OPEN THREAD: Golden State Warriors Sale- The Oracle of Larry Ellison?
by Atma Brother ONE on Jul 14, 2010 9:05 AM PDT
in News
Email
PrintHopefully something big will be happening soon here in Dubs land.
An owner that actually cares!
[pic via extras.mnginteractive.com]
Here's hoping that the new owner is smart enough to keep coaching legend Don Nelson on board. Here's hoping that the new owner is smart enough to keep Larry Riley, who has made some very intriguing moves lately, as the GM. Imagine if these guys had an owner who actually cared about hoops and had the dough to back it up? There's a lot of basketball knowledge and cleverness between the two. Shoot, imagine if Dubs fans had that kind of owner!
Jump for some linkage!
Linkage:
- SB Nation Bay Area Story Stream- Lots of goodies
- Warriors' Sale Imminent -- Ellison Likely Winner [CSN Bay Area]
- Ellison's time has come: Buy the Warriors, save the world (or something like that) [Talking Points]
- Could Ellison buy the Warriors TODAY? What we know now... [Talking Points]
- The Sale Announcement That Never Came [Inside the Warriors]
- Source: Oracle's Larry Ellison gets late competition in imminent sale of Warriors [Oakland Tribune]
Thanks to VonteegoCummings for the FanPost and everyone who commented.
More from the GSoM Vault:
- 16 Years of Chris Cohan Owning the Golden State Warriors: 10 of the Dumbest Moves
- Oracle CEO Larry Ellison trying to buy NBA franchise Golden State Warriors
- Polling GSoM: Do you want Chris Cohan to sell the Golden State Warriors to Larry Ellison?
- RUMOR: Chris Cohan IS INDEED interested in selling Warriors and was in negotiations with Larry Ellison
- Q&A: Marcus Thompson - Contra Costa Times / InsideBayArea.com (Part 2 of 3)- Don Nelson's media downfall, Chris Mullin as a front office hire, Chris Cohan's closeness to selling the Golden State Warriors
- SPECIAL REPORT: The man who owns the Warriors. Cohan's rocky reign. An era marked by lost games, lost fans and endless litigation [SFGate]
- RUMOR: Warriors owner Chris Cohan "highly likely" to sell
- Polling GSoM: Are you really that surprised that PR director Raymond Ridder and the Golden State Warriors got caught "astroturfing"? (5/23/09)
- At the Press Conference: Write "Sell the Warriors" (8/29/06)
- Missing Signatures (4/19/06)
- Rise to the Occasion (3/17/06)
- 2005-2006 REPORT CARD: Chris Cohan and Robert Rowell (8/23/09)
- BREAKING NEWS: Ice Cube Purchases the Warriors (4/1/06)
- We Want Larry! (7/25/09)
- San Jose SuperSonics in 2k8 (7/18/06)
- NBA Draft 2006: Chris Cohan is happy the draft isn't in the Bay (6/28/07)
- The Dirty Dozen - Part 1 of 3 (9/11/06)
- IRS Stressing Warrior Owner Chris Cohan (5/19/09)
- NBA Payroll Playpen and Cohanomics (11/30/07)
- WARRIORSist (6/6/06)
- RUMOR: Chris Cohan and Robert Rowell said no to Kevin Garnett because of additional salary and the luxury tax (5/16/09)
202 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
Larry!!!
Larry Ellison.
In the sad tradition of the Warriors, he’ll probably get in a horrendous helicopter wreck on his way to the press conference after his acquisition of the team.
Seriously though, buy the team already Larry!!!
Maybe the person who has actually bought the team!
:-D
Its a new dawn...its a new day...its a new owner ....for us!!!!! and I'm FEELING GOOD!!!!!!
by BritWarriorGSW on Jul 15, 2010 11:40 AM PDT up reply actions
Hell Yes!
but it is mystifying to me how many people seem to still support Nelson.
New owner, new coach, new GM. Let’s DO THIS
by panhandlelegend on Jul 14, 2010 9:26 AM PDT reply actions 1 recs
+1
exactly. it’s tough to read this feature when it says crazy stuff like
Here’s hoping that the new owner is smart enough to keep coaching legend Don Nelson on board. Here’s hoping that the new owner is smart enough to keep Larry Riley, who has made some very intriguing moves lately, as the GM.
anyway, new owner, new front office, new coach… maybe some new winning?
don't get this reasoning
Nelson is the only successful coach we’ve had in the 15+ years. Yeah he’s made mistakes but so does every other coach. He also has an ability to inspire players to play to their max potential, as well as being an astute observer and prognosticator of talent, as proven from by some of our best posters with tons of evidence.
In the year or so that Riley has been here, he’s made nothing but good moves, as well as refraining from making plenty of bad moves. I know it’s easy for the ignorant to confuse the Riley FO with the Mullin FO or even the Gary St. Jean FO, but an honest evaluation of Riley shows he’s been pretty good. And even if you don’t agree with him being good, you can’t prove him to be bad, at least not yet. Why fire someone who’s already imprinted the team with his vision of success; bringing in someone new will delay our progress since that GM will want the team to match his vision.
Keep both.
Goal: 8 seed!
by dso on Jul 14, 2010 10:08 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
I have nothign against Nelson
but if he’s retiring and only going to be here for one year. We need to get a new coach set up now and a team that’ll play for him.
agreed
he is nearing 70 years old! we have to set ourselves up for the future. No point in my mind to bring him back for one last season. We are not in the position to give a coach a farewell tour. We need to bring in someone to get ready for the future.
Agreed!
http://sportshistorynow.com/2010/07/14/new-gsw-ownership-shouldn%E2%80%99t-fully-clean-house/
Confident Marco Belinelli supporter
Ode to Tim Kawakami
by Doctor Kajita on Jul 14, 2010 10:39 AM PDT up reply actions
It's not...
…pertinent to say that Nelson’s the best coach we’ve had in fifteen years if every other coach we’ve had has been bottom-of-the-barrel abysmal. What’s the ranking? You got Nelson, then Musselman, then… Montgomery? Winters? Carlisimo? Pretty desperate bunch. I think Nelson could have a good season as a head coach ahead of him, but it seems like a pretty big gamble to me. Past success is no guarantee of future success. If there’s a compelling reason that Don Nelson should be kept as head coach that relies on current analysis and not his coaching history, I don’t really see it.
Riley is a different story. From a financial standpoint he’s been decent; shedding Maggette’s contract was s savvy move, but at the same time his behavior surrounding the Morrow decision is hard to stomach. He said afterwards that you can’t let emotion dictate your decisions (which, incidentally, was what Otis Smith suggested had happened when the Magic tried to sign CJ last offseason), which is a bizarre comment. There are plenty of reasons rooted not in emotion, but in intellect, not to give up Anthony Morrow. An obvious one is that our team, which if Don Nelson remains will obviously shoot a bunch of threes, doesn’t have the ideal personnel for that task. Curry, yes. After him, who do you feel comfortable hoisting an outside shot? Monta, no. Wright is a downgrade as a shooter. David Lee? Reggie Williams could end up being their best deep shooter behind Curry, and that’s quite an unproven. Anthony Morrow, being the best three point shooter in the damn league, certainly would’ve mitigated that.
This wouldn’t even bother me so much if it didn’t seem like such a no-brainer hang on to him. Is there any downside to having that kind of sniper on your team? And at a damn reasonable price, too- despite being the best pure shooter in the league, Morrow doesn’t make as much as other one-dimensional spot-up artists (which is saying a lot, considering Morrow is actually two-dimensional with his rebounding). The only possible overriding negative is his defense, but Riley just signed up one of the league’s worst defensive big men to a six year deal, so clearly he isn’t too worried about stopping the ball, at least not so that it dictates all his decisions.
but an honest evaluation of Riley shows he’s been pretty good. And even if you don’t agree with him being good, you can’t prove him to be bad, at least not yet.
If you can’t prove him to be bad (which I agree, we can’t) then I don’t know how an honest evaluation shows he’s been good.
by Zack Vank on Jul 14, 2010 10:54 AM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
If there’s a compelling reason that Don Nelson should be kept as head coach that relies on current analysis
You’re right, we shouldn’t rely on what he’s done in the past but what he can bring next season. I think it means a lot to him to be coaching his last year and I think the players want to play for him like they did last season. Except this season he will hopefully have a better, healthier roster.
Confident Marco Belinelli supporter
Ode to Tim Kawakami
by Doctor Kajita on Jul 14, 2010 11:00 AM PDT up reply actions
good points
Your reasoning behind the coaching differential is legit but, to me, irrelevant. Cuz I don’t care what the extenuating circumstances are, I care more about results.Nellie took us to the playoffs when no one else could and did so with a squad that was, honestly speaking, crap. For me, this means he deserves to finish his contract. His failures after that should give us pause in re-signing him, but when 15 years of Nba hell is bracketed by one man, then respect the contract.
As for Riley, you’re right about the financial stuff. And thanks for agreeing with me in regards to the inability to prove him bad. Now let me show you how he’s been good:
1. Drafting Stephen Curry. Easy move? Yeah, sure… in hindsight. The move was panned by every “expert” site last year, saw hella hate from this site. He did the ballsy move and picked a player that was ready now that had low “potential”, especially athletic potential.
