philly’s future, whereas Dalembert’s reputation (regardless of whether it’s deserved) is an inconsistent underachieving who doesn’t live up to his contract. It makes sense for Philly to move Dalembert.
by Missing Barry on Feb 8, 2010 10:42 AM PST up reply actions
Dalembert is east coast slang for Biedrins.
I think most GMs are smarter about that kind of player than most fans. Maybe players don’t appreciate the rebounding, but you better believe they appreciate the defensive help.
That’s what Amare (or, heck, even Tim Duncan) are saying when they say, “I’m not a center:” I don’t want to be guarding the biggest guy on the opposing roster, because defending a guy who’s bigger than you sucks.
I’m sure that most of these guys have been yelled at by enough coaches to rebound enough over their careers that they recognize the value of playing next to some one who does it as well as Dalembert does.
It seems to me the conversation started out about talking where Amare will want to go, though? Even if GM’s understand the importance of rebounding (and I’m not sure many GM’s really understand statistical principles as well as you seem to be implying, we’ll see how much Amare gets paid, for instance), aren’t we talking about players, here? Seems to me Amare the player would see a smaller gap in value between Speights (athletic, decent but not great rebounder, good scorer for a C) and Dalembert than actually exists, considering what kind of player Amare is. I just think there’s not going to be much of a perception different between Amare and Speights to most players, and even a number of GM’s. Dalembert’s only averaged double digit rebounds one in his career, after all! Yes, I know to use rate stats, you know to use rate stats, but most people don’t, and the point I’m making is in their perceptions.
From an objective standpoint, I’m also not so sure Dalembert is that much better than Speights, too. Offensively Speights is already much better than Dalembert. He’s not as good defensively or as a rebounder, but he’s 22 with potential/athletciism, getting better, and already a solid contributor…combine that with the perception of Speights vs. Dalembert, a long run strategy, and I think it’s a no-brainer for Philly to move Dalembert and make room for Speights.
by Missing Barry on Feb 8, 2010 11:27 AM PST up reply actions
Well, as I said before, Speights may still be improving
But I’m willing to bet that if they replace most of Dalembert’s minutes with Speights, they get worse as a team. Adding a superstar scorer may stop that, I don’t know …
If they can pull it off.
But I’m willing to bet that if they replace most of Dalembert’s minutes with Speights, they get worse as a team.
And I agree, at least in the present. I’m just making the point that a guy like Amare doesn’t understand just how well Dalembert rebounds (most people look at RPG, after all) and how much that contributes towards winning, and I bet a lot of GM’s don’t either, which is why you see guys get paid so much for scoring still.
For me, I just don’t think the difference is that big, and Speights is in their long term plans while Dalembert isn’t, so while I recognize it’s a downgrade for them currently, I think it makes sense for them in the long run to move Dalembert.
by Missing Barry on Feb 8, 2010 1:57 PM PST up reply actions
Curry is fine at point and has great court vision
Court vision is nice, but if your PG can’t penetrate and get others open, is it really that useful?
by Missing Barry on Feb 8, 2010 8:05 AM PST up reply actions
You know Curry is getting better and better at the point and most think he will make an excellent true point (including Nelson, who really knows what to look for in talent).
Also, Iggy is one of the best passing wings.
You know I spit technique to the freshest freak
Gimme a call you will see results in just a week
With the soul of a LOST HAWK
Is there a heaven for a Rap Cat, let's talk
Curry's definately a legit point
we must remember he is still a rookie playing the most diffucult position and he’s gotten better every month,.
He hasn’t really shown he is great at creating for others. He has shown he can create offense for himself at a very productive rate. Thats why he is a good player, not a good point guard.
Euro Players Rock! Go Warriors!
OOOOOOOHHHHHHHHHH
i thought u understood point as in 1 point, my bad. it’s not like he has point guard vision or better passing skills than anyone else on our team. and it’s not like monta doesn’t dominate the ball 90% of the time he touches it.
don't argue with the troll
it’s pointless.
You know I spit technique to the freshest freak
Gimme a call you will see results in just a week
With the soul of a LOST HAWK
Is there a heaven for a Rap Cat, let's talk
So i’m the troll? LosthawkGSW…. i’m the troll?
