RECAP: Golden State Warriors 124, Toronto Raptors 112- Stephen Curry + Monta Ellis- Birth of a Backcourt?
by Feltbot on Mar 14, 2010 12:17 AM PST
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Asking GSoM: Why the Golden State Warriors are so bad + Stephen Curry and Monta Ellis co-existing + Keys against Toronto Raptors (165+ comments)
Raptors HQ
- Marco Belinelli, Patrick O'Bryant, and Chris Bosh staying or leaving?
- Raptors Rapid Recap: Toronto 112 Golden State 124
- Tip-In: Toronto Raptors' Post Game Report - Now or Never
Monta Ellis and Stephen Curry, two players whom the Bay Area media don't believe can coexist in the same backcourt, collaborated on an offensive masterpiece that buried the Toronto Raptors in this game. Ellis had 31 points on 12-22 shooting, including a career high 5 three-pointers. Stephen Curry had one of his best games this season, with 35 points, 5-8 from three, 10 assists, 6 rebounds, and 4 steals. That's a stat line that will get you noticed in fantasy leagues!
What was most impressive about this performance was how well Ellis and Curry worked together. The ball flowed beautifully between them, with the result that very little of their offense seemed forced. With Curry having grown into the point-guard role, and doing most of the ball-handling, Monta played one of his most controlled games of the season. He committed only 3 turnovers, and Curry only 2, as the Warriors won the turnover battle 17-11. In a game where the Raptors outshot the Warriors 57% to 47%, this was huge.
Jump for some salivating!
Was this game our first real glimpse of the premier NBA backcourt of the future? It should be noted that it is already, in Stephen Curry's first season, the highest scoring backcourt in the NBA. Both players are in the top 10 in the league in steals, and should be near the top of the league in combined assists and rebounds. I heard Fitz say that they lead the league in "productivity." I'm not sure what that means, particularly coming from such a noted authority, but I'm sure some stat phreak can analyze it for us. What I am sure of is what my eyes tell me. And that is that Ellis and Curry, playing together, could turn into one of the great guard tandems in NBA history.
But they're too small! They can't defend! That's the refrain we hear from Bay Area pundits. I have a simple answer to that: Walt Frazier and Earl Monroe. Isaiah Thomas and Joe Dumars. Steve Nash and Nick van Exel.
But Monta Ellis doesn't want to play with Curry! Another constant refrain. To which I have to ask, are we so sure about that? I'm guessing that Monta sees quite clearly now why Don Nelson drafted Curry. And I'm guessing that he understands very well right now how easy Curry can make the game for him. In this game alone, Monta got at least two of his threes on pinpoint feeds from Curry.
Package the Warriors lottery pick for a legitimate NBA big man, and then ask Monta Ellis what he thinks. I think he'll think what I think: Playoffs.
Shouldn't that jersey read 0-2?
Random Observations:
The Raptors stink: No defense, no rebounding, and no shooters is an interesting way to build a team. The Warriors, a team that has lost the rebounding battle by an average of 20 over the last 5 games, outrebounded the Raptors. That's pathetic. Fearless prediction: No playoffs. Not so fearless prediction: Bosh is gone.
One of the Ant's 5 fouls. Right, ref?
Anthony Tolliver: Shot a miserable 2-12, that included blowing several great feeds from Curry under the basket. And yet he may have been the third most important contributor to this win. Nellie singled him out for praise post-game, saying he played "a heck of a game." Tolliver guarded, rebounded and stayed out of foul trouble. Take a look at that +21. Does +21 and 11 boards constitute a double-double?
Chris Hunter: Also had a nice game. His putback slam to close the 3rd really made me believe the Warriors would win. 8 rebounds in 15 minutes. Can he repeat that against a real NBA team?
Stephen Curry highlights: Splitting the trap on the pick and roll and the teardrop finish high off glass at 3:10 of the fourth. I'd rather watch that than a dunk any day.
The play where he stole the ball at midcourt, and then saved it from going out of bounds with a blind left-handed behind-the-back pass to Corey Maggette for the layup. OK fine, the ridiculous degree of difficulty. We've seen it before. But how in the world did he know exactly where to fling that pass? A basketball savant.
Reggie Williams v. Anthony Morrow: Williams is stealing time from Morrow, because he's been outplaying him on both ends of the court. Is this something to be interested in? Can the Warriors even hold on to Williams once his second 10-day contract runs out? Or would they have to cut another expiring contract to sign him?