2. Not trading for Amare Stoudemire. Great move. If we had gotten him we wouldn’t have stephen curry and he would have left us anyway, which means we would have absolutely nothing now and wouldn’t have had the pieces to get David Lee
3. Getting David Lee. Let me explain to you why this move shows he’s a good GM in 2 ways. First, many “expert” sties have posited that David Lee may be the best big free agent 4 this year, and if not the best, than at least as good. So it’s a good move in that respect; the knock against his D is pretty retarded when the marginal defense between his supposedly poor Defense with our poor Defense is totally weighed by the huge improvements he brings to our offense.
Second, getting david Lee shows that Riley can make the move that he wants to make. So whether he was right or wrong in doing so, the fact he can make the decision shows he can get the job done. Contrast that with years of FO ineptitude talking the talk but absolutely toothless when it comes to actually making the big move, as epitomized by the KG trade that never happened and left us with Brandan Wright.
Let’s talk about this a bit more. When Riley first came in he was hampered with two ridiculous ball-and-chains in Maggette and jackson. Riley wanted to get rid of them, and was able to do so even though most considered it impossible. This mean he can do what he wants, a sign of a GM who’s skilled at his craft.
Goal: 8 seed!
The reason...
…I agreed he couldn’t be proven bad is because last season the roster was too savaged by injury to resemble anything close to its ideal, and because it was his first season dealing with a foreign roster. I suspect most people would grade GMs not on the immediate vibe or analysis right after they make a deal, but on the on-court effect it has for the team. Last season we didn’t really get to see that, so I’m willing to say you can’t prove him bad. However…
1) I’ve heard this said recently around here about Curry, that it was a gutsy call to draft him, but honestly, I can’t think of anybody on the board at that point that the Warriors (or myself, for that matter) would’ve taken. None of us wanted Jordan Hill, did we? I seem to remember him being a depressing proposition around here. Sure, maybe some contingent of people had “hella hate” for Curry here, but this is a sports blog. That’s like reporting that a baby is crying- happens all the time for virtually any reason. The call seemed to be him or Jennings, and given Curry’s exceptional collegiate career, picking him doesn’t seem that surprising. Still, it is a draft pick, and Riley (or Nelson) made it, so that is a positive move. As for the experts reaction, my understanding was that Curry was expected (by the Warriors brass in particular) to be gone by the time they picked. The Knicks were definitely taking him right after us. So, it seems kind of like an expected move. He was considered a top-8 pick going into the draft, and that’s right about where he landed.
2) I agree, not trading for Stoudemire was a good move! But given that Stoudemire voiced his displeasure at the idea of playing here, and was an FA destined to bolt the second he could, it’s certainly not a decision that I would expect a competent GM to foul up. Essentially, this and the last point revolve around the same good decision- to put your eggs in the Stephen Curry basket and not give up on him.
3) You mention that “expert” sites rank him as the best free agent 4 this year (which I’d like to see- I was under the impression Bosh was the blue chip), but this betrays an inconsistency; in your first point, you credited Riley for ignoring the “expert” sites in drafting Curry. Basically, your earlier point about Curry, if you truly believe in it, defeats your own first thesis about Lee, which is that this same vague group of people rate him highly. As for his defense/offense- I honestly don’t believe you can take a team as bad on D as we were last season, make them incrementally WORSE, and have a successful season, regardless of our offensive output. We weren’t exactly bad on O last year. Also, I’m sure you’d agree that in an ideal world, we’d be getting better at defense in future seasons, even if not this next one as a matter of personnel; having Lee as our starting 4 for the next six years (or three, or four, or whenever we tire of him) isn’t going to really allow that, because he’s playing an important defensive position and brings, well, no defense.
I’ll agree that it’s refreshing to see the Warriors target a big name and get him, but all big names are not created equal. I’ll gladly eat crow about this if the team starts winning, but trotting out one of the league’s worst defenders at PF seems an unlikely way to spark a turnaround given this squad’s recent history.
by Zack Vank on Jul 14, 2010 11:37 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
well one thing is true
i’m hella wrong about the move being panned, every site i searched seemed to give at least a B. Guess I sided myself too much with Monta back then
Goal: 8 seed!
i’m hella wrong about the move being panned, every site i searched seemed to give at least a B.
don’t accept that all those sites know more about the warriors than the long term fans know, most of them don’t watch as many warrior games as we do.
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jul 15, 2010 9:38 AM PDT up reply actions
and in regards to expert sites
basically, I think the important thing is that Riely doesn’t put much weight into what the experts say in making his decision, not that he’s actively looking to run contrary to them.
Goal: 8 seed!
Right...
…but as such, you’d grant me that touting David Lee’s ranking amongst these faceless experts has a diminshed worth, at least if you believe they were so wrong in their assessment of Curry.
well i'm not the type
to discredit an entire source because they make a mistake here or there. ( I for one make a lot of mistakes and admit it when I do, if I held myself to the that standard I would have to hate myself). The reason I brought it up was to show that I respect Larry’s ability to make decisions that run contrary to popular opinion if he feels it’s the right move. So yeah, their worth is diminished if you feel that I’m trying to discredit the source by highlighting a mistake, but I’m not really trying to do that.
Goal: 8 seed!
I agree...
…as far as sources are concerned. I think part of the problem is that we’re arguing about “experts,” which is a term so vague. If we were arguing bout, say, one or two named sources it’d be easier.
"You got Nelson, then Musselman, then… Montgomery? Winters? Carlisimo?"
ouch. Rick Adelman is definitely better than Carlesimo, Winters, Montgomery & Musselman.
by the evil monkey on Jul 14, 2010 11:36 AM PDT up reply actions
I always...
…forget Adelman was here. Thanks for the catch.
I think PF is actually one of the easier positions to cover up a bad defender. Far less detrimental to team defense than having poor perimeter defenders that give up penetration, or a weak sister center that gets manhandled in the post. Unfortunately, we have both those things, so it will be difficult to help Lee out…
Sittin in my scraper watchin Oakland goin wild, ta-dow!
If...
…the team defense got much better, I agree that we could muster. My concern is that Lee’s defensive liabilities might be as much physical as mental- his blocking abilities are indescribably anemic for a big man who plays around 34-36 minutes. While I agree that blocked shots aren’t everything, a PF at 6’9 who only blocks one shot every two games sets off a big warning bell for me. It seems like as much an issue of “can’t” as “won’t.”
Is there any downside to having that kind of sniper on your team?
only to the coaching expectations. Morrow = more pressure to succeed, worse shooter = less pressure?? remember nellie needs to be the underdog and sabotages every team that exceeds average skill level.
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jul 15, 2010 9:34 AM PDT up reply actions
Nelson is the only successful coach we’ve had in the 15+ years
and all we have to show is a couple lousy playoff appearances…in 15+ years….no matter how good or bad we think these FO’s have been we still had a loooooong sh**ty stretch of completely lousy to mediocre seasons. Riley may be ok in your opinion but the fact is we aren’t winning at all….and we arent keeping any teams together long enough to develop a chemistry to win….have we gotten so used to losing that we think as long as the FO is “trying” then losing is ok? or if we go 29-53 one season then 31-51 the next then it was a success? last time i checked thats a reason to be fired not praised and understood
KeWzEe
Clean house!
Nobody should be left standing. Not a single remnant of the FO disaster we’ve experienced over the last decade and half should be allowed to survive.
No mercy. No survivors.
Start new. Find a direction. Spend money. Build a contender step by step.
- W's and A's fan since '68
to be fair to Riley, he had less to do with the past decisions than he has this summer – I’d consider keeping him on, and am not convinced he hasn’t been communicating with the new ownership group. But it’s passed time for Nelson to retire and the fact that he got his record last season removes any sentimental or other pressure to keep him aboard other than negotiating a buy out.
Agreed
Nelson should definetly be out, I wouldn’t mind giving Riley more time. However, if he feels the need to bring in a more experienced GM, I won’t complain.
by bayareaballa on Jul 14, 2010 9:50 AM PDT up reply actions
riley's has plenty of experience as GM
Goal: 8 seed!
riley has plenty of experience as GM
Goal: 8 seed!
You now have plenty of experience posting that.
I agree with your post BTW.
Derrick Coleman is my power animal.
by bloodsweatndonuts on Jul 14, 2010 12:29 PM PDT up reply actions
im definitely on board with Nelson finishing out his final year of his contract and keeping Riley on board as GM. Riley has done as good of job as anyone since taking over. What, with cleaning up the messes with dumping contracts, drafting Curry, getting Lee long term for a reasonable contract, setting this team up with a workable situation cap wise while having a young core to keep building with yet capable of potentially winning now. A lot of people on here like to dump on Nelson especially with the last few seasons but As Nelson has shown throughout his coaching career, if you get him a team with the potential to win and be successful, he can get them to win and be successful. Sure that hasn’t resulted in a championship for him, but like we saw a couple years ago if you get him a a decent enough team and let him do his thing, it can work out. unfortunately in 07 we had to face Utah in the second round which we never have seemed to match up well with the last 6 or 7 years. I would also be in favor of eventually, potentially giving Keith Smart a fair shot at being a head coach after Nelson’s contract is up. I’m usually in favor of promoting from within coaching wise with sport teams assuming you have a decent enough staff to give that shot too. (thankfully coaching staff isn’t our issue, it was front office. Which makes the job Riley has done all the more impressive.)
by dannyschmanny on Jul 14, 2010 10:31 AM PDT up reply actions
my idea situation would be keep Riley in the FO somewhere, while bringing in a better, more recognizable GM. Riley’s moves this offseason have earned him his stay here, but if we can, upgrade by all means
by bamboobanga on Jul 14, 2010 10:33 AM PDT up reply actions
If he will take
the demotion than I completely agree. I still really want Pritchard. If Riley would accept being his assistant GM than it would be ideal. Otherwise, if we can land a Pritchard type than bye bye Riley thanks for the one good offseason.
nice analogy
yes, the desire to fire riley/nelson is similar to the vacillations of the paranoid Mob
Goal: 8 seed!
either way. it’d be nice to get rid of Rowell, Abdenour & Fitz asap.
and if there are better candidates out there, the sooner the better.
