The Warriors are still after Bynum

by Gainon10 on Jan 7, 2012 11:28 AM PST

The Warriors have been linked to talks for Dwight Howard. Publicly they have stated they are willing to try to talk Howard into staying in Golden State after the season. I do not think they are really planning to do that if they can land Howard. I think they package him to LA for Bynum and Gasol.

It's clear to me that West is very, very shrewd. He's had a plan for the entire time to grab Bynum from the Lakers. I really believe that. The Lakers owner probably has strong feelings for Thompson, and I think he was drafted with that in mind as a "bonus" that no other player had for this one need. The Lakers are trying to shed salary, dumping Odum for nothing and going all out for Paul or Howard. I think they could see Thompson as a cheap future piece. They really need shooters. Their back court isn't very good.

I live in LA, and I can tell you the talk is everyone here wants to offer Gasol (too old and getting softer each minute) and Bynum (dominante for 60 games out of an 82 game season, but bad knees) for Howard (Best Center in the NBA.)

I believe the Lakers are trying to make Bynum look "dominant" early in the season to up his trade value. Bynum is kind of an immature punk. He's mentally soft. But he's a 7' center who can score on anyone when he wants to. I think West believes he's the best talent the Warriors could land.

Howard is going to LA to find is place in history as a great Laker center like Chamberlain. Book it. He won't be talked into Golden State, and the Warriors aren't trading half the team for nobody. I believe the plan is/was to trade Curry plus whomever it took minus Thompson for Howard and whomever. Then turn around and ship Howard plus Thompson (Kobe's successor) and whomever is left for Bynum and Gasol and change.

I think in the end the Warriors would have Bynum, Gasol, and a bunch of scrubs and bad contracts. And that's an improvement that future moves can be made from. The W's haven't done a thing with Curry and Ellis. Of the two, I think Ellis is the better asset, but if the Lakers demand him, then throw him in also.

This FanPost is a submission from a member of the mighty Golden State of Mind community. While we're all here to throw up that W, these words do not necessarily reflect the views of the GSoM Crew. Still, chances are the preceding post is Unstoppable Baby!

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Of the two, I think Ellis is the better asset

I think most NBA GMs would disagree with this, though Monta’s impressive passing of late and Curry’s cranky ankle may have altered the calculus a bit.

I’d trade either of them (or anyone else on our team) for Bynum, though. The injury concerns are real, but I think when healthy, he’s the second-best big man in the NBA. And he’s only 24.

For kicks and giggles…

Lakers get: Klay / DHoward / Lee
Warriors get: Bynum / Hedo / Duhon
Magic get: Monta / PGasol / Biedrins

Assuming the Magic (a) think Howard isn’t re-signing and (b) really do want proven NBA vets rather than a rebuild, I can see reasons all three teams might do this. We don’t get the best player in the deal, but we do get the second-best. We wouldn’t have to worry about an extension for Bynum till next year, which would give us two full seasons for Lacob, Jackson, and Curry to convince him to stay in the Bay.

We’d basically be hitching our franchise’s wagon to Bynum’s knees and Curry’s ankles, but I dunno, I like that idea a heckuvalot more than hitching it to the demonstrably mediocre core of Ellis/Biedrins/Lee. We’d have two 24 year-olds with totally complementary games — the best-shooting PG in the league paired with the second-best big man. And both with still a bit of upside.

Lacob’s gotta be able to bring in the world’s best knee/ankle specialists…

There will be no extra point!

by Sleepy Freud on Jan 7, 2012 12:10 PM PST reply actions

something unsettling about having ex laker players on the warriors..

kinda alot like watching murphy and barnes on the lakers (and watching them beat us lol)

im partially hoping that we dont make any trades and tank and get a beast out of the draft and keep our mostly home grown squad. way more satisfying if we ever get to a championship imo

by PIRATEWARRIOR on Jan 7, 2012 1:39 PM PST up reply actions

Meh, a championship is a championship.

