RUMOR: 3-way trade- Monta Ellis to New York Knicks, Al Jefferson to Golden State Warriors, David Lee to Minnesota Timberwolves
by Atma Brother ONE on Jul 4, 2010 7:39 AM PDT
in Rumors
Email
Print
JUMP for another July rumor!
From the New York Post:
When [Amare] Stoudemire becomes official, it would end the five-year era of David Lee, but set up a possibility of a sign-and-trade to add another piece. There's been rumors of a three-way trade talk between Golden State, Minnesota and the Knicks where [David] Lee winds up with the Timberwolves, Monta Ellis comes to the Knicks and Al Jefferson goes to Golden State. Lee visited Minnesota yesterday and it has only $7 million in cap room, meaning he'd want a sign-and-trade.
This would be a great time to cut out the middle man, meaning the T-Wolves. Monta Ellis for David Lee (with some pieces to make the numbers work) would be a STEAL. The injury-prone, turnover-prone, tantrum-prone, low IQ-prone, selfish-prone Moped Ellis for a 20-12 big man with over 3.5 assists per game?
SIGN. ME. UP.
Actually come to think of it, why are the Knicks so willing to give up Lee? This guy is a stud. Sure he's not exactly an all-world defender, but he's a fantastic rebounder and a very nice scorer and passer. Show this man the money!
Sending out Al Jefferson for Monta Ellis is an interesting topic for discussion. The deal can be done straight up because the two players' contracts are so similar. For the Warriors it's not quite the no-brainer as Ellis for Lee. Both Ellis and Jefferson have had some injuries over the years and both seem to put up some empty scoring numbers and neither have set the world on fire with their defense. Nothing cracks me up more than two bad teams swapping players- it's basically just changing the way the two teams lose. The Warriors would pick up some much needed help on the glass with Jefferson, but losing Monta would dramatically hurt their game speed and tempo-- but I guess that just means their losses will seem seem slower? In terms of contracts, Jefferson's is one year shorter than Ellis' which goes until 2014 (player option).
I've said it before and I'll say it again. The player who really piques my interest on the Minny roster is Kevin Love. This guy might be one of the most underrated players in the league. I'd LOVE to see this man get more playing time on the Warriors.
More perspectives:
- Minnesota Timberwolves: The Minnesota Timberwolves will trade Al Jefferson to the.... [Canis Hoopus]- Check out the section on the Warriors.
- New York Knicks: Posting and Toasting- From LeBron to Moped... that would be quite a downgrade in so many ways.
- RUMOR: Memphis Grizzlies NOT trading for Golden State Warriors guard Monta Ellis
- RUMOR: Golden State Warriors head coach Don Nelson would have traded Monta Ellis to Memphis Grizzlies for O.J. Mayo + Hasheem Thabeet "in a heartbeat"
- Polling GSoM: Monta Ellis to Memphis Grizzlies, O.J. Mayo + Hasheem Thabeet (+ maybe Hamed Haddadi) to Golden State Warriors- Are you down?
- Q&A: Tim Kawakami (San Jose Mercury)- Monta Ellis and Andris Biedrins situations + Ellis and Stephen Curry co-existing [Part 1 of 2]
- RUMOR: Monta Ellis and Andris Biedrins to Celtics, Ray Allen, Kendrick Perkins, and J.R. Giddens to Warriors- Think the Boston Celtics would be in the 2010 NBA Finals if they made this trade? I doubt it. They'd be SOFT.
- RUMOR: Monta Ellis to Boston Celtics, Ray Allen to Golden State Warriors
350 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
I would love Lee
but what do we do with our glut of PFs? Maybe move Udoh to center and trade Randolph for a small forward?
I'd like to take out the middle-man too
But the problem is that Lee probably wants to go to Minnesota over Golden State, as evidenced by his visit.
As for Jefferson, the contract is tough, but he’d be the first big with a post game that we’ve had in a long while. My guess is this would be the most talent we can get back for Ellis this off-season.
no chance of Lee coming to GS
and I don’t think the Warriors are going to trade Ellis before the new ownership gets in either
But the problem is that Lee probably wants to go to Minnesota over Golden State?
I don’t know about that, Lee had a very good game against the Warriors last season and he knows how great the Oakland crowd is so what’s not to like?
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jul 4, 2010 11:11 AM PDT up reply actions
problem is
his post game isn’t actually good. I don’t understand why everyone says Jefferson has a post game. He takes a lot of shots from the block, but he doesn’t really make that many of them…. that qualifies as a post game?!
Thing A
"Correlation between inability to use the reply button and general crappiness of analysis: pretty high." -Sleepy Freud
Lee, Jefferson, Love
In that order. Let’s face it, the Warriors need an inside presence badly. I want to see what the team can do with someone who has an offensive game down low, a threat in the paint. It will allow the team to do so much more.
by SmittytheCutman on Jul 4, 2010 8:01 AM PDT via mobile reply actions
Lee, Love.
Just say no to Jefferson. There’s a reason, beyond just salary, that Jefferson is on the block. Mediocre at offense + bad at defense = mediocre/bad.
Of course, Love’s salary doesn’t match up with Monta’s or Lee’s, so I’m not sure why we’re discussing him here.
There will be no extra point!
"Mediocre at offense"???
He may have the best post moves in the NBA (I don’t think being coached by Kevin McHale hurt his post game much). Saying he’s mediocre at offense is a huge insult.
He came off of a bad injury last year, so he obviously didn’t play quite as well, but he still played well.
by KGMN on Jul 4, 2010 10:12 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Don't you think somebody who had the best post moves in the NBA wouldn't miss so many shots?
He’s only had one season where he was significantly better than average at putting the basket in the bucket, based on how many shots he took.
Well as in a blackhole, who couldn't score efficiently, or defend anyone?
Kobe sucks
"Frankly your desire to be a seller is just proof of how blinded you are by your hatred of Sabean"-giantsrainman..LOL
by GovernorStephCurry on Jul 4, 2010 10:19 AM PDT up reply actions
"'Mediocre at offense' He may have the best post moves in the NBA "
both of those things could be (kind of) true. he’s pretty good down low (1-7 ft) 340 for 547 or 62.2%. unfortunately, he has horrible shot selection causing him to take jumpers 8ft & out at a 207 for 552 clip or 37.5% dropping his overall % to 49.8%. considering he doesn’t get to the line a lot & his TS% was 52.4% with league avg being 54%, it’s not a stretch to call him mediocre. though it might have been a slight exaggeration.
by homer simpson on Jul 4, 2010 10:20 AM PDT up reply actions
he’s pretty good down low (1-7 ft) 340 for 547 or 62.2%.
another AndrisBe’dGrinch huh? Can this version make a damn freethrow??
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jul 4, 2010 11:15 AM PDT up reply actions
His efficiency as a scorer is and has always been mediocre at best: .524 TS% last season, .535 for his career. The fact that he shoots a lot despite the fact that he’s inefficient doesn’t really impress me. (And clearly, he doesn’t do much on offense other than shoot).
There will be no extra point!
by Sleepy Freud on Jul 4, 2010 10:23 AM PDT up reply actions
C'mon Sleepy
Don’t use TS% when you’re talking about scoring efficiency- it includes the ability to shoot free throws which is completely outside of the scope of this argument. While Jefferson isn’t helped a ton by the removal of FT shooting (69.3% for his career), it is awkward to use TS% to measure something like post efficiency when it includes other things which bias the #’s.
Don’t use TS% when you’re talking about scoring efficiency- it includes the ability to shoot free throws which is completely outside of the scope of this argument.
Don’t use TS% when taking about scoring efficiency???!!!! TS% is scoring efficiency. The ability to shoot freethrows, and even more importantly, the ability to draw fouls and get the opportunity, is a rather sizable component of a player’s ability to contribute on offense. Saying that you shouldn’t talk about this when discussing scoring efficiency is idiotic. It’s like saying you shouldn’t discuss water when talking about things that are liquids.
by jae on Jul 4, 2010 11:03 AM PDT up reply actions 4 recs
It’s like saying you shouldn’t discuss water when talking about things that are liquids.
haha, well water IS not that interesting compared to beer and cognac?
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jul 4, 2010 11:17 AM PDT up reply actions
While Jefferson isn’t helped a ton by the removal of FT shooting (69.3% for his career),
This issue isn’t his FT% so much as his (in)ability to get the line, which is a huge part of what makes for an effective offensive player. Dwight Howard, despite his FT shooting woes, shot .612 TS% last season. It’s not a total coincidence that Howard’s teams are always good while Jefferson’s always stink.
There will be no extra point!
by Sleepy Freud on Jul 4, 2010 11:18 AM PDT up reply actions
It’s not a total coincidence that Howard’s teams are always good while Jefferson’s always stink.
I would argue that just as big a difference between those two teams is the difference between Howard (one of the most valuable players in the game) and Jefferson (who’s moderately above average).
In fact, Jefferson has by far the best teammate, in Kevin Love. He’s better than any non-named-Dwigh-Howard Orlando player by a mile. Now, after that, it gets to be pretty slim pickings with one other above-average player in Minn.
Orlando, on the other hand, has 7 other guys who are above average. Although they do also give major minutes to Rashard Lewis, who sucks. But it’s not like most of the guys who get a lot of minutes for Orlando are particularly spectacular (Matt Barnes has their second-highest WP48). Rather, it’s that guys like Barnes, Reddick, Jason Williams, Gortat and Nelson have well-defined roles which they can fill well.
Howard clearly has better teammates, but I think it might be easy to overstate the difference between Howard (over 22 wins produced this last season, second in the league) and Jefferson (jsut over 7 wins produced). That is a HUGE difference.
I think you overvalue WP too much.
Its nice, but when it rates Barnes over Paul Pierce, somethings wrong.
Don’t overuse it. It has Troy Murphy as one of the best players in the league for christ sakes.
Kobe sucks
"Frankly your desire to be a seller is just proof of how blinded you are by your hatred of Sabean"-giantsrainman..LOL
by GovernorStephCurry on Jul 4, 2010 3:26 PM PDT up reply actions
I would argue that just as big a difference between those two teams is the difference between Howard (one of the most valuable players in the game) and Jefferson (who’s moderately above average).
That’s the point I was trying to make (rather poorly, evidently).
I think it might be easy to overstate the difference between Howard (over 22 wins produced this last season, second in the league) and Jefferson (jsut over 7 wins produced).
You mean easy to understate, or hard to overstate, right?
There will be no extra point!
Saying he’s mediocre at offense is a huge insult.
Perhaps it is an insult, but it’s also a reasonably accurate description of what his actual contribution is. Whether or not he has the best post moves in the NBA, his overall offense includes taking too many shots he doesn’t make and he very rarely gets trips to the charity stripe. These things are important. He doesn’t appear to know that he shouldn’t take those jumpers, takes them anyhow and as a result drags down his overall contribution. His skills in the paint only provide a loose picture of what he does for his team on offense.