Euro Players Rock! Go Warriors!
by monta.da.boss on Feb 6, 2010 11:23 PM PST up reply actions
Yeah, that was confusing.
I thought you were saying he’s a great point guard, and i was just saying, hes a good player. I’m not sure he is a point guard.
Euro Players Rock! Go Warriors!
by monta.da.boss on Feb 6, 2010 11:25 PM PST up reply actions
PG: curry/Watson
SG: Turner/Buike
SF: Randolph/Morrow
PF: Love/Wright
C: Beidrins/Turiaf
Monta 4 Love Movement!
Randolph can’t play the 3.
Euro Players Rock! Go Warriors!
by monta.da.boss on Feb 7, 2010 1:56 PM PST up reply actions
Huh?
AR at 3? A star for a solid 4? Maggs for basically nothing? That team is as bad as this team
Rookie: "Why did you bench me?"
Nellie: "You're a rookie"
except Turner has size and can defend bigger 2s/smaller 3s, Love can rebound, AR4 is a mismatch at 3 and thats what he was scouted as out of college… just because Nellie is our coach doesn’t mean i can’t believe!
I like all those guys
AR will never be a 3 , but that team lacks a top dog so to say. No leader, no star, this team isn’t that good at all
Rookie: "Why did you bench me?"
Nellie: "You're a rookie"
Another trade idea
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yf9zlre
Why GSW does it : Lose Maggs’ contract and get someone to help out Ellis. Can do no wrong here.
Why Nola does it : West’s future is already cloudy (supposedly) and they probably won’t make the playoffs this year. They badly need a wing scorer and Maggs helps them there, Wright can take West’s spot next year, Amundson provides MUCH needed deph and Kapono is a huge expiring contract. Basicaly it’s a move for a scorer to help Paul and Wright can flourish with a great point.
Why Suns do it : They want something for Amare if they lose him right? Why let him go for nothing? West is a nice replacement for him and can fill in very well. Wright is there to make it all work but they can use him on the wing a little. I think West with Nash can be just as good as Amare and provides much better defense.
Why Philly does it : They need an upgrade up front and I think there one guy away from being a great team. Honestly, I think they should risk it. Very risky move but could payoff big time. Losing Iggy and the big expiring will hurt but I think Amare could help those wounds. To resign him though will need a max contract.
Rookie: "Why did you bench me?"
Nellie: "You're a rookie"
getting rid of West and gaining Maggette makes no sense for the Hornets...
they want to shed salary… not gain offensive blackholes in addition to their salary.
If they want to shed salary why did they get Okafor?
And sign Posey? They flip flop, to keep Paul happy they will need a scorer. He’s not a blackhole when you got CP3 either, you can’t be.
Rookie: "Why did you bench me?"
Nellie: "You're a rookie"
I remember seeing some post where everyone dissed David West for declining and being too old (at what, 30?). That was some homeristic hyperbole there.
go rowand
by lincypoo i wuv u on Feb 9, 2010 2:17 AM PST up reply actions
Difference
We have AR and Wright. Suns don’t
Rookie: "Why did you bench me?"
Nellie: "You're a rookie"
My question…. why do you want an old, highly paid tweener instead of Wright/ Randolph.
Euro Players Rock! Go Warriors!
by monta.da.boss on Feb 9, 2010 7:32 PM PST up reply actions
Huh?
Iggy is none of those. Or if your talking about the suns getting West you could say he is as good as Amare with Nash and they want value out of Amare before free agency. Amare is an overrated injury prone and aging power forward, West is an aging tweener and an average player without CP3
Rookie: "Why did you bench me?"
Nellie: "You're a rookie"
It wasn’t an either/or situation. People were saying we shouldn’t give up expirings and our bench players for him. People liked him less than Maggette!
As for CP3 making West, he’s still shot .490, 18 points this season, I think scoring more with Paul out but don’t quote me on that. 29 is not old either. At the very least he has trade value.
go rowand
by lincypoo i wuv u on Feb 9, 2010 8:31 PM PST up reply actions
this trade makes a lot more sense
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yhfk5xf
radman and maggette for powe and lebron.
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