Nellie’s probably last on my list since he’s gone after this season anyway.
by the evil monkey on Jul 14, 2010 11:42 AM PDT up reply actions
I wouldn't clean house though
Maybe if we were in a rebuilding process I could understand, but we’re one piece away from legitiament play off contenders.. And even with the team the way it is now we have a chance. We don’t have many of the same players comming back from last season, and the last thing we need to do it get a whole new coaching staff and FO, I say we give Nelson and Riley another year.. See what happens. It was nelli who got us to the play offs, and mullin hat traded Jrich. We still got a chance to do something special, the last thing I want to happen is to bring in new coaches and somehow that effects the growth of curry.. I would hate to see that happen
by GSW Fan4Life on Jul 14, 2010 9:43 AM PDT via mobile reply actions
I wouldn't clean house though
I would agree that a year transition is better. Nellie needs to retire after this season but many who hate him now will miss him if we donot get the right coach…..funny how this would turn around after a healthy winning year…….Riley has made nothing but good moves in just a year on the job and is not really a Cohan link…..why the hate herd mentality.
by Only In Fairfax on Jul 14, 2010 10:13 AM PDT up reply actions
Riley...
has made nothing but good moves in just a year on the job…
Obviously it’s a matter for argument, but while I understand the logic, I’m not sold on David Lee. It’s gonna be a conga line to the rim. Also, washing his hands of Morrow is a decision I can’t make heads or tails of.
Ellison
He probably won’t be firing people the first day, but shortly thereafter he definitely should clean house and get some new organizational blood in the FO and leading the team. That includes getting rid of Nelson, who is past his prime and doesn’t seem to care anymore, and the dysfunctional front office. With the amount of money Ellison will be willing to spend, free agents will want to come here and W fans won’t have to settle for the D League all stars anymore.
Neal before Zod!
Official Sponsor of the 1997 San Francisco Giants
by nostocksjustbonds on Jul 14, 2010 9:48 AM PDT reply actions
I bet Nellie might stay around but no longer be coach
Keep him around for the last year as a scout.
Nelson and Riley
I think we should keep Nelson and Riley as they are going to be critical to the success of next season. When people say Nelson or Riley does not care, it is somewhat false as both are seemingly determined to keep this team improved. I mean even Nelson took time of his vacation and studied summer league players. Riley certainly has done a good job of changing our team (depends on how people look at it).
I also think that if we were to completely throw out the coaching staff and GM, it will undermine the teams growth and we would have to somewhat start over looking forward to 11-12’ season. I say we let Nelson and Riley try this new team out and see how far were going to go.
ESPN
This has gotten no pub on ESPN and I know its not final but for all the talk about Prokarov (misspell I’m sure) Ellison dwarfs the guy. He’ll clean house over a 2-3 week span I’m sure Jerry West??!!!
this is not NY, LA, LeBron, Wade, Miami or Kobe. You really expect ESPN to cover it?
by Ice Watter In His Veins! on Jul 14, 2010 10:02 AM PDT up reply actions
there's a story in the rumors section
but you have to be an insider.
Even before the Warriors went up for sale, the common assumption was that if and when the team was available for purchase, Oracle CEO Larry Ellison would be the top candidate to assume ownership of the franchise. And it looks like that day is nearing. The San Fransisco Chronicle reports that Ellison is “close to acquiring the Warriors” and that sources say he “outbid 24-Hour Fitness founder Mark Mastrov, among others.” The paper also reports he would control 80 percent of the team and four incumbent minority owners would retain their stakes. If Ellison assumes control soon, it’s possible coach Don Nelson could be out of a job. Some have surmised if ownership changes hands before the season starts, it could signal a house clearing of sorts. But the $6 million Nelson is owed next season would be at issue.
since when
did espn care about us in the slightest bit. Aside from the Dallas upset, we never get any pub.
ESPN is a joke.
They have a HUGE east coast bias. The only thing good about SportsCenter now is the Top 10 Plays of the day. Their peronalities aren’t what they used to be.
Type the words RUN TMC in Ebay!
Type the words RUN TMC in Ebay!
Type the words RUN TMC in Ebay!
Type the words RUN TMC in Ebay!
Pacquiao fans type MANNY CHANT in Ebay!
He probably won’t be firing people the first day, but shortly thereafter he definitely should clean house and get some new organizational blood in the FO
If the america’s cup experience means anything he’ll probably sue the league and hire an aussie head coach? then spend a fortune to build a super team to beat the heat in a series that no one wants to watch?
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jul 14, 2010 9:59 AM PDT reply actions
I’d watch. You would too.
the league needs more than warriors and heat fans to be successful, every franchise should be able to compete with expectations of winning, two superteams would kill the appeal of the sport for the other 28 teams fans.
Same thing happened to the america’s cup. it was once an interesting elimination series in very equal boats and now it’s just a corporate freak show and most sailors don’t even follow it.
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jul 15, 2010 9:45 AM PDT up reply actions
Riley and Nelson....
I feel Don Nelson is more collecting a check than building a winning team. IMO, he should be on the beautiful island, enjoying a well earned retirement.
Riley might deserve a year to or two, but if Ellison gets the Dubs my bet is his good friend Jerry West takes over all basketball operations.
Here’s to the future Warrior fans !
sharkraider
Can you imagine if Ellison loses?
I really hope he gets it otherwise, it could get ugly. I could see him yanking the naming rights on the Arena which would cause the new owner to pull an Indiana Pacers and demand Oakland to pay for the displaced revenue. Then he would go up highway 80 buyout the Kings, who already have a leg up on us in terms of two cornerstones and focus all of his energy on destroying the team that turned him down.
Sadly, this extra drama might actually be a welcome change.. sigh..
by Ice Watter In His Veins! on Jul 14, 2010 10:06 AM PDT reply actions
Troll alert!
Set a record by getting banned for the 8th time!
After rehab I saw the light and promise to be kinder and gentler!
Probation is a very slippery slope!
by StinkyFingers on Jul 14, 2010 12:06 PM PDT up reply actions
"Coaching Legend Don Nelson"
and “critical to the success of next season” regarding Don Nelson are the too most ridiculous things I’ve read on this blog. I’m serious.
This is not Nelson’s team anymore, his days are officially numbered. If you think he’d be anything other than a lame-duck, directionless, meddler to this team you’re seriously reaching – when has he ever proved otherwise? WHAT HAS HE EVER DONE? Most wins, least championships.. why is that? Is it because his bs style of basketball gets beat every time? It is, the stats prove it. What could he do for this team and it’s players other than steer them in the wrong direction strategically, developmentally, etc?
START OVER. We have new Warriors ownership, some new Warriors players, and a new Warrior culture. Stop the madness, let’s try and compete with the rest of the real basketball teams.
by eastbayallday on Jul 14, 2010 10:15 AM PDT reply actions 1 recs
WHAT HAS HE EVER DONE?
Not even the greatest Nellie detractors truly believe he’s done nothing in his long career.
"I never watched baseball on TV. It's slow and boring. I'm not a fan. Never was." - Jeff Kent
FREE POSEY IS FREE
by Yoyo on Jul 14, 2010 10:27 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Sorry, extracting the exaggeration
I guess it should read, “What has he ever done for the Warriors… in the last 4 years that would suggest he wouldn’t be a negative influence, or a hinderance on this team or the development of its players?”
by eastbayallday on Jul 14, 2010 12:17 PM PDT up reply actions
two, not too.
“too most” is also ridiculous, sorry.
two, not too.
“too most” is also ridiculous, sorry.
For those who want Pritchard
Pritchard’s good, yes, but this could be a case of the grass being greener while turning a blind eye to his egregious mistakes. Because when you sacrifice Jordan for Sampson, no matter how exonerated you may be by the misfortune of injuries, you still need to take blame for not getting Jordan. On a lesser scale, this analogy works with Oden vs Durant. If Pritchard had made the right choice, he wouldn’t have had to trot out the bust Martell Webster as his 3; with Roy + Durant, his team would have been championship contenders every year without a doubt.
So even though his reasoning may have been justified, he still screwed up horribly. Yeah, who can predict the future regarding injury? But even a healthy Oden does not compare to Durant. Then he fills out his lineup with a bunch of more injury-prone bigmen, punctuated by his trading for Camby last year and just praying for him to buck his trend of injury. Not to mention another acquisition that failed in Andre Miller.
My point is that every GM makes mistakes. Pritchard’s good but not that good, not to the point he gets to replace Riley, a GM who has made a lot of good moves so far and as of yet, no proven mistakes
Goal: 8 seed!
Yeah, because Oden vs. Durant was the only decision he made
He has consistently been a part of very, very good drafts, from the Roy for Foye steal (as well as getting the #7 pick in the first place) to the Webster for Babbitt move a few weeks back to Nic Batum and Rudy Fernandez at the bottom of the first round.