"Monta is the MAN." -Bob Fitzgerald

by WarriorForLife on Jan 7, 2012 1:56 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs

i dont know if i would enjoy having howard lebron wade kobe and cp3 lead us to a title as much as a homegrown squad but hey just my opinion

by PIRATEWARRIOR on Jan 7, 2012 2:09 PM PST up reply actions

I agree with that, but I'd rather have a championship caliber team than a non championship caliber one.

"Monta is the MAN." -Bob Fitzgerald

by WarriorForLife on Jan 7, 2012 2:13 PM PST up reply actions

I would enjoy that. A lot.

by notEdreese on Jan 7, 2012 2:30 PM PST up reply actions

the best-shooting PG in the league

This seams borderline oxymoronic. It is like saying: the best ball handling center in the league. Big Whup!

With all due respect, I am a Analyst Hall of Fame candidate. If you are offended by my comment, I did write "With all due respect".

by KillaContract on Jan 7, 2012 6:34 PM PST up reply actions

A great shooter is the perfect teammate for a back to the basket center.

by Uwe Blog on Jan 7, 2012 6:54 PM PST via mobile up reply actions

That’s silly. Sure, ideally you want the best passing PG, but shooting is the clear second most desirable skill for a point guard to have. Can set up his passing by making teams defend him honestly.
There is value to having a ballhandling center, but it doesn’t come close to the value of a great shooting point guard. To put it in the form of your sentence: the best passing shooting guard in the league. Big Whup!

I heard he doesn't like music.

by Reverend_Randy on Jan 8, 2012 12:38 AM PST up reply actions

I would also rate low turn overs and defense above shooting at PG as more desirable. I still think the shooting ability in Curry’s case is way overrated. I also think that there is a compounding effect of being good at all things vs being great at just one thing which makes the difference between a winner and a very forgettable player like Curry Jr. and Sr..

With all due respect, I am a Analyst Hall of Fame candidate. If you are offended by my comment, I did write "With all due respect".

by KillaContract on Jan 8, 2012 12:35 PM PST up reply actions

I’m of the opinion that point guard defense doesn’t matter that much. If you rank the top 10 point guards in the league, probably 8 of them aren’t any good at defense. With the exception of Rondo, they’re all passing and scoring. The most obvious example is Steve Nash, who is consistently one of the most valuable players in the league despite his noted defensive troubles. He does this by being not only an excellent passing threat, but by being one of the best shooters of all time. Curry’s blue print would be the flipped version of Nash. Nash uses his passing to set up his shooting. Curry would have to do the opposite.
I would say that when I consider turnovers, I generally consider that as a part of passing or more broadly ballhandling. The primary job of the point guard is to create opportunities for teammates and take care of the ball. The secondary job on most teams is not to play defense, but to score enough to be a threat. The only really valuable point guard who isn’t a scorer is Rondo. Kyle Lowry is also a good defender, but is scoring 15 PPG on .600 TS% this season. Not huge scoring numbers, but he is making a great use of his possessions.

I heard he doesn't like music.

by Reverend_Randy on Jan 8, 2012 3:27 PM PST up reply actions

Rondo's actually been to a Finals as the best player of a team

Which of those other TOP 10 have?

The only one I can think of is Kidd, who is probably no longer top 10

Guys like Nash might get you going a lot of places in the regular season, but you have to be able to play defense in the playoffs, no matter what position you play.

http://nbawarriors.wordpress.com/

by Brownie13 on Jan 8, 2012 7:08 PM PST up reply actions

Do you think Rondo is better than CP3?

I heard he doesn't like music.

by Reverend_Randy on Jan 9, 2012 1:07 PM PST up reply actions

Do you think Rondo is better than CP3?

that’s physically impossible to think.

Mirror on the wall
Here we are again.

by Skeptic con Urquell on Jan 9, 2012 2:14 PM PST up reply actions

No it isn't.

http://nbawarriors.wordpress.com/

by Brownie13 on Jan 10, 2012 4:52 AM PST up reply actions

At times I have believed this.