I like to watch Morrow shoot, but watching Williams' tremendous offensive versatility makes me wonder just how valuable Morrow really is. He's still a long way from deserving big minutes.
Don Nelson: Anyone else see Nellie pace the sideline for the entire fourth quarter? Not sure I've seen that before this season. He wanted this win.
Marco Belinelli: Hey, maybe Don Nelson's not an idiot.
Monta Ellis deserves consideration, particularly for carrying the team in the second quarter while Curry rested, and for his fourth quarter defense. But for me, Stephen Curry was the guy tonight.
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Hey, maybe Don Nelson’s not an idiot.
Jay Triano is one big idiot.
Nellie needs to go! but while we suffer....John Wall or Evan Turner please!
Terrible rotations throughout the season. Talked to Raptors HQ, and it seems they are sick of him playing Bargnani and Derozan tons of minutes when they continue to suck it up over more deserving players (Amir Johnson, Belinelli). Although Weems stats are bad, they appear to appreciate his athleticism, and the 2nd chance points he creates at times. However, once again they do not understand why Antoine Wright is getting more minutes than Belinelli, when all the stats (and their eyes) suggest he is the far better offensive player, and defensive player. Some like Belinelli alot there but think his inconsistent play was hard to deal with and maybe this is deserved, but the overall feeling is Triano has a short leash with certain players, but none with others (remind you of someone?). Also, seems not to put Hedo in a better role. Hedo may not be a good player anymore, but he is not being utilized well as a 3 point specialist.
Thats why i think that way.
Benching of Belinelli, has coincided with some of their worst play of the year against sub-par competition. Curious as to why a player like Marco would make a big difference? Giving a guy 20 minutes a game and having him produce averagely-to slightly above average, and then replacing those minutes with terrible production (Wright, Weems, Derozan) will cause more problems than one thinks.
Nellie needs to go! but while we suffer....John Wall or Evan Turner please!
Marco is not a great player
End of story. He reportedly has a bad attitude out there, still can’t play good defense (improved but not good), and isn’t really the sharpshooter everyone wants him to be
We all love the Warriors..
We all hate Cohan as an owner of this franchise…
You are hilarious!
You say Monta plays good defense and that Marco doesn’t?
What a homer!
He reportedly has a bad attitude out there,
Sources?
isn’t really the sharpshooter everyone wants him to be
40% from 3 is pretty good.
But hey lets talk about Monta’s superstar defense because MT said he played good defense on Roy once.
Nellie needs to go! but while we suffer....John Wall or Evan Turner please!
The attitude thing comes from people I know who are big Raptor fans
They tell me he has a bad attitude out there. And calling me a homer is like calling you a hater. It doesn’t contribute
We all love the Warriors..
We all hate Cohan as an owner of this franchise…
82games.com
look at Marco’s defense.
Go to the Warriors page and see what Monta’s is given.
Then look at the rest of Toronto’s roster and see how high Marco ranks up there.
Go down on GSW’s roster, and see how low Monta’s is.
Nellie needs to go! but while we suffer....John Wall or Evan Turner please!
Stats don't tell how good someone is 1 on 1
Or how they are off the ball, or there technique or awareness. Marco does not play good defense and if he did he’d play more thats why Derozan plays over him cause he plays better defense and so does Wright and Weems. Why else would they be playing if there not offensive players?
We all love the Warriors..
We all hate Cohan as an owner of this franchise…
Dude, it shows he plays good defense. And i watch the game, did you know Derozan scored 8 points in the first quarter against Monta?
Derozan is a terrible offensive player.
And if Marco is so bad on defense, why is his adjusted plus-minus good on defense, and all those other players have bad ones? So again, explain why Monta the star didn’t score against Marco is five minutes….that would show Marco played good one on one defense don’t you think?
But lets not get carried away, the stats show Belinelli is the most productive defender on their team that gets minutes. He holds his opposition to a 13 PER. The league average is 15. That means he holds his player to below average. Derozan does 17. Wright 19. Monta’s is a 16.
Why would that be if they are all superior defenders? Why would their man score more often, and at a better clip if they were a better defender. And don’t give me ‘he doesn’t guard best player’ because when Marco plays he has to guard the best perimeter scorer… you aren’t going to let the defensively inept Calderon and Turk guard them right? Your argument is flawed.
Nellie needs to go! but while we suffer....John Wall or Evan Turner please!