Trading Zach Randolph and getting back anything positive, much less Channing Frye, in return.
Adding Marcus Camby for nothing of value was an incredibly good move as well, as was extending him before this crazy off-season.
Pritchard was a major part in turning a team that was in the pits into a team that should be in the playoffs a vast majority of the next 10 years despite being in a city that has as much or more trouble than anyone luring free agents. What more do you want?
by dprodigy19 on Jul 14, 2010 10:34 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
i'm pretty sure i said he's made plenty of good moves
i’m just saying that his mistakes need to pointed out, especially his most egregious one. Even if his reasoning is 100 percent justified, which it probably was, it doesn’t matter. He still gave up the third best player in the game and got in return an injury prone big man who has given next to nothing in production… in other words, he gave up a superstar and got a bust instead. This team has been able to contend thanks to his moves, yes. But this team could be a championship contender now and for the forseeable future if it had Durant. That is a mistake of paramount proportions; and just as drafting Sampson over Jordan had tons of extenuating circumstances but still is considered the biggest draft mistake ever, so too should Pritchard be judged for his unlucky failure.
Goal: 8 seed!
drafting Oden was not a mistake
it may not turn out well, but he was the consensus #1 pick. Hindsight is 20/20. If Wall has a career-ending injury tomorrow, was he a mistake, too?
A mistake is something like picking Udoh when the majority of opinion is that he is not the BPA or doesn’t fill a need.
no, what you don't realize is the consensus is irrelevant
who cares about consensus? Okafor was the consensus number 1; was charlotte right in drafting him ahead of Howard? Of course not! The right move is not the move that matches the consensus but the one that gets you the most results, especially when the consensus fails more often than not as evidenced by all these consensus high draft picks that go to crap.
remember, the consensus had us drafting anyone but steph curry last year. riley gave a big “F You” to DX, Nbadraft, ESPN and all these other talking heads or wannabe talking heads and did what he felt would get him the most results
Goal: 8 seed!
Are you insane?
The only reason people didn’t see the Warriors drafting Curry was because people didn’t think he’d be available when they picked.
Other than some who supported Brandon Jennings, you’re completely talking out of your ass.
hi guy
http://www.goldenstateofmind.com/2009/5/19/880561/2009-nba-draft-lottery-results-+
then press control+f
then type curry. Guess what? 0 results. Which means that no one even stated a desire for him in 173 comments.
The more I search the more evidence I find in my favor. I’m more than willing to post them if you want to continue with the derogatory talk
Goal: 8 seed!
Wow, a thread from MAY
That’s your evidence?
It was more than a month before the draft and the guys most discussed went 2-6 (Harden, Evans, Rubio).
Hollinger’s player rater had Steph Curry #5
Draft Express had Curry going #6
Plus, the post-draft discussions were during the time that it looked like the Dubs were going to trade the pick to Phoenix for Amare, so very few talked about Curry as a fit.
actually you're right
as it gets closer and closer to draft day more people support curry. my bad yo
Goal: 8 seed!
no one thought curry would fall
I thought it was obvious we were going to take him if he fell since Hill duplicated AR/BW. He seemed a Nellie type player back then :)
The consensus is actually pretty important. It turns out Gilbert Arenas was better as a second rounder than most of the people taken before him in his draft. Yet to take him in the top 10 would be a terrible call, because the consensus says he is a second round pick. So why take him high when you can trade down and get him at what the consensus deems his value?
Actually the Orlando Magic had the first pick.
They picked Dwight Howard over Okafor.
by tayuku on Jul 14, 2010 4:40 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
The move didn’t pan out, true, but was it really a mistake? A franchise big guy, which is what everyone was projecting Oden to be, is the most valuable thing in basketball. You have to make that move.
Also, you miss on a number one overall pick and your team is still a contender? What does that tell you?
or you could look at it from an opportunity cost perspective
and say that if he had drafted Durant his team would not just be contending for an 8 seed every year but woudl be championship contenders every year.
Goal: 8 seed!
According to who?
How often do potential Hall of Fame Centers change zip codes before they are past their prime?
In the last 15 years, it has happened with one player, and that was Shaq.
Also, learn what opportunity costs mean, because they don’t work in your favor when arguing Durant vs. Oden. At ALL.
the opportunity cost of drafting oden is not drafting durant
sup?
Goal: 8 seed!
but that's hindsight
do you not get that? A “mistake” is something that everyone else knows you’re doing wrong. If you pick a player who is clearly not considered BPA, people will either call you an idiot or genius, depending on how it turns out. If you pick the BPA, at worst, you can be called unlucky, at best, you get credit for doing what everyone else would have done, too. You lose your job for making mistakes, but usually not for being unlucky.
Also, saying that Oden was a worse prospect that Durant at the time is insanity
Hall of Fame quality big men are infinitely more valuable than #1 scorers that aren’t transcendent, and we had no idea that Durant was going to be this good this soon.
Plus, Oden might have been the best big man prospect in the last decade at the point he was drafted so it’s not like they took Bowie over Jordan ( and that was the pick, not Sampson over Jordan).
Also, Durant and Roy together would not be nearly as good as they are apart since both of them (particularly Roy) use the ball a lot, though I’m confident they’d make it work since they are both amazingly talented.
you are providing the extenuating circumstances that i also referred to
I understand this. It doesn’t matter… results matter more than reasoning. He messed up and all his good moves cannot cover it up. And as such, we should realize that Pritchard is not perfect and not automatically the superior alternative to Riley that many assume he will be.
Goal: 8 seed!
Congratulations, you picked the worst and most unfair possible way to evaluate a GM's draft choices
“Results matter more than reasoning”
So making the right decision but being hit by completely unforeseeable circumstances makes that decision incorrect?
I’m sure you’d love to tell that to Red right when he drafted Len Bias.
bringing in bias is low
but whatever, i’m not saying you don’t have a point, but you need to realize i’m not damning pritchard. I’m saying he’s a good GM that’s not worth firing Riley over since he has his share of mistakes
Goal: 8 seed!
How is bringing in Bias low?
It is the prototypical example of your ex post facto draft argument.
Unless you’re arguing that Oden getting off the couch and needing microfracture surgery was foreseeable and every single draft person didn’t see it, you’re downgrading one for the same thing that is “low” in the other case.
If I’m misinterpreting, I’d love to hear where the distinction is.
arguing the extreme, especially when it's a tragic one
is about as strong a rhetorical strategy as bringing up Nazi Germany.
Goal: 8 seed!
Bringing up...
…Nazi Germany is an argument that’s pertinent isn’t a problem, it’s only when it’s bandied about cavalierly as some people do nowadays.
forget Bias
“So making the right decision but being hit by completely unforeseeable circumstances makes that decision incorrect?”
That’s the reasoning being questioned. Like… having one big go down with injuries is an unforeseeable circumstance. After 3 or 4 go down, it’s not unforeseeable, it means you’re not looking at the cause. So which is worse – losing a player in the draft, or turning a blind eye to the fact that your buddy runs a team that is excessively dangerous to the players?
Opportunity cost is one thing – asset destruction is quite another.
by sellWarriorsNowplzthx on Jul 14, 2010 11:38 AM PDT up reply actions
Are you arguing that Oden's injuries are asset destruction?
If so, look into what actually caused them:
Oden’s second injury was a complete fluke and identical to Blake Griffin’s.
Oden’s first was a little more open to discussion, but was still completely unforeseeable.
The Blazers had a ton of injuries in general, but Oden’s were so unusual and did not show anything concerning brittleness on his part or structural problems for Portland. They disprove neither, of course, but that’s because they aren’t probative either way.
You can call Oden's injuries "unforeseeable" but that's hindsight speaking.
A lot of people (Bill Simmons comes to mind, he harped on this repeatedly) called it in advance.
Now maybe that’s a coincidence. Simmon’s point was simply that Oden LOOKED like he was a guy who was always going to be hurt, he didn’t move well.
His style got us the play offs
And gave us a 48 win season after, we started to lose talent. People love to play in this system and hate to play against it. We can’t blame Nellie for lack of talent and injuries. Because as I recall, when heathly with some talent and his style if play.. It got us o out first play off apperence in over a decade
by GSW Fan4Life on Jul 14, 2010 10:23 AM PDT via mobile reply actions
+1
Nelson is gone after this season no matter what, and that probably means Riley is as well. I kind of doubt Ellison is going to blow the whole thing up on day one though, given the feelings of renewed optimism. Why not at least see if they can have some success? I would guess that if we are out of sniffing range of the playoffs in January though, heads will roll. In any event, I am sure he has a transition in mind already.
Sittin in my scraper watchin Oakland goin wild, ta-dow!
His style is nice
But it has NEVER won a championship. Run n Gun in modern times just doesn’t work, only time it SHOULD/COULD was the infamous “Horry Bump” that ruined the Suns chances. End of the day, Defense always wins championships, works that way in all sports…
by WarriorKing76 on Jul 14, 2010 10:33 AM PDT up reply actions
you're right.
but only 2 or 3 teams actually impose a “run n gun” style and 1 of them (suns) actually went far into the playoffs. All I am trying to say is that with the right set of players, non-injured ones, we may actually succeed in the playoffs. Heck Nelson did that with a somewhat unorthodox team and made miracles happen in the playoffs.