Remember, every shot he takes is a shot that a teammate can’t take. If he’s taking shots he’s missing (and on those jumpers, he is) that drags down what he’s actually providing for his team. Perhaps he could learn that he sucks at anything outside of the paint, but rarely do players learn to improve their shot selection.
It's really not a reasonably accurate description of what his actual contribution is.
If you look at his teammates, he has a better chance of making it than his teammates (even if they get an open shot). He scores half of his shots and besides Craig Smith and Ryan Hollins (who don’t even take shots unless they’re 1 foot from the basket), he’s has by far the highest FG%. Taking bad shots for him is better than giving teammates like Sasha Pavlovic open jump shots.
If you look at his teammates, he has a better chance of making it than his teammates (even if they get an open shot).
Somebody always makes this claim when defending a low-efficiency scorer, but as is often the case, with Jefferson this is actually not true.
There are five timberwolves who are more likely to score when they shoot than Jefferson. (Hollins, Love, Cardinal, Gomes, and Ellington).
When you specifically talk about the shots that Jefferson takes which he really shouldn’t be taking (anything not very close to the basket) that number only goes up.
Why take them away?
You don’t need all of them at once, just a couple of them. Love should be getting major major minutes anyway.
Pro-Skub for life
by Reverend_Randy on Jul 4, 2010 3:37 PM PDT up reply actions
Not WITH Al Jefferson.
They don’t play together too often because of the defensive nightmare that would bring.
well then
Love should be getting major minutes INSTEAD OF Jefferson since he’s a much better player.
Thing A
"Correlation between inability to use the reply button and general crappiness of analysis: pretty high." -Sleepy Freud
Really? A much better player?
At best they’re equal. Big Al’s too dominant of a force on offense to have Kevin Love as a much better player.
We should boo him everytime he shoots a jumper...
it worked with Maggette!
Check out Goallineblitz - Free Football MMORPG
Build players, Build teams, watch games...
http://goallineblitz.com/game/signup.pl?ref=4892220
I think Maggette actually cares what we think
And I don’t doubt what Maggette does. When he shoots, it is a good decision. I can’t say the same for Jefferson.
Kobe sucks
"Frankly your desire to be a seller is just proof of how blinded you are by your hatred of Sabean"-giantsrainman..LOL
by GovernorStephCurry on Jul 4, 2010 3:42 PM PDT up reply actions
this is a fine trade with me...
the icing on the cake would be to get love and expirings instead of jefferson
This would be a great time to cut out the middle man
Exactly. Thanks for the tip, David Kahn! If Donnie Walsh is really hot for Monta, I’d tell Kahn to take his Jefferson and go jump in a frozen lake. I don’t 100% trust Larry Riley, but I don’t think he’s dumb enough to prefer Al Jefferson to David Lee, given a straight up choice.
Sure, we’d have a bit of logjam in the front court, but it shouldn’t be that tough to swing a deal involving one of the excess bigs for a serviceable small forward. Lee’s got the beef, mad rebounding, sweet outside touch, and passing skills to play high post center, which would make him a very nice complement to Randolph, Udoh, Wright, or even Biedrins. On the other end, the weakside shotblocking skills of our bigs would nicely cover Lee’s only real weakness.
Reposting my fantasy trades from the deleted thread … how about (a) Monta for Lee, and (b) Biedrins+Wright to Utah for Kirilenko?
Curry / Livingston (MLE)
Reggie / Morrow
AK / Azubuike
Randolph / Udoh
Lee / Turiaf
That starts to resemble a real team, I think. Of course when you’re talking not one but two hypotheticals, the chances of it happening start to approach nil. :-(
There will be no extra point!
by Sleepy Freud on Jul 4, 2010 8:06 AM PDT reply actions 1 recs
It's not a matter of choice for Larry Riley between Jefferson and Lee....
I don’t think Lee wants to come to the Warriors.
Why not? Is Minnesota so much more appealing of a destination? Seems like he’s warm on the Wolves this weekend ‘cos Kahn and Co. took him out and wined and dined him and made him feel wanted. We’ve got some nice restaurants in the Bay Area too, last I checked.
There will be no extra point!
well, of course, the Bay over Minnesota
But the visit tells the story more than fact that this is the best place to live in the country
?
The Warriors also have much better surrounding talent than the Wolves.
The only we don’t have yet is an ownership team in pace to woo potential players. That will come soon enough.
There will be no extra point!
Or prefer to think logically rather than swallow whatever rumors the press feeds us.
I mean, obviously, the idea of the Knicks parting with Lee for Monta is far-fetched in the first place. But from Lee’s perspective, why do you think he would he embrace a deal to Minnesota while vetoing one to GS?
There will be no extra point!
he actually visited Minnesota!!!
you seem to be ignoring that fact – he’s already clearly shown interest in going to Minnesota, not GS. What part of that isn’t clear to you?
Just because he HAS visited MN
Doesn’t mean he would be opposed to go to GS or even prefer MN to GS.
I think that’s the point.
by Jeremy Belvins on Jul 4, 2010 8:55 AM PDT up reply actions
yes it does
he’s a free agent, if he had any interest in GS, he would have visited already or be planning a visit.
you're inferring too much
The fact that he has not visited GS, does automatically mean he prefers MN to GS. Just stop…
by Jeremy Belvins on Jul 4, 2010 8:59 AM PDT up reply actions
Or
evidence that he’s clearly opposed to going to GS.
by Jeremy Belvins on Jul 4, 2010 9:00 AM PDT up reply actions
again, he's an unrestricted free agent
NY has no pull over him. He can go wherever he wants, and he has shown no interest whatsoever in GS. Let me know when he does…kthnksbye
Are you kinda starting to see
where you messed up?
by Jeremy Belvins on Jul 4, 2010 9:03 AM PDT up reply actions
also, if there is a rumor of a 3-way trade
and not a two-way deal between NY and GS, why?
I mean, if Lee wanted to come to GS, and the Knicks want Ellis, that deal could get done, could it not? But that’s not the rumor, is it?
If he turned down an invitation to meet with GS brass
THAT would be meaningful.
by Jeremy Belvins on Jul 4, 2010 9:02 AM PDT up reply actions
What's meaningful
is that Minnesota has more money to play with than GS and thereby might pay him more. Plus, David Lee visited Minnesota, so I don’t really see how this is a discussion.
We’re discussing Lee in the context of a rumored three way deal in which (if the rumors are to be believed) the Warriors hold all the cards. As long as they hold the cards, it’s not unreasonable to think they should try to get the player they like out of the deal. Lee went to Minnesota because the Wolves invited him. He hasn’t been to GS yet, likely because we don’t have an ownership/management team in place to invite him.
Sorry if I prefer to think about these things in terms of realistic motives. Instead of ranting, why don’t you try to articulate why you think Lee would prefer Minnesota to Golden State?
There will be no extra point!
by Sleepy Freud on Jul 4, 2010 8:59 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Instead of ranting, why don’t you try to articulate why you think Lee would prefer Minnesota to Golden State?
There will be no extra point!
Well, thats fair enough. But as I noted, if all it takes to warm Lee up is some wooing and wining and dining, I think NellieRiley are probably capable of that, even without the new owners in place.
The Warriors (1) were a much better team than Wolves last year (despite being one of the most injured NBA teams in history), (2) have a legit budding NBA star PG and (3) have a bevy of athletic, rim-defending, garbage-cleaning big men whose games would seem to complement Lee’s a whole lot better than another high post, earthbound big man like Love.
Plus, the Bay Area’s a pretty nice place with decent wining and dining…
Bottom line: the Warriors hold the cards in this rumored deal. If you want to start another post in which you extoll the joys of Lee signing with the Timberwolves, ignoring the rumored Monta linchpin, feel free.
There will be no extra point!
well, for one, Minnesota has shown interest in him…and GS hasn’t. Minnesota invited him. GS hasn’t.
What if Ellison called him up and invited him out for a sail? Are you listening Larry? Call the boy and let him know what we got here.
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jul 4, 2010 11:23 AM PDT up reply actions
HILARIOUS!!!
Let me put an end to this argument!
Just because the Warriors haven’t “shown” interest in Lee or invited him to check out the facilities, don’t have anything to do w/ Lee himself having interest in the Warriors!
If that’s your basis for your argument, then is it safe to say that since the Lakers or Celtics haven’t “shown” interest in Lee or invited him to check out their facilities, that he has no interest in playing for them? I highly doubt that!
You guys are arguing over apples and oranges! Which came first…the chicken or the egg? PotaTO…poTAto!
Bottomline is that most GSOMer’s want Lee and hope that the FO will make a trade for him straight up rather than for Jefferson!
Geeez Louf*ckingweeez!!!
by scottiepimppen on Jul 4, 2010 1:27 PM PDT up reply actions
I already explained all this
there are two possibilities, if one is to believe the rumored 3-way trade:
1) the Warriors aren’t interested in Lee (and whether Lee is interested in them is moot)
2) Lee isn’t interested in the Warriors
take your pick, or present a reasonable third option.
you don’t invite players to visit, free agent or not, if you need to trade for them. you’d basically be throwing your players under the bus and giving a terrible message to the team.
by HOLDEMUPGoldenStateOfOppression on Jul 4, 2010 1:31 PM PDT up reply actions
you're kidding, right?
if you’re encouraging reason, then it’s pretty reasonable to put Minnesota higher on David Lee’s list than Golden State based on his visit. David Lee is an UFA, he can do visit whomever he wants, he didn’t visit Oakland.
I love the accusation of “ranting” when somebody merely has a different opinion.
And in terms of why Lee would prefer Minnesota over Golden State:
1. Minnesota has a more proven frontcourt piece to pair with Lee in Kevin Love
2. For the most part, Minnesota isn’t a tumultuous franchise
3. Minneapolis is a really cool town and is closer to major media markets in the East
4. Minnesota has more money to pay Lee
he actually visited Minnesota!!!
you guys are just blowing smoke out your ass
This is ridiculous.
Sounds pretty ranty to me. He didn’t merely “have a different opinion.” He came into this thread acting like anyone who didn’t share his opinion was an idiot.
As to your points…
1. As mentioned above, the Warriors “have a bevy of athletic, rim-defending, garbage-cleaning big men whose games would seem to complement Lee’s a whole lot better than another high post, earthbound big man like Love.”
2. They’ve had their share of tumult. And they’re a worse team. The Warriors are in a less stable state right now because they’re for sale. This will change shortly.
3. Possible, I guess, but it’s hard for me to believe that all things being equal, Minneapolis is a more appealing place for a free agent athlete than the Bay Area. Smaller market, colder.
4. That’s possible. I’m not enough of capologist to say. From what I can see we’d have Monta’s $11M slot to offer him, plus the 125% wiggle room allowed for trades. That’s $13.75M per year. Hard to imagine the Wolves’ offer would be much more than that.