Tell me why he doesn't play than
If he’s this great defensive player you make him out to be or this offensive threat how come he gets no time? Stats can measure efficiency, rebounding, and most offensive stats. But defense cannot be measured by stats. What goes into a defensive rating? How much he held his man to? His percentage? Does it take into account that his man didn’t touch the ball often cause others were getting it done at that time? A certain way the opponent was playing? Can it measure footwork and how a guy thinks or reacts? No it can’t. I don’t buy into defensive stats like that. If those guys ahead of him can’t score and can’t play defense why do they play? Cause coaches could care less about a stat like that, they see who’s a good defender and who isn’t . You call my argument flawed, I call those stats flawed
We all love the Warriors..
We all hate Cohan as an owner of this franchise…
Monta is INCREDIBLY mediocre defensively
Largely due to physical limitations. How many 6ft3 SGs who aren’t strong and have small wingspans have become above average defenders? Monta tries hard, but he will never be a good enough defender on a SG. Problem is Curry is actually a worse defender. The combination is awful. One win does not change this. One will need to go.
Wow
Curry is an awful defender?
The Ultimate Opportunist
by Rated-R Superstar on Mar 14, 2010 10:06 AM PDT up reply actions
I wouldn't say awful
He’s average at best
So let me get this straight... Maggette is the healthy guy.
"Winning is not enough. All others must lose." - Larry Ellison
by Badly Browned on Mar 14, 2010 10:06 AM PDT up reply actions
indeed
I’ll site his awesome display on Collison v. New Orleans as exhibit A.
Curry tries hard, but again has a lot of limitations due to foot speed.
Disagree
I think that game was a bad example. Curry was notably gassed due to Don Nelson running him into the ground. He isn’t a great one-on-one defender, but he has great instincts and knows where to be. He has a knack for deflections and is aware of the surrounding.
The Ultimate Opportunist
by Rated-R Superstar on Mar 14, 2010 10:19 AM PDT up reply actions
he isn't athletic enough to be a great defender
HE gets beaten badly by all athletic penetrating PGs. Collison isn’t even that compared to others like Derrick Rose
Um
Curry defended Rose very well in our last game against them.
by WheresMyChippy on Mar 14, 2010 12:21 PM PDT up reply actions
You know I was talking about Marco right?
We all love the Warriors..
We all hate Cohan as an owner of this franchise…
Well maybe you can consider him to be a bad coach? He doesn’t play Amir Johnson much, and he is much more effective than his Andrea and Hedo, but he rarely plays.
I can’t tell you why he doesn’t play, because its the coach’s decision, but why doesn’t Nellie play Randolph more, and why does he play Monta 48 minutes a game. They are both two inept coaches when it comes to rotation.
. But defense cannot be measured by stats. What goes into a defensive rating? How much he held his man to? His percentage? Does it take into account that his man didn’t touch the ball often cause others were getting it done at that time? A certain way the opponent was playing? Can it measure footwork and how a guy thinks or reacts? No it can’t.
You didn’t look at the stat completely. If you click on Marco’s profile, it goes into more depth about his opponents shooting percentages and etc. So it can measure how effective he is at guarding his man. The other things you suggested are not as good of a measure of defense as 82games.com suggests.
Nellie needs to go! but while we suffer....John Wall or Evan Turner please!
I like the opponent eFG% stat
82games does a decent job of capturing defensive stats, I think, and this comes from someone who is wary of defensive numbers in general.
by Reverend_Randy on Mar 14, 2010 11:38 AM PDT up reply actions
http://www.mercurynews.com/sports/ci_14673270?source=rss
“On defense, Ellis made a big contribution. Toronto guard Jose Calderon had 22 points and seven 3-pointers through three quarters. With Ellis defending him in the fourth, Calderon had two points.”
a whole quarter vs. 5 mins of defending.
by hellafornia on Mar 14, 2010 11:54 AM PDT up reply actions
I still can't buy into those type of defensive stats
Cause it can’t tell you what the offense is trying to do or if they tried something different. I’m sure he’s an improved defender but still very average. Also he may be a bad coach but even Nellie plays someone if someone is contributing as much as you say. Maybe there is some truth to the attitude who knows.
We all love the Warriors..
We all hate Cohan as an owner of this franchise…
No, you are just trying to make a point, and now theres proof to the contrary, you won’t support the notion that Nellie doesn’t play players like AR and BW.
Nellie needs to go! but while we suffer....John Wall or Evan Turner please!