But yeah you’re right and defense-minded teams do win championships and that is why I see riley somewhat focusing defense-minded playing style on the team. Which is good to see.
Nelson isn't Anti-Defense
His teams in Milwaukee were among the best defensive teams in the league on a regular basis.
What Nelson’s MO has always been is to adapt to the talent on his team and put them in the best position to win. With the RUN TMC teams, his best players were 6’ 7" and under.
In NY, he had Patrick Ewing with broke down knees and he was trying to get the team to recognize that Ewing, at this stage in his career, needed to a 3rd option. Next best player was aging Charles Oakley.
In Dallas, his best player was Nash and a rookie Nowitzki. Not big defensive guys.
W’s should keep Nellie this last season since he’s looking at a CLEAN EXIT. Not a firing. W’s can openly negotiate with new candidates throughout the season and have 1st pick at the best available.
Plus it’s respectful of the man.
A win win
If we...
…were talking about a player instead of a coach- a player who earned a much higher salary than most peers who had more success over that period of time- who was also over-the-hill (insofar as we know Nelson’s age only permits one, maybe two more seasons) but had been instrumental in a playoff series win three years ago, how would people feel? I suspect people would say we have no need to care about what’s “respectful to the man,” because he’s overpaid, and is essentially a contracted employee of the team (which is, lest we forget, what Nelson is).
I’m also curious to know why it is that basically everyone derides Rowell and Cohan as poor management that couldn’t fall ass-backwards into a good decision, and yet Rowell extending Nelson is somehow the one decision (in the eyes of the most ardent of his supporters) that doesn’t evoke a, “this has Rowell’s stink all over it.” If you’re hugely behind Don Nelson, then you need to thank Robert Rowell for making that happen, by making a move you consider savvy and wise. I don’t think anybody is willing to do that.
W’s should keep Nellie this last season since he’s looking at a CLEAN EXIT.
that makes the most sense, we are going to need a transition year anyway so the coach is kinda irrelevant at this time(unless we can steal doc rivers)
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jul 15, 2010 9:49 AM PDT up reply actions
His style is to overwork his main guys, trust no one else, never develop the bench, then act like there is nothing he can do come April when the team has no energy left.
Or in 2006-2007, when his main players were injured for most of the season, forcing him to use other guys, but then in the playoffs going back to a 6 man rotation when everyone was healthy. He had the perfect matchup where he knew what adjustments to make against the Mavericks because he used to coach them, but against Utah he was outcoached, because he kept trying the same thing.
His style is perfect for the regular season, bad for the playoffs, when you face the same team 4-7 times and you need to change up your style on them.
The Jazz were just a better team.
Confident Marco Belinelli supporter
Ode to Tim Kawakami
by Doctor Kajita on Jul 14, 2010 10:46 AM PDT up reply actions
Maybe so but when the one thing you keep trying is not working, you can either adjust to something else (which might not work as well) or be stubborn and keep doing what you have always been doing.
Also, we were a Jackson missed 3 pointer and some Pietrus missed free throws away from being up 3-0, so I’m not sure they were clearly better at all. I would say they adjusted very well after the first couple games to slow down the pace, and we never made any moves to counter this.
Maybe so but when the one thing you keep trying is not working
and nellie had the whole season to prepare for the jazz, he had foyle sitting all that year instead of figuring out a way to use his size for a few minutes a game when we were getting worn down by the other teams bigs.
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jul 15, 2010 9:53 AM PDT up reply actions
That
“His style is to overwork his main guys, trust no one else, never develop the bench, then act like there is nothing he can do come April when the team has no energy left.”
Combine overwork with inferior training and conditioning, and you get injuries. D’oh. It’s reason enough to not bring Nellie back – the damage his “style” can do to players is a cost we don’t need to bear. It’s not like it gives us a lot of wins..
by sellWarriorsNowplzthx on Jul 14, 2010 11:25 AM PDT up reply actions
You can still have a Run n Gun style offense while having a Defensive team if they are letting their D spark that offense. We haven’t seen a team fully commit to that philosophy (or maybe just never have the full personnel to accomplish it).
Be realistic...
We were an 8 seed, that got a perfect matchup in round one. And get muscled out in round 2 by a superior Jazz team. You can’t win a championship with Al Harrington at 4 and no bonafide superstar, and it takes ATLEAST one superstar and a supporting all star to win one (read Bill Simmons book). The Warriors had one all star (Baron) and some nice role/young guys. I loved that team but there’s no way it was a championship caliber team at any point.
Seeing as...
…Bill Simmons is basically like a blog author had written a book, I don’t feel much need to value his opinions any higher than, say, my own. I agree, though- we weren’t going to win the championship, although if either Baron or Pietrus could have converted their free throws, knocking off the Jazz might have been possible…
Zack Vank
Well even if I DIDNT read Bill Simmons book you can know that only the Pistons have won a championship without a superstar and a star sidekick. Don’t knock Simmon’s I’m about as avid a sports/basketball fan as there is and he blows me out of the water with his sports nerdyness. Read the book then judge, I thought the same thing until page 300 and realized by entire day had gone by. He’s a Boston homer but he’s also very very knowledgeable, don’t let his super fandom hide that fact
by WarriorKing76 on Jul 14, 2010 11:15 AM PDT up reply actions
I like...
…reading Bill Simmons pretty well, he’s an entertaining writer. And I love basketball, so I’ll probably read it sometime. I honestly was flashing back to a different fanpost regarding a claim Isiah Thomas makes in his book about “the secret to basketball being not about basketball,” but about selfless team first guys, yada yada. My negative reaction to it was that it struck me as a terribly trite observation that every NBA analyst makes about five hundred times a year, but you’re right, that doesn’t relate to this argument.
It’s worth noting, though, that a single counter-example disproves a thesis, so if you believe the Pistons didn’t meet Simmons’ requirements (assuming you’ve represented them properly to me here), you’ve disproved the very claim you’re advancing. You could say it ALMOST never happens- much in the same way it almost never happens that an 8 seed topples a 1 seed.
Jazz series..
What people don’t remember is that the Jazz and Rockets went 7 games.. if the Rockets won that series, (and it was close) the Warriors had a really good shot (Al Harrington was a Yao Ming stopper!!). The team had an identity, an obvious pecking order and amazing chemistry. And yes, we were a few made free throws away from taking home court advantage from the Jazz. Yes the Mavs were a perfect matchup, but we went something like 16-5 to close the season playing very well against most of the heavy hitters. This team deserved at least one chance to see what a full season, and maybe a free agent and some free throw coaching, could do.
by Ice Watter In His Veins! on Jul 14, 2010 12:07 PM PDT up reply actions
If Pietrus had made the free throws in game 2
we might have beaten Utah, but he bricked both, game lost and Warriors down 2-0.
Replace Harrington with Artest and that team could have beaten Utah. It takes a very unusual and difficult to acquire group of players, but playing that style could lead to real success. The problem is that it also leads to fatigue (and then injuries), and is ultimately unsustainable.
Sittin in my scraper watchin Oakland goin wild, ta-dow!
I can't remember, but...
…didn’t Harrington play well against Utah? He went cold against the Mavs, but I believe he came out of it for the Jazz. In any case, I’ve was been skeptical of the contingent that wanted us to get Artest, presumably to play as a PF. He’s just not that big…
He’s not that big, but he would have made a much better smallball PF than Harrington. He’s about equal in terms of his ability to stretch the court, while being a far superior defender and rebounder. Against a paper tiger like Boozer, he would have more than effective at PF.
Sittin in my scraper watchin Oakland goin wild, ta-dow!
I'd probably agree...
…that Artest would’ve given Boozer a harder time. Harrington is a better rebounder, though, by almost 1.5 boards per 36.
SMALL BALL
Doesn’t win championships. Its a gimmick that is fun to watch in the regular season and can create mismatches and will maybe win one playoff series (Mavs) but it doesn’t win championships. I know as Warriors fans we are just desperate for the playoffs but a team should ALWAYS be looking to build a championship winner not just a playoff team…
small ball is not a choice
its a result circumstances due to injuries and lack of free agent appeal. Did you really want to build around an Erick Dampier?
It's always a choice...
…there are always free agents and even D-Leaguers availible to reshape a roster to adequate size, if you’re willing to establish set rotations and employ admittedly limited role-players in specific circumstances. Nelson, instead, seems to opt to throw out his five best players, even if nobody tops 6’8, and see how it goes (this was much truer two seasons ago than last season, though his time spent clinging to Mikki Moore was similarly galling). That is a valid philosophy, but it’s served us pretty poorly I’d say.
no
there’s not always free agents d-leaguers that play big
I beg to differ...
…I don’t think there was any point last season or the season before at which you couldn’t find an available role player more suited to play PF than Corey Maggette, if (and this is the big “if” with Don Nelson) you’re willing to rely on set rotations in which players know their jobs, and are played in positions to maximize their success. Nelson’s problem is he gets nervous whenever his best talent isn’t on the floor; this much is clear looking at how he runs certain players into the ground year after year (Baron, Jackson, Ellis in succession). I’d venture to guess Phil Jackson would go into the D-League for a genuine big man, even one that was raw, before he would try trotting out a lineup that goes 6’2, 6’3, 6’6, 6’6, 6’7. But that’s because Jackson always gets his players on the right page as far as their role, expectations, minutes and rotations in a way that, over the course of the last few seasons, Nelson simply hasn’t.