There will be no extra point!
how is it ranting
if one person (actually two people) keep saying the same thing over and over (David Lee visited Minnesota, not GS), you ignored that fact, and then you changed your mind (“Well, that’s fair enough.”)?
If anything, you can say I was exasperated or peeved. But ranting implies that my argument was without any rationale, which clearly is not the case, because you ended up agreeing with me (and eastbayglory).
you ignored that fact
I didn’t ignore it. i just tried to consider the situation of from Lee’s perspective and didn’t find the trip to Minnesota as meaningful a data point you seemed to.
and then you changed your mind ("Well, that’s fair enough.")?
It’s possible to have a different opinion from someone while allowing that s/he has made a fair point. It’s called “being respectful.”
But ranting implies that my argument was without any rationale,
No it doesn’t. Rant = “talk in a noisy, excited, or declamatory manner.” The substance of your ranting is immaterial. All I meant was that you sounded exasperated or peeved. ;-)
because you ended up agreeing with me (and eastbayglory).
Haha. What are we agreeing on again? As far as I can see, the burden is on you to show why Lee would veto a deal to the sadsack Warriors while embracing one to the even sadder-sack Wolves. So far, you’ve failed to make a persuasive case.
There will be no extra point!
by Sleepy Freud on Jul 4, 2010 10:18 AM PDT up reply actions
sleepy
the burden is on you my friend, to prove that Lee has shown interest in the Warriors. Not the other way around.
Haha. Not really, because I never suggested his coming to the Warriors was certain, or even likely; whereas you came into the thread ridiculing anyone who considered it a possibility.
no chance of Lee coming to GS
these guys clearly like to ignore the reality of the situation
As long as you can’t make a coherent argument for the Wolves as a significantly more appealing destination for Lee than the Warriors, I don’t see why you’re so quick dismiss the Warriors as a possibility.
There will be no extra point!
by Sleepy Freud on Jul 4, 2010 10:57 AM PDT up reply actions
I already made the argument many times
using facts – such as, he hasn’t scheduled a visit to GS, GS hasn’t invited him, the 3-way trade rumor suggests Lee is not interested in coming to GS…
you can keep ignoring those facts, if you want
Those are nice anecdotes, but they’re not really “a coherent argument for the Wolves as a significantly more appealing destination for Lee than the Warriors.”
There will be no extra point!
by Sleepy Freud on Jul 4, 2010 11:21 AM PDT up reply actions
Because facts tend to be more persuasive.
In the absence of facts, we have to make educated guesses. My contention that Lee might accept a trade to the Warriors is an educated guess — i.e. speculation — based on my observation that the Warriors are no less appealing of a team or organization than the Wolves. Your contention that Lee would certainly veto a trade is, similarly, pure speculation. And yet for some reason you continue to act as if your crystal ball is clearer than anyone else’s.
As they say: we’ll see.
There will be no extra point!
can you prove that Lee currently has interest in the Wolves?
Thing A
"Correlation between inability to use the reply button and general crappiness of analysis: pretty high." -Sleepy Freud
can you prove that Lee currently has interest in the Wolves?
Here’s the news, seems like he had a good trip.
http://blog.taragana.com/sports/2010/07/03/free-agent-forward-david-lee-visits-minnesota-timberwolves-117971/
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jul 6, 2010 10:18 AM PDT up reply actions
Well, you know, he did take the meeting.
Although to be fair, when you’re in his situation you’ve probably got to take every meeting. LeBron can pick and choose (but I’ll point out that he still met with the Knicks) but Lee?
put another way
if I said LeBron James wanted to come to GS, would it be fair for me to say, “Sleepy, prove that he doesn’t want to come to GS.” Of course not, that would be ridiculous.
If I asked you to explain why Chicago (for example) were a more appealing destination for LeBron than the Warriors, you could probably come up with some more compelling reasons than “LeBron’s been to Chicago recently, fool!!!!” For example, the “Bulls have cap space” or “the Bulls are a more relevant and appealing organization.” You’ve yet to provide comparably compelling reasons for Lee to prefer Minnesota to GS.
There will be no extra point!
by Sleepy Freud on Jul 4, 2010 11:02 AM PDT up reply actions
just the fact that he's visiting certain places
and not others is all the proof you need
He’s an unrestricted free agent who can go wherever he wants. End of story.
just the fact that he’s visiting certain places and not others is all the proof you need
This hardly constitutes “proof” that he would certainly veto a trade to the Warriors, which seems to be your contention.
There will be no extra point!
by Sleepy Freud on Jul 4, 2010 11:24 AM PDT up reply actions
but where is the evidence
that he has any interest? Name one piece of evidence…I’m still waiting. So far, all you have done is speculate on why David Lee should like to come to the Warriors, but absolutely nothing to show that he is actually interested.
And you’ve done nothing to show that he isn’t interested. Again, since you’re the one dismissing the possibility of his coming to GS, the burden of proof is you.
If assume the rumor to be true (and that’s what we’re doing in this thread) the relevant “facts” here are
1. The Knicks want Monta.
2. Lee is a better player than Jefferson.
Given this, the main sticking points to a Lee/Monta deal would be
1. Riley isn’t aware that Lee is better than Jefferson.
2. Lee vetoes a deal to GS.
Neither of us can really speak to Riley’s thoughts on the matter. You seem pretty confident that Lee would veto a deal to GS. I’m less convinced. That’s about the size of it, right?
There will be no extra point!
by Sleepy Freud on Jul 4, 2010 11:39 AM PDT up reply actions
Humans like money. David Lee is a human. If we traded Monta and paid David Lee comparable money, he would want to come here.
Humans like nice weather. David Lee is a human. Playing for Golden State would result in him living in nice weather, which he would like, being human.
Humans don’t like to lose. He would be more likely to lose with the T-Wolves. David Lee would not like that.
Humans don’t like cold weather… etc., etc.
These are all so obvious that anyone with common sense knows that David Lee would likely be willing to play here.
Go Andris's free throw shooting!
by Naticus2 on Jul 4, 2010 3:20 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
by that logic, we should be able to get LeBron or Wade
just get rid of some other contracts first…
awesome, I’m glad you’ve single-handedly solved all the Warriors’ problems in one post.
by that logic, we should be able to get LeBron or Wade
Well, sure — if the Warriors could compete with MIA, CHI, CLE, NJ and NY in terms of surrounding talent, winning, prestige or available $$$.
Since they’re not close to any of these teams on most of these fronts (available $$$ in particular) your analogy seems pretty flawed.
There will be no extra point!
We could get LeBron if the only team we were competing with was the Wolves and provided we could pay him. There is no reason David Lee wouldn’t play for us, provided we pay him well and provided we don’t have to compete with, for example, a championship squad.
But we’re talking about David Lee, weren’t we? We’re talking about competing with the T-Wolves, weren’t we? What are you, a troll? There is no rational reason that, if Lee is interested in the T-Wolves, he wouldn’t be interested in Golden State.
That he’s interested in the T-Wolves strongly indicates he would be interested in us, provided we could pay him enough. Duh.
Go Andris's free throw shooting!
Well, remember it's pretty rare that a player puts any factors above "who's going to pay me the most."
The LeBron is even considering it makes him pretty remarkable.
Its not like David Lee said “yea I’m finally an unrestricted free agent… Quick get Minnesota on the line so I can schedule a visit.” I’m sure Lee and his agent are willing to take a meeting with any team that expresses interest in paying Lee gobs of money. The fact that Minnesota has already expressed that interest (while they still remain unable to actually do it without the help of a team like the Warriors taking a contract from them) and the Warriors have not YET expressed that level of interest (and it possible the current management group doesnt have the authority to do so) is in no way an indication of Lee’s interest in Minnesota or his lack of interest in the Warriors. Its really not that complicated, if you’d just listen to Sleepy instead of stubbornly making the same defeated argument this point would be clear to you by now.
Thing A
"Correlation between inability to use the reply button and general crappiness of analysis: pretty high." -Sleepy Freud
if he thought GS was more appealing than Minnesota
he would’ve already visited or scheduled a visit. He hasn’t, therefore, I assume he isn’t more interested in GS.
Using your logic I guess he has no
interest in playing for the Lakers, Miami, Chicago, Boston, etc. because he hasn’t met with them either. Your logic is weak.
Set a record by getting banned for the 8th time!
After rehab I saw the light and promise to be kinder and gentler!
Probation is a very slippery slope!
by StinkyFingers on Jul 4, 2010 11:26 AM PDT up reply actions
actually he has scheduled
visits with 4 teams: Miami, Chicago, Minnesota, and New Jersey
As for LA or Boston, I doubt they have the cap room.
They don't
but it’s not like the T-Wolves have significant cap room either
Pro-Skub for life
by Reverend_Randy on Jul 4, 2010 3:55 PM PDT up reply actions
The Wolves have $7M
That may not be a lot, and it may not be what he’s looking for, but it’s something. And when you’re a free agent, you respond to teams that express interest. At the very least, you can leverage them into getting more from your desired employer.
The Warriors, on the other hand, are over the cap and can only make trades. They will not be talking to free agents, they will be talking to other front offices trying to trade their players.
There is absolutely no point in Riley inviting Lee to come for a visit because we could never sign him because we will NOT be able to afford him. However, it’s not impossible for the Wolves to be able to afford him, so their front office invited him out to get a feel for what he’s looking for.
Trust me, learning english isn’t a waste of time. It is actually sort of useful.
-randolphforpresident
by Dubs fan in Boston on Jul 4, 2010 11:20 PM PDT up reply actions
if I said LeBron James wanted to come to GS, would it be fair for me to say, "Sleepy, prove that he doesn’t want to come to GS." ?
only if you could prove that he did.
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jul 4, 2010 11:28 AM PDT up reply actions
your point number 1 is definitely up for debate
Stephen Curry
Reggie Williams
Kelenna Azubuike
Anthony Randolph
(David Lee)
vs.
Ricky Rubio
Jonny Flynn
Wesley Johnson
Kevin Love
(David Lee)
by eastbayglory on Jul 4, 2010 10:20 AM PDT up reply actions
?
My point #1 was that the Warriors’ stable of big men (Biedrins, Wright, Randolph, Turiaf, Udoh) is better at the things that Lee isn’t good at (playing above the rim, cleaning garbage, blocking shots) than the Wolves’ duo (Darko and Love).
As for the respective quality of the two teams (which I think you’re referring to here): the Ws were significantly better than the Wolves last season, despite being significantly harder hit by injuries. The Wolves may have closed the gap with the addition of Wes v. Udoh, but until we see them play against NBA competition it’s hard to say for sure. The trump card for me is that the Ws have a primary initiator who produced for a half an NBA season like one of the Top 5 PGs in the league, where the Wolves have … Jonny Flynn.
There will be no extra point!
by Sleepy Freud on Jul 4, 2010 10:38 AM PDT up reply actions
This is clearly in GSW favor
Wewon all the games head to head last year.