He plays AR more than Triano apparently plays Marco
And BW before he got injured looked like he was going to get a lot of minutes. Question for you, why do you think Marco struggles to find time regardless of team?
We all love the Warriors..
We all hate Cohan as an owner of this franchise…
Well, he didn’t struggle to find time until this 8 game run. He was averaging around 20 minutes a game (like AR and BW).
And because he has played for two of the worst coaches in the league, who struggle to put together rotations that make sense.
Nellie needs to go! but while we suffer....John Wall or Evan Turner please!
He actually plays below 20 minutes a game
So do you think he deserves to be playing 25+ minutes a game? Cause I sure don’t. At best he’s a role player, not a starter or a 6th man
We all love the Warriors..
We all hate Cohan as an owner of this franchise…
Yeah, before these games where he was getting 5 or 6 minutes a game his minutes were in the 20’s. And i sure as hell would want Marco over Monta. Efficient scoring, defense, and unselfishness would be much appreciated.
Nellie needs to go! but while we suffer....John Wall or Evan Turner please!
I don't even know what to say to that
You honestly think Marco is better than Monta?
We all love the Warriors..
We all hate Cohan as an owner of this franchise…
He doesn't play because he doesn't play
Seriously, that’s been Jay Triano’s logic in terms of rotations this year. Marco is not a lock-down type, but he can be a pesky defender when given the minutes.
Instead, to our chagrin, the Raptors’ coaching staff prefers to roll the Ottoman out for 40 minutes a game to justify his $53 Million dollar contract, DeRozan, who hasn’t proven a damn thing, or some strange combination of Calderon, Jack AND Hedo.
by Adam Francis on Mar 14, 2010 12:52 PM PDT up reply actions
When Nelson actually coaches the game...
we win!
by Cpt. Jack in the Box on Mar 14, 2010 12:33 AM PST reply actions
When we play teams without defense....
we win!
So let me get this straight... Maggette is the healthy guy.
"Winning is not enough. All others must lose." - Larry Ellison
by Badly Browned on Mar 14, 2010 9:17 AM PST up reply actions
Monta and Curry were great
We just saw a quick preview of what life can be like with Monta of the ball. His efficiency was great tonight and we played so much smoother on offense. On defense it was a great team effort. Most of there points came off of them just being that much bigger than us. We also did a great job on the boards. WW for me goes to both Monta and Steph great. Both played great on both ends of the floor TOGETHER.We don’t win tonight without either of them. Also CB4 just showed why he can’t be the guy for a team. When it gets tough, he hides. Also he ripped his own team after the game. He’s done in Toronto
We all love the Warriors..
We all hate Cohan as an owner of this franchise…
Just to let you know, this is what they said about Jay Triano’s handling of Marco on Raptors HQ.
I could keep going around the circle too here; DeRozan and Calderon for their defense (although Jose’s offensive game was the best it’s been in weeks), Weems for his shot selection, and Belinelli for…um…not playing enough. I’m not sure what happened to Triano’s whole “I’m going to give Marco some major run tonight” thing, but it never came close to occuring.
Nellie needs to go! but while we suffer....John Wall or Evan Turner please!
I liked Monta tonite, but honestly, if he didn’t have a career night shooting from 3, would it have been good?
Can we honestly expect him to shoot 5/7 on 3’s?
Nellie needs to go! but while we suffer....John Wall or Evan Turner please!
Um why try to bring a great performance down with a what if?
Thats like me saying Steph did well when he got the triple double, but can we ever expect him to rebound that well when we have AR and Wright? You reward a player when he plays well, not second guess. Anyway 6 more for Nellie and we got playoff teams coming up. I smell an 8 game winning streak! Positive thinking FTW
We all love the Warriors..
We all hate Cohan as an owner of this franchise…
5/7 on 3’s is amazing…. especially for a 30% 3 point shooter. Thats my point. So should we expect anything similar in the future? Most likely not.
Nellie needs to go! but while we suffer....John Wall or Evan Turner please!
32% and rising :P
Honestly I think he will end up around as a 34 -36% 3 point shooter. And we can expect this type of play from him off the ball like we just saw. 5/7 from three? Probably not, great play? I think so
We all love the Warriors..
We all hate Cohan as an owner of this franchise…
Yeah, it was promising, but watching the game, having Jose Calderon and Antoine Wright guard you can help you out. They put Marco on Monta for 5 minutes and he shut him down. Even got a monta-like steal off of him.