Not sure about where I stand this season.

http://nbawarriors.wordpress.com/

by Brownie13 on Jan 10, 2012 4:52 AM PST up reply actions

Oh you mean like the Lakers, Heat, Mavericks? Derrick Rose and Westbrook were close and neither of them are any good at defense. I’d be surprised if Westbrook didn’t go this year.

I heard he doesn't like music.

by Reverend_Randy on Jan 9, 2012 1:09 PM PST up reply actions

Westbrook is the best player on the Thunder?

http://nbawarriors.wordpress.com/

by Brownie13 on Jan 10, 2012 4:53 AM PST up reply actions

i certainly don't think rondo was the best player on the celtics during either of their finals runs

by bigkino217 on Jan 10, 2012 7:39 AM PST up reply actions

I don't think he was when they won the title. That'd be absurd.

I think he was significantly less important than each of the Big 3.

Second time around, all you need do is watch those playoffs and how much he had to carry the offense on his back because Allen becoming almost completely an off-ball scorer, Pierce losing his elite scoring ability, and KG’s loss of mobility. He was by far their most dominant player on offense, and a very good defensive player as well.

http://nbawarriors.wordpress.com/

by Brownie13 on Jan 10, 2012 8:45 PM PST up reply actions

but you have to be able to play defense in the playoffs, no matter what position you play.

Westbrook, Rose, basically all of the point guards of the teams I mentioned are pretty bad at defensive.

I heard he doesn't like music.

by Reverend_Randy on Jan 12, 2012 12:57 AM PST up reply actions

Hmmm

maybe that was a part of the reason their teams lost…

oh yeah, THAT WAS MY POINT

http://nbawarriors.wordpress.com/

by Brownie13 on Jan 13, 2012 8:34 PM PST up reply actions

Yeah, but it’s probably not a top 4 reason their teams lost. The Heat and Mavericks also had bad point guard defense. The norm at the point guard position is minus defense. It’s nice hwen you have a dude who can play good PG defense, but for the most part offense is more important out of that position. Point guard defense is easy to make up for by getting good defense from your frontcourt. It didn’t matter that they were giving Jason Kidd and JJ Barea tons of minutes when they had Shawn Marion and Tyson Chandler. Derrick Rose when they have Joakim, Deng and all those bench guys. Westbrook with Perk, Ibaka, Collison. I mean, Derrick Rose can’t play any defense but his team was the best defensive team in the league. Chalmers and Cole are both really young, but the Heat are another great great defensive team. The main reason the Celtics have been so good defensively is a dude named Kevin Garnett. Rondo could be Stephen Curry and that team would still likely have a top defense.

I heard he doesn't like music.

by Reverend_Randy on Jan 15, 2012 8:36 PM PST up reply actions

i like rondo for curry

by Xtremelink on Jan 8, 2012 10:54 PM PST via mobile up reply actions

It’s a pretty good trade. I do like Rondo. My point wasn’t that Rondo sucks because he’s defense oriented, but that he is the exception and that all of the other point guards are much more offense oriented.

I heard he doesn't like music.

by Reverend_Randy on Jan 9, 2012 1:08 PM PST up reply actions

I'd go with the luxury of having a solid offensive PG

Offense wins championships right?

RIP "We Believe"

by sorryness_marciulionis on Jan 9, 2012 2:47 PM PST up reply actions

I don’t think either side of the ball in particular wins championships. I think that “defense wins championships” is a platitude.

I heard he doesn't like music.

by Reverend_Randy on Jan 9, 2012 8:26 PM PST up reply actions

Couldn’t we just offer the lakers lee and Thompson for gasol and they can keep Bynum and we can trade gasol Ellis and biens for Howard? Then we could have curry and Howard? If we’re taking on hedo and duhan then we should not do the lakers any favors here. And besides we’re gunna trade our roster for a bad contract, a below average point guard and 1 1/2 years of Bynum at $15 mil? He is gunna walk since we would have a horrible roster and no money to spend on free agents.

by A's Nation on Jan 7, 2012 11:54 PM PST via mobile up reply actions

Couldn’t we just offer the lakers lee and Thompson for gasol

No.