We won twice as many games last year with a roster that was injured. Hell our NDBL team was better that the TWolves. Quit while your ahe….. well quite while you have some dignity.
Set a record by getting banned for the 8th time!
After rehab I saw the light and promise to be kinder and gentler!
Probation is a very slippery slope!
by StinkyFingers on Jul 4, 2010 11:00 AM PDT up reply actions
By point differential, the Warriors (-3.6) were just about as close to the Mavericks (+2.7) as they were to the Wolves (-9.6). The Wolves were the worst team in the NBA this measure — even worse than the Nets. And they were basically healthy.
There will be no extra point!
by Sleepy Freud on Jul 4, 2010 11:07 AM PDT up reply actions
you said GS has “much better” surrounding talent
OK, let’s just say ’better." In any case, the argument that Minnesota is a more appealing destination than GS clearly fails the “surrounding talent” test.
There will be no extra point!
by Sleepy Freud on Jul 4, 2010 11:09 AM PDT up reply actions
Considering it's going to be two more seasons until we see Rubio in the US
i’m not sure including him in the calculus here is that fair.
Can, but won't
Staying another year makes sense because there will be a lockout and waiting that third year takes him out of the first year pay scale.
now your putting players on the TWolves roster that are not even on the team.
Ricky Rubio? thats like saying we have Kobe on our team. Neither is on either roster.
Set a record by getting banned for the 8th time!
After rehab I saw the light and promise to be kinder and gentler!
Probation is a very slippery slope!
by StinkyFingers on Jul 4, 2010 10:57 AM PDT up reply actions
And yet somehow the Warriors were a much better team than the Wolves last year, despite playing most of the season without all four of their big men as well as perhaps their best wing / perimeter defender (Azubuike). Wes Johnson and (next year) Rubio will probably close that gap a bit, but until we see them (and Udoh) play into the NBA, and until we see what kind of players Curry, Flynn, Randolph, Love and Wright develop into, it seems safer to give the slight edge in overall talent to the team that’s been much better over the past two seasons. Or at least call it a push. In any case, the idea that Lee would consider the Wolves’ “advantage” in surrounding talent sufficient to accept a trade to them while vetoing one to the Warriors seems pretty silly.
On a side note: if you’re going to continue to troll here, Kings fan, can you at least try to back up your assertions with some fact-based analysis? Your tired routine of posting inflammatory one-liners and then running and hiding is pretty juvenile. Can’t you try to be more like Wallywagon? That dude seems like good people.
There will be no extra point!
Good thoughts
I will add- is Chris Bosh really that much of an upgrade over David Lee especially when you consider the money?
It seems like a foregone conclusion that Bosh will get the max (which he doesn’t deserve or warrant), while Lee will rake in a very reasonable $12-14 million.
I’ll take Lee.
Golden State of Mind :: Always keeping it... "Unstoppable Baby!" | SBNation.com
by Atma Brother ONE on Jul 4, 2010 8:11 AM PDT up reply actions
However,
Synergy Sports shows Lee is the worst big man in the league at defending post ups.
Kobe sucks
"Frankly your desire to be a seller is just proof of how blinded you are by your hatred of Sabean"-giantsrainman..LOL
by GovernorStephCurry on Jul 4, 2010 9:39 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
.98 PPP, which is attrocious.
Kobe sucks
"Frankly your desire to be a seller is just proof of how blinded you are by your hatred of Sabean"-giantsrainman..LOL
by GovernorStephCurry on Jul 4, 2010 10:21 AM PDT up reply actions
Lee is not a center and has said he doesn't want to be a center
Bubble bursted
When I get older, I will be stronger.
They’ll call me freedom, just like a Waving Flag
Source?
Before you make such a proclaim…
by SnakesOnAPlane on Jul 4, 2010 4:29 PM PDT up reply actions
Source?
From out of his [hat].
Basically, in matters that concern Monta Ellis, dubzfan is pretty irrational and entirely predictable. He doesn’t want Lee because he doesn’t want the team to trade Monta. All observations involving Monta work tend to backwards from that desire.
dubzfan: whether you call Lee a C or a PF, my point was that his game seems to complement that of Randolph, Biedrins, Wright, and/or Udoh pretty well.
Now kindly stick to our agreement and stop replying to my posts unless you have something nice to say to me? I’ve been good about letting you post your nonsense; please extend me the same courtesy.
There will be no extra point!
No More Broken Down Players
AK has been breaking down physically for way to long to take a chance on his 17 million dollar contract.
The guy can’t stay on the court without hurting something.
It’s an expiring contract. It’d give you the option to resign him easily.
Go Andris's free throw shooting!
Don't count on it.
The Bird exemption may not exist in the same form in the coming CBA.
That’s – if you believe the rumors – one of the major points of contention.
Say the Jefferson trade did go down, what would be the GSW starting line-up?
The pieces don’t fit very well, and the SF position has not been addressed. I still don’t think Randolph is a SF, and Morrow as the starting SG isn’t ideal. But this team is bigger on the whole and can finally score inside. But this has to be one of the worst defensive starting 5s on paper:
Stephen Curry / Watson / Bell
Anthony Morrow? / Azubuike
Anthony Randolph? / Williams / Radmanovic
Al Jefferson / Udoh / Wright
Andris Biedrins / Turiaf / Gadzuric
I think Reggie would have to start at SG
No way Morrow can handle those minutes – he’s too much a liability on defense, and Curry would essentially be the only ball handler on the floor.
I agree with you, though, that lineup is terrible. Maybe Udoh or Wright will emerge at PF. I don’t think it makes sense to have Biedrins and Jefferson on the same team – not when they can’t be on the floor together for more than a few minutes per night.
Thoughts
tantrum-prone
Haha. Also, I don’t know if the Warriors were actually better or worse without Moped out there, but they were much more fun to watch.
he’s not exactly an all-world defender
I think there’s a typo and you meant to write, “he doesn’t play defense”.
Both Ellis and Jefferson…seem to put up some empty scoring numbers
If Monta and Jefferson put up empty scoring numbers, what makes Lee’s numbers so full or not empty.
Golden State of Mind: Unstoppable Baby!
If Monta and Jefferson put up empty scoring numbers, what makes Lee’s numbers so full or not empty.
There’s just something incredible about a big man who shoots 54.5% FG (we’re not talking about 100% easy lay-ins or low volume scoring like Andris Biedrins), this guy actually has a nice jumper and a variety of scoring ways) and 81.2% FT.
I will readily admit that I did not watch him every game he played last season. If someone has a good argument that Lee’s scoring numbers are empty, I’m listening.
Also isn’t this funny (look at the poll results):
- Polling GSoM: Andris Biedrins vs. David Lee (2/10/09)- I will take Lee over Biedrins right now ANY DAY OF THE WEEK.
Golden State of Mind :: Always keeping it... "Unstoppable Baby!" | SBNation.com
by Atma Brother ONE on Jul 4, 2010 9:00 AM PDT up reply actions
"If someone has a good argument that Lee’s scoring numbers are empty, I’m listening."
on court vs off court, David Lee only helped the NYKs by 1.6 pts per 100 possessions which didn’t make up for his atrocious defense. the NYKs gave up 4.2 more pts per 100 possessions when Lee was on the court. this was also the case in 08-09, a small increase in offense +2.8 with a bigger deficit defensively -4.6 per 100 possessions.
accounting for pace, his adjusted +/- was -1.3 last season & -2.7 in 08-09. considering who his back ups were in NY, that’s not exactly what i was expecting.
basically, his scoring #‘s are empty b/c he’s one of the NBA’s biggest sieves on defense. he & Troy Murphy (another empty stat big) are supposedly 2 of the league’s worst defenders according to Synergy at 0.98 ppp.
by homer simpson on Jul 4, 2010 10:12 AM PDT up reply actions 4 recs
… and that would be a good argument.
I still wouldn’t mind having this guy on my squad, but maybe after watching his defense for a full season I’d change my mind.
Golden State of Mind :: Always keeping it... "Unstoppable Baby!" | SBNation.com
by Atma Brother ONE on Jul 4, 2010 10:16 AM PDT up reply actions
would you want him at $15M per year?
NOPE!
Set a record by getting banned for the 8th time!
After rehab I saw the light and promise to be kinder and gentler!
Probation is a very slippery slope!
by StinkyFingers on Jul 4, 2010 11:50 AM PDT up reply actions
Those a damning splits for Lee, but it’s curious that in 07-08, the Knicks were +2.6 pp/100possessions on offense with him in the game and -1.5 (minus being better) per 100possessions with him in the game. Year before that? +8.9 on offense and -2.6 on defense. In both years, he seemed to improve both their offense and defense.
And we’re not talking about small sample size of minutes played for him those years. What explains this? Did he regress? Did he have trouble with D’antoni’s gameplans? (Is there a whole lot of noise in the plus/minus numbers?)
by jae on Jul 4, 2010 11:12 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Could be...
that in those years he was replaced by Curry for many of the minutes he was off the floor? Curry probably makes Lee look like all-NBA defense 1st team. I’m not sure if that’s the case or not, but that could have something to do with it right?
Golden State Warriors '10-'11 Season: The Return of ^^^^
+8.9 on offense and -2.6 on defense.
Sounds like he was made to wear a Warriors uni.
Trust me, learning english isn’t a waste of time. It is actually sort of useful.
-randolphforpresident
by Dubs fan in Boston on Jul 4, 2010 11:23 PM PDT up reply actions
-2.6 on defense is far too good for the Warriors. A minus on defense is good. Positive on defense is what you want to avoid.
by jae on Jul 5, 2010 8:21 AM PDT up reply actions
I know...
A man can hope, right?
Trust me, learning english isn’t a waste of time. It is actually sort of useful.
-randolphforpresident
by Dubs fan in Boston on Jul 5, 2010 1:39 PM PDT up reply actions
I'd take Lee over Beans to
But not at center
When I get older, I will be stronger.
They’ll call me freedom, just like a Waving Flag
With the bad contracts piling up it means that
Both Ellis and Biedrins look more appealing in trades with their 11 and 9 Million/Yr Contracts respectively. There will be several teams that WILL lose in the FA market by not signing any of the all-stars. This is where Ellis’ contract comes in, he will be worth far more than any part of his career, especially if a Franchise misses out on a big name free agent. Wait till the big names get signed and I expect the FO to get many calls.
"I tell him straight, 'If you're going to lead, you have to be the first to practice. You have to come in, get your work down and be prepared for practice,' " assistant coach Keith Smart said. "He needs to figure out why he is having stomach problems and he's got to watch how LeBron (James), Kobe (Bryant) and D-Wade (Dwyane Wade) work. He needs to mimic that if he wants his teammates to speak volumes about him." -Keith Smart on Motna Ellis
Anyone else surprised that a team not named the Grizzlies want Monta? Well, looking at free agency, Monta seems like a cheap deal.