Nellie needs to go! but while we suffer....John Wall or Evan Turner please!
He didn't shut him down don't kid yourself
Yeah he got a steal big whoop, 5 minutes isn’t anything in an NBA game.
We all love the Warriors..
We all hate Cohan as an owner of this franchise…
Homer alert. Can you add something to the conversation once in awhile.
I was at the game, and the only time Monta scored in Marco’s five minutes was on that 3 point play where he fell on Antoine Wright’s feet. I won’t kid myself… just sayin, but you just say in every conversation about how good monta is all the time…
Nellie needs to go! but while we suffer....John Wall or Evan Turner please!
You can say that I'm a homer all you want
But you call people out for saying your a hater and say it’s not really a good way to get your point across. It has the same meaning. And no I don’t, I usually partake in every thread regardless on what it’s about, give an honest opinion and I do poke fun at him or call him out when he does something bad as I should. I’m not a fan of a personal attack but that was one and I don’t think you should be talking about that. Most of the time you show up just when you want to bash on Monta and rarely give him credit for doing something good. I also make a conscious effort to be in the game thread each game and give an honest opinion. I call all our players out for playing badly and what not. I give each player a fair shot, not just get stuck in my own way of hating someone no matter if we win or lose or if that guy plays well or poorly
We all love the Warriors..
We all hate Cohan as an owner of this franchise…
Sorry homer was harsh, how about Monta apologist?
Nellie needs to go! but while we suffer....John Wall or Evan Turner please!
Still an accusation
How about a honest warriors fan?
We all love the Warriors..
We all hate Cohan as an owner of this franchise…
That sounds like disagreeing just for the sake of disagreeing without any contribution
See what I did there?
We all love the Warriors..
We all hate Cohan as an owner of this franchise…
No, i don’t see what you did there.
Nellie needs to go! but while we suffer....John Wall or Evan Turner please!
You pointed out I don't really contribute much
So I reversed it
We all love the Warriors..
We all hate Cohan as an owner of this franchise…
And I distinctly remember Monta going right past Marco while he stumbled.
Belinelli’s opponent PER is one of life’s great mysteries, because he’s still a pretty awful defender.
by Spider Jerusalem on Mar 14, 2010 5:53 AM PST up reply actions
And, no Monta didn’t go right past Marco. He tried to drive past but there was no room. Only time he scored was when Antoine Wright fell on top of him on a jumpshot.
Nellie needs to go! but while we suffer....John Wall or Evan Turner please!
He did. I'll have to go back to the DVR to pinpoint it, but Marco was the primary defender, Monta drove from the left wing and Marco just fell down because he couldn't change direction that quickly.
And that’s his issue. He understand defense well enough, he just isn’t quick enough laterally.
by Spider Jerusalem on Mar 14, 2010 6:54 PM PDT up reply actions
If this is the same play you’re referring to, Marco points to the middle of the key prior to Monta driving. Raptors rely on their big men to help against penetration, their so-called ‘protecting the house’ d. Marco is supposed to prevent him from going to the outside, pretty much inviting him to drive down the middle.
And it’s a stupid strategy and is why the Raptors are so bad at defense.
no next game he may drive to the hoop all night
and score 35. Thats what a skilled player does. He has a diverse game and can score in may fashions. Your just a hater.
8th alias and on probation
I promise to be kinder and gentler
by StinkyFingers on Mar 14, 2010 11:55 AM PDT up reply actions
Monta and Curry certainly looked nice tonight
but I attribute a lot of that to the Raptor’s not willing to (or not able to) defend the drive and kick tonight. Against a better defensive team, I expect those drive and kicks to be absent, and we’d see more players having to create their own plays and/or take their own shots.
I credit them tonight for executing the plays they’re suppose to run, but we have some good teams coming up in the Lakers, Spurs, Grizzles, Suns, Mavericks and Jazz to close out the month of March. Those are the games that will put the Monta/Curry backcourt to the test, both offensively and defensively.
Nevertheless, it’s good to see Curry snap out of his 2 game funk and return to normal after his Charlotte homecoming. I was afraid he would need more games to get back in rhythm.
It was a fun little win, but it was so empty of a win considering the Raptors just didn’t care to play in the 2nd half.
And Triano took out Amir Johnson for Barganani …..that gave us the win.
Nellie needs to go! but while we suffer....John Wall or Evan Turner please!
Amir
picked up his 5th foul with like six minutes left in the game. I think that’s why he got taken out.