I’d venture to guess Phil Jackson would go into the D-League for a genuine big man,
Didn’t even have to do that, he just picked up josh powell instead.
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jul 15, 2010 9:58 AM PDT up reply actions
M.Moore was Smart's pick
more than Nelson’s—Smart made a point to remind us of their previous history together, and Moore was most prominent during the period of Nelson’s sick leave/sabbatical. Smart explicitly said he differed w. Nelson, who wanted to give Hunter more playing time. When Nelson returned and tried to work Hunter into the rotation, Hunter re-injured himself, and shortly after Moore did as well.
Funny to read some of the other posts on other sites. I have seen a number of comments along these lines…
“We need to have Ellison so we can now go after one of the big Free Agents next year!”
“If we had Ellison a couple of months ago we could have been able to get one of the big Free Agents this year”
Like we get a new owner and suddenly the Cap has no effect whatsoever on moves we are able to make, instead of realizing what this does is get a very successful Business mind as our owner to Right the business and hopefully get the organization on a successful path. Suprisingly, Riley has been able to get steps in the direction going with Cohen and Rowell still around. They must be ignoring Riley with Cohen just trying to squeeze every last cent out of the sale and Rowell trying to figure out what he is going to do once he is out of a job here.
by dannyschmanny on Jul 14, 2010 11:28 AM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Maybe not this year, but next year...
We’ll have around 16 million in cap space (IF we don’t trade Gads, RadMan, or that small trade exception we recieved from the Morrow trdade) which is enough to offer one max contract. Larry Ellison’s money has nothing to do with it, but he COULD lure a big name free agent here because people WANT to play for an owner with his will to win. No one wants to play for Cohan. People want to play for Ellison.
true, although Riley is the one who got us in a favorable situation cap wise to have that option of being able to have a max contract to offer next year. Which i still think is amazing given the mess of things when he got the job, and how he has been able to operate essentially being ignored and left to his own devices by Cohen and Rowell. It’s still a shock to see a GM in place making smart basketball decisions that are being made with the purpose of improving the team now as well as have pieces to keep the team solid and leave room cap wise for improvements. Also nice to hear that people around the league are starting to take notice and he is building a good rep for himself. That has got to only help the preception around the league between teams wanting to do transactions with us and players potentially having interest in coming here on top of the pieces that are here and the pending new ownership.
by dannyschmanny on Jul 14, 2010 12:45 PM PDT up reply actions
Nonsense, players go where the money is.
They go where there is an opening to play and make more money.
The Warriors have not been competitive so a lot of players won’t come here unless we over pay. If money was the issue all players would go to Dallas, but they don’t.
They may...
…want to make as much money as possible, but this organization has the reputation of a barrel of toxic waste. We offered max deals to Arenas and Brand, two players who sure as hell don’t deserve max deals, and we got spurned in a new york minute. Sometimes your organizational rep can trump even the green in your hands.
Sounds like something is happening at 1 p.m. I don’t know what it is yet. The drama is TNT-esque – Gswscribe
Owner- Larry Ellison
G.M.- Kevin Pritchard
Coach- Vinny Del Negro
Mentor to teach Big guys- Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
Just got this from the Matt Steinmetz chat
It’s about Comcast Sportsnet Bay Area. Nothing to do with the Warriors sale. I think they’ll announce a new member to their team.
by IQofaWarrior on Jul 14, 2010 12:43 PM PDT up reply actions
Wow
I didn’t think this would actually happen. I will believe it when it goes through. But if Larry does buy….
1. How much will he pay? Can someone post a poll on this giving options like:
A. <$300M
B. $300M-325M
C. $325M-350M
D. $350M-375M
E. $375M-400M
F. >$400M
2. Should he clean house? Of course he should clean house. Is this even a debate? For the sake of my sports betting account, please do nothing. But for the sake of the organization, fire everyone! Including the players.
I love how Larry was ‘pre-approved’ by the league. That cracks me up.
The Warriors...
…for all their troubles, are a crown jewel NBA market thanks to our attendances and the media profile. I haven’t heard anybody suggest it would be less than a 400 million price tag. It’s supposed to be the most expensive team sale to date.
Thread Breakdown:
Smart Warriors Fans: “We’ve sucked for 15 years, leave no stone unturned! Murder those accountable!”
Dumb Warriors Fans: “Hey, come on guys. It’s not their fault we’ve sucked for 15 years. Even when we get a brand new rich owner we should give them second chances. Life is about second chances, right guys? He made one trade that could be viewed as decent 5 years from now. Come on, give him one more season. And Don Nelson, the guy who’s been a coach twice as long as some of us have been alive, he deserves another opportunity to alienate players on this team. He needs one more year so he can give up on us midseason and stop giving a damn. And lastly, he needs one more year to miss the playoffs and add to his useless legacy of winning while still losing. Have a heart, guys.”
Smart Warriors Fans: “No.”
'Like' my band. I mean, it'd be awesome if you did that.
by slapchop on Jul 14, 2010 12:53 PM PDT reply actions 2 recs
even smarter warriors fans “wow Riley managed to not only convince a team to take Stephen Jackson’s riduclous contract, but convince another to take Corey Magette’s Contract. Both of which were thought impossible until they were expiring.”
the two guys that shoulder the blame for the suck are going to be gone with this sale. Cohen and Rowell.
by dannyschmanny on Jul 14, 2010 1:19 PM PDT up reply actions
Dumb Warriors Fans: “Hey, Riley found a couple of other dumb teams to take our dumb contracts! He must be worth something, right?! Let him stick around one more year. Just one more year. What’s that going to hurt? He’s got a plan for the Warriors and it’s coming to fruition in the form of 40 wins tops. We goin’ places!”
'Like' my band. I mean, it'd be awesome if you did that.
whats it going to hurt? The dude has essential cleaned up contract messes, kept a young core together, while getting an All-Star who does something this team is awful at as well as get the cap in a respectable place for the team to be able to actually do things financially going forward. Not to mention put them with a lineup that could get them at least to a winning record to start, potentially battling for an 8th seed playoff spot. Wow, a guy who actually is competent and makes smart basketball decisions. There is a novel concept. He is a problem and clearly has to go.
by dannyschmanny on Jul 14, 2010 2:30 PM PDT up reply actions
What isn't it going to hurt?
Yeah. He’s a regular Mitch Kupchak. He’s done it all for us, and we’re a viable playoff contender. Oh wait, no we aren’t.
But lets applaud a guy for cleaning up messes that he made. You know, forget about basing anything on the last two terrible years we’ve had on the basketball court. (A lot of it has to do with injuries, but that’s part of this too.)
Purge the team, start fresh, move on. Bleed the team of it’s horrible vuju, and rebuild brick by brick with one of the richest men alive. Cohan and his cronies can keep their curse. There’s a novel concept. He IS a problem and he clearly has to go.
'Like' my band. I mean, it'd be awesome if you did that.
by slapchop on Jul 14, 2010 2:55 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Is it official yet?
"Even the Swedes are getting mad."-Randy Hahn
"It's very cozy in the sin bin."-Randy Hahn
Hopefully it’s official today. It was close yesterday.
The Ultimate Opportunist
by Rated-R Superstar on Jul 14, 2010 2:19 PM PDT up reply actions
I say clear the whole FO out and hire West as the president
Pritchard as GM and move Nellie to the FO as well.
This is my sig, what do I do with it?
Nellie to the front office???
Seriously? That’s the biggest problem with this team, and Nellie’s history. He comes in as a great coach and schemes with the personnel he has and creates mismatches. The he starts to know the management a bit better, starts working his way into the front office. Once he has a little power, he starts to wield it drunkenly over his players to the point that most of them hate him and want out, or he wants them out. Regardless, him getting to the front office involves losing lots of valuable players and eventually him getting run out of town.
by Ice Watter In His Veins! on Jul 14, 2010 2:00 PM PDT up reply actions
Do you really think a guy like Ellison would let an old man push him around?
Come on, remember who were talking about. Ellison will not get thrown around like a rag doll, also Nellie has been good at finding talent. So that would be his preferable position
This is my sig, what do I do with it?
I like that idea
Nellie has always been good at finding talent.
"Even the Swedes are getting mad."-Randy Hahn
"It's very cozy in the sin bin."-Randy Hahn
Can Nellie coach a big lineup?
we know he can coach a small lineup……maybe that’s why Riley got rid of the tweener’s so Nellie doesn’t have an option. And can he coach defense minded players ?
Sign Raja Bell and bring SHAQ to the bay
I’ve actually gotten the impression that Riley is intentionally limiting the different options that Nellie has with this team. Which is awesome. Because the mad scientist needs to chill and just coach a real lineup. Maybe Nellie is complicit in this, maybe not. Either way, Riley deserves a lot of credit. He has taken a sinking ship and righted it. Not saying playoffs are on the horizon, but there is a path forward.
Sittin in my scraper watchin Oakland goin wild, ta-dow!
Will Nellie even be the coach by the start of next season?
"Even the Swedes are getting mad."-Randy Hahn
"It's very cozy in the sin bin."-Randy Hahn
depends on the length of time it takes for the new owner to get ahold of the franchise
His name is Bond, Brock Bond, and his adopted father? ME, any questions?
I'm talking about the 2011 season
His contract will be up by then, he’ll probably be gone.