RIP Al Davis

by dubzfan on Jan 8, 2012 12:40 AM PST up reply actions

yesss

by eastbayglory on Jan 11, 2012 12:00 PM PST up reply actions

I'd think that Bynum is fairly untouchable right now

Unless he too gets injured.

"I'm not a big vegetable guy'' he says. -Tim Lincecum

by ejdacanay on Jan 7, 2012 12:29 PM PST reply actions

I think the reason that he isn’t untouchable is because he’s so prone to injury. At his best, he is really close to Dwight Howard, but he isn’t at his best half of the time. Dwight plays in 98% of games. Bynum plays in 60% of them.

I heard he doesn't like music.

by Reverend_Randy on Jan 8, 2012 12:39 AM PST up reply actions

Bynum and Kobe hate each other's guts.

Kobe publicly stated after last years playoff’s the pecking order for the ball, and it was Him Gasol, Odum, THEN Bynum, and Bynum said to the press that “certain players” on the team wouldn’t pass him the ball inside so he could score and that’s why the Lakers lost the playoffs.

I think the laker’s owner hates Bynum, but their GM likes him. They know tey have a great asset in Bynum, but want Howard more. West know these personalitites, so I think he’s working it.

by Gainon10 on Jan 7, 2012 12:43 PM PST reply actions

Yesterday Kobe said the pecking order has changed

He said Bynum is now second.

"It ain't Chinese algebra. If you get stops and you execute on offense, normally that team wins." - Tony Allen
"One thing LeBron James has won that Kobe Bryant never has, and never will: A bronze medal."- Josh Tucker

by steffun4tw on Jan 7, 2012 1:10 PM PST up reply actions

I’ve always heard that Jim Buss is a huge Bynum guy. I’m sure he would trade him for Howard, but it doesn’t have anything to do with not liking Bynum.

by Pippen on Jan 7, 2012 2:02 PM PST up reply actions

LOL this gave me a good laugh

The Lakers will never trade both Gasol and Bynum for Howard. If they offered the Magic that trade, DH12 would already be in Hollywood. I don’t know why people here are saying anyone in LA hates Bynum. The owner absolutely loves him (drafting Bynum was Jim Buss’ idea and he wants his legacy to start with a dominant center that he drafted) and for everyone else, they love him because the performance thus far speaks for itself. Yes, he’s had a major injury in each of the past 4 years, but each of those were literally freak accidents that would kill anyone’s knees, and he’s come into this season in better shape and with a stronger build than ever.

I don’t know where the hell you get the idea that Jim Buss has strong feelings for Klay. I’m sure he’d like Thompson as a backup until Kobe retires and maybe even as a starter at the SF position, but he’s nowhere near the point where he’ll give up a major asset for the rookie.

And finally, I just don’t see a trade bringing Howard to the Bay happening unless it includes Curry, Udoh, and Klay Thompson. Those 3 pieces will probably absolutely have to be included if they want to keep Ellis to pair with Howard, which currently appears to be the plan (unless they can keep Curry and trade Monta).

But overall, I got a nice chuckle out of this.

by steffun4tw on Jan 7, 2012 1:17 PM PST reply actions

If LA will give up Bynum and Gasol for DHO

why would they need to get the Warriors involved? The Magic would do that deal in a minute and since he would be willing to sign an extension for the lakers it would be an easier trade to pull off.

Mirror on the wall
Here we are again.

by Skeptic con Urquell on Jan 7, 2012 3:04 PM PST reply actions 1 recs

i believe

Howard wants a championship team not a regular season/playoff team.

by stepN30 on Jan 7, 2012 10:48 PM PST via Android app reply actions

You are very out of touch with reality.

He’s had a plan for the entire time to grab Bynum from the Lakers.

Say’s what?

Bynum is kind of an immature punk. He’s mentally soft.