Curry/Monta/Turner/Morrow/Buike/Maggs/AR/Wright/Goose/Turiaf= Wins
On another note
Please add me to the “hope the warriors get the #2 pick” fan club.
I’m sold on Evan Turner.
Curry
Ellis
Turner
Randolph
Biedrins
And with the 11th pick of the 1996 NBA draft, the Golden State Warriors select...
by ToddFullerBaby! on Mar 14, 2010 9:27 AM PST reply actions
Bench:
Bell
Maggette
Wright
Watson
Azibuike
Turiaf
Morrow
If we don’t make the playoffs with that team, we gotta clean house and rebuild!
Thats not a playoff team.
By the Way,
John Wall > Evan Turner
John Wall > Steph Curry
John Wall > Monta Ellis
Thing B
by warriorsscore110 on Mar 14, 2010 3:56 PM PDT up reply actions
he as the potential to to be better than Monta and Steph
Don’t make your decision if he hasn’t played a single NBA game yet.
John Wall = Turner (based on how effective they can be on the Warriors)
John Wall < Steph Curry
John Wall < Monta Ellis
by Richboievans on Mar 14, 2010 4:12 PM PDT up reply actions
based on your logic
CJ Watson > John Wall
In my opinion (I thought that went without saying) I think John Wall will be the best player out of this draft and will be a better player than anybody on the current Golden State Warriors roster. I hope we get the #1 pick draft Wall and than we can worry about shaping the rest of roster around him and for a long future around him.
Thing B
by warriorsscore110 on Mar 14, 2010 4:15 PM PDT up reply actions
I have no doubts that he will be the best player out of the draft
But saying he’s better than two of our best players that could possibly be starting on a contender is somewhat outrageou.
Other than that, I agree with everything else you said.
by Richboievans on Mar 14, 2010 4:20 PM PDT up reply actions
Doubts
I have no doubts that he will be the best player out of the draft
I certainly have doubts. Every college basketball fan does. The more I watch him play, the more I see the obvious flaws in his game concerning his jump shot and his ability to execute in the half-court. He’s athletic, yes. He’s explosive, yes. He’s dangerous in the open floor, yes; however, still, something is missing when I watch him play.
The Ultimate Opportunist
by Rated-R Superstar on Mar 14, 2010 7:08 PM PDT up reply actions
It's probably his inability to control a game...
and survey the court. We’re Warrior fans so we’re probably used to Curry’s outstanding level of play.
Your probably just contrasting Curry’s game to his without even knowing it.
Trust me, I just realized I was doing it to lol
by Richboievans on Mar 14, 2010 8:58 PM PDT up reply actions
Wall
The more I watch him play, the more I just don’t know. His jump shot isn’t there. He struggles in a half-court setting, something evident in today’s game against Mississippi State. You just can’t have that in a point guard. He’s definitely very raw.
The Ultimate Opportunist
by Rated-R Superstar on Mar 14, 2010 7:04 PM PDT up reply actions
Amazing
This has me wanting the draft to be like tomorrow. That is really a great lineup for the future. So much talent. The bench is probably one of the better ones in the league. I hope that we can keep a lot of these players though. That remains the question.
by warriornation23 on Mar 14, 2010 1:24 PM PDT up reply actions
I think Matt Steinmetz was a bit right about Bosh. Bosh is a 20/10 guy, but he doesn’t really make an impact on the team. We need to play better D in the paint and also outside because Calderon just lit it up from the 3 point line. Overall, good game from Curry and Monta. That 3 at the end from Steph was crazy aha
Exactly
This why we need to keep Randolph. Not only can he turn into a 20 and 10 guy, but he also makes an impact on the defensive end. He might get bullied by bigger bodies, but he can block anyone’s shot in the league, and he is very feisty. Bosh is none of that. Developing our talent with the right coach and the right ownership is the key here. I think we’d all be willing to sit through a few more seasons of no playoffs if Curry, Randolph, and Either Turner, Cousins, or Favors from this draft are developed properly. We need a coaching staff that coaches defense and rebounding as much as they coach offense. Don Nelson is not that coach, and a 70 year old can not relate to such youth.
Curry = Best Rookie in the draft, regardless of ROY. He’s going to be a STAR
StephEllis gave another glimpse of what they could become, their pluses should always over shadow their minuses.
You would be surprised to see how much better they can look on D with strong post defenders; You can get up on quick guards play his J knowing you have help if they go pass, Know that if the big guards try to post, you have help from a shot blocker.