David Lee >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Al Jefferson
Kevin Love >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Al Jefferson
I’d only want Lee or Love, not Al. If we can’t get Lee, there’s always Marc Gasol for next year.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rs5TPniQtJ4&feature=fvw
I’ll take Lee’s 37/20/10 > Steph Curry’s block.
I'll take Curry's talent/potential over Lee's talent (which IMO, is already at it's peak.)
"Monta is the MAN." -Bob Fitzgerald
by WarriorForLife on Jul 4, 2010 6:40 PM PDT up reply actions
Well of course, but just because Curry blocked Lee, doesn’t mean we can’t get him? Just showing Lee can be a good player, well maybe not defensively…
Don't get me wrong.
Lee is a solid player. He boards great and can give you some offense. But his D is atrocious as many people are pointing out. Also, if it weren’t for our glut of PFs, I’d love to have Lee. But I still think AR and Wright can hold down the 4 for us as long as they are healthy.
"Monta is the MAN." -Bob Fitzgerald
by WarriorForLife on Jul 4, 2010 11:09 PM PDT up reply actions
How is it that Dubs fans are not completely fed up with bad defense, especially for our big men? We are not going to win without strong defending bigs. Or at least, we’re not going to win regularly.
Go Andris's free throw shooting!
I never said I wasn't fed up with bad defense.
But the reality is, our whole front court was injured for the majority of the season last year, and basically for the year before that. Give them a chance to play together healthy, and I think they might be able to surprise most of us. AR and Wright are long and tall, and even though they are not great one on one defenders, they are great weak side shot blockers. And two years ago, the center tandem of Ronny/Goose led the league in blocks. Now I know blocks aren’t everything in defense, but our team is set up for the “piranha style defense” of the We Believe year, which was swarming guards and attacking the passing lanes, with bigs to defend the rim with shot blocking/altering shots.
Yes, true big men who can play post defense one on one will win games, but our roster has no one who can do that. And bringing Lee in would definitely be a step backwards as Lee is not a good defender at all.
"Monta is the MAN." -Bob Fitzgerald
by WarriorForLife on Jul 5, 2010 9:33 PM PDT up reply actions
which was swarming guards
To clarify, I meant our guards can swarm the opposing big men with double teams and also attack the passing lanes, which will lead to fast breaks, which is another aspect of the game our team is built for.
"Monta is the MAN." -Bob Fitzgerald
by WarriorForLife on Jul 5, 2010 9:35 PM PDT up reply actions
let's recap a bit here
if this rumor is to be believed, or even if it has just been discussed, then it means the following:
1) The Knicks don’t want a straight-up 2-team sign-and-trade with Minnesota, presumably because Minnesota doesn’t have a player they covet.
2) The player the Knicks actually appear to covet is on the Warriors (Ellis).
3) Given that the Knicks want Ellis, it would appear either a) The Warriors actually want Jefferson or b) the Warriors would love to get Lee, but something is blocking an Ellis-for-Lee deal.
4) If 3a is true, then this discussion is moot, because the Warriors don’t actually want Lee, for whatever reason.
5) If 3b is true (which I tend to think is more likely), then the most logical reason, to my mind, anyway, is that David Lee, himself, is the one that is against coming to GS. Otherwise, why wouldn’t that deal get done (assuming 3b is true)?
by Evanz on Jul 4, 2010 9:16 AM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Whoa, Is that deductive reasoning??
Maybe we’re just tasteless.
by War Years Legacy on Jul 4, 2010 9:23 AM PDT up reply actions
Or the warriors want to save money and get rid of ellis
and this is their best option right now
The difference between Lee and Jefferson
Let’s put things into perspective here.
1) Lee is an Unrestricted Free Agent meaning he can go sign with any team he wants, which means unless he’s willing to do a sign and trade then this rumor deal AIN’T HAPPENING, which could add some validity to the Minny rumor that he wants to play for the wolves.
2) If the Warriors wanted Lee, why wouldn’t they just talk to his agent and schedule a visit for him to come to the Bay Area?
3) Why would Minnesota want Lee when he’s almost an identical replica of Kevin Love, who happens to be another rebounding machine that doesn’t block shot but gets a little more assist?
4) Do the Warriors really need another power forward that doesn’t play defense in Lee? Jefferson ain’t that much better even though he does block shots but he comes as a red flag injury risk with multiple surgeries throughout his career.
5) New York obviously wants Monta, especially after it looks like Joe Johnson will sign with Atlanta for a max contract while John Salmon is already locked up in Milwaukee, which makes Monta that most appealing (and affordable) guard on the market, especially since D-Wade doesn’t seem interested in the Big Apple.
by OG Warrior Fan on Jul 4, 2010 10:17 AM PDT up reply actions
Kevin Love=David Lee? I don’t think that’s true. I think Love is a decent defender, while Lee is garbage on defense. Love>Lee by a significant margin on the defensive end. (Half the game).
Go Andris's free throw shooting!
And Love is better rebounder
Not by much but still better rebounder.
Kobe sucks
"Frankly your desire to be a seller is just proof of how blinded you are by your hatred of Sabean"-giantsrainman..LOL
by GovernorStephCurry on Jul 4, 2010 3:43 PM PDT up reply actions
Lee vs. Love
Yes, you can make the argument that Love is a better defender but probably not by much to see a noticeable difference. I’m not sure you can say Love is a better rebounder when they have similar rebounding averages. It’s also very subjective to claim that Love has better basketball IQ than Lee especially when Lee averages almost 4 assists a game, indicating that he’s capable of getting the ball to his teammates and helping them get open looks and easy buckets.
You can make a case that Love’s learning curve maybe higher but as of right now, I believe that Lee is more of an established player while Love is still progressing. Can Love eventually become a better player? Possible. But the fact is, Lee is an All-Star and Love isn’t so I’ll give Lee the benefit of the doubt as of right now.
by OG Warrior Fan on Jul 4, 2010 6:34 PM PDT up reply actions
I’m not sure you can say Love is a better rebounder when they have similar rebounding averages
Kevin Love gets 15.3 rebounds per 40
David Lee gets 12.6 rebounds per 40
Their per game numbers are close, but Love gets like 10 minutes less a game.
Pro-Skub for life
by Reverend_Randy on Jul 4, 2010 9:45 PM PDT up reply actions
I think Love’s defense is better, based on the various things I’ve read about him. Lee, from everything I’ve read, SUCKS at defending the post. He also seems to lack good instincts in one on one situations. Granted, he’s a good rebounder, but as Rev points out, Love is better.
Go Andris's free throw shooting!
Wrong! More likely a salary thing. Thats the case in almost 100% of 3 team trades.
If its true Lee wants a near max deal we can not trade Monta for Lee straight up. If that is the case we would have to give up another player. Is Lee worth $15M per. NO WAY!. So this is where the deal becomes problematic. Has nothing to do with his preference to be with the TWolves. They have cap space to take on his new bloated contract. Us? Not with lame duck ownership. Now if Lee will sign for $13M per or less then we can deal with him
Set a record by getting banned for the 8th time!
After rehab I saw the light and promise to be kinder and gentler!
Probation is a very slippery slope!
by StinkyFingers on Jul 4, 2010 11:55 AM PDT up reply actions
if we wanted Lee and he was interested in us
don’t you think we’d try like heck to get him? We could trade someone else or just not re-sign Morrow. That would free up enough cap room.
OK dude
This is what’s called “a rumor” that sportswriters and random “people in the know” are putting out via twitter and anything they can use to immediately disseminate them… then it’s getting re-quoted by a NYC beat writer who doesn’t give a rat’s behind about doing any background checking at all. You’re reading way, way, way too much into this thing.
First, the Warriors have no cap room. They will not be talking with any premier free agents and only be bringing in MLE types because they do not have the money and thus will not waste their time or the players’ time with useless discussion (“Hey, LeBron, why don’t you come visit the bay. We’ve got the MLE, let’s talk.”). This is why David Lee has not and will not visit the Warriors. Same with LeBron, Wade, Bosh, and the rest.
Second, 99% of reported potential deals don’t happen, and 99% of potential deals do not get reported. There’s simply nothing to your claim that the Knicks don’t want player X. Heck, maybe it’s Minny that’s holding things up because they don’t want to part with Jefferson.
Third, there is the issue of money. If this S&T were to happen with just the Warriors and Knicks, Lee could be offered a maximum of ~$13.8M given the 125% trade clause. This is more than I’d want to pay Lee, but it’s not guaranteed that somebody else wouldn’t be willing to pay him more. The Knicks don’t have to abide by the 125% rule because they’re under the cap. Including Minny & Jefferson helps Lee because now he can be paid up to 125% of Jefferson’s salary, which I believe will be $13M next year. So, by going to Minny instead of GSW, he can make up to $2.5M more annually than he could in the bay. Assuming he gets a 5-6 year deal, that adds up to about $15M including future raises over the life of the contract. If I were his agent, I’d be looking to extract that for my player.
You’re just leaping to way too many assumptions on so little information, none of the information being remotely based in fact or reason. There’s nothing saying Lee doesn’t like the Warriors or the bay. It’s July 4th, not August 15th, and he hasn’t visited every team he’s interested in. The Warriors do not have the money to sign free agents. Minnesota doesn’t have much, but they’ve at least got something.
Trust me, learning english isn’t a waste of time. It is actually sort of useful.
-randolphforpresident
by Dubs fan in Boston on Jul 4, 2010 11:43 PM PDT up reply actions
Nothing cracks me up more than two bad teams swapping players
I can’t remember where I read it, but someone once said “it’s always a bad sign when the trade negotiations begin with the words ‘you think YOU’VE got problems?’”
by jae on Jul 4, 2010 9:23 AM PDT reply actions 2 recs
My guess is that the Warriors would use Jefferson at the 5, then go out and trade Biedrins and Wright for a 3. Or maybe we could get Wilson Chandler in the deal. Either way I’m not a real big fan of this idea. Starting 5: Curry, Williams/Morrow, new 3/Azubuike, Randolph/Udoh, Jefferson.
But isn't the whole reason that Minny wants to trade Jefferson is because they don't think he's a viable 5?
They feel they need a “real 5.”
Now, I tend to think a lot of the differences between most 4s and most 5s are overrated, but if the reason why a team wants to trade someone is because they don’t see him as a viable center, that makes me hesitant about trading for him and planning to put him in at center.
So they think that Lee is more of a 5 than Jefferson?
The Wolves already have Love, so Lee would obviously be the 5. I don’t see them having Love come off the bench to back up Lee. Where did you hear that they said they need a “real 5”? Doesn’t sound like that’s the case to me. Lee is not a 5. Neither of them are great defenders, but Jefferson is definitely the better one. I think they want to trade Jefferson because he doesn’t really fit well with Love.
Jefferson isn't a 5 next to Kevin Love
That in now way means that he can’t be a 5 next to someone else. I’m a bigger Kevin Love fan than anyone here, but the Jefferson/Love combo amplified their weaknesses and nullified some of their strengths.