Okay…

Bynum and Kobe hate each other’s guts.

Of course you would know this, when no one else does…

I think the laker’s owner hates Bynum, but their GM likes him.

LOL Jim Buss loves Bynum

I live in LA, and I can tell you the talk is everyone here wants to offer Gasol (too old and getting softer each minute) and Bynum (dominante for 60 games out of an 82 game season, but bad knees) for Howard (Best Center in the NBA.)

You’re hilarious. Laker fans DO NOT want to trade both of them for Howard. Go to any Laker Blog, or just talk to ACTUAL Laker fans.

I believe the plan is/was to trade Curry plus whomever it took minus Thompson for Howard and whomever. Then turn around and ship Howard plus Thompson (Kobe’s successor) and whomever is left for Bynum and Gasol and change.

In bold: LOL I can’t take it anymore. Please stop.

and oh yeah

Odum

It’s ODOM

http://nbawarriors.wordpress.com/

by Brownie13 on Jan 8, 2012 5:52 AM PST reply actions

lol these were the exact thoughts going through my head

by steffun4tw on Jan 8, 2012 2:25 PM PST up reply actions

Is this a joke

IF Warriors were lucky enough to acquire the best Center in the league, you suggest to trade him for the next best who has injury concerns?

by Babyface Assassin on Jan 9, 2012 9:56 AM PST reply actions

You have to factor the chance of an extension into that calculus. If we rate the chance of a Howard extension at next to zero, wouldn’t you rather have two years of Bynum plus a realistic chance of an extension — injury concerns and all?

There will be no extra point!

by Sleepy Freud on Jan 9, 2012 10:57 AM PST up reply actions

Nope

I am factoring the chances of Howard leaving as well as Bynum’s injury history. As I said before, don’t think of Howard as a rental but as a gamble. If he leaves after this season, Warriors failed….plain and simple!!!

Now if you go all in (which we would be with Curry), you need to go ALL IN, that means you go for the best, the one who’s played with less injury and the one who will bring you closer to a championship.

With that said, I might be more optimistic than you that Warriors can convinve Howard to stay but really all they need to convince him is to not opt out of his contract at this season end, just like CP3 is doing. They just need to convince Dwight Howard to stay for one more year and give them a chance to prove they’re for real.

Now you have room in the offseason to go hard after Deron Williams and bring him to the bay and join forces with Monta and Dwight, in my opinion that must the Warriors an instant championship contender and a team that Howard would like to stay with. If we can provide him a team that he can compete for the championship with, Howard will sign the extension, he gets his money, he gets to play in a big market, he gets his max shoe deal and most importantly he gets to compete for the championship….what else is there ?

by Babyface Assassin on Jan 9, 2012 3:44 PM PST up reply actions

Of course

This whole discussion could be moot if we had just drafted Andrew Bynum in 2005 instead of Ike Diogu. But how could we expect the Warriors to have had the foresight to roll the dice on a 7-foot beast center with ridiculous upside when you’ve got a 6’7" power forward with feet of clay sitting there winking at you.

"And the Warriors won, so I guess your household is pretty happy"--Donald Sutherland, Invasion of the Body Snatchers, 1978

by BlueInTheFace on Jan 13, 2012 5:43 PM PST reply actions

Well...

You could trade away a decades worth of draft picks to make sure your replacement could never draft anyone better and show you up. That might work!

by Gainon10 on Jan 14, 2012 10:54 AM PST up reply actions

Landing Howard is a Pipe Dream

If the Ws FO know what the F they are doing…

Right now, Andre Blatche can be had for Kwame Brown’s Contract straight up! Washington’s team is terrible/not winning and its time to break them up. Ws can throw in 2012 2nd rounder as well if that’s what it takes to land Blatche (who has a bad shoulder right now but is a nice player when healthy). According to MStein, Wizards are ready to dump his contract and Kwame’s expiring contract would allow the Ws to go after a star player next year.

by yuman1234 on Jan 15, 2012 9:50 PM PST up reply actions