Most O skills do translate D, it’s just that most players come into the league not ever playing any, most of all players out of H.S. it’s mostly effort.
Too Small
Offensively, they’re amazing to watch. But in the NBA, size matters. I don’t care how many steals Monta gets, he’s a bad defender and he CANNOT guard SG in this league. I think pairing Turner with Curry would be the way to go. Turner can defend, he can score, he can distribute, he can drive, he can do it all, plus he’s 6’7.
How many Assists could Curry have had?
If Tolliver was actually able to finish inside…
You know I spit technique to the freshest freak
Gimme a call you will see results in just a week
With the soul of a LOST HAWK
Is there a heaven for a Rap Cat, let's talk
Tolliver is embarrassing when I watch games with non Warrior fans
by 123707THIZZ on Mar 14, 2010 12:06 PM PDT up reply actions
Wonder how many assists
Curry would have if that was Randolph or Wright…
You know I spit technique to the freshest freak
Gimme a call you will see results in just a week
With the soul of a LOST HAWK
Is there a heaven for a Rap Cat, let's talk
by LostHawkGSW on Mar 14, 2010 12:27 PM PDT up reply actions
Tonight's Warrior Wonder was definitely....
Monta. It’s not because what he did do, it’s what he didn’t do. First off, he wasn’t the primary ball handler, Steph was. He played off the ball, which saw him shoot a higher percentage, make his dribble drives easier, and cut down his turnovers. Sure Steph had the better game statistically, but today Monta did what it took to win. In the future, Steph would get the Warrior Wonder, but Monta’s mentality change gets him my vote tonight. And he still put up 31, 4 and 2, not bad for the secondary ball handler and SG. Loved him tonight. Maggette too, they all benefited from Steph bringing the ball up.
by shahbazi3 on Mar 14, 2010 12:32 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Completely agree
This is one of the first times I have seen Monta play off the ball, which is what I thought he appeared incapable and unwilling to do earlier in the season.
I have previously mentioned that we need to trade Monta if he continues to demand control of the ball, but if this is a glimpse into Monta and Curry playing next year, we should do pretty well, hopefully well enough for a 6-8 seed in the playoffs.
I guess you never saw Monta with Baron.
You know I spit technique to the freshest freak
Gimme a call you will see results in just a week
With the soul of a LOST HAWK
Is there a heaven for a Rap Cat, let's talk
No, what I meant is
I never thought he could go back to that form after being given, as many people like to say, “the keys to the franchise”. That is why I said he seemed unable to play off the ball “earlier in the season”.
Yeah, he started it in the Portland game, and the team really tanked when he fouled out, but he’s looking for his teammates more now, especially looking for Steph. The fast break where Monta dished it out to Steph for the easy lay in against Portland is more of what I want to see from him. I think he might be playing a little less selfishly because the all-star consideration is being thrown out. If they both play like this next year, no doubt they’ll both be All-Stars.
If you mean that if they average 60+ ppg next year they'll be all-star's, than I agree
that’s not happening. The West has too many all-star guards, plus it appears the league doesn’t like Monta, or they just really only like teams with a .500+ winning percentage to be represented by the west squad. Well except that time Roy was selected over Baron. The League loves Curry though, and mostly for that reason I could see him having a better chance to make the all-star squad. Also Evans and Westbrook will also be viable all-star candidates next year.
If Monta had played for an eastern conference team, he would have made the all-star team….
More to your point, I think that Monta can play off the ball next year and average ~27ppg 4ast 5reb 2+stls. I feel those are slightly conservative, but we’ll call them realistic for now. I could see Steph averaging like 21ppg with 8ast 5reb and 2stls as well.
4 steals a night from your backcourt would be solid, and if they can establish a defensive strategy that focuses on utilizing our speed, quickness, and athleticism, we should be able to score more points than we give up next year. 110pf-106pa. That’s assuming that 100% of our top guys are at 85% health for at least 80% of the season though…
That's true...
And it’s unfortunate that if only Curry or Ellis would make the team both putting up all-star numbers, that Curry would probably make it even though Monta deserves it more. The last two games, its looked like Monta has matured a lot more. Maybe he started reading GSoM? Whatever it is, if they play like they have been the last two nights, I’m all for keeping Monta and Curry together. That Mayo swap does not sound too appealing for me right now, especially after reading he’s having trouble playing with Rudy Gay.