Both guys would be better off with other players next to them.
Exactly
Put AR/Udoh/Wright and Jefferson is better off on defense. Love and Jefferson couldn’t help each other out.
Riley Loves Injured Players
Their trading Jefferson because he has the knees of a 60 year old. Of course Riley who loves to trade for injured players thinks thats wonderful.
Starting 5: Curry, Williams/Morrow, new 3/Azubuike, Randolph/Udoh, Jefferson.
We better get a 3 that can also play 2 if that trade happens. Now PGeorge over EpicUdon tastes pretty good?
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jul 4, 2010 11:37 AM PDT up reply actions
Biedrins and Wright for whom? What 3 is worth both Biedrins and Wright that we could get? Bigs are valuable in this league, Biedrins was considered a top 5-10 center when healthy and Wright’s PER is excellent. If he gets healthy and has a great year next year, we would kick ourselves for trading him AND Biedrins for a three. Kirilenko and a 1 round draft pick, maybe I’ll consider it.
Go Andris's free throw shooting!
DON'T TRADE MONTE ELLIS!
Playoff teams don’t change players like a pair of shoes!
Every year the Warriors trade away good players and get worse players in return. A team has to learn to play together! If the Warriors had any intelligence what so ever they would keep the core they have now and give them a chance to grow together!
Monte and Curry were very good together at the end of the year. At the very least give them a year together to see what happens.
We traded Maggs and what did we get?
by deja8 on Jul 4, 2010 10:38 AM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Playoff teams don’t change players like a pair of shoes!
And that applies to us how?
We traded Maggs and what did we get?
Garbage. But we’re talking here about getting David Lee, last I checked.
There will be no extra point!
by Sleepy Freud on Jul 4, 2010 10:43 AM PDT up reply actions
It's not us getting Lee
The sign and trade would be specifically to get Lee where he wants to go, which is Minnesota.
sleepy is under the delusion
that what Lee really wants is to come to GS, but that he doesn’t know it yet.
Haha. That’s not what I said, but thanks for playing.
There will be no extra point!
by Sleepy Freud on Jul 4, 2010 11:28 AM PDT up reply actions
That in a chat room thread about how the Knicks are willing to give up David Lee for Monta Ellis, Lee to the Warriors is a possibility worth entertaining?
There will be no extra point!
by Sleepy Freud on Jul 4, 2010 11:42 AM PDT up reply actions
it amazes me
how people still can’t spell Monta’s name
by misterho on Jul 4, 2010 11:22 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
We traded Maggs and what did we get?
probably a higher draft pick next year?
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jul 4, 2010 11:39 AM PDT up reply actions
so we can buy more "potentials" ??
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jul 5, 2010 9:57 AM PDT up reply actions
Did any of you want Curry last year?
Monte and Curry were the best back court in the league last year, and you want to break it up before it has a chance?
I am glad the Warriors FO does not listen to this blog!
Monte and Curry were the best back court in the league last year,
What team are you talking about? Who is this Monte guy? I can’t find a single player in the league named Monte.
I am glad the Warriors FO does not listen to this blog!
I’m not really sure that this is true. Their PR people certainly monitor the blogs. I’d hope if they are reading, they’d forgive people for not knowing the names of the players on the team.
by jae on Jul 4, 2010 11:19 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Can you define "best"?
Offense?
Defense?
Winning?
Losing?
by caseycheesecake on Jul 4, 2010 1:38 PM PDT up reply actions
Most Fitz compliments during broadcasts
Trust me, learning english isn’t a waste of time. It is actually sort of useful.
-randolphforpresident
by Dubs fan in Boston on Jul 4, 2010 11:47 PM PDT up reply actions
And Monta isn’t a soft, stat-padding, no defense, huge contract, tweener?
Kobe sucks
"Frankly your desire to be a seller is just proof of how blinded you are by your hatred of Sabean"-giantsrainman..LOL
by GovernorStephCurry on Jul 4, 2010 12:07 PM PDT up reply actions
Terrible Trade
Ellis and lee are excellent and Jefferson is just damaged goods. His knees are not good. Jefferson is slow and will have a short career with those knees.
Lee for Monta would be fine, but NO JEFFERSON. I am so sick of freakin Riley trading for injured players. Then they complain about their bad luck with injuries, gee I wonder why?
by robyn k on Jul 4, 2010 11:23 AM PDT reply actions 1 recs
A strong case can be made that Monta's game relies on speed
and his ankles are damaged goods so he will have fewer years of high level play. Bad ankles vs., bad knees. Take your pick.
Set a record by getting banned for the 8th time!
After rehab I saw the light and promise to be kinder and gentler!
Probation is a very slippery slope!
by StinkyFingers on Jul 4, 2010 11:44 AM PDT up reply actions
What was missing was his mid range shot
He seemed to have the speed last year, just not that mid range shot he uses to make over 50% of the time.
don't trade MONTA ELLIS!
My concepts are logical, even if the name was spelled wrong! You get my drift???
AND how is Lee going to make us any better than we are? He has played for NY for how many years? And they have gone to the play offs how many years with him on the team?
by deja8 on Jul 4, 2010 11:24 AM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Have you seen the talent on NY?
Thats like saying Crawford sucks and then he magically goes to the playoffs with Atl…
by bojangles408 on Jul 4, 2010 11:27 AM PDT up reply actions
Umm wasn't the rumor about how we're getting Jefferson?
How did this turn into a getting David Lee thread lol
He’s the best player in the deal.
The Ultimate Opportunist
by Rated-R Superstar on Jul 4, 2010 11:30 AM PDT up reply actions
Mecca, I know I can say the same for us…. That’s why we need to keep Monta.
Give the team a chance to become a team. Teams become playoff teams with a consistent core group. OKC is a prime example. Durant was not a #1 pick! And they were the worse in the league for a while. But their management did not trade away key people every year.
You can't become a playoff team
if you don’t have a player that can guard opposing 2s effectively. Monta is so bad at defense.
Pro-Skub for life
by Reverend_Randy on Jul 4, 2010 9:55 PM PDT up reply actions
Monta is at $11M per and Jefferson is $13M per
What do you think Lee will want? As it is we are at the cap so we can not take on any additional salary unless we include a second player in a deal. Wonder what :Lee will expect to sign for? It is not a problem for TWolves as they are under the cap but of Lee expects say $15M per then we have a problem.
Set a record by getting banned for the 8th time!
After rehab I saw the light and promise to be kinder and gentler!
Probation is a very slippery slope!
Considering the drunken sailor spending on Rudy Gay? Lee’s a max contract by that standard. (No, I’m not saying the standard is reasonable. Rudy’s new contract was just plain idiotic and using it as a benchmark of real value throws everything off.)
So if thats the case we can not sign Lee to a contract unless we add someone else to the deal.
I think Lee is a nic eplayer but he is not anywhere enar a max player. So if thats the case I would pass on him.
Set a record by getting banned for the 8th time!
After rehab I saw the light and promise to be kinder and gentler!
Probation is a very slippery slope!
by StinkyFingers on Jul 4, 2010 11:46 AM PDT up reply actions
which is exactly the same thing to the W's as dealing them.
Set a record by getting banned for the 8th time!
After rehab I saw the light and promise to be kinder and gentler!
Probation is a very slippery slope!
by StinkyFingers on Jul 4, 2010 12:31 PM PDT up reply actions
Considering the drunken sailor spending on Rudy Gay? Lee’s a max contract by that standard.
so maybe Jefferson is not such a bad deal? I recall him having some promise a few years ago, maybe nellie can resurrect him before heading off to maui?
So is Montay bad enough to flip for Jefferson? Which player could help us the most??
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jul 4, 2010 11:51 AM PDT up reply actions
Is anyone else horrified at this rumor? Al Jefferson coming to our team to seems like a death sentence.
Also, I don’t understand why the discussion is circling around Lee when the rumor is that we are getting Jefferson.
If Minnesota can turn Jefferson into Lee (when NY is interested in Monta), why not cut them out and get Lee directly?
if jefferson comes here beans is definitely gone so..
bulls are looking for a “serviceable” center so how about beans for deng if this 3 way goes down http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=2dvhuhe ignore monta to the wolves, i couldn’t add david lee into the deal but you guys get the idea..
Almost 150 comments...
And still no Missing Barry saying Al Jefferson sucks? He must be on vacation.
Golden State Warriors '10-'11 Season: The Return of ^^^^
I haven't seen him here or on McCovey lately.
Kobe sucks
"Frankly your desire to be a seller is just proof of how blinded you are by your hatred of Sabean"-giantsrainman..LOL
by GovernorStephCurry on Jul 4, 2010 12:08 PM PDT up reply actions
Absolutely Not!!
I will not support any major trade that involves bringing back a player who does NOT play defense. Al Jefferson does not play D. David Lee does not play D. Easy no.
So is Mike D'Antoni a bad judge of talent? He has been openly trying to trade Lee for 2 years
yet we all look at him like he is a star in this league. What gives? Do we really know more about Lee and his game than D’Antoni. If Lee was so good why wouldn;t they build around him. Why is it their first move was to sign Amare to take Lee’s place? Makes one wonder.
Set a record by getting banned for the 8th time!
After rehab I saw the light and promise to be kinder and gentler!
Probation is a very slippery slope!
I like the trade
And it’s mostly because it would replace Biedrins. If we can find a way to move him, then that opens another opening for signing a decent FA.
Lee is very good, but he IS going to ask 15M a year, which makes him essentially un-tradeable for our situation. Jefferson is a big who isn’t mediocre on offense. Sure his defense could be better, but this gives us plenty of chances on the offensive side if he grabs his boards. His contract isn’t great either, but this guy wants to win. It would be the first promising big man to the Warriors in a long time. Maybe we really are switching our philosophy?
Golden State Warriors fan since 1984. The Filipino sensation!
The loudest Warrior fan in Section 208, Row DS, Seats 15-16.
P.S. I also have to look at Kahn's track record and say if Kahn wants him
I don’t. Kahn is a wiseman’s contrarian indicator.
Set a record by getting banned for the 8th time!
After rehab I saw the light and promise to be kinder and gentler!
Probation is a very slippery slope!
Screw Minny, how about Denver?
Here’s another thought. If Amar’e goes to the Knicks like it sounds like he is and he wants Melo to go too, and Denver is considering trading Melo this year to get some value, why not try to send Monta to Denver, Denver send Melo to the Knicks, and the Knicks sign and trade Lee to GS?
I would only do it if Lee’s deal was similar to Monta’s per year or less.