"Even the Swedes are getting mad."-Randy Hahn
"It's very cozy in the sin bin."-Randy Hahn
ohhh sorry bout that, true, he’ll be gone most likely… either way, whatever happens to Nelson, he was probably one of the best coaches for the warriors
His name is Bond, Brock Bond, and his adopted father? ME, any questions?
Basically Nellie will an interim coach until the new ownership finally has both feet in the door.
"Even the Swedes are getting mad."-Randy Hahn
"It's very cozy in the sin bin."-Randy Hahn
NBC Bay Area and SF Chron reporting...
…that Ellison is indeed our next owner.
^
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2010/07/13/SPOD1EDQ9Q.DTL
NELLIE MUST GO
This Franchise needs an Enima, and it starts with Nellie.
by Colorado Fan on Jul 14, 2010 3:23 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
I don't know but...
if this were Vegas, I’d lay a dollar down on NO just for the odds.
Type the words RUN TMC in Ebay!
Type the words RUN TMC in Ebay!
Type the words RUN TMC in Ebay!
Type the words RUN TMC in Ebay!
Pacquiao fans type MANNY CHANT in Ebay!
The person who saved us from the jinx.
Whatever Sabean thinks about the IQ of the average baseball fan, you just proved him right.
by cybermaldonado on Jul 14, 2010 4:08 PM PDT up reply actions
Larry Ellison not the owner yet
See discussion at http://www.goldenstateofmind.com/2010/7/14/1570006/moment-of-truth-ellison-is-new
"I never watched baseball on TV. It's slow and boring. I'm not a fan. Never was." - Jeff Kent
FREE POSEY IS FREE
Nellie
Keep Nellie for at least one more (with restrictions). Do y’all remember the years between nellie runs? BORING. The excitement is here because of the style of play. Players succeed in his system. Steph, Monta, Andris all benefit from his uptempo game. Do you really think Curry would be better in a half court set? Do you think 6’3" & 6’3" in the backcourt will work in another system? Until this team adds talent, mismatches & running is the only way. Nellie will never win a title & thats why I say 1 or 2 more tops. It will take at least 2 to get the talent needed. Look at what Nelson did in Dallas with an owner who would spend money. That said, Ellison will have to sit Riley down or hire a new GM that will build the team for championships regardless of what Nellie wants. Nellies there to entertain me. I dont want to go to 43 games a year to watch a boring team in the rebuild, I want to be entertained until 2012-13 season when my new shiny rebuilt remodeled ready to compete for titles team is revealed.
Changing horses...
Time to let one of the better “people persons” and basketball minds show his stuff…and the beauty is…he is already on staff…Keith Smart is ready, willing and more than able to take this team to the next level…the level that has more on the W side than the L side. Give him a chance…he has earned it.
Clean house
To become a first rate basketball organization, we need to hire first rate people from the top down. Larry Ellison, as an owner and businessman is definitely that.
From a GM on down, firebomb the entire front office (figuratively). Do not take any prisoners, allow for no survivors, except maybe the season ticket sales guys, its not their fault.
Luckily, there is a bevy of talented front office personnel available, starting with my personal choice Kevin Pritchard. Aside from missing on the Oden/Durant decision, the dude built a pretty solid organization from the ground up after the “Jailblazers” debacle that was both talented and financially sound.
Coaches? How about a young, first time coach we could get excited about: Dan Majerle, Mario Elie, Brian Shaw anyone? What about a proven, coach-a-holic like Lawrence Frank or Jeff Van Gundy? Keith Smart had the run of the roost when Nellie was out with drunkenness during the season, he definitely did not impress. We have to move beyond him.
Would love to hear your guys suggestions for replacements and as a 25 year old Warriors fan who has toiled through the rough years am thoroughly looking towards a brighter future.
We have some of the best fans in the NBA and we all deserve the best going forward.
Ridiculous
The above paragraph is some of the most uninformed nonsense I have read about the Warriors in a while. A friend e-mailed me the post b/c he could not believe how off point it is. This site, GSOM, is TERRIBLE. This organization would be in even worse shape if and only if the fools who made this site ran the team. The teams first steps in actually rebuilding would be to sell the team and drop Nellie and Riley whose “intriguing” moves have been anything but. This site perpetuates the notion that the Warriors are the laughing stock of the NBA. As a Warrior fan I am truly disappointed in this site.
how?
as in, how is dropping Nellie and Riley justified?
how are the moves not “intriguing”?
how does this site perpetuate the notion that the Warriors are the laughing stock?
I’m not saying you’re right or wrong, what I am saying is that you’ve strung together a bunch of hyperbolic accusations without even providing a rationale, let alone evidence.
Goal: 8 seed!
this is how
Riley is a puppet, have you ever heard one of his press conferences? It is mind numbingly boring and he does nothing to instill confidence. There is nothing intriguing about drafting another PF and then trading for one. I’m happy that Lee is on the team, but it shows that there is no forethought. Why would they not draft Monroe (since we just traded our backup C)? Instead he so intriguingly drafts a backup PF instead of bringing in competition for Biedrins. There is also nothing intriguing about turning down the OJ Mayo deal from last year, who would have fit much better next to Curry. The list goes on for Riley. Fair enough that there we have small sample for Riley with this team, but thus far very unimpressive.
As for Nellie, aside for ONE good year, he has been checked out. He has had everything to do with this team having more turnover than any other team in the league. You simply do not win when you constantly change rosters and starting lineups. When there is no continuity, you don’t win and he has made the Warriors the poster child for that. He also loves to advertise when we want to trade players, killing any leverage that we may have had in a trade deal.
This list of egregious ineptitude could go on. But for the above reasons, and this site supporting the people who make these mistakes, that is what makes it perpetuate the fact that the Warriors are the laughing stock of the NBA.
furthermore
And maybe most importantly, why the hell would you want to keep the GM and head coach who has put together and manages one of the worst teams in the NBA!?!? For no other reason that should be enough to clean house!
maybe cuz
the coach has more wins than everyone ever in the nba. Is there someone the market who’s that much better, marginally, to fire a coach on the last year of his contract and who’s players have proffered an open admiration and desire to play for?
as for the GM, he has imprinted his vision of the team with his moves. If you get someone new, that person brings their own vision, which means he may want to start over. Which means more delays on the quest for competitiveness. Also, it appears that at least so far, he’s made a lot of good moves and few, if any, bad ones. Drafting Udoh… it could have been a huge mistake, but we don’t know yet. Trading for an allstar while giving up a prospect, in theory, can be considered a good move for the short term. Until we see the results all we have are opinion, and opinions aren’t enough to risk the uncertainty of the unknown
Goal: 8 seed!
nice
thx for some reasoning behind your ideas. Such efforts are appreciated here, because as fanatical we may be, most of us are keen to rhetorical fallacy.
Of course, just cuz you added reasoning doesn’t mean they’re good ones. Let me help you a bit here:
1.) Subjective reasoning: where one forwards their opinion as fact.
Riley is a puppet, have you ever heard one of his press conferences? It is mind numbingly boring and he does nothing to instill confidence.
This is you opinion. Unfortunately, not many care about your opinion; you don’t have the wherewithal or the reputation to posit your feelings as fact.
The following is also examples of this:
There is nothing intriguing about drafting another PF and then trading for one.
not sure why you’re harping on the word intriguing, maybe you’re trying to be sarcastic but it just doesn’t really come through.
2.) Hypotheses without support:
There is also nothing intriguing about turning down the OJ Mayo deal from last year, who would have fit much better next to Curry.
How do you know Mayo would be better next to Curry? Once again, not arguing if you’re right or wrong, though I’m inclined to think this is untrue. But do you have any evidence? Or is it your magical eye thatmakes this judgement?
As for the other stuff, I don’t think they’re well argued but you make decent points. Continuity is important, but then again, sometimes there are extenuating circumstances (like the whole team collectively steamrolled by the injury train). Advertising a desire to trade players hasn’t helped but I think by the time such an advertisement came it was already widespread for Dunleavy, Murphy, Harrington, Jackson and Crawford. Just realize that you’re arguing only the negative while ignoring the positive, and there are some of us who appreciate the relatively positive work he’s done for us.
Goal: 8 seed!
Thank You
The positive? This is how I felt about this team a decade ago. Thank you. It has become clear that you are a recent fan and have not gone through the anguish that this team has put fans through for decades. Either that or, what I think may be more true, you simply ignore the glaring ineffectiveness of this franchise.
While you make a topical effort to write off my points as opinion, if you watch/read any reputable NBA shows, you will find unavoidable discrepancies in what NBA analysts say and what is written here. How do I know that Mayo would fit better next to Curry than Monta? Seriously? He is bigger, a true off guard and a better distributor not to mention at a fraction of the salary. Since we announced we were shopping Monta around, that is as good of a deal as I think we could get.
It is truly unbelievable that a knowledgeable fan of this franchise, not just in recent years, not just since the “We Believe” years brought about this teams first band wagon movement since Run TMC, but a fan who actually wants improvement could possibly want Nellie and Riley to stay.
I think my biggest worry is that some unsuspecting fan will stumble upon this site and think that this site is a Warrior fans general sentiment towards a franchise that routinely under performs and accepts mediocrity. Actually, mediocrity should be a goal for this front office. I will end with a simple request. You have spent time to dissect my opinion, now back up yours. What has Nellie/Riley done for this team? Aside from, and I was there it was amazing, our one playoff run.