The sad thing is, it seems like our front office is 2 months late on everything and if they saw the reactions most of us had to them rejecting the Mayo for Monta trade, they’ll probably try to trade Monta in the offseason. I think it would be hard to find a better 2 guard to fit our system.
Great win,
and Sacramento is playing Minnesota tonight, so we’ll probably maintain our three game win differential.
by golden_solitude on Mar 14, 2010 2:30 PM PDT reply actions
Yup, Kings did end up beating the TWolves tonight
Kings 4 games behind. The current threats are the Wizards (3 1/2 behind) and the Pacers (2 1/2 behind).
by IQofaWarrior on Mar 14, 2010 8:36 PM PDT up reply actions
Biedrins?
I’m not a regular so please forgive me if I’m asking questions you’ve already discusse.
What are your thoughts on Biedrins? It seems that coming back after his first major injury this season he was playing really tentatively. Could it be his operation will make it worse? I really loved the guy last year, but I don’t think he will ever be the dominating presence the rest of the team needs. I think there’s a real chance he’s going to be gunshy.
One other thought—if we ever DO get such a presence, this team will be awesome, because everyone else has had to learn to play defense (steals etc) to make up for the lack.
To be honest
I have no idea what to think. His confidence seems to have gone down the drain. I love his shot blocking and rebounding but I think we need to upgrade the center spot if given the opportunity. If we draft a center he should be traded. If we draft a 3 he should stay to see if he still has it.
We all love the Warriors..
We all hate Cohan as an owner of this franchise…
Never thought I'd say this
Nelson did a great job coaching and I shudder to think if next season the Warriors might end up looking like Toronto if Nelly did get the boot.
OTOH, looks like Toronto muddied up the ROY picture and swung the pendulum back to Steph again.
i loved
seeing curry push the ball up the court by passing ahead reminded me of baron.. as far as defensively, monta has the quickness and does what he can considering he has to go for long stretches of time going all-out on O( still meh D tho). he can limit his defensive defficiency by picking his spots for steals and not getting out of position when guarding he can stay in front of anyone if he puts forth the effort. Somebody tell morrow to stop reaching in altogether, it seems like they almost always result in fouls and 3-pt plays
Curry and Ellis can be a very good backcourt
I was at the game last night, and I saw one of the best backcourt duo’s in the league. Curry and Ellis were passing the ball very welll to each other, and set each other up for good shots. I realized that the games on csn don’t show Monta and Curry interacting much at all, but in person you can see that they get along. They do not have a grudge against each other at all. I saw them high five numerous times. I say this because a lot of people on here think that they don’t get along or that they won’t be able to workout as a scuccesful backcourt, and that has included myself sometimes, but they will become a very good backcourt on a consistent basis in the near future.
Too people...
High fiving means nothing.
I was watching the raptors broadcast and I actually saw the both of them communicating pretty with each other. They were constantly talking and kept giving each other there props.
But honestly, I could care less about there relationship as long as they know what they have to do to win, and are actually successful. Although, them getting along would be nice.
by Richboievans on Mar 14, 2010 4:22 PM PDT up reply actions
Great show by our backcourt, even though it was the craptors.
I think the next few games against teams like the Lakers, Suns, and Grizzlies will give us a better glimpse of the sort of game we can expect on a nightly basis from these 2 next season.
No denying that the last few games are a legitimate cause for optimism.
I agree
If Curry and Ellis mirror this kind of game in the following weeks, then we shouldn’t trade Ellis unless we end up with the first overall pick. If we continue wining and end up with lower then the 3rd overall pick, I think we should trade the pick plus Biedrins for a big man that averages 20/10 either AL Jefferson or Andrew Bogut. We have to get a big man that is reliable scorer and defender, a skinny AR won’t be able to defend against most teams big men.
Waaaarriors
Oh man getting Bogut would be incredible
Also I think we should try to package Maggs with Beans and the 1st if it can get us Bogut and maybe a 3. Also lets not make our expectations too high for Ellis and Steph right now. Were going to be playing some teams with some real size now and we may struggle without AR, Beans and Wright. I just want to see Monta off the ball
We all love the Warriors..
We all hate Cohan as an owner of this franchise…
Just saying, we have a cheaper, better version of Bogut in Andris.
Nellie needs to go! but while we suffer....John Wall or Evan Turner please!
Except that
Bogut has post moves, can guard bigger centers and is improving at a better rate than Andris
We all love the Warriors..
We all hate Cohan as an owner of this franchise…
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