Lee is an upgrade over both Love and Jefferson. Your lineup would then be:
Curry/ Bell
Williams/ Azubuike/ Morrow
Randolph/ Vlad
Lee/ Wright/ Udoh
Biedrins/Turiaf/ Gadzuric
Thoughts?
wow...really?
i dont get why everyone is so set on tearing apart this roster. sure ellis was an immature baby last year, but i think he’s come to terms with the fact that this is currys team now. he is a scoring machine and has proved to be a great defender when he wants to be. trading him for david lee doesnt make sense b/c that would add ANOTHER power forward to a team that already has too many to begin with. id be willing to take the chance on al jefferson, but not if it means giving up ellis.
what happened to the good old days where we actually wanted to keep all our players and watch them mature over the years? we shouldnt keep signing players to contracts just to try and trade them as soon as possible. we already did that with maggette and ended up getting NOTHING in return. let monta stay…give the kid 1 more year to show what he’s got…
"Warrior Pride Till The Day I Die"
by WarriorFanLive on Jul 4, 2010 1:07 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
we're not getting Lee
this whole thread is basically rampant speculation and wishful thinking based on an alleged rumor
i dont get why everyone is so set on tearing apart this roster
Maybe read the website a little more.
Pro-Skub for life
by Reverend_Randy on Jul 4, 2010 9:57 PM PDT up reply actions
what happened to the good old days where we actually wanted to keep all our players and watch them mature over the years?
What years were those? Sure, we had some homegrown talent at times (Mullin), but none of the players we’ve drafted in the last 2+ decades have been anything but squat (Webber excluded, but that’s a special case where the team didn’t really have the option). There has been absolutely no reason to hang on to any of them any longer than necessary. We’ve got probably 2 of the most promising Warriors draft picks in ages in Curry & Randolph. Monta is good, but he is flawed and if we have the opportunity to trade him for a PF who could come in and complement Randolph, Biedrins, and Turiaf really, really well… then you’ve got to do it. Now, Monta may be flawed and play an easily replaceable position, but I’m gonna throw up if he gets traded for Al Jefferson.
Trust me, learning english isn’t a waste of time. It is actually sort of useful.
-randolphforpresident
by Dubs fan in Boston on Jul 4, 2010 11:52 PM PDT up reply actions
none of the players we’ve drafted in the last 2+ decades have been anything but squat
Squat may be a little harsh, but you certainly can’t tell me that “If only we’d held onto Jason Richardson and Antawn Jamison longer, we’d have had something.” We kept a lot of players as long as we could. They never really amounted to much.
Trust me, learning english isn’t a waste of time. It is actually sort of useful.
-randolphforpresident
by Dubs fan in Boston on Jul 4, 2010 11:56 PM PDT up reply actions
Not that it really matters
Even with him, that team wouldn’t be all that amazing.
Pro-Skub for life
by Reverend_Randy on Jul 5, 2010 12:11 AM PDT up reply actions
He's probably the best player we lost outside of Webber.
Kobe's a jerk and overrated.
"Frankly your desire to be a seller is just proof of how blinded you are by your hatred of Sabean"-giantsrainman..LOL
"We didn't win our independence from the British to watch Aaron Rowand hit this bad,"-KNBR caller.
by GovernorStephCurry on Jul 5, 2010 12:37 AM PDT up reply actions
what happened to the good old days where we actually wanted to keep all our players and watch them mature over the years?
1975? 2007?
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jul 5, 2010 9:58 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Haha
I love how the people who want Monta out so much also hate on Jefferson constantly, so when they get there wish of a potential Monta move, we get Jefferson! Irony!
No but seriously this is a bad trade, Al is not really a center and Monta is way better than him. Even if we were getting Lee we would have 4 PF’s, Lee doesn’t want to be a center and I can’t blame him either. I’m just not a fan of this deal. If Monta is moved move him for a 3.
When I get older, I will be stronger.
They’ll call me freedom, just like a Waving Flag
I don't even think it goes through
Minny did meet with Lee but I have no idea why Lee would want to go to Minny when he can go to New Jersey or Chicago at a better price for better teams? Also Jefferson is not really a true center, but I have always liked him. Maybe paired with someone like AR he’d do better but I’d rather have Monta than Jefferson. I feel like we’d get ripped off but I also don’t think this goes through mainly due to David Lee going elsewhere. You can bet that he will go to Miami, New Jersey or Chicago before he goes to Minnesota
When I get older, I will be stronger.
They’ll call me freedom, just like a Waving Flag
I know some of you guys hate Ellis
But PLEASE don’t wish him to go to the hell of the Knicks, I’d feel bad for him.
I think Monta’s attitude and exciting play would work on the Knicks. He may play better there. Of course, competing with Amar’e for offensive touches might be a problem.
Go Andris's free throw shooting!
The Knicks have led the league in trading for "exciting," high-volume, low-effeciency scorers in the last decade.
Monta might be a perfect fit.
Unless, you know, they’ve learned their lesson.
I don’t think it ruins the poll. David Lee would still win it.
The Ultimate Opportunist
by Rated-R Superstar on Jul 4, 2010 1:46 PM PDT up reply actions
I can understand Monta wanting to join his mate Harrington at the Knicks...
But I really dont like this trade if it is real. Jefferson???? Not someone I would trade Monta for. Monta is looking like really, REALLY….good value right now.
It is a sad state of mankind, that in the modern age, we have no one with the common sense to think.... 'Lets install some shut off valves in this oil pipeline!'
Al is a FA
He’s gone from NY
When I get older, I will be stronger.
They’ll call me freedom, just like a Waving Flag
I think Lee is just talking to the Wolves right now as his plan B or C. That’s because he could be waiting to see what other bigs do (Bosh, Stoudemire, Boozer). He’s probably wanting to go to either Chicago, if Bosh/Boozer doesn’t end up their, or Miami for the same reason. Since those teams are busy talking to the 1st tier guys, he’s just trying to see how much he could get if he were to go to the Wolves.
+1
Lets assume Stats goes to NYK
Boozer = Chicago/Miami/NJ
Bosh = Chicago/Miami
That means Lee goes to either the Bulls, Nets or Heat since all say they like him. My bet is the Bulls
When I get older, I will be stronger.
They’ll call me freedom, just like a Waving Flag
Same
I think Wade and Bosh are just hyping the Chicago thing up for their documentaries. I think they both go to Miami, Boozer to the Nets, while Favors develops and learns on the bench, Jazz, or Bulls, and then Lee to the Bulls, Nets, or Jazz to replace Boozer.
We should go after Horford in '11
Atlanta wouldn’t be able to match an offer sheet because of JJ’s contract.
or Marc Gasol
Or both + Carmelo. That’d be nice 3-4-5
It’s all about Marc Gasol.
PG – Curry / Random backup PG
SG – Reggie / Morrow
SF – Harrison Barnes (I’m wishing) / Azubuike
PF – Marc Gasol / Randolph
C – Biedrins / Randolph
I don’t know what we’re going with Monta, so I’m leaving him out of this.
Well we don't know whats going to happen with Beans
Why not leave him out? And Gasol is a center
When I get older, I will be stronger.
They’ll call me freedom, just like a Waving Flag
Dunno, It looks like we have actual big men depth and yeah Marc is a center, but I think he can do well as a PF/C, just like his bro.
He plays nothing like his bro
I doubt he can be a 4
When I get older, I will be stronger.
They’ll call me freedom, just like a Waving Flag
He still plays really well.
Not as athletic as Pau, but very good player still.
Kobe sucks
"Frankly your desire to be a seller is just proof of how blinded you are by your hatred of Sabean"-giantsrainman..LOL
by GovernorStephCurry on Jul 4, 2010 3:44 PM PDT up reply actions
He's not mobile enough
We’d have 0 athletic ability with beans and him. We’d almost be like Love and Jefferson
When I get older, I will be stronger.
They’ll call me freedom, just like a Waving Flag
Really? I think Beans and Gasol would be great together. They might not be super athletic, but I see the duo working. We’ve played Hunter and Biedrins at the same time before and that worked out well. I think Gasol and Biedrins can coexist with each other. Randolph would come off the bench and get 30 minutes anyways but with a Gasol/Biedrins frontcourt it could definitely create mismatches.
Gasol and Biedrins could absolutely work together
Biedrins is a mobile, athletic center. His size is more like a 4, at least weight-wise.
Pro-Skub for life
by Reverend_Randy on Jul 4, 2010 10:00 PM PDT up reply actions
Except we wouldn't have any mid range game to speak of there
And it’d be like a traffic jam since neither can be outside the paint
When I get older, I will be stronger.
They’ll call me freedom, just like a Waving Flag
Who cares. You don't see that being a problem with the Lakers....and M. Gasol has a nice little j.
Kobe Bean Bryant is a douche and profoundly overrated by the media.
"Frankly your desire to be a seller is just proof of how blinded you are by your hatred of Sabean"-giantsrainman..LOL
"We didn't win our independence from the British to watch Aaron Rowand hit this bad,"-KNBR caller.
by GovernorStephCurry on Jul 4, 2010 11:15 PM PDT up reply actions
I was responding, in part, to
He’s not mobile enough
We’d have 0 athletic ability with beans and him
No claims made about shooting, only lack of athleticism.
And I think Gasol has a solid jumper. Nothing amazing, and he doesn’t take it often, but he can take it.
Pro-Skub for life
by Reverend_Randy on Jul 5, 2010 12:12 AM PDT up reply actions
Well whats the point if he never shoots it?
Thats like me saying I’m an amazing 3 point shooter but I only shoot 3 a year, what is the point?
When I get older, I will be stronger.
They’ll call me freedom, just like a Waving Flag
He doesn't really take that many shots at all
playing alongside Zach Randolph. I can’t say for sure, but probably 1/3 of his FGA are jumpers. He can take them, scores on them at a reasonable clip, but just doesn’t take a lot because he isn’t the scoring big there.
Pro-Skub for life
by Reverend_Randy on Jul 5, 2010 4:16 PM PDT up reply actions
Dude, Biedrins is really atheltic.
Kobe sucks
"Frankly your desire to be a seller is just proof of how blinded you are by your hatred of Sabean"-giantsrainman..LOL
by GovernorStephCurry on Jul 4, 2010 5:40 PM PDT up reply actions
*athletic
Kobe sucks
"Frankly your desire to be a seller is just proof of how blinded you are by your hatred of Sabean"-giantsrainman..LOL
by GovernorStephCurry on Jul 4, 2010 5:40 PM PDT up reply actions
i love ellis but if we could get barnes this year id be happy
by 4Ever Golden on Jul 6, 2010 10:51 PM PDT up reply actions
Does anyone remember when we could have got Lee as a throw in with Jamal Crawford butdidn't
God that was stupid
No kidding.
Kobe sucks
"Frankly your desire to be a seller is just proof of how blinded you are by your hatred of Sabean"-giantsrainman..LOL
by GovernorStephCurry on Jul 4, 2010 3:44 PM PDT up reply actions
I don't think that was true
But they could have perhaps traded Harrington for Lee and fillers. Lee wasn"t as developed a talent. at that point. But what did we do? We ended up trading for Crawford and Nelly ended up deriding him for being the player we all knew he was.
by War Years Legacy on Jul 5, 2010 2:19 PM PDT up reply actions
They were looking to dump crawford or anyone who had contract after 2011
It wasn’t about Al, it was about summer of 2010 and they knew Crawford wouldn’t opt out (thus be under contract thru 2011). As usual, management screwed it up by making Al tradeable, otherwise we could have gotten more out of NYK as Warriors clearly had the edge.