It is inconcievable that NellieRiley should stay
There was a time in my life I loved Don Nelson. Alongside Baron and Captain Jack he rescued our moribund franchise from the depths of despair and instigated one of the most stirring playoff runs in recent pro sports history. For a lifelong basketball junkie, it was the most fun I’ve ever had watching sports.
HAVING SAID THAT:
Nellie’s time has come. The NBA coaching life would wear out a man half his age, let alone one prone to as many cocktails as our dear Nellie. Riley is and has always been Nellie’s lapdog, following him from franchise to franchise and doing a mediocre job (Grizzlies director of player personnel 94-00, Big Country Reeves anyone? Mavericks advance scout under Don and Donnie Nelson, oh great you’re an advance scout? Lets promote you directly to GM!) .
Yes, mbuddtha is hammering the negative pretty hard. As he should. As we all should. I ask you to find a greater disparity in all of pro sports between the quality of the product the franchise puts on the floor and the quality of the fan of that franchise than the Dubs (Cubs maybe?). It is about time we get a first rate organization populated by first rate basketball people.
There are a reason certain franchises are perpetually successful – they have a vision, a plan and a talented front office able to implement it from a talent, development and financial perspective. Even small market teams like the Spurs, Blazers and Jazz have bee more successful in the last 20 years than the Dubs, who represent the fantastic market of the ENTIRE Bay Area. Why? 99% is Chris Cohan’s embarassing excuse for leadership, but more accurately abysmal decision making from the top on down.
We have an incredible opportunity here. We have the opportunity as fans, as zealots and junkies to have one of the richest, most cutthroat, most competitive, most SUCCESSFUL men on our planet own OUR basketball team. We should tear up everything and throw it out, the tables, chairs, Spalding basketballs, ball boys, cheerleaders, the GD hyphy guys launching pizzas and shirts into the crowd AND START OVER. We need to rinse the franchise of the stench of perennial failure and start anew as a world class basketball franchise. This isn’t about next year gentlemen, its about the next 15-30 years. Its about taking our kids and our grandkids to Warriors games and feel the same sort of pride, have the same sort of glowing collective memory that all successful sports franchises’ fans can feel and have felt since the dawn of modern sport.
And that chance, that incredible opportunity, is not something I will waste on a stubborn, thick headed, 75 year old Scotch swilling drunk who is no longer able to teach the game of basketball to his young talent (see: Anthony Randolph) and his mediocre performing lapdog.
by mullinsflattop on Jul 15, 2010 8:27 AM PDT up reply actions
How do I know that Mayo would fit better next to Curry than Monta? Seriously? He is bigger, a true off guard and a better distributor not to mention at a fraction of the salary. Since we announced we were shopping Monta around, that is as good of a deal as I think we could get.
Your factual opinion is based off of other people’s opinions. Mayo is only 6’4". Not that much bigger than Monta.
I’m not disputing this, but how is he a better distributor? Again, you’re just stating an opinion with zero support all the while mocking another member’s commentary that supplies plenty of support and reason. You’ve come on this board to accomplish what? To yell and scream and belittle fellow Warrior fans because they don’t agree with your line of thinking?
Why are you worried about an “unsuspecting fan?” Why are you worried about what anyone thinks? Let them form their own opinion, right or wrong, stupid or smart. You can’t dictate people’s perception
Maybe if you didn’t come off as a complete jerk and formulated your opinions without disparaging the entire community, you might get some positive feedback.
No one is disputing the failures of Cohan, Rowell, Don Nelson, et al, but that doesn’t mean consideration shouldn’t be given for what appears to be some decent moves that have a vision (Riley) that coincide with Don Nelson’s success, not failure.
No one is disputing that Don Nelson has never won anything or that small ball is a gimmick. That being said, he has one year left on his contract and the team is up for sale. No one knows how long the transition will take. Keeping the people that have familiarity with the current product isn’t such a bad idea when you weigh those things.
Confident Marco Belinelli supporter
Ode to Tim Kawakami
by Doctor Kajita on Jul 15, 2010 8:58 AM PDT up reply actions
Thanks Again
Of course we cannot say for certain that Mayo would be a better fit b/c he has never played alongside Monta. Mayo weighs more and is taller. Per minutes played, Mayo averages more assists than Monta. We have a small back court, he makes it bigger and can match up better, physically, with other 2’s in the league. I could go on but I think you would just find a sentence, put it in a blue box and complain about my opinion.
Once again you supply nothing of substance to support keeping Nellie and Riley. The fact that he has one year left actually plays against him. What other teams do you know of who are rebuilding want a coach for just one year and then make a change? You agree that continuity is paramount…so why not start this consistency now and get rid of him?
And yes, we do have a good idea of how long the transition will take. Unlike other bidders, Ellison has the capital to make a fast transition. This would not be the case with another, less insanely wealthy buyer, but Ellison already has a group comprising 20% of the ownership in place. It has been well reported that b/c he could buy the team w/o loans, long payment periods etc, the transition would be far swifter. Which is why there is even the realistic conversation about Riley and Nellie losing their jobs before the season.
More important than any sort of reconciliation regarding this debate, the Warriors need to rid themselves of the people who got them in this position. Those members are headlined by Nellie, Cohan and Riley. This is really falling on deaf ears and not worth the time. Good day to you sir and please start paying more attention to the team you love. God speed.
Gotta be careful on this site
Mbuddtha, you have to be careful on this site. From being beaten down senseless by a near-criminal owner and an incompetent front office, W’s fans over time have become a very confused lot. I do not really believe the W’s have “the best fans in the league” like everyone says, but you will hear that repeatedly on this site. I do not believe Monta and Biedrins are as bad as everyone says, I do not believe that Anthony Randolph is on his way to super stardom, I do not believe this offseason has really improved the team, and I most certainly do not believe in any of the leadership or decision making on this team.
I generally disagree with the typical “Warriors fan” about the direction of the franchise, and I’ve found that arguing with most of them (including the one you are deep in conversation with) is just a general waste of time. One of these days the fans will wake up.
by UncleCliffy on Jul 15, 2010 11:43 AM PDT up reply actions
ive been a fan since 99
my original lineup was bimbo, starks, jamison, cummings and dampier, with tony delk off the bench and an injured chris mills our best perimeter shooter. You overstep your reasoning to insinuate so much.
Also, you still haven’t proven mayo > monta. And as for everything else, all you’re doing is positing your opinion as fact, but let me say this to you again, newbie: no one cares about your unsubstantiated opinions. Bring some facts, remove all the melodrama from your writing and come back with some reason. Till then, you’re only making yourself look stupid as you can’t even reason properly with members of a “TERRIBLE” site.
Goal: 8 seed!
Welcome to the Internet
Confident Marco Belinelli supporter
Ode to Tim Kawakami
by Doctor Kajita on Jul 14, 2010 8:11 PM PDT up reply actions
then
obviously you havent been to the other nba team sites then…..what? do u think posts like these are only limited to the bay area? best to think of posts like that as entertainment rather than lettin it get to you…..hes just a frustrated fan like the rest of us …if everyone agreed on everyones post then what the hells the point of being on here
KeWzEe
SCREW NELSON
heres hoping samurai larry sends that old useless wind bag back 2 sucking down unbrella drinks in hawai’i
ANY QUESTIONS???
Larry Ellison
kinda looks like a combination of Tony Stark(Iron Man) & Ivan Vanko(Crimson Dynamo)
Maybe thats why he was in the movie
If you NO'd this poll....
please don’t ever ever post at GSOM ever
The 97% who votes Yes are wrong
Fail
"I tell him straight, 'If you're going to lead, you have to be the first to practice. You have to come in, get your work down and be prepared for practice,' " assistant coach Keith Smart said. "He needs to figure out why he is having stomach problems and he's got to watch how LeBron (James), Kobe (Bryant) and D-Wade (Dwyane Wade) work. He needs to mimic that if he wants his teammates to speak volumes about him." -Keith Smart on Motna Ellis
LOL maybe the few that posted No...
Were actually buying the team…lol
“Golden State Warriors…where 96% of fans are wrong!!! Happens….”
:-D You have to laugh…
Its a new dawn...its a new day...its a new owner ....for us!!!!! and I'm FEELING GOOD!!!!!!
by BritWarriorGSW on Jul 15, 2010 11:42 AM PDT up reply actions
What "experts" have to say
“Golden State has plenty of young assets, but it continues to languish near the bottom of the Western Conference standings and the bottom of our rankings because of a management team — from ownership to the front office to the bench — that has made the Warriors the league’s laughingstocks. There is talk that the team could have new ownership in the foreseeable future. If so, and if the new ownership cleans out the current management, the Warriors should move up the rankings quickly.”
Chad Ford and John Hollinger
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
"UNSTOPPABLE BABY!"
Golden State Warriors rookie Marc Jackson to the Mavericks' bench, after hitting a lay-up during a 29-point loss (2000)
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
Featured Stories
Most Commented
In Association With
Ball Don't Lie - NBA - Yahoo! Sport
- Days of NBA Lives: Wherein Roy Hibbert tap-dances to Maine
- Grizzlies Valentine’s Day cards are the key to love
- Kevin Love would like the NBA to take the MLB’s approach on All-Star games
- Kobe Bryant fires a few hilarious salvos at Jeremy Lin
- Brandon Jennings states the obvious regarding his 2014 free agency, everyone goes nuts
Certain photos copyright © 2012 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