GSW doesn’t have the cap room to sign Lee. They most they could offer is the MLE. That’s why they didn’t invite him. It would be pointless. The only way they can acquire Lee is through a S&T. If GSW had the money to offer Lee, I’m sure they would invite him and he would visit.
Confident Marco Belinelli supporter
Because you need 15 players
And sometimes players get injured, and often just drafted players are kinda useless. Not to mention the fact that the mind set going into the draft would have been vastly different if we’d had significant cap room… and we’d have fewer players on salary. Suffice to say, having cap room mandates a lot of things that would have changed the draft process irrespective of whether or not we could sign David Lee.
Trust me, learning english isn’t a waste of time. It is actually sort of useful.
-randolphforpresident
by Dubs fan in Boston on Jul 4, 2010 11:58 PM PDT up reply actions
which of the 3
do you actually see help us making the playoffs..u trade monta for one of them..you lose your starting shooting guard…u can trade one of the PFs for one…or how about you just keep developing randolph as PF..hes already better defensively over love and lee..they might be better rebounders now but randolph will eventually average as much as them and he still has more potential than both..hopefully he will get it together soon..he is still very young..very inexperienced..but he has all the tools you need to be solid player in the league..real talk..i dont see getting either love or lee help us getting to the playoffs this year..we should be focusing on getting a legimate defensive minded SF
Develop our guys
Home grown talent
When I get older, I will be stronger.
They’ll call me freedom, just like a Waving Flag
I genuinely think that Reggie Williams could step in
and do at least as well as Monta did last year. Not like that’s much of an accomplishment, though.
Pro-Skub for life
by Reverend_Randy on Jul 4, 2010 10:01 PM PDT up reply actions
i'm for Lee
if this team has a chance to get a young bigman that could be a star, GSW definitely needs to cu the middle man, here and go straight for Lee. It would be something special in setting up for the future.
David Lee and Ekpe Udoh
would play very well together if we can assume that Udoh can play at all. Generally, you have to be excited with the aspect of Udoh changing shots and David Lee doing what he does best on the defensive glass. I like the idea of having a combination of big men who specialize in rebounding, protection, and scoring. Of course it remains to be seen who will emerge as the prevalent scorer between Wright and Randolph, but these 4 big men could pack a unique punch and versatile combinations on the floor.
Wesley Johnson is still a piece I would like to inquire about if I were Riley. This is not just an ode to the greatness of Stephen Curry, because Johnson would be an excellent fit. Would any of you be willing to trade Randolph for Johnson? Does Randolph have too much upside to quit on right now even for a prospect such as Johnson? If Randolph is traded, how much faith do you still have in Brandan with the understanding that he could still emerge as quality starter?
Dead The Convo, GSW Not Interested
http://realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/67826/20100704/sources_warriors_uninterested_in_al_jefferson/
GSOM- Where Education From Debate Happens
by The Dedication on Jul 4, 2010 4:41 PM PDT reply actions 3 recs
Good
Lee is good but we don’t need him, where would we use him?
When I get older, I will be stronger.
They’ll call me freedom, just like a Waving Flag
I’d trade Ellis and Wright in a package to get Lee. He would be the best big man on our roster and he’s only 26 years old.
The Ultimate Opportunist
by Rated-R Superstar on Jul 4, 2010 5:10 PM PDT up reply actions
He also can't play defense and AR wouldn't get to develop as much
AR can actually defend the rim, Lee can’t. We don’t need ANOTHER scorer
When I get older, I will be stronger.
They’ll call me freedom, just like a Waving Flag
I actually think Randolph can benefit from this since his shot blocking ability is much needed if Lee is on the floor.
Where would they both get playing time?
Log jam
When I get older, I will be stronger.
They’ll call me freedom, just like a Waving Flag
Randolph may get blocks
but that doesn’t mean he can defend the rim. I assume “defend the rim” means play defense, in which case, no he can’t do that.
Defending the rim = Blocks
Post defense = defense
When I get older, I will be stronger.
They’ll call me freedom, just like a Waving Flag
Blocks are under defense
post defense=post defense
Pro-Skub for life
by Reverend_Randy on Jul 5, 2010 8:18 PM PDT up reply actions
Just remember that even if Riley wants him, doesn't mean he'll get him
The Knicks might not even want Monta. They may have in the past, but it sounds like they want a point guard, and Monta is not that. Plus, Amare is likely going to have a lot of say in who they trade for because he may or may not sign depending on who they get. That’s why they’ll probably trade for Tony Parker. The Spurs know that Parker wants to got NY, and they really like George Hill. They probably don’t want to let him walk without getting any value in return. They Knicks could s&n Lee for Parker, or trade Curry (huge expiring), Chandler, and Walker/Douglas for Parker. The Knicks would definitely prefer Parker over Ellis, and so would Stoudemire, who could make all the difference.
They could go for Ellis with Parker so they could have a great Trio (offensively)
Ellis could play off-ball with a good point guard in Parker.
Parker
Ellis
Walker
Danillo
Amar’e
Thats a great offensive team. It may be more like the 07-08 Warriors than an actual contender but they would still have an overall good team. This is assuming Ellis goes back to 07-08 form with a great point, and a real # 1 option in Stoudemire.
Kobe sucks
"Frankly your desire to be a seller is just proof of how blinded you are by your hatred of Sabean"-giantsrainman..LOL
by GovernorStephCurry on Jul 4, 2010 7:14 PM PDT up reply actions
Wolves Fan
Believe it or not, there are some Wolves fans, and I’m one of them. The Wolves have NO NO NO NO NO NO NO interest in Monte Ellis. I can’t emphasize that enough. The Wolves want Lee, and the Wolves want to move Jefferson, who doesn’t fit the triangle. You guys are only involved in trade rumors about Jefferson for the Knicks’ sake.
And Kevin Love isn’t untradeable. The Wolves would move him…for an All Star shooting guard. That’s about it. He’s a young, gifted big man, and he’s still cheap, which makes him a pearl without price in the present-day NBA, and means if the Wolves tried to trade him, it would be almost impossible to get a player back who’s worth as much to the Wolves as what they’d be giving up.
The Wolves have NO NO NO NO NO NO NO interest in Monte Ellis.
Who is this Monte guy people keep writing about? Presently, there’s no one in the league named Monte.
by jae on Jul 5, 2010 8:28 AM PDT up reply actions
The Wolves have NO NO NO NO NO NO NO interest in Monte [sic] Ellis.
I don’t think anyone suggested otherwise.
You guys are only involved in trade rumors about Jefferson for the Knicks’ sake.
Haha. Well, if the rumors are to be believed, the Warriors are involved because the Knicks are hot for Monta, who happens to play for the Warriors. The real question is why the Wolves are involved. As Atma Bro and others have wondered allowed: since Lee is a better player than Jefferson, why wouldn’t the Warriors just cut out the middle man? And indeed, subsequent rumors and tweets have suggested that the Warriors have no interest in Jefferson, and are much more intrigued by Lee.
There will be no extra point!
The Wolves would move him…for an All Star shooting guard. That’s about it.
Well Montay is just about an allstar shooting guard?
Lights please, lights please, turn off the lights.
by Skeptic con Urquell on Jul 5, 2010 10:01 AM PDT up reply actions
The Wolves want Lee, and the Wolves want to move Jefferson, who doesn’t fit the triangle. You guys are only involved in trade rumors about Jefferson for the Knicks’ sake.
Humm… sounds like the Knicks are NOT interested in Jefferson, who isn’t a good fit for a basketball team trying to win games, let alone a D’Antoni run team. You guys are only involved in trade rumors about Jefferson because you’re trying to offload him on anyone and everyone who has a pulse…
You want Lee, and you want to rid yourselves of Jefferson. The Knicks have Lee, but they do not want Jefferson (nor does anyone else, probably). Thus, you want to have a 3 way trade with the Knicks giving you want you want, but you need some sap to take your worthless PF off your hands while simultaneously giving the Knicks something they like.
Good luck with that. As documented, the Warriors are not interested in your worthless, overpaid Al Jefferson. Go find another sap, and stop talking like the Warriors are lucky that the Wolves have deigned to allow them to participate in some stupid rumored trade.
Trust me, learning english isn’t a waste of time. It is actually sort of useful.
-randolphforpresident
by Dubs fan in Boston on Jul 5, 2010 1:50 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
The Wolves want Lee, and the Wolves want to move Jefferson
And I want a Ferrari.
At this point, the Wolves and Al Jefferson are an unneeded middle-man. Just because your team has a want doesn’t mean it’s going to happen under your terms. Like the Warriors, the Wolves are a team with zero leverage in the trade market. Maybe less than the Warriors.
Confident Marco Belinelli supporter
by Doctor Kajita on Jul 5, 2010 2:46 PM PDT up reply actions
I don't think the Knicks will end up with Ellis
I think if Amare ends up there, he will want to play with another superstar. He already said he would like Carmelo and/or Tony Parker to join him. Trading for Ellis would place severe restrictions on who the Knicks could sign next year.
Exactly
The Knicks would almost certainly have to run trade ideas by Amare. If they want Parker and/or Carmelo, then they can’t make this trade. I think Amare would say no, and this trade will not be made. Why do you think Amare turned down playing for the Warriors? He said he wouldn’t re-sign. He obviously wans’t thrilled with the idea of playing with Monta, plus other goood players, so why would he want to now? It ain’t gonna happen. Lee is either going to the Spurs for Parker, Nets, Bulls, or Heat.
It ain’t gonna happen. Lee is either going to the Spurs for Parker, Nets, Bulls, or Heat.
Well, thanks for that Karnak. Can I get tomorrow’s lotto numbers while you’re at it?
There will be no extra point!
by Sleepy Freud on Jul 5, 2010 11:00 AM PDT up reply actions
Make it a blockbuster with the knicks
we trade Monta B wright and Rad for David Lee and Wilson Chandler
Fear is the Mind Killer
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
"UNSTOPPABLE BABY!"
Golden State Warriors rookie Marc Jackson to the Mavericks' bench, after hitting a lay-up during a 29-point loss (2000)
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
Featured Stories
Most Commented
In Association With
Ball Don't Lie - NBA - Yahoo! Sport
- Days of NBA Lives: Wherein Roy Hibbert tap-dances to Maine
- Grizzlies Valentine’s Day cards are the key to love
- Kevin Love would like the NBA to take the MLB’s approach on All-Star games
- Kobe Bryant fires a few hilarious salvos at Jeremy Lin
- Brandon Jennings states the obvious regarding his 2014 free agency, everyone goes nuts
Certain photos copyright © 2012